Get your tommy guns out of the closet [Archive]

Forward Observer

08-26-2007, 18:15

Someone posted recently about the gangster game Mafia.

I was a big fan of the original PC version when it came out and it is still on my PC now as one of my sand box games. If you never played it, it is similar to the Grand Theft Auto games, but set in the 1930's gangster era---Tommy guns and women of ill-repute, but no drugs.

Most of the game plays like a 3rd person shooter, but you get to drive period vehicles, ride trolleys, and trains, and interact to some degree with the enormous environment. Even though it came out in 2002,---when one is driving down the street amid traffic with streetcars, overhead tains, and pedestrians it is still pretty visually impressive.

Here are a couple of shot I took from the orginal game; you can get in any of those cars and drive them if you have gas

https://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/forward_observer/game2007-08-0620-25-06-26.jpg

https://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/forward_observer/game2007-08-0621-44-21-00.jpg

https://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y74/forward_observer/game2006-06-1816-01-52-00.jpg

My post is actually about a new sequel that I just read about aptly named Mafia 2. It is by the same group, and this time it is going to move into the 1940's and 50's.

Here is a link to a short preview and 5 screen shots.

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=170565

Check those screen shots out and particularly the second one inside a bar. Damn, just another game that is going to force me to buy a new rig.

Cheers

Husar

08-26-2007, 18:43

Forward Observer

08-26-2007, 19:38

Don't forget to watch the GC trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmVrVBmqYaU) and visit the official website (http://www.mafia2game.com/home.html), which seems a bit empty though.

Edit: I just had a deja-vu, apparently you're also active on SimHQ.:laugh4:

Yeah, you caught me--I am too lazy to re-compose the entire post--lol

That clip is amazing--if it is in game graphics. It seems like every year we are moving closer to movie grade CGA graphics in games. I can only guess what it will look like in 5 or 10 years.

Maybe the Startrek holodeck is not that far away after all.

Cheers

Crazed Rabbit

08-27-2007, 01:23

Sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet.

Now I just need a new computer...

CR

Geoffrey S

08-27-2007, 11:01

Bob the Insane

08-28-2007, 02:11

Yeah, I was a real fan of Mafia too... Great game and almost more importantly a really great story at the center of it...

Some mad missions, remember the moonshine running?

Great to hear about Mafia 2...

TB666

08-28-2007, 10:34

Mafia is one of the greatest games ever made.
A mandatory game to play for anyone who considers themself a fan of PC gaming.
That there will be a Mafia 2 was to be expected and I hope they make it worthy of being called Mafia.

Forward Observer

08-29-2007, 02:47

That trailer is beautiful. I also still play bits of Mafia again and again. I just love driving around the city, not necessarily doing anything but just looking at all the loving details the developers included, particularly out in the countryside. It's a classic game without a doubt, with one of the best plots with the most memorable characters I've ever seen (not just in games).

Only thing that does bug me. My rig is now a fair bit better than before, but I still get a lot of popup and fog when driving over bridges in the centre. Anyone know of mods which alleviate that issue? Otherwise, it's a game that's aged very well.

There are a bunch of mod sites on the net and I found one sometime back that listed a mod to extend the draw distance. The problem was that in addtion to the mod files, you had to download a couple of editors to open the encrypted files and mod some of the files yourself. It was a bit more complex than I had expected and I ended up breaking the game. I eventually had to delete it from my harddrive and re-load it all over again.

It didn't seem worth it after all that.

Cheers

Mailman653

09-01-2007, 02:37

Mafia was/is an excellent game, hopefully Mafia II won't dissapoint, by those screen shots, visually it will be pretty cool.

Geoffrey S

09-01-2007, 12:01

There are a bunch of mod sites on the net and I found one sometime back that listed a mod to extend the draw distance. The problem was that in addtion to the mod files, you had to download a couple of editors to open the encrypted files and mod some of the files yourself. It was a bit more complex than I had expected and I ended up breaking the game. I eventually had to delete it from my harddrive and re-load it all over again.

It didn't seem worth it after all that.

Cheers
Thanks, when I've got time to fiddle about I'll be sure to have a look.

