Fighting wars as good knight in europe

[icek]

Ok, im 76 turn as england, mongols appeared near sarkel and, when i through that only fun i have left is going to timbuktu, french attack me. im reliable(coz of that #$% scilians) and french are very reliable, we both were in great relations and aliance with pope(an english guy). French should destroy 2 times already excommunicated mediolan that have only 2 point in pope rating, but no they decided to give me a green light. when they attacked brugge they lost alliances with hre and pope and lost 5 points in pope rating. i smashed offenders at brugge and let go free all prisoners. I going now to attack forces that are already on bordeaux terrain trying to take fortress from both sides i pressume. I will also release prisoners from those fights. france is still very reliable but have only alliance with portugal. I know guys youre specialist about tips when i comes to relations with nations so i want to ask what should i remember playing war as good knight besides relising prisoners, only occuping and not killing completly faction?

[Didz]

As you say. release all prisoners, always occupy settlements and try not to eliminate a faction completely. The only other options to consider are, always try get your general into combat, but never use him to chase down routers. I usually make one token charge during the battle, preferably on the enemy Generals unit and then pull him back out of the way. In fact, don't bother chasing routers at all unless they are likely to rally, you are only going to release them anyway. Just make sure you capture a few prisoners to give you someone to release.

Thats all I've been doing as Turkey and it seems to be working perfectly. Most of my general's are 8/10 chivalry the only thing holding them back is a lack of battle experience to earn their stars, so ideally you need to rotate command to give them all a chance.

[icek]

But how react to french diplomacy, because i see alreadytheir diplomat running to me with ceasefire option. I mean will it be bad to all world or to only france if i decline.

[Didz]

It will not have any affect on the reputation of your generals.

[Sentinel]

original quote by Didz.

As you say. release all prisoners, always occupy settlements and try not to eliminate a faction completely. The only other options to consider are, always try get your general into combat, but never use him to chase down routers.

This explains were I have been going wrong!
I was doing most of the above but forgot about the chasing of routers. No wonder my chivalry is not as good as I expected.

A few questions
1. Is it only the main general in the battle that shouldn’t chase routers. Can other generals / units on the battlefield chase them?
2. What happens if reinforcement under AI control chase them?

[phonicsmonkey]

I think it is determined at the time you win the battle and are given the option to end or continue

if you end, you're ok

if you continue you are considered bloodthirsty and your rep takes a hit

[icek]

nope, you dont get a bloodthirsty if you continue battle againts faction coz you will run after escaping enemies and you will only capture them. i always catch as many as i can coz your units gets exp for this. i did this for armies that attacked my bordeaux and my general have 5 chivalry points now and not even a victory is the most important attribute. the msot important factor that send your general into the dread dark side path is fighting rebels. youll always need to kill all those you capture and if you bring a bigger force youre going for cunning or victory is the most important. And if you come with general only he will aquire introvert thats nasty for governor.

[phonicsmonkey]

i didn't mean that your general would get the trait "bloodthirsty"

I just meant that if you continue the battle after it is won the game considers that you are some kind of genocidal killer and hits your reputation as a result

I don't think this is necessarily related to chivalry / dreadfulness, just your global reputation as a faction

correct me if I'm wrong though

[icek]

as i say in previous post it depends if you fight againts rebels or ai nation. chasing rebels always occuring as tending to kill them, chasing ai nation soldiers will always give you an option what to do with them.

[Didz]

A few questions
1. Is it only the main general in the battle that shouldn’t chase routers. Can other generals / units on the battlefield chase them?
2. What happens if reinforcement under AI control chase them?

Based on my personal expereince it only applies to the General commanding the army. I have never seen a supporting general get any trait increases or decreases as a result of a battle. Which is why you need to rotate command of your armies over time to give everyone a chance.

@Phonicsmonkey
I'm not sure your entirely correct. I regulary continue my battles in order to chase down routers and have not noticed a lot of difference. My understanding was that the 'bloodthirsty' line of traits was based more upon the overall loses inflicted on the enemy during the battle, rather than an single act like pushing the 'continue' button. Of course continuing the battle particularly when as Icek says you are fighting Rebels does tend to increase the enemies loses, so there is an element of cause and effect in making that decision.

The important thing is to make sure you do get some prisoners, because you need to have some in order to show them mercy and 'Release' them unharmed.

However, I am pretty sure that the system does take into account how many men your generals unit (if not your general) has personally killed and captured and so you need to be careful not to use your General too heavily during a battle.

[icek]

easy way to get bloodthirsty: have general in army that demanded ransom for prisoners and that offer was rejected.

[_Tristan_]

easy way to get bloodthirsty: have general in army that demanded ransom for prisoners and that offer was rejected.

