Combat bonus in woods

[Ancyrean]

Hi everybody ~:),

In a recent forest battle as Romans against the Lusotannan, I realised I didn't know a detail that may prove important in such situations. It is about the "combat bonus in woods" special ability that many units in EB have.

How exactly does this attribute translate into unit stats? Is it, say, +2 or +3 in attack, defence or both?

[Michaelis]

I have no idea what the bonus is, but it makes a big difference. When playing the Sweboz, I beat Roman armies 50% stronger than mine in the woods and in the snow (double bonus). I did have the impression that their morale broke down quicker.

[kalkwerk]

I heard this bonus is bugged and actually has no impact.

[The Celtic Viking]

Yes, and I've also heard another theory that says that it is indeed bugged, but in the way that the bonus is always given, no matter if you're in woods or not. Can't say I know for sure which theory is correct, though.

[Foot]

Yes, and I've also heard another theory that says that it is indeed bugged, but in the way that the bonus is always given, no matter if you're in woods or not. Can't say I know for sure which theory is correct, though.

This one is correct. It was introduced in 1.5, so we won't be using this bonus any more,

Foot

[Cybvep]

This one is correct. It was introduced in 1.5, so we won't be using this bonus any more,

Foot

Has it been thoroughly tested? Do the other bonuses work properly?

Does it mean that cavalry in the woods will be overpowered?

[QwertyMIDX]

This one is correct. It was introduced in 1.5, so we won't be using this bonus any more,

Foot


I'm pretty sure its only some bonuses. Scrub was one of the main problems I think.

[Pharnakes]

I've heard about the scrub being lost, never about the woods bonuse going haywire though.

[Ancyrean]

Yes, and I've also heard another theory that says that it is indeed bugged, but in the way that the bonus is always given, no matter if you're in woods or not. Can't say I know for sure which theory is correct, though.


This one is correct. It was introduced in 1.5, so we won't be using this bonus any more,

Foot

Wow, didn't know about this bug! I wonder if this is also the case for "combat bonus in snow" attribute, if true it would affect units to even a larger degree if a one has both of these attributes.

@ Foot: Some units in EB currently have the woods bonus (I'm posting from work, can't remember about the snow bonus now) and I understand from your post that all these units will be retouched to lose it in the next build. I would assume it wouldn't change unit strengths by much, would it, since this isn't quoted to be a big bonus, but just to confirm?

Seperately but relatedly, is there a way at all to learn what exactly these boni are? This would help readjust the stats of units who have them and thus carry it on them regardless of terrain because of the bug. I searched the forums and then did a wider google search but failed to find the info...

[Foot]

Wow, didn't know about this bug! I wonder if this is also the case for "combat bonus in snow" attribute, if true it would affect units to even a larger degree if a one has both of these attributes.

@ Foot: Some units in EB currently have the woods bonus (I'm posting from work, can't remember about the snow bonus now) and I understand from your post that all these units will be retouched to lose it in the next build. I would assume it wouldn't change unit strengths by much, would it, since this isn't quoted to be a big bonus, but just to confirm?

As others have stated, I was wrong the broken attribute is the one that gives bonuses in scrub. Woodland appears to still work.

Foot

[NeoSpartan]

OK I am confused now....:dizzy2: ...

Is is:
-Bonus on the Woods and Bonus on Snow are bugged on all "barbarian" infantry/skirmisher units.
OR
-Bonus on the woods is the only one bugged.
OR
-Bonus on the Woods and Bonus on Snow are bugged ONLY on those units whose description says "Bonus Fighting on Woods" and "Bonus Fighting on Snow".


plz fellas.... clear this up :dizzy2:

[bovi]

Bonus on woods works. Bonus on snow works. Bonus on scrub does not work. The magnitude of the effect is unknown.

[Aradan]

Hi guys!

That's what FATW research has yielded so far:
Scrub, sand, woods and snow, all terrain combat modifiers work perfectly fine. They are not applied the whole time, they are only applied when they should, their relationship is a 1 to 1 point with unit attack and the max value (for both bonus and penalty) appears to be 8.

The only "bug" of the deal is that sometimes it's hard to tell when you are fighting on scrub terrain.

Cheers!

EDIT: 99% of research was conducted on BI. There is always the slim possibility that the modifiers are broken only in RTW, but I highly doubt it, as the few tests run on RTW suggest normal function.

[blacksnail]

Thanks Aradan, that's illuminating as usual. :2thumbsup:

[Palasta]

i experienced that the bonus in wood works... for me. i hate to fight in the woods and casualties are always higher than in nonwood terrain. so it works one or the other way (or both) and the barbarians (which i've fought mostly) have a great plus when fighting against them in woodland.

[Watchman]

So the whole straight flush of terrain modifiers in fact does work properly after all ? The man currently modding the EDU says "Bugger" and faces a dilemma. :shame:

Side note: I've always kinda wondered, but what does count as "scrub" ?

[Ancyrean]

Hi guys!

That's what FATW research has yielded so far:
Scrub, sand, woods and snow, all terrain combat modifiers work perfectly fine. They are not applied the whole time, they are only applied when they should, their relationship is a 1 to 1 point with unit attack and the max value (for both bonus and penalty) appears to be 8.

The only "bug" of the deal is that sometimes it's hard to tell when you are fighting on scrub terrain.

Cheers!

EDIT: 99% of research was conducted on BI. There is always the slim possibility that the modifiers are broken only in RTW, but I highly doubt it, as the few tests run on RTW suggest normal function.

Thanks for the research Aradan! ~:) :2thumbsup:

If you'd excuse my noobness, and just to clarify the working of the mechanism;

Does this mean the penalty-bonus range is -8 to +8? If so, what determines the exact number? Do you mean, in woods/snow/scrub/sand if a unit with the relevant bonus attribute has an attack value of, for example, 4, they get +4, if 6 they get +6 and if it's more than 8, their bonus is fixed at 8?

[Watchman]

It's set by the unit-specific "stat_ground" line in the export_descr_units.txt file, if that's what you were asking.

[Aradan]

Yep, what Watchman said.

This is a line of the export_descr_unit.txt

stat_ground 0, 3, -2, -1
They are in order of appearence: scrub, sand, forest and snow combat modifiers. The unit gets a combat bonus or penalty according to the numbers there.

The range means that the game will not take into account values higher than 8 or lower than -8 and will make them 8 and -8 respectively. No CTD if you put sth higher (I've tested up to 20 myself), but +20 and +15 for example have no difference.


Np guys, always a pleasure! ~;)

[Ancyrean]

It's set by the unit-specific "stat_ground" line in the export_descr_units.txt file, if that's what you were asking.


Yep, what Watchman said.

This is a line of the export_descr_unit.txt

stat_ground 0, 3, -2, -1
They are in order of appearence: scrub, sand, forest and snow combat modifiers. The unit gets a combat bonus or penalty according to the numbers there.

The range means that the game will not take into account values higher than 8 or lower than -8 and will make them 8 and -8 respectively. No CTD if you put sth higher (I've tested up to 20 myself), but +20 and +15 for example have no difference.

Very useful info! Thanks again! :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: ~:)