Husar

09-03-2007, 10:07

Yeah baby!

Anyone who liked that GC trailer can get it in it's full glory and in english from Gamershell (http://www.gamershell.com/download_20844.shtml) or WorthPlaying (http://www.worthdownloading.com/download.php?gid=2895&id=12258). :2thumbsup:

Hepcat

09-07-2007, 23:53

Oh yeah, Mafia, haven't played it for a few months but that was a game I loved. The story is one of the best ever in my opinion and I always like the setting of 1930s America. :2thumbsup:

Tran

09-08-2007, 14:02

Is it just me, or Mafia is an unfinished and somewhat boring game? I mean, yes at first I could play endlessly trying to complete missions and free ride stuff. But after that, maybe only one to two hours playing free-ride with many supposedly "enterable buildings" in the mission are not available, literally no "special mission" available, and the same repeated AI scene/activity nearly all over the place...

They even took out a supposedly available "racing feature" within the game (you can view it with editor). Hope they don't repeat these again. So far, GTA looks better for me :yes:

econ21

09-08-2007, 14:30

Is it just me, or Mafia is an unfinished and somewhat boring game?

It's just you. :laugh4: To me, it was a story-driven game - with a very well done story. I agree I would not be bothered with free ride, but to me that's like saying a chocolate bar is rubbish after you've eaten what's inside the wrapper.

Maybe they could spend more time creating a "world" you can freely interact with. But personally I find that Morrowind/Oblivion style game a little empty. I'd rather have them spend the time on a strong story, characterisation and gripping missions. From the Mafia 2 trailer, I have strong hopes they will.

My only complaints are that a few of the missions were too hard (esp. the race) and the hotel assassination/mass cop killing mission seemed jarringly out of place, both in the story and in terms of the gameplay.

Tran

09-08-2007, 14:55

It's just you. :laugh4: To me, it was a story-driven game - with a very well done story. I agree I would not be bothered with free ride, but to me that's like saying a chocolate bar is rubbish after you've eaten what's inside the wrapper.

Maybe they could spend more time creating a "world" you can freely interact with. But personally I find that Morrowind/Oblivion style game a little empty. I'd rather have them spend the time on a strong story, characterisation and gripping missions. From the Mafia 2 trailer, I have strong hopes they will.

My only complaints are that a few of the missions were too hard (esp. the race) and the hotel assassination/mass cop killing mission seemed jarringly out of place, both in the story and in terms of the gameplay.
The "free-ride / free roam feature" is exactly why I bought the game in the first place, if perhaps they integrated both story mission and free-ride level it would be better. But it didn't happen. It's like you're being told that a chocolate taste nice, only to find out that it is rubbish because you had to add "some stuff" to it to be able to have a nice taste.

Never really like Oblivion anyway, it's an over-hyped game with sadly, similiar to Mafia, many supposedly in-game features removed.

GTA still rocks :2thumbsup:

Hepcat

09-09-2007, 08:54

Mailman653

09-13-2007, 20:27

Put your tommy guns back in the closet till 09.
http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/819/819118p1.html

Hepcat

09-14-2007, 10:11

Put your tommy guns back in the closet till 09.
http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/819/819118p1.html

~:mecry:
That's so depressing.

Tran

09-15-2007, 10:18

I don't really understand what you mean by the Chocolate tasting like rubbish before adding to it reference. So you don't like the free ride mode because it isn't about the campaign? But isn't the campaign what you want then?
Or maybe I'm just misunderstanding you.
Nah. Appearantly econ21 thought that Mafia was no different than rubbish chocolate, so I just added "my comment" to it :2thumbsup:

The delay actually doesn't surprise me, seeing as how the first Mafia was repeatedly delayed (for years), before it was finally and suddenly released.

econ21

09-15-2007, 10:27

Appearantly econ21 thought that Mafia was no different than rubbish chocolate,...

Not really.

To me, it was a story-driven game - with a very well done story. I agree I would not be bothered with free ride, but to me that's like saying a chocolate bar is rubbish after you've eaten what's inside the wrapper.

