CRUSADE!!!!!!!!!

[Stephen Hummell]

How do they work? Give me all the info!!!

[Emp. Conralius]

you basically send emissaries to the pope and make a request for a crusade. It can only go down if you have the pope's signature. Once signed, you can travel through otherwise enemy Christian provinces with no problem. Though I'm no sure how you would start a Jihad.

[Stephen Hummell]

Say your byzantium and you want to expel the turks but you can't by yourself. Can you ask for a crusade from other countries to help you? (Like the 1 crusade was started)

[Darkmoor_Dragon]

its here somewhere - just got to find the post....

hmm cant find it - i'll repost it tomorrow - got to hit the hay atm, knackered.

[This message has been edited by Darkmoor_Dragon (edited 07-10-2002).]

[w00tage]

How did you sign up for a BETA darkmoor?


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"A warriors death in battle should be bloody"

[Aelfred Magna]

I understand crusades for catholics, and jihad for moslem factions . . . how does it work if your nation is orthodox??

[Emp. Conralius]

It'll probably work the same way Magna. Remember that the 1st Crusade started when the Orthodox Byzantines asked for help from Pope Urban to expell the Turks.

[Darkmoor_Dragon]

Orthodox dont/cant call crusades... (i really must check that, got to finish my late danish campaign first though ;-)

[Emp. Conralius]

That seems unfair...

[Emp. Conralius]

well it is unrealistic to see the Russians fighting the Almohads in Spain or something...

[fubi]

yeah but there should be a alternative for crusades and jihads, otherwise it would seem a little unbalanced as crusades seem to have alot of advantages.

[Darkmoor_Dragon]

i'd check it but ive just stuffed my copy of MTW during an upgrade to winXP.. so getta get a new licence or something - so coupla days before i can check sorry

[Rokkaku]

Quote Originally posted by fubi:
yeah but there should be a alternative for crusades and jihads, otherwise it would seem a little unbalanced as crusades seem to have alot of advantages.[/QUOTE]


yeah, I think your right, what disadvantages DO they have?

[Emp. Conralius]

I don't really think having the Holy Land is an advantage. It's really kind of a curse. I say this because your probably gonna have a Crusade called on ya and all of Caholic Europe is bearing down on ya. On the other hand, if your Christian and have the Holy Land, your asking for a Jihad, and that's not much different.

[Darkmoor_Dragon]

NB: Cross post from .com so some bits may seem a tad confusing as they are out of context.

Crusades move 1 province at a time - sort of... although a single "move" may be from the province of Wessex to say Novgorod (so that one move is actually a good way across the map).. cutting across "russia" is actually quite a "shortcut" as the provinces there are vast and you can cut down towards north "turkey" and into palestine that way... but that depends on the sea route being open of course (to get to novgorod).

Where you "build" your crusade is also a strategic choice - as is where you want it to go through. Depending on local "Zeal" it can be either a good or bad thing to go via many or few provinces... remember crusader armies do NOT have the 960men or 16 unit limitations of normal armies - i had one which was 39 units strong, thats one mother of an army!

So - the "concept" that walking for 20 years (although not something id necessarily advise) isnt necessarily "bad" in itself.

But - lets take a crusade i started in Flanders - it hopped to novgorod on its first move and the ruskies let it through - it then went via 3 rusky provinces to get to turkish (and thus muslim) lands, from that point onwards it is fighting its way through enemy lands to its destiantion (in this case palestine) and its getting no more recruits....

So ive only "built" my crusaders up via 3 provinces outside of its starting block... its about 19 units strong (arouns 1100 men ish).. bascically i literally got worn down. I won the first 3 fights and got into the middle east but i never even reached the destiantion point of palestine - after being beaten back into a "non muslim province" (byzantines owned it) I only ahd about 120 guys left - zeal in that province was low anyway and they all left me after the next 2 moves anyway.

Next Crusade I elected to build in Northumbria and march through Mercia, Wessex and into Flanders collecting good english troop types along the way - BEFORE i did this i "employed" an inquisitor to make sure zeal ine ach province was high when the crusade got their (as i did along its route for all christian provinces) - i then had it go through as many of the high zeal provinces as possible and ended up with that mammoth army - which eventually battered its way through to palestine and captured it.... whereupon all the remaining troops became "mine" as did the province.

So its far from a case of forming a crusade and dashing off to its target - indeed "half" of the useage of crusades isnt actually in capturing its target (necessarily) but weakening the other factions provinces along the way.... remember that crusader armies take from two sources ine ach province:

1) the troops visibly present in the province and 2) a "hidden" pool of troops who "rally to the cause".

So if the AI sends a crusade through one of your provinces you WILL loose troops to it and need to replace them - its thus hardly surprsing when you see the AI attack a weakened province right after you just graciously allowed a crusade through and it nicked half your best troops.

- - -

On the flip side. The "duration" of the crusade also is involved in the army staying together - so you play a fine balance between those leaving the crusade in low zeal provinces or after a long time and those joining it... and because you can "pave the way" by raising zeal (and the ai do this to you) the assassiantion of inquisitors if you are on the pathway to crusader targets is pretty darn important - as in thsi case you want the lowest zeal possible so you dont loose too many of YOUR troops to the crusade.

Remember though that crusades canot roam about "willy nilly" - when they move they have to move closer to their target, you "can" leave them static in a province gathering troops - but again, this will lower zeal and you may loose troops also... the "best" crusade is a cosntantly moving one that always goes through high-zeal well-developed provinces for as long as possible and then "dashes" into its target in the shortest possible fashion.

Good luck in doing that though ;-)

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so - its not really just about "how long it takes to get there", indeed that only paints a small part of the picture.

Hope that helps.

PS: I'll check on the Orthodox stuff this week.

[Emp. Conralius]

Darkmoor, how do Jihads work?

[Darkmoor_Dragon]

sorry emp i've allready answered this in other threads - dont ahve th time to re-type everything every time its asked - try the .com forum.