View Full Version : Creative Assembly Map in MP?
WhiteSkull
08-16-2002, 05:36
Will they finaly have a map in MP for people to yuse or are they skipping this yet again?
GilJaysmith
08-16-2002, 06:01
Quote Originally posted by WhiteSkull:
Will they finaly have a map in MP for people to yuse or are they skipping this yet again?[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure what you mean... almost all of the 370 Medieval maps will work fine in multiplayer games. Can you tell me if I've misunderstood the question?
Gil ~ CA
Toda Nebuchadnezzar
08-16-2002, 06:06
I'm stumped as to what you mean also.
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Jaguara-Spoken like a TRUE SPAMMER Toda!
No Fear Legend.
He probably means a balanced map for multiplayer.
Do the ratio of money of the offense vs. the defense change depending on the defensability of the map?
mizuYari
08-16-2002, 14:09
I saw that you can set separately defense abd attack money.
MizuYari
Yeah, but I think CA or the mapmaker should set or recommend the ratio of defender's to attacker's money depending on the defensability of the map.
GilJaysmith
08-16-2002, 14:20
Quote Originally posted by andrewt:
He probably means a balanced map for multiplayer.
Do the ratio of money of the offense vs. the defense change depending on the defensability of the map?[/QUOTE]
There is no fixed ratio, but the host can set the amounts separately, and doubtless feedback will start zooming around about what ratios make for good games.
Hopefully, with 370 maps to choose from, people will find quite a few which are popular, and the rest will be at least worth a try in multiplayer.
The maps are designed by 'landscape type' rather than associated directly with the stratmap regions. So for example there's a bunch of maps for "hilly inland" battles, and one of these is chosen at random each time you invade a region across a border in a hilly inland area. So the single-player game should be more challenging, and the multiplayer game gets more maps http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
Gil ~ CA
Aren't you guys going to have sort of a listing of recommended maps or recommended values for maps? It's kinda hard if everybody at first is blindly picking maps and ratios.
youssof_Toda
08-16-2002, 15:10
Diff koku's for att and def is the most stupid option I've ever heard off. All we have to do is for guys waiting on a hill with 5 min timer with twice the amount of koku (or florins in this case) as the attacker.
GilJaysmith
08-16-2002, 16:19
Quote Originally posted by andrewt:
Aren't you guys going to have sort of a listing of recommended maps or recommended values for maps? It's kinda hard if everybody at first is blindly picking maps and ratios.[/QUOTE]
Good idea, might happen...
But the best thing would be for you to all start with the same money limits. The ability to set different limits is there so that you can decide on your own handicapping systems later on. STW games were very different according to whether you set high or low koku limits, and you probably found out quite quickly what you were comfortable with.
Gil ~ CA
Quote Originally posted by youssof_Toda:
Diff koku's for att and def is the most stupid option I've ever heard off.[/QUOTE]
Hmm... controversial opinion there, youssof.
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Quote MagyarKhans Cham:
i even suspect Target is coming here to hype things up.[/QUOTE]
Erado the Black
08-16-2002, 17:08
Youssof,
If you join a battle as attacker with half the amount of money as the defender I have absolutely no mercy nor compassion. Even if it's a newbie. I am just happy to see this option, so that serious players can come up with decent odds on maps that are simply no challenge without this option. So, a map is giving an advantage to the defender? Useless in STW/MI/WE. In MTW, give the defender 80% of the amount the attacker has and the advantage is neutralised.
Funny to see someone thrashing one of the improvements we asked for the most.
youssof_Toda
08-16-2002, 17:09
I'll try to express myself a little more gental: I don't like the option cuz again it is something which can be misused.
I'm almost entirely sure he means campaign multiplayer.
Not sure how you lot could have mis-understoond Whiteskull's question.
Will there be a campaign map for MP or not?
And no is the answer AFAIK so far. The game would have to be seriously different from SP if you didn't want to spend upto 3 hours waiting for other players to take their turns. It just dosn't suit MP online.
We would however all love the option to play other humans. My possible solution would be a 2 minute time limit for each players turn. In fact that could be a good option for SP to make us think as fast as the AI does. Not sure about the real time battles though.
DarknScaly
08-16-2002, 18:38
Different values for attack and defender is pretty much essential where you play on maps with castles.
The defenders holding a castle always have an advantage from the castle itself - especially with the larger ones and without question a big advantage with fortresses and gun fortresses.
At the same time its almost impossible (no it IS impossible) for CA to set an "absolute" or fixed "ratio" for these sorts of maps/games as the choice of era and units varies so much, plus it should be something the layer can set to arrange for a relatively fair fight to a totally unfair one - depending on their own desires.
OK its going to make MP leagues more difficult to interpret but thats why they are giving the interpretation of results more to the player - good moves imo.
GilJaysmith
08-16-2002, 18:47
Quote Originally posted by DrNo:
Not sure how you lot could have mis-understoond Whiteskull's question.