Tran

09-15-2007, 12:56

Hmm...you're so eager to defend yourself. You must be one of those scummy mafia. I say lynch econ21 :tongue:

Mailman653

09-26-2008, 21:21

Has there been any new MAFIA 2 news? It's been a while since I've heard anythiing on it.

Kekvit Irae

09-27-2008, 03:17

Just a quick note: Try to avoid derogatory slang.
That is all.

Bob the Insane

09-30-2008, 14:31

One of the things I enjoyed was that way the cops actually enforced the speed limit and red light signals. It added a little extra depth driving parts of the game (of course one persons "depth" is anothers "annoying"). IIRC the original top down GTA did that too, or at least the traffic signal part I think...

But the story and the set peice missions where really the key parts of the game. It came from the makers and engine for Hidden & Dangerous so it is not surprising that it was focused that way...

I am looking forward to Mafia 2 (whenever it turns up)...

Mailman653

12-15-2008, 20:52

New Mafia II trailer (http://media.pc.ign.com/media/957/957839/vids_1.html)
The 50's never looked better.

Mailman653

05-06-2009, 18:06

IGN MAFIA2 preview (https://www.youtube.com/v/mikQ43_0WPw&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&feature=player_embedded&fs=1)

Crazed Rabbit

05-06-2009, 23:32

Regenerative health?!?! :embarassed:

CR

Furunculus

05-06-2009, 23:42

Mafia was awesome, i very much look forward to the sequel provided its made by the same developer.

Husar

05-07-2009, 09:03

Mafia was awesome, i very much look forward to the sequel provided its made by the same developer.

It is, but unfortunately they made it very...modern..., like a modern shooter that is, dumbed down driving, health regeneration etc. and I'm not sure that's a good thing, I'm getting a bad feeling about this. :disappointed:

Mailman653

05-08-2009, 15:26

A day in the life (http://www.gametrailers.com/game/mafia-ii/5403) Scroll half way down.

Mailman653

06-04-2009, 02:31

Mafia II at E3 (http://e3.g4tv.com/videos/38827/Mafia-II-E3-2009-Gameplay-Footage/)

Crazed Rabbit

06-04-2009, 05:56

They change magazines after firing a single bullet - I guess they downgraded realism from Mafia I, where if you reloaded, you lost all the bullets currently in the magazine. :shame:
CR

Husar

06-04-2009, 12:31

They actually changed a lot, the cars are way more arcady, you auto-replenish health like in shooters, there is now a cover system etc. Basically it seems like generic shooter set in 1950ies now and at the same time went down on my list from must-buy to play demo first then maybe still not buy. Sad, but apparently true.
Seems like a lot of (western (financed))games are going in that direction, some generic shooter rules like auto healing, cover system and the rest is just a way to get from one explosion to the next as easy as possible. :no:
A demo could prove me wrong but I'm not going to buy this anymore without playing a demo first.

Mailman653

09-11-2009, 06:27

Way too much to repost (screens and videos) so I'll just post the link to it.

http://mafiascene.com/modules.php?name=news&nid=351
Hopefully that works.

miotas

09-11-2009, 14:11

I was quite the fan of the first game and was very dissapointed by the earlier videos, but now there is a small possibility that I might actually get it, I still think the replenishing health and unrealistic car driving are a big downgrade from the first but it's gone from no way to a maybe now. One thing I thought was awesome about the first one was that there was actually a clutch in the game, something that I've never seen in another game before or since.

Crazed Rabbit

09-11-2009, 16:31

Azathoth

09-12-2009, 03:48

Even if the driving was realistic, it was easily the most aggravating aspect of the game.

Especially the goddamned race level. :wall:

As long as the cars don't handle as easily as in GTA III, I'll be happy.

And that guy in the interview mentioned kids throwing snowballs. So, this is revolutionary: the first ever FPS where you can gun down innocent children in cold blood! That's gotta be worth something!

Husar

09-12-2009, 14:43

Even if the driving was realistic, it was easily the most aggravating aspect of the game.

Especially the goddamned race level. :wall:

It was hard, but it made me happy when I beat it.
If it had been easy then it would be like a mandatory tutorial, just another boring thing you have to do to get to the next explosion/cutscene.

