View Full Version : The Final Word
This was supposed to be posted in 'The inside word'topic, but it was closed.
Konnichiwa,
I'm too shocked and I may fail to express my feelings, not that that really matters as anything I've written here hardly ever reached what I tried to say. I'll give it a try though.
It was DarkMoor who entered the discussion about seasons, a discussion like we've had many here at the org. His very right as org patron to do so, nay, very welcome to do so and not unwelcome like he put eloquently himself in a later post: the overall attitude they give out is one of "If you haven't been here for years and have more than x hundred posts - Fook-off we dont want to know you". Now read the line again, and tell me whether this guy shows any respect. He's either a good journalist, which is objective, or a patron who respects the opinion of others. He's neither.
Indeed, I didn't read DarkMoor's posts, but it's clear that he was threated like an all knowing god, now there was some opposition (didn't the org always had opposition to anything?), not to the liking of DarkMoor and he started to degenerate our views.
The season stuff was a normal discussion, resulting from what De Plater said in a gameSpy chat (timely announced so that all fans of the first hour could listen in awe-yes there's sarcasm here).
If DarkMoor was flakked there, than it was his own manoeuvring into turmoil waters and making the current even stronger. Again, no more evidence as most of his posts are edited, but that's just what a textwriter does. Don't tell me that Puzz remark in Perspective on opinions was the only reason to jump on Puzz, as baggage from any thread was used there.
Nor was puzz posts a lightning strike from a bright sky.
The forum administrator Erado san saw fit to jump in as well. Their intention was really to muzzle this 'harmless' discussion, I'ld say that DarkMoor was the one who heated it up, no evidence anymore as he edited most of his posts. I can assure you that a couple of DarkMoor's posts were really insulting.
His attitude of 'I played it' I know and only I' is grieving. As if he's talking to 5 years old retards.
I don't know whether DarkMoor has any connections with CA and I don't care at all.
He did provide a lot of information, thank you DarkMoor, but don't dare to speak against it, otherwise he, the majority of this community and our Administrators fall over you: read the Perspective on opinions topic again if it's still there (unedited) and also what's left of the interesting topic at the com forums.
JRock did put that DarkMoor talked out of his ... about games having too many options. Not my wording, but I fully agree with JRock.
We were talking about options, that's not what DarkMoor is interested in: he only wants playable fractions to write about. Options is in the fullest interest of gamers, not of reviewers who will have to think before they write if a game optionally offers more complexity than an episode of Sesamestreet.
Puzz' remark about DarkMoor's posting his core market review at the org is also not my wording, but I think Puzz is right here. DarkMoors opinion is welcome, an objective review too, but we can do without these insults.
All 3 of the site administrators jumped on Puzz, in wordings you'ld never have seen of Anssi sama or Dan sama. I can't remember any patron here at the org has ever been humbled like that, no matter how insulting they were. They do anything to keep this 'indepent honorable writer' aboard, because he played the game and provides us so many nice information. I'm not impressed nor amused.
The very last post in the Perspective on opinions is nice too: again the Administrator blames Monsta, Puzz, JRock and me, while DarkMoor may only have made a mistake by leaving us.
DarkMoor really doesn't understand what the org is about, and what Puzz always tried to do: please a broad audience (this entire conversation started because of a SP feature, not something a hardcore clicque should bother about). Our Administrators don't get that either. Beat any resistence (of those whose only intention is to make the game better) and protect those who have 'useful information' about a game even when they are insulting or rude. The ordinairy rules of conduct don't apply to us all. Puzz didn't kept his cool,
DarkMoor gave full reason to that.
Making mistakes is human, refusing to take responsibility for shit too. I can understand the former, I disgust the latter. This defense of DarkMoor is disgusting.
It'll simply not happen that either DarkMoor or any of the administrators will publicely admit that they were wrong too.
I wish to thank anyone who took the patience to read this, I thank anyone who has ever took any effort to improve this game, I thank anyone who waged online battles with me, I enjoyed them very much and I especially wish to thank the honorable Rage clan (I may still jump in the server to play some teambattles, if the server allows me to join). And I wish CA and any gamer succes and lots of fun with MTW (there's no sarcasm in this line, something some easily tends to think).
It was a pleasure to be here (almost 30 months), but not anymore: this post, if still here, will be my final contribution.