Are you sure of that ?

I almost always ransom and often get rejected but not one of my generals got the Bloodthirsty trait...

I would rather think it was tied to "execute"... After all, by ransoming, you offered them a chance and so should not qualify as sanguinary...

[icek]

well i was sure untill today m2tw session when i captured jerusalem with my crusaders, my general almost didnt fight, the fight took place in square so there wasnt any routers, i occupied city later and general got bloodthirsty.

Look what you can aquire after playing as good knight. I never started war with ai faction,i won 2 of 3 crusades, i build kingdom of heaven, i found the holy grail, i always occupy and free prisoners, i never use enemy territory as road for my non-crusaders armies, i fight french and took their angers already and i have a reputation +1 above very relable.
http://aycu31.webshots.com/image/23190/2000443773910160628_th.jpg (http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2000443773910160628)

[ForgotMyOldNick]

I keep a few nasty generals about just in case... My main problem is being forced to use assassins later in game and stuffing up the faction leader's chivalry etc.

[Didz]

well i was sure untill today m2tw session when i captured jerusalem with my crusaders, my general almost didnt fight, the fight took place in square so there wasnt any routers, i occupied city later and general got bloodthirsty.
Which is why I think the Bloodthirsty trait has more to do with the overall losses inflicted on the enemy army than any specific act. Presumably, if there were no routers, then you must have slaughtered almost all of the Jerusalem garrison. A kill rate of close to 100% would almost certainly qualify you as Bloodthristy, I get similar results in some battles simply because my armies are usually missile heavy and missile troops tend to kill rather than rout or capture their opponents.

[icek]

I keep a few nasty generals about just in case... My main problem is being forced to use assassins later in game and stuffing up the faction leader's chivalry etc. My king is and always be a dread lord due to spies and assasins. thank god that rufus had only one son so i dont have to many new generals with heritage of fear on beggining.

[ReiseReise]

For the General's traits... When you are offered Release/Ransom/Execute Prisoners, Release gives chiv trait, Ransom is neutral, Execute give dread trait, Also your King gains/loses chiv trait for paying/refusing ransom on your own troops. All of these have no effect if it is less than 80 prisoners in question. I don't remember the names of the traits.

As for how it affects reputation I don't know, I imagine ransom hurts your rep because you are not being very nice.

[icek]

As for how it affects reputation I don't know, I imagine ransom hurts your rep because you are not being very nice. after i released prisoners from 2 battles with france that i have engaged myself i aquaire veracious reputation as on screen above so... :)

[Grog]

How large a force are you attacking the enemy with? If you outnumber them to any degree of significance (1.3:1 ratio or so) you will pick up dread/blood traits I have found in my games.

Often If I have a general I want to remain chivalrous I will use the smallest force I can get away with, but use trained elite troops. Also, as others mentioned above, I chase down routers and usually take 30%+ prisnors but don't use general for this.

I have maintained chivalry to the point that when taking rome from the pope (just the pope unit in rome), my chivalrous general at the time ran in solo with spy help and duelled the pope 1v1 (I did have max armour and sword training which helped)

[icek]

but youll get introvert by acting alone without army. i prefer to get a dread point than this

[ReiseReise]

@Grog

Its not the numbers that matter its the odds displayed before the battle, so for instance 6 knights vs 6 peasants you are outnumbered almost 2:1 but the odds are hugely in your favor. The odds also determine the "level" of the win or loss, you are not going to get a Heroic Victory in the above case because you are *supposed* to win. Heroic Victories IIRC help get the Good Attacker/Defender/Beseiger/At-The-Walls lines of traits. Also I know to get the bravery and some other traits the odds have to be between 1:2 and 3:2. I think fighting with odds >2:1 gets you dread traits.

But going along with what you said, its usually good for your generals to try to have close to 1:1 odds if you are going for Chivalry.

[icek]

Will game put me in major reputation drop when i put an assasin mission that will end enemy faction? Im very proud of beign immaculate right now :)

[Dîn-Heru]

I was also immaculate in my Danish campaign and I dropped down to very reliable when I tried to assassinate a HRE family member (my allies). Ie three nothes down. *

*(I am playing a short campaign and am trying to win without braking any alliances, unfortunately HRE has been my ally since turn 3 or something, and I am well over 100 turns now, I have gained the requiered 20 provinces through diplomacy or fighting rebels, the only thing standing in the path to victory are those damned three remaining HRE family members..)

[icek]

but you tried and not-succeded so they know its you. I need to know if i go bad after i succed in such elimination.

[Dîn-Heru]

Nope, it is only when you get caught that your reputation drops.