[/QUOTE]
I misunderstood it because the question doesn't mention the campaign game. It might seem obvious what it means now (if this is indeed what it means) but I didn't understand at the time, hence my asking.
So, now I have the right question, here's the right answer: there is not, and there will not be, a multiplayer campaign option implemented by us.
Gil ~ CA
Sorry GilJaysmith and others, wasn't having a go at anyone, it's just that this was such a hotbed of discussion with STW it's the first thing that jumps to mind when anyone mentions a map and MP.
Maybe everyone's discussed it so much they have a mental block on thinking about it http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif.
Not sure if anyone's asked this Gil but:
Have you ever done any investigational experiments into creating a MP campaign version?
I would guess that the resources needed to create such a version that would satisfy most peoples wants, would be far greater than the returns CA would get so I can clearly see why it hasn't happened. Would this be true to say?
DarknScaly
08-16-2002, 20:01
They'd be better off changing its "angle" and making a "semi-persistent world" or MMOG version of the game.
"Easier" to do and with a wider potential audience.
Total War Online to go up against Warhammer Online.
Sounds good to me.
MagyarKhans Cham
08-16-2002, 20:26
it would be nice if teh elements for the strat map as gif, bmp or whatever appear in a webkit as downlaodable or whatever.
furthermore being able to set florin amounts for both sides is a good thing, it was always requested and make many things easier. eventually there will be a list of mapratings which people can check if they join an unequal "florined" map
GilJaysmith
08-16-2002, 21:26
Quote Originally posted by DrNo:
Maybe everyone's discussed it so much they have a mental block on thinking about it http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif.
[/QUOTE]
S'okay... and yep, that's pretty much why it didn't occur to me.
Quote
Not sure if anyone's asked this Gil but:
Have you ever done any investigational experiments into creating a MP campaign version?
I would guess that the resources needed to create such a version that would satisfy most peoples wants, would be far greater than the returns CA would get so I can clearly see why it hasn't happened. Would this be true to say?
[/QUOTE]
I wasn't here at the time, but CA did try a multiplayer campaign for The Mongol Invasion. (A lot of the code for it is still in the project source, commented out.) But it proved too difficult and costly with the resources at hand so it was dropped.
We did have it on the very wishy wish list for Medieval but there wasn't enough time and like you say it would have cost an awful lot to provide the feature for a comparatively small number of hardcore fans.
Maybe next time.
Gil ~ CA
GAH!
Given we now have different koku options by stance...
It would be nice if the host could ADJUST the amount while the game is still waiting for players to join OR hit 'ready'. This way, people can join, and if they think 10000 florins is too little, the host could add some to their amount without having to exit the game and rehost.
GAH!
Same goes for other options.
A lag-meter would be nice besides each player too. So, if joining a 4v4, you can see if the others there are going to bog you down... like, if the host has a latency of 5000, maybe you should reconsider moving forward with that particular 4v4...
GAH!
Kraellin
08-17-2002, 00:06
vanya,
the trouble with lag meters is that they tend to be VERY inaccurate and non-reflective of true connection speeds, particularly where you have bandwidth on demand type isp's. when yer sitting almost idle in the foyer, doing almost nothing, a lag meter might show you at 500 ms, but as soon as you get in a game and the demand of information starts flowing, this 500 can be cut in half easily. thus, a lag meter in an idle area isnt very accurate. there's prolly other reasons, like how often updated and so on, that also makes a lag meter very 'iffy'.
but, even saying all that, yes, it's prolly better than no indicator at all, especially if the latencies are huge.
K.
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The only absolute is that there are no absolutes.
ElmarkOFear
08-17-2002, 00:35
White Skull may have meant will they provide a simple map of all the provinces in jpg. format that will be usable/editable for those players that want to host campaigns of their own. Will a simple map file be included that lists all the provinces? jpg., tga., gif. all will be fine.
WhiteSkull
08-17-2002, 05:18
thx for all the reply guys and ya i ment the campaign map sorry for the confussion.
But i probly wont buy MTW now till it drops as i really dont need another SP game hehe and STW and the warlords got old MP really fast when the only purpose was to fight for win/lose record http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif
I like games that give me a reason other then that but i will buy the game when it drops below 20 " http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
ElmarkOFear
08-17-2002, 07:20
You should try joining a clan. They provide much entertainment, especially when you battle against other clan teams. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif There are good things about clans and bad things about clans. They give out what you put into them, plus most of my old clan members have followed me to new games and thus I always have a group of friends to play with. We will be back in force come MTW time, so look for some UGLI's online. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
I guess its understandable why there's no multi campaign, but its still a bummer. I remember way back when, my friends and I would sit down with the old NES and play games like Ghengis Khan, and Romance of the 3 Kingdoms for hours on end. Itd go on forever until just 2 or 3 of us were left controlling the whole map.
I agree it'd be pretty well pointless for internet play- but it'd rock for lan play.
[This message has been edited by Xiahou (edited 08-17-2002).]
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