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Ja mata
Toda MizuTosaInu
Daimyo Takiyama Shi
http://www.takiyama.cjb.net
Tosa!!!
It's only a fricken game mate...!
I know it's likely going to be a good game, but like its predecessor still just a game. I fail to see why this has become such issue, ok, both you and some others had disagreements with others here and heads were bitten and maybe some pride was dented, but so what!?
I mean, for GOd's sake, nobody has even played it yet, well... bar one.
Anyways my head strong friend, if you decide still to leave the .org then that is your decision... and i'll hope to catch up sometime in the future. Who knows, maybe beta testing a MTW patch http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif or maybe online for a whipping http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
I, for one, will be disappointed as we worked and enjoyed working on the STW beta 1.02 together and you have put a lot of work in here at the .org. Actually, we all survived that "testing" time (excuse the pun http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif), which makes me surprised that this minor business has affected you and Puzz so much.
Cheers
Jamie
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=MizuDoc Otomo=
=Clan Takiyama=
sasasaizo
07-18-2002, 14:44
.
[This message has been edited by sasasaizo (edited 07-18-2002).]
For the love of God, so we need to agree on everything to continue going on? Come on. I said it in one of my posts, you and Yuuki are two of most proficient, experienced, hard-working members of the community. 1.02, 1.03, 300 maps, campaigns - these are all a testament of the enormity of your work. We need you Tosa, we all do, as we need Yuuki.
But just because you did all this hard work, it doesn't mean you're omnipotent, perfect and can't make mistakes. Neither I am that...and neither is DarkMoor!!! DON'T LET THIS TROUBLE GET YOU! Darkmoor was a wealth of information about MTW and ill-afford to lose him, but BELIEVE ME, it's much more sad to lose you. Darkmoor made mistakes, you made mistakes, I did, everyone does - if we all leave the community on the first stumbling block believe me we wouldn't be here.
I was hoping to leave this bad story behind and continue were we stopped before - working together and having fun together. And this about the administrators, let me be clear. I am the mainpage admin and I look at the interests of that when I posted in the Darkmoor issue. And I don't think the mainpage benefited from the leaving of Darkmoor, please do understand my interest as admin. I don't like to get involved in forum admin issues - it is beyond my ABILITY - I am not good at it.
Back on topic - Darkmoor wasn't an angel but he wasn't a demon too. And Yuuki and you aren't demons for the love of God - you gained my personal respect over the months and will never lose it. I know Darkmoor was very rude as you pointed out, and you don't like him. DON'T LET HIM SPLIT US THEN! Open your eyes please...just because you were my buddy for 2 years it doesn't mean I have to defend you and your interests even if in my eyes you have are not right on some points. We're not toddlers, as you pointed out.
Tosa, please do stay. We need you, we respect you but you can't expect that we agree with you on EVERYTHING. Darkmoor had his bad sides - but had his good too. And it's not a matter of 'we need you' too...we hell LIKE you...I like a lot playing with you...we've been working together for over a year now, don't let a stupid issue about a stupid preview about a game split us...it would be a shame.
This issue already caused too much trouble, don't let it do more! Would just harm both you, myself and everyone. I did errors, big errors, small errors, and I apologize for them. I am willing to happily continue working with you as I've did for years and leave this damn issue behind. Please Tosa really, please do understand what I mean...
EDIT: DOC's final remark is too true to ignore, we worked too much for ORG and for the game to throw it out of the window because of such a reason which is in itself, very very sad for all its consequences, mainly in the bond between us. Don't let it break them...please. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka)
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
[This message has been edited by Terazawa Tokugawa (edited 07-18-2002).]
Catiline
07-18-2002, 15:03
Tosa I hope with time you'll reconsider this. I fear not though. You deserve immense gratitude from everyone for all that you have done both for the game and the community here at .org. I echo tera's sentiments completely on those grounds, we will be immensely the poorer place if you leave, much more than the loss of Darkmoor.
That said i think you've made the wrong decision. The whole episode has been sordid and uneidfying, noones come out of it looking good. Mistakes have been made on all sides, including dare I say it by admins and mods. Everyone picking up their balls and sodding of home over this is ludicrous.
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Timeo hominem unius libri
*Bows to Tosainu.