Azathoth

09-13-2009, 01:11

Back when I played Mafia I still sucked at videogames. The number of times I've had to replay missions is greater than the sum of the ages of all the posters in this thread. Unless you're all really old.

This isn't the game's fault at all, but it still impacted my enjoyment negatively.

econ21

09-13-2009, 11:31

I had to download a save off the internet to bypass the race - it was just beyond me.

A couple of other driving parts of the game were very hard too - racing the yellow mobster, for example.

Thanks to the downloaded save, I finished the game. But when I tried to go back to it, I could not even do the first driving part.

An option of a lower difficulty would be good.

Husar

09-13-2009, 14:11

I gave the race several tries in the evening, then tried again next day, many times as well, until I finally won it. It was hard and took long but better than spending 50 bucks on some 8 hour thing you just blast your way through.

Azathoth

09-13-2009, 20:19

Easy can be fun too. And there should really be a variety of difficulty options in every game. Some people can breeze through at the hardest difficulty, but others might have trouble even on Easy.

For example, that Il-2 Sturmovik game that just came out for consoles? It has 3 difficulty settings, the latter two which the player must unlock. It starts off very arcadey, third person, and with many assists for the player. Then, you can do Realistic, which turns off the assists and unlimited ammo, among other things. Finally is the Simulator difficulty, which represents the hyperrealism Il-2 is known for.

Husar

09-13-2009, 22:47

I tried the demo of that one and it wasn't any fun, the plane just stalls all the time, it seems pretty crazy to have such realism settings with a console controller(hey, I tried gentle and the thing still stalled whenever I tried anything but flying straight into the ground). :dizzy2:
On the easy setting it's too easy though. :laugh4:

But yeah, letting people choose is not a bad idea, I usually like medium. :2thumbsup:

Mailman653

03-09-2010, 00:42

2K, Playboy Announce Mafia II Partnership (http://xbox360.gamespy.com/xbox-360/mafia-2/1075251p1.html)

Mailman653

03-25-2010, 17:24

MAFIA 2 to be released in August. (http://xbox360.gamespy.com/xbox-360/mafia-2/1079815p1.html)

PanzerJaeger

08-15-2010, 08:19

MAFIA 2 to be released in August. (http://xbox360.gamespy.com/xbox-360/mafia-2/1079815p1.html)

I played the demo for this game for a while last night. It's like a mod for GTAIII set in the '50s. Is it made by the same company? If not, there have to be some copyright issues at play.

Anyway, I never played the first (and can thus be unencumbered by what was changed) and I enjoy GTA, so I will be buying.

Husar

08-15-2010, 08:32

Uhm, no Panzer, it's made by 2K Czech, former Illusion Softworks, GTA is made by Rockstar and published by Take 2. Actually 2K seems to be a label of Take 2 or something like that but the developers are different ones anyway.
Gave the demo a try and wasn't impressed, the overlay keeps telling me that it's using CPU PhysX as well and it looks so much more detailed with PhysX on, but also runs so much slower.
The cars in simulation mode seem to slide like you're driving on ice, may give it another try sometime(and actually play the demo mission :laugh4: ) but so far I wasn't impressed.

Crazed Rabbit

08-15-2010, 09:08

Furunculus

08-15-2010, 10:59

i loved the first Mafia game.............. *crosses fingers*

Monk

08-15-2010, 11:01

The first game had realistic reloading - in terms of using magazines and not individual bullet counts. The new one doesn't. It does have a cover system like every other game out now, and health that replenishes a couple seconds after hiding.

Is a cover system a bad thing? I find it really helps third person games, especially when weapon damage values are balanced properly to make it feel powerful. As for the Health thing: it makes sense when you feel the weapon scaling. Pistols don't hurt enough that you need cover (unless you're after multi-enemies) but a single close shot with a shotgun, or a lucky burst from a cop with his tompson is generally all it takes and you're dead. It's easy to see why they settled on regenerating health.

Three main concerns I had deal with inconsistency:

Enemy AI is inconsistent: Enemies will constantly seek to outflank you in (non-mission) fire fights which is amazing, and encourages you to keep on the move. Kept getting surprised by cops circling around houses and hitting me from the side with machine guns. The oddity comes when some guys just stand out in the middle of the street trying to gun you down instead of running to cover.

