Empirate
08-24-2007, 14:43
Hey all.
I am just playing a H/H campaign as the Sicilians, using Lusted's LTC mod (highly recommended!). I'm having a lot of fights against Venetian and sometimes Milanese armies, being at peace with just about everybody else.
In some recent battles I noticed how much Pavese Crossbowmen depend on lucky timing, as well as on position. I always used PavX very much like other missile infantry, just with the idea in the back of my head that using them in a missile duel wasn't a waste. Using any other type of foot missiles in a duel with other foot missiles always annoyed me because of the many casualties I would take even in winning. Now I noticed that with both sides having Paveses, small things would massively impact the outcome of a missile duel.
I just fought a defensive battle last night that may serve as an example. My forces were lined up on a slight ridge, and the Venetians had to get to me. I used two PavXes, but also two Mercenary Crossbows and two Muslim archers, none of them with more than two chevrons. The Venetians had no fewer than eight PavXes, along with a lot of Italian Spear Militia. They marched up in good order, and my men started shooting once they were in range. They got off about two salvos at extreme range before the Venetians stopped and began firing themselves. Those two salvos, however, played absolute havoc with their formation: They needed time to reorder their men before loading their crossbows, and in the meantime, they got shot up some more, so individual men needed still more time to reach their new places in the formation. When they finally started shooting, some men hadn't even loaded their crossbows, some got shot once they stood up from loading, and some managed to shoot, but seemed to lack accuracy. I won the missile duel hands down, all due to a slight elevation in the ground that I could use to my advantage. The Venetians were forced to charge and got their buhts handed to them.
On other occasions, I have seen the tricky thing about Paveses: Once the men stand up to fire, they're very vulnerable to being shot themselves. So keeping up a steady barrage at a single unit or two will cause heavy casualties even against Paveses. As long as you order two or even three units to fire at a single target unit, Paveses are not much use, and the target will get reduced quickly. Then you just switch targets. Granted, you lose a lot of ammo that way, and quickly, but you can also quickly get rid of enemy PavXes. The AI never seems to concentrate its fire on one unit. Thus, with even or slightly inferior numbers of missile troops, you can decimate AI armies even in missile duels. This even works with other than Pavese forces on your side.
Against PavXes, use the one or two salvos you get from higher ground well to disrupt their formations, then once they start firing at you, concentrate on one or two targets. Using PavXes, you need a solid standing position to fire, don't march them up to the enemy, especially under fire. PavXes are a largely defensive weapon due to their long reload times. To make the most of their ability to remain in partial cover while reloading, you need higher ground, and it's imperative to disrupt enemy missile fire by using cavalry (preferably quick and light). Just scare enemy shooters into double-timing away from your cav. In the meantime, your PavXes can take up a nice elevated firing position, load and loose their bolts into the disorganized enemy. I find this to be the best use of light cav outside of router chasing: scaring the enemy foot missiles into retreating, drawing out enemy melee infantry into missile range. Don't engage with the light cav, though: The whole point of a missile duel is to make the enemy assault your fortified position after getting shot up.
I am just playing a H/H campaign as the Sicilians, using Lusted's LTC mod (highly recommended!). I'm having a lot of fights against Venetian and sometimes Milanese armies, being at peace with just about everybody else.
In some recent battles I noticed how much Pavese Crossbowmen depend on lucky timing, as well as on position. I always used PavX very much like other missile infantry, just with the idea in the back of my head that using them in a missile duel wasn't a waste. Using any other type of foot missiles in a duel with other foot missiles always annoyed me because of the many casualties I would take even in winning. Now I noticed that with both sides having Paveses, small things would massively impact the outcome of a missile duel.
I just fought a defensive battle last night that may serve as an example. My forces were lined up on a slight ridge, and the Venetians had to get to me. I used two PavXes, but also two Mercenary Crossbows and two Muslim archers, none of them with more than two chevrons. The Venetians had no fewer than eight PavXes, along with a lot of Italian Spear Militia. They marched up in good order, and my men started shooting once they were in range. They got off about two salvos at extreme range before the Venetians stopped and began firing themselves. Those two salvos, however, played absolute havoc with their formation: They needed time to reorder their men before loading their crossbows, and in the meantime, they got shot up some more, so individual men needed still more time to reach their new places in the formation. When they finally started shooting, some men hadn't even loaded their crossbows, some got shot once they stood up from loading, and some managed to shoot, but seemed to lack accuracy. I won the missile duel hands down, all due to a slight elevation in the ground that I could use to my advantage. The Venetians were forced to charge and got their buhts handed to them.
On other occasions, I have seen the tricky thing about Paveses: Once the men stand up to fire, they're very vulnerable to being shot themselves. So keeping up a steady barrage at a single unit or two will cause heavy casualties even against Paveses. As long as you order two or even three units to fire at a single target unit, Paveses are not much use, and the target will get reduced quickly. Then you just switch targets. Granted, you lose a lot of ammo that way, and quickly, but you can also quickly get rid of enemy PavXes. The AI never seems to concentrate its fire on one unit. Thus, with even or slightly inferior numbers of missile troops, you can decimate AI armies even in missile duels. This even works with other than Pavese forces on your side.
Against PavXes, use the one or two salvos you get from higher ground well to disrupt their formations, then once they start firing at you, concentrate on one or two targets. Using PavXes, you need a solid standing position to fire, don't march them up to the enemy, especially under fire. PavXes are a largely defensive weapon due to their long reload times. To make the most of their ability to remain in partial cover while reloading, you need higher ground, and it's imperative to disrupt enemy missile fire by using cavalry (preferably quick and light). Just scare enemy shooters into double-timing away from your cav. In the meantime, your PavXes can take up a nice elevated firing position, load and loose their bolts into the disorganized enemy. I find this to be the best use of light cav outside of router chasing: scaring the enemy foot missiles into retreating, drawing out enemy melee infantry into missile range. Don't engage with the light cav, though: The whole point of a missile duel is to make the enemy assault your fortified position after getting shot up.