This whole discussion is not my buisiness, I can only say I value your work and you deserve the gratitude and respect from the community.
Please reconsider.
Kas http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
BarryNoDachi
07-18-2002, 15:35
hello tosa,
i dont know you or yuuki very well http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif however, the reputation of your work here has preceded you. i understand that you have done a great amount of work here that, beleive me, is greatly appreciated by everymember of the community that i know! looking at the previous posts i can see that darkmoor appeared to have access to various beta versions of medieval, now this is surely something that every patron here at the org would love! surely you can understand that people wanted him to stay and tell all?. but i am sure that given a swap no-one would choose to have yuuki and yourself leave this community because of this. nethertheless, it is your choice and i am sure that no one here can change your
mind, i just hope that you can reassess your decisions and come to a brighter conclusion in the morning so to speak.
wishing luck in the future - barry
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka)
Right as this is the final word.. It is the final word isn't it?
I suggest that we start a new topic entitled SORRY. Every member of the org simply posts the word SORRY in there and everyone takes it as read that everyone has apologised enough for anything that has gone before and we all move on and start over.
In future I think it best if the admins can refrain from taking sides as much as possible in these discussions due to your extra powers and influence, no matter how strong you feel. It's a difficult task and I am sure everyone would like to say thank you for your time and effort.
This is the final word isn't it?
tosa it is sad that you have decided to go . . me like so many others wish that you would stay and thank you for your work . . even if u do go ur maps, campains and ideas in the patches will continue to be used . .
it is a great shame if u and puzz do too. . a great shame!
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"...but one of them would make war rather than let the nation survive,
and the other would accept war rather than let it perish,
and the war came."
Abraham Lincoln, 2nd Inaugural Address
4 March 1865
Without Tosa's guidance many of my creations would not have been at all possible.
Tosa's ideas and comments have guided many players in the creation of numberous campaigns and mods, for all variants of Total War.
Tosa's abscence will be a great loss to the Community
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Clan Doragons Medieval Website
Mods, Unit Descriptions and more
DoragonBarocca of Clan Doragon (http://doragon.cjb.net)
Erado San
07-18-2002, 19:03
If there's one mistake the admins and moderators didn't see it was the potential this controversy had to create this situation.
For any role I played in it I apologise. And, if that has been part my responsibility, then I also consider it my responsibility to try and set this straight. Initially I will do this through e-mail. Don't start that this should be done in public for now. It's better to start this private and if neccessary then a public statement will be made as well.
One thing I'd like to say now, and that will be the starting point for me in this... There is no point in letting this be the end of the good relation we have had over the past two years. I don't see anything that can't be corrected. If anybody else does, then that's a pity. Whatever reasonable things need to be said or done to remedy this I will do my part.
RageMonsta
07-18-2002, 19:34
I say sorry for nothing...
I like some of the people stand by the members this forum...and not leap on the band wagon because some (out of nowhere) geezer feeds the 'groupies' some info about the 'holy grail'.....and sadly (in many opinions) Monsta is never the type to leave...I bite and scratch till the grave....
I stated before (in ANOTHER thread that was closed because it was not MY FAVOURITE UNIT flavour)whenever I feel I see and injustice (here or in life) I will battle for what seems to be correct.
How can so many of the so-called 'friends' here have just turned like 'junkies' on a person who has contributed hours (days/week/months) to improving the fun for us all is beyond me..
I spoke to Puzz in the game room and he seemed upset by the reaction (sorry M8 for repeating this)...Monsta reacts true to his nature....hurt one of mine and I hurt one of yours...or in this case...insult mine expect the same back...(damn childish isnt it..and?)
If any of you Puzz 'jumpers' had the honour you often claim to have you would have never turned against a loyal trooper for the sake of a some sh*tty review..
muppets..just as I was starting to relax.
NinjaKilla
07-18-2002, 19:53
Um yes a great shame ur going Tosa, you ll be missed m8. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka)
TosaInu San:
I have no idea what the fight was about, but please don't leave.
For me, no on-line quarrel is worthy enough for me to leave a forum that I truly like. You are here because of your addiction to this fantastic game, please keep it that way.
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Pain is weakness leaving the body.
http://www.grahamday.dial.pipex.com/rose-knight1.gif
Tosa, Yuuki come back !!!!