Driving physics: Seriously. What is that? It's so incredibly awkward, maybe i just need more time with it but it feels like Husar said, driving on ice at all times.

Crowd reaction: When i fire a gun, i like to see bystanders scatter and cops rush in to make the take down. Take a game like GTA4, when you fire a gun panic hits and people start running. Maybe a few characters pull out a few pistols and return fire before the cops show up, but by and large there is immediate reaction. In the demo for Mafia 2 I saw that at times, reactions were delayed (especially in shops) by as much as two or three seconds. Felt really off.

Even with that though, I dunno I had a lot of fun with it. Actually i'd say it's the second best demo i've ever played, right behind Just Cause 2's in pure crazy fun - If i had been given more time (say 30 min) it would have easily been taken the top spot.

Crazed Rabbit

08-15-2010, 18:23

For me, the cover systems makes games seem more like arcade games where you pop out of cover, shoot, then go back into cover to reload or heal. Plus I don't like sticky cover systems. And the health system means that even a near fatal shot becomes harmless in a few seconds behind cover. There's no big incentive to avoid damage that isn't high.

I'm gonna see if I can use my logitech steering wheel in the game.

One interesting thing the game has going for it is the police/wanted mechanics. Cops don't automatically know where you are and hunt you down like GTA4, or have a set area they'll search for you in. But neither does the police presence disappear quickly. They'll keep an eye for you if you're walking around, and attack if they spot you. Couldn't really tell how long it lasted with the short demo length.

One interesting moment was when I started a shoot out with cops in the middle of the street. After shooting the first responders, some gang members came out and started attacking me, though to my knowledge I hadn't shot at them.

Before turning on the Physx (sp?!) to medium, I had an average of 45 fps in the test, and that was halved with physics on medium. Graphics wise, the game looks nicer than GTA4 at close distance, because you don't have to turn graphics down. In the distance, though, buildings don't look as nice.

CR

Monk

08-15-2010, 19:31

PanzerJaeger

08-16-2010, 06:53

From my experience gang members respond in force if you go crazy in their territory, so long as there aren't any cops around. They tend to run once the police arrive on the scene, but i've seen some instances where three-way shoot outs have broken out. Very rare but so cool when it happens.

Me too. I accidentally got into a gunfight with a bunch of gangmembers that wasn't looking like it was going to end well for me. Suddenly the police showed up and started shooting at the gangmembers, allowing me to slip away alive and without becoming 'wanted'. It was very cool and something I hadn't seen in GTA.

A Nerd

08-16-2010, 23:35

I just downloaded the demo and really enjoyed it. I liked the cover system and the regenerating health (I still got killed once :P). There was so much going on in the gun fight part if there wasn't any way to take cover or have your health regenerate, I might have died more often! I loved the environments and the interaction allowed within them. A nice attention to detail as far as damaging things, bullet holes, shell casings etc. The driving was a bit slippery, but it is just a matter of getting used to the physics. The physics might be unrealistic to some, but they are what is in the game so practice makes perfect. Didn't tool around the city too much, but might later. All in all it sold me, I plan to buy it next month. I hope there aren't too many timed missions though, I am terrible at those! :(

The MG42 was oh so much fun to use! :D

Crazed Rabbit

08-18-2010, 00:35

More on why I don't like cover systems; they are designed to work when your target is ahead of you, and it breaks down when they are to your side or rear as well. If you're ducking behind a low barrier, you have to pop up to shoot someone, even if you want to shoot someone to your side, where you don't need to stand to get a clear shot. Standing up exposes you to fire from everywhere and takes time.

I just want to be able to crouch without a wall nearby, for ()@*&(@*$&*@_$(*)*A_&@$)*@$)*@'s sake.

Still, it's fun. I've taken to trying to rob all the stores before time expires or (as is the case) dying. Anyone else find the jump from the dirt road up to the paved road?

CR

Mailman653

08-18-2010, 07:35

You know there is a weapons mod and time hack out already for the demo....

A Nerd

08-18-2010, 13:44

You know there is a weapons mod and time hack out already for the demo....

That seems alittle dishonest...10 minuets is more than enough time to get the feel for it!

Mailman653

08-18-2010, 17:24

That seems alittle dishonest...10 minuets is more than enough time to get the feel for it!

I believe over at the 2k forums it hsa been said by one of their reps that by using the time hack you are "stealing the game." It's caused quite an uproar, plus the moderators allegedly crack down on modding threads which have some people saying 2k doesn't want people modding MAFIA II.

Gregoshi

08-18-2010, 19:44

That seems alittle dishonest...10 minuets is more than enough time to get the feel for it!
Yeah, let's not go any further down this road if there are uproars about the issue elsewhere.

A Nerd

08-19-2010, 02:05

Yeah, let's not go any further down this road if there are uproars about the issue elsewhere.

K, sorry. I just am against software piracy, that is all.

I believe over at the 2k forums it hsa been said by one of their reps that by using the time hack you are "stealing the game." It's caused quite an uproar, plus the moderators allegedly crack down on modding threads which have some people saying 2k doesn't want people modding MAFIA II.

Thanks for the info and peace of mind! :)

Crazed Rabbit

08-19-2010, 09:26

I was reading that the full game would support using a wheel, as in driving games. Unfortunately, I've also heard that there is no force feedback; which makes wheels next to useless, because without even basic force feedback there's no resistance to turning the wheel.

Apparently some of the console versions - the PS3 in particular - has problems relating to absence of blood pools, grass, screen tearing.

Plus one review said the length was a short 10 hours. And it appears they may have some launch day DLC, like extra cars, they took out of the game in order to make you pay more for them.

The demo can be a lot of fun, but some of this info is worrying. Plus they seem to frown on modding. I guess they think it could detract from DLC sales.

CR

Gregoshi

08-19-2010, 14:58

K, sorry. I just am against software piracy, that is all.
No need to be sorry Nerd. I was making a general comment, not one directed at you. :bow:

Mailman653

08-19-2010, 18:50

Organization Calls Mafia II Racist, Demands Take-Two Halt Release (http://xbox360.gamespy.com/xbox-360/mafia-2/1114460p1.html)

A Nerd

08-19-2010, 18:55

Plus one review said the length was a short 10 hours. And it appears they may have some launch day DLC, like extra cars, they took out of the game in order to make you pay more for them

This is dissapointing news. 10 hours is way too short. The only way to make up for it would be to embellish the free roam part of the game. I don't know how that would be done though. I would invest in some worthwhile DLC, but if free roam is bland, then some extra cars and the like would be worthless.

No need to be sorry Nerd. I was making a general comment, not one directed at you.

Thanks for the clarification! :)

Mailman653

08-19-2010, 19:25

10 hours?:inquisitive: How long was the first game?

Monk

08-19-2010, 21:52

Organization Calls Mafia II Racist, Demands Take-Two Halt Release (http://xbox360.gamespy.com/xbox-360/mafia-2/1114460p1.html)

I Don't buy it. If we go that route then The Godfather is pure racism.

Give me a break.

Crazed Rabbit

08-20-2010, 02:42

This is dissapointing news. 10 hours is way too short. The only way to make up for it would be to embellish the free roam part of the game. I don't know how that would be done though. I would invest in some worthwhile DLC, but if free roam is bland, then some extra cars and the like would be worthless.

I do not care for launch day DLC as a general rule. And DLC that expands gameplay is generally priced higher than gameplay in the form of expansion packs.

One of the 2k people on the forum said the length was 15 hours on average. Considering they're PR hacks, that probably means the real average is less than that - and could be 10 hours.

And it's confirmed that there is no force feedback (http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1021581&highlight=force+feedback#post1021581):

Will the game support force feedback steering wheels? (It doesn't in the demo)
Not at this time – good idea though, I’ll tell the team!

Good idea? GOOD IDEA?! Has the team not heard of force feedback before? Do they know nothing of PC driving games? DID THEY FORGET ABOUT THE FORCE FEEDBACK IN MAFIA (1)?!?!

Also, no freeride:

Will there be a Freeride mode outside of the game?
No – Mafia II is a story-based game and that was what we focused on and the experience we really wanted to immerse players in.