To leave Shoggy is like a thirsty man in the desert abandoning a bottle of fresh, cold water...
GAH!
Well Monsta, just stating again that I respect Yuuki and Tosa as you WELL know...been working with them on several projects...with Tosa especially I run ORG's mainpage. But that doesn't mean if they do errors then I won't acknowledge them and cover them...we all do mistakes and must correct ourselves.
And that's what we're trying to do...you want Tosa back don't you Monsta? http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
Tera.
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka)
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
Erado San
07-18-2002, 20:29
Monsta,
Acually agree with a lot of the things you said. I mentioned in my post above yours that I take my responsibility in trying to set some things straight. For that purpose I would appreciate it if you would mail me at erado_san@hotmail.com
Thank you.
Man ... this is becoming ridiculous http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif
People is going to extreme positions and overreacting for things that could have been worked out in a civil manner.
Darkmoor Dragon did a great service to the community providing info about MTW. I am very grateful for his time and effort invested on that.
But again, many (and I incluide myself) didn't like his "I have played the game and you don't so I am the final word" attitude. Howver, in any case, that was not such a big deal for me.
But again, some members such as Puzz went over the edge and overreacted to DD's attitude. Furthermore a lot of people behaved like DD's "groupies" abusing Puzz for daring to attack the "Forum Star".
So DD left (which was wrong) and now Tosa leaves (which is also wrong) and this Board which should be joyful and excited for the upcoming release of the game looks like a place to mourn and blame.
We all need to cool out and accept that discussion and disagreement is what makes this place worthwhile as far as we don't go over the loop defending our opinions.
Peace
[This message has been edited by Choco (edited 07-18-2002).]
Orda Khan
07-18-2002, 22:45
Honourable Tosa,
I have just got in from work and read your post. Can you imagine how sad this makes me feel? I understand your feelings as some comments I have read in certain posts were very insulting and on the whole arrogant. I spoke to you last night and we had some good battles, now I read this. My friend, words are very easily spoken or written and feelings can quickly take discussion into the 'mud slinging' stage. It almost always proves harder to leave this stage than it was to arrive here. I agree with yourself and Monsta and I too am sick of seeing 'who will you play as' posts. I just don't read them. I also object to the way some people are ridiculed because they say something against mtw. I took stick because I didn't like the bright colours. For every reason I posted I was trashed as some clown who could not understand the concept of a pc game. My response is 'stuff 'em' I know what I mean and so do other like minded ppl. As I said medieval forum is full of samey posts so I don't read them.
As a long standing member of the community you would be sadly missed. For the help and guidance you offer others you would be sadly missed. As a formidable (modest) general you would be sadly missed. Most of all by the honourable way you conduct yourself, you and the example you set would be sadly missed. If some in the community can not see this they are blind. I urge you not to act in haste and I know you have thought about this but I still think your feelings are running too high at the moment. I will continue to go online usual time. I hope you will too.
......Mizu Orda Khan
..My heart is heavy for today I lost a friend........Orda
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" Send us your ambassadors and thus we shall judge whether you wish to be at peace with us or at war..if you make war on us the Everlasting God, who makes easy what was difficult and makes near what was far, knows that we know what our power is."
Pachinko
07-18-2002, 23:15
You guys are funny..Like a damn Soup from TV!! Keep going!!
Pachinko
vyanvotts
07-18-2002, 23:23
omg.....this is so childish...like kiddies having tantrums and running off
I have spoken to Obake about this sad issue and and he wants to intervene and put forward his opinion. Since his firewall at work blocks access to ORG I have forwarded him all the posts in the Darkmoor issue topics...and offered myself to be a 'medium' for him to present his opinion. So here goes:
OK! Everyone take a collective deep breath and try to listen for a change. This entire chain of events is due to just that, people not listening to each other. Nothing that has been said in any of the multiple threads is worth leaving the Sword Dojo for good. Kneejerk reactions by Org patrons and Admins does not serve the online/posting community and through us, the rest of the TotalWar community. Neither does airing our laundry in public. This will be a long post so be ready, or choose not to listen and skip ahead to the shorter posts.
There are many different points of view regarding Darkmoor's posts at the Org and .com forums, along with his decision to refrain from posting and the subsequent fallout. There are also kernels of truth in all of those varied points of view. I will not however take the time now to state them all, as they are there for you to read yourself. What I will do however, is give my opinion of recent events and suggest a course of action for people to follow.
First and foremost, it has been a long-standing unspoken rule here at the Org, that everyone is equal. It doesn't matter if you are making your first post, have posted consistently for over 2 years, or have more posts than 10 other patrons put together because you like spamming and the "Shameless" thread is your favorite. None of here is any different than the rest of us. Unfortunately some patrons have been elevated above others due to contributions to the community, responsibility as moderators, or simply because of the quality of their posts. As much as they may not want to admit it (and indeed fight it), but a certain amount of hubris has ended up creeping it's way into the general attitude of those individuals. The result being that some patrons of the Org do not give the same level of credibility to newer members that they do to those who have been here for some time.
Darkmoor said that his perception of the Org was that "the overall attitude they give out is one of 'If you haven't been here for years and have more than x hundred posts - Fook-off we dont want to know you'.
Rather than using this quote as proof of Darkmoor's "lack of respect" for the Org patrons, it should have prompted the Dojo patrons and the Org as a whole to look inward and find out HOW and WHY he had gained that impression. Lack of respect for the Org and/or others opinions as Tosa states is superficial at best, and an arguement that I don't buy! I'll guarantee you that this is not the first time this is happened. Khan7 for example was subjected to the same initial treatment (nevermind that there is a whole separate set of valid issues there). The same holds true of any new patron who doesn't keep a low profile until the existing patronage gets to know them. And just to remind everyone, I'm as guilty of this as anyone else. In fact you will probably claim that I'm exibiting a bit of hubris right now.
Why was Darkmoor made to feel so unwelcome here with the information he brought? Information I might add that we have been asking for over a year. I'm sure that everyone has their own opinion, but I'll voice mine. I believe the reason to be that Darkmoor had not been a patron prior to his arrival with his information. Had he been a patron for even a short while, what he had to offer would have been accepted at face value and none of this would have happened. Monsta stated his belief early on that Darkmoor was a plant by CA, and this became the point that some patrons continued to hammer on, and used to discredit anything he had to say. Nevermind that the information provided was of high quality and in depth. How quick we forget that even our beloved Anssi began his tenure at the Org with similar information regarding the release of Mongols!
Other patrons most certainly DID accept the information Darkmoor provided, or as Tosa put it "...he was treated like an all knowing god". Whether you liked him or not, Darkmoor was the ONLY patron here who had first hand experience with the FULL game.
Discussions revolving around this information grew (as they should). However, I don't believe that they were anywhere near as "harmless" as Tosa indicates. I've followed the threads at the Dojo for well over 2 years and I've NEVER seen such an undercurrent of mistrust be directed at another patron. Even Demon was never treated this way. Whether the belief was that Darkmoor was a plant was the cause or something else, the discussions around the information he provided were NOT open and harmless as personal feelings entered into the discussions. Some patrons refused to look at the information objectively, and many snide and insulting remarks on both sides of the fence were made. Monsta sums up the unwillingness of some with his remarks in the "CA-Darkmoor conspiracy" thread when he half-jokingly says;
"I say we send the hit squad and have him buried in quick lime....if it turns out he was for real...we spare the rest of his family...or we could just chop his hand off...is this too kind?...maybe skin him?" bold is mine
What everyone forgets is that it doesn't matter whether he is "real" or not, the information he is providing IS. It DOESN'T MATTER if the review he offered was a "marketing" opportunity. What matters is the information itself and most people seem to have forgotten that point.
By the same token once Darkmoor had withdrawn his offer, everyone turned on Yuuki/Puzz3d. That level of response by patrons and moderators also became personal. I'll re-state again that the Dojo does NOT make things personal! It has been the one thing that made the Dojo different from virtually every other forum in the community, and that is now gone! Monsta most eloquently states just how personal this has become: "I like some of the people stand by the members this forum...and not leap on the band wagon because some (out of nowhere) geezer feeds the 'groupies' some info about the 'holy grail'....." bold is mine
Everyone needs to take a few steps back and remember why we are all here. We are here for the greater good of the community. Our personal agendas and grudges MUST take a back seat to the overall good of the community. The sniping, insults and outright attacks on each other needs to stop.