I can't believe it. And no manual shifting as well (something else that was in Mafia).

CR

A Nerd

08-20-2010, 02:47

Also, no freeride:

That smells. I was really looking forward to this game. I guess I will save 50 dollars though. I always tend to look on the bright side of things.

Will you be able to tool around the city between missions? If this were the case, the game is still a go.

How does a DLC that offers more cars exist without a freeride mode? Assuming the campaign is set in stone.

edit: Bright side, ahhhhhhh *singing sound*, Mafia I is on steam as well! That can always placate the sense of loss over my beloved freeride mode. How dare they omit such a staple of this genre of game? There is that dreaded racing mission though...grrrrrrr...

Crazed Rabbit

08-20-2010, 02:57

I don't know how *much* you'll be able to ride around during the missions. In the original, you could ride around freely after some missions before returning home. But that's a poor substitute for the freeride mode. They're offering a lot less gameplay for the price for this sequel.

As for the DLC cars, it seems that you will simply have them in your garage from the start of the campaign.

CR

A Nerd

08-20-2010, 03:17

I don't know how you'll be able to ride around during the missions. In the original, you could ride around freely after some missions before returning home. But that's a poor substitute for the freeride mode. They're offering a lot less gameplay for the price for this sequel.

As for the DLC cars, it seems that you will simply have them in your garage from the start of the campaign.

I just assumed that a mission would involve starting at point A, then driving to point B where the mission would start. Thus, you could tool around the city inbetween. Or, in a similar fashion to GTA and the original Mafia if I recall correctly, you could drive around all you wanted when a mission ended before you initiate a new mission. This would be acceptable to me, although a freeride mode would be better, you take what you can get. How would one learn the layout of the city when you had to go from mission to mission? Does that lame line appear on the map when you have mission objectives thus limiting freedom? How large is the city exactly? The size of a postage stamp?! From what you have stated, the game is starting to sound like a rail-driven FPS! BLECH!

DLC cars in the garage...cars you can only drive for a minuet or so as you go from mission objective to mission objective...I say again...BLECH!

Ah, but the temptation remains...

Crazed Rabbit

08-20-2010, 03:41

Whoops, missed the word 'much'. I would agree that most missions would involve driving from point A to point B at some point. However, there might be limitations on how much you can 'roam' during that time - like a timer counting down to when you have to arrive. And it seems likely there will be a line on the map leading you to your next objective all the time.

From what I've seen, the demo area is 1/6 or 1/5 of the whole city, which seems much smaller thatn GTA4.

I can't see any reason to not have freeride in. Well, any good reason. Apparently there's launch day DLC missions that will have more 'free roam' aspects than the regular missions. The cynical part of me wonders when they'll announce the DLC that gives the freeride option.

CR

Husar

08-20-2010, 13:50

Uhm, not gonna get this.

I've been eagerly awaiting it two or three years ago and after all those delays they have nothing to offer than cars on ice and 10 hours of story mode? Mafia 1 may have only taken me longer because I had to reload every mission a lot but at least that kept me busy for a while, I don't like paying 50 bucks for 10 hours of gameplay, maybe I'll get this once there's some special edition with all the DLC for 30 or so, just like I'm apparently doing with DA:O and ME2. :shrug:

Monk

08-20-2010, 15:37

The lack of free roam in a sandbox game is death. I'll pass, despite the amount of fun I had in the demo.

A Nerd

08-20-2010, 16:14

I was geatly entertained by the demo. I would think timing rides inbetween missions would be somewhat lame and not going to happen. I would also shell out the money (despite the dumb and perhaps greedy way of not including it in the original) for the free ride mode. I think I might make a gamble and buy this game anyway. Hopefully I choose wisely!

I could have sworn that I remember it being stated in the demo that the 'activity' in the demo did not necessarially represent what would happen in the purchased main game. Perhaps that is something to be happy about? There were also icons, as I noted, on the map denoting places to go that were not related to the mission. For instance, I thought I saw an icon that looked like a gun as I drove along that red line. The size of the city is irrelevant to me, as long as you can go about it between missions while not being rushed. To timed trips between missions only to have you teleport to the mission objectve would void out the necessity of the drive itself. Oh, and I live in New England, I am used to icy roads! :P

Mailman653

08-20-2010, 19:35

Are they serious? No Freefride? In otherwords if we beat the game in 10-15 hrs, that's it.