TosaInu,
Old friend. From our many conversations you know the respect that I have for you. You also know that I will speak my mind as well. How this entire situation has been handled by all the parties involved is unfortunate, as is the damage caused to many of the patrons of this board. I also understand fully the impact your tremendous honor has had on your decision to leave, and also the impact that honor will have on what I consider to be a rash decision. Common sense dictates that there is no need for you to follow through on your pledge to never post here again. Speaking warrior to warrior, I say to you in full honesty and with the same commitment to honor that you carry:
"You will lose no honor or integrity by re-considering this decision and returning to the Org".
Obake
------------
Thank you for your wise participation, Obake. If you have any replies you want to direct specifically to Obake, do post and I will forward him the message.
Tera
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka)
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
[This message has been edited by Terazawa Tokugawa (edited 07-18-2002).]
Jochi Khan
07-19-2002, 01:54
Coming to the forum tonight I was dismayed to read of Tosa and Yuuki deciding to leave. I am new to online gaming, this being my first time and I have been very impressed with the way that you both have been so keen to help me with my problems. I think I would have thrown in the towel by now if it wasn't for you. Would you please take the advise of an older person....Senior Citizen of many years. In my time on this earth I have come across many instances where it has seemed easier to walk away from the problem. An old saying....sleep on the problem..tomorrow you may see things in a different light. Believe me, I have found this to be very true. I haven't grasped what all the hassle is about, as I said, I am new, but PLEASE Tosa and Yukki, don't let this spoil a good organisation. Reading the posts tells me that the community like and respect you both. I hope I am able to persuade you to think before you do something you may regret later..........Jochi Khan
I must say I reconize all involved parties here. I have never been much of an MP but I sure know that Tosa and Yuuki not only has been, but still are important to the community... And I'm sad to see anybody go, besides flamers and such.
I have to disagree with Tosa (are you watching from the shadows?) that the SP aspect not being something a hardcore clique should/would bother about. I bother a lot about it, and in my time I have had many discussions with others who were equally hardcore about the SP aspect, to optimize my strategic play. And why is that? Simply because the campaigns give so many options for play. You want the challenge of MP, that is fine by me, but don't say SP can't be bothered with.
That attitude was why I didn't post here very often until now.
But to cap it off, don't leave, anybody... It is not worth it, is it??? http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif
I don't buy it, you two left cuz you wanted to leave and decided to make a passing shot at DD.
Bye.
(as for Khan7 - he is a w@nker )
Ryurik
this post fills me with much sadnes, i will not comment on the nuts and bolts of this dispute as it is not my place .I would just like to express my admiration for puzz and yukki you allways welcomed me into your games and made me feel at home , due to your wise and kind help and comments i started to feel part of this community . for this i wish to thankyou . i would also urge you to reconsider your decision to take a back seat you will be sorely missed , as jochi said sleep on the problem , i have found this to be wise , on reflection a problem or dispute is rarely as bad as it seems on initial inspection , time will dim and heal any problem . i for one will miss both of you
Tosa and Yuuki,
your decision to stay or leave is of course yours alone to make. for me, the distinction of the org has always been the civility. the main reason people have been banned from the org has been rudeness, like for example jd after sep 11th. duncan idaho and shai-hulud are usually at the opposite ends of every major politcal debate here in the org, and though they may at times get heated, they never engage in personal attacks.
you do yourself a disservice if you believe that the admins and mods who you've known, worked with, and played with for a long time, and who you've found to be honorable, would admonish you just for some piece of information that all will have access to within a matter of months.
most people found yuuki's post to be very personal and very rude. you may argue that darkmoor's previous posts were insulting but that is irrelevant.
if retard were to start a thread that began 'f**k you all' most people would laugh or shrug it off. if on the other hand kurando were to start a thread like that most people would be very concerned and reprimand him. it would be precisely because kurando is held to a higher standard of conduct.
it is unfair, but we do hold yuuki to a higher standard of conduct. we are less tolerant of his statement BECAUSE we view him as very honorable. again, your decision to stay or go is yours and yours alone. but don't let it demolish the friendships you have built here.
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indeed
Your post is quite disgusting I must say Dom. Never thought you would believe something like that.
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka)
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
Wavesword
07-19-2002, 04:00
Tosa and Yukki's work has given many hours of pleasure to all those who encountered it, if they choose to leave then the org and the total war series will be the worse for it.
Quote Originally posted by Terazawa Tokugawa:
Your post is quite disgusting I must say Dom. Never thought you would believe something like that.
[/QUOTE]
Tera, I was simply returning the favour http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif .
Regards, Ryurik.
Tosa - I was sad to lose DD but I am even more saddened to lose such a great a noble member of the community as yourself. I've read your stuff in Editing / Mods and Patches - can't say I understand it all but you and Puzz have made great contributions to the field for which we can't thank you enough. The loss of DD is nothing compared with the thought of losing you. DD's information will mean nothing when the game comes out but it is people like you two who will enable us to have fun with this game another 30 months down the road.
You have been a great fellow moderator and I salute you!
I beg of you to reflect on your choice some more. I'm sure you will find that you be welcomed with open arms if you choose to return.
The issue - I believe that mistakes were made all around. I wish we could forget our differences and all work to making this a better community. Let that goal be in mind whenever a situation like this arises.
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“Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.”
—Samuel Johnson
[This message has been edited by Shiro (edited 07-18-2002).]
RageMonsta
07-19-2002, 04:44
Tosa your thread (the long one) was good..sadly tainted by Dum...Dom sorry.
Dum strange how your still here since you left about a month ago..and it was me who said you made a 'passing shot' at the 103 makers...that issue was done so leave it buried...we all agreed you smell like rotten fish...oh you missed that thread..?..must have been the afternoon you left for!
In the original post...Monsta did not say D D was CA marketing man..Monsta said D D sounded like one...to which we got an answer...to his credit...rather than DD just coming here and 'researching' our views and seeming like the 'OverLord of the Grail' you must have seen this....with his continued defence of anything that seem like a criticism.....but the point made by Tera was good...marketing or not he gave some info....although I feel some of the complaints came because it was all too 'nice'...and many of us have felt the 'burn' of disapointment with TW.
Monsta (like in this thread..'smells like rotten fish' etc) used some type of humour..if only to make myself and the under 12s smiles....but to break the ice...Dom may respond with a flame but that will make me smile more..as it took him about a month to say something last time...
Monsta does think it wrong for Tosa and Yuuki to leave and Monsta is sure they will return....imagine Takiyama going eviiiiiillll....god help us all....they would make the Angels look like..Angels?
Monsta sometimes forgets that alot of people who come here are a bit thin skinned....and Monsta speaks from the heart (a*se in some cases).... sadly without the Monsta 'calming' tablets from Krast, Monsta is prone to 'savage' people who 'hurt' those Monsta considers friends....and to be honest Yuuki was upset....now Monsta does not get like this...because Monsta is a Monsta...so when he sees another get upset Monsta gets angry...
Never Monsta's wish to harm TW...and this is why Monsta et al ask these questions and sometimes go against the grain..in the long run we are asking/questioning for us all... because it is yourself and the likes of Monsta/Tera/Magyar/Newbie person etc who will be down if the sh*t hits the fan and things go 'pear shaped'.
So when you see people 'question'...'doubt' ..do not see them as the enemy....see them as trying to get to the 'bones' of an issue and find a resolve to a problem or a future problem.
Sorry for the flame at Dom....tried to resist...held back...but alas...oh well!
Sir Kuma of The Org
07-19-2002, 04:55
I am closing this thread now.
The reason i am closing this thread is that it is starting to slip back to something that i have seen quite enough of for now.
You might expect, and rightfully so, that i should express myself about the turn of events of the last few days at the org as the forum administrator.
I will in a couple of hours from now. It has been a shitty week for a lot of us here. After one week as forum admin, i can tell you that i already hate my new duties.
Since Tosa has decided to *go public* with this unfortunate saga and seems to be not on speaking terms with me. I will do it also. But i will back it up a bit, and try as the best i can, to explain to big picture through my perspective. Because the fallout that we are witnessing right now did not start with DD. It started when i had to announce that i may be taking the forum admins duties to my fellow staff members.
Of course, if they so desire, anyone mentioned in my post will be able to explain how they lived through this from their perspective.
Right now, i ask you to respect the topic of the forum you are posting. This forum is for discussing the Medieval game.
Be patient ( a few hours) , you will all have the chance to continue discussing about this.
Kuma
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