Then again....It could be very similiar to GTA. Drive around and do whatever, and when you want to do a mission talk to the person or go to the location indicated.

Crazed Rabbit

08-22-2010, 02:39

I don't think it will be like GTA in being able to choose when to do missions; it will probably be more like the original game where whenever you are in the world you have a specific mission to go to and accomplish.

Also, they patched the demo so the timer freeze doesn't work anymore...or so I heard. And since Valve screwed up the latest l4d2 update and it CTD's in less than five minutes every time I play, my action game options have become suddenly limited.

Apparently the "DLC" is included in the physical DVD - so you aren't downloading anything, just paying to unlock content on the disk you already bought. Some of the DLC - like the jeep - is even accessible (to clever coding types) in the demo.

I could've lived with the dumbed-down firearms and cover system and replenishing health. But no freeride and DLC that's just a poke in the eye?

I loved you, Mafia. But your sequel, I cannot live with.

CR

A Nerd

08-22-2010, 02:46

I don't think it will be like GTA in being able to choose when to do missions; it will probably be more like the original game where whenever you are in the world you have a specific mission to go to and accomplish.

I could have sworn you had to check in with Don Salieri before you started a mission. Or perhaps another if the case justified. Thus progressing the story. When a mission was started as well, I don't recall having a time restraint in which to reach my objective. Though I haven't played Mafia I in quite some time. How would one learn and enjoy the city layout?!

I too am disappointed...but still tempted. I might not buy upon release, but I might still buy later after I have heard some opinions. Well, if I agree with the opinions I have heard.

Mailman653

08-22-2010, 06:14

I'm tempted myself, I want that pre-order stuff from Gamestop.

naut

08-22-2010, 16:13

No freeride? 10 hours of gameplay? Cover systems? Regenerating health? Pass.

Mailman653

08-22-2010, 20:49

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=sv&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gamereactor.se%2Frecensioner%2F23768%2FMafia%2BII%2F
Swedish Mafia review, translated into English. 9/10

A 13 hour short adventure...
I'm still wondering, how long was the first game approx?

A Nerd

08-22-2010, 21:01

Sounds like playing a movie sort of. This might be appealing to some. His description of the city makes me think you might have some time to explore it. The missions sound fun as well. I just wonder about replayability, especially for the 50 dollar price tag. Tempted, but will wait for opinions. Though once I get something in my mind, it is hard to get it out again.

Mailman653

08-23-2010, 19:57

Miss Hungry 2007 review (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rM_nzNPiQQ)
IGN review (http://pc.ign.com/articles/111/1115076p1.html)
Worth Playing review (http://worthplaying.com/article/2010/8/23/reviews/76381/)
Gamepro review (http://www.gamepro.com/article/reviews/216220/mafia-2/)
PALGN review (http://palgn.com.au/pc-gaming/17101/mafia-2-review/)

A Nerd

08-23-2010, 20:11

Mailman653

08-23-2010, 20:22

IMO, it would be nice if someone compared and contrasted it to the first game and not GTA.

Monk

08-23-2010, 23:48

I read a few. Seems to be quite linear. The city only exists along a given route, you can go anywhere, but there is really little point. Perhaps some future DLC will liven it up? Otherwise, I think I will hold off and read customer opinions/reviews. Thanks for the links by the way, very informative!

I don't hate DLC, in fact you could say I am the kind of customer that's caused developers to move toward DLC since I eat it up in regards to certain games. Bioware and Mass Effect 2 in particular, but DLC should never be the only way a game world feels complete. I should be able to play a game through from start to finish and enjoy it fully without the need to download anything extra.

If the developers wanted to make a third-person, narrative driven shooter then they should have made one. Being linear is only a bad thing when you try to pretend your game is something it's not, which is what Mafia 2 feels like to me.

A Nerd

08-24-2010, 00:07

I don't hate DLC, in fact you could say I am the kind of customer that's caused developers to move toward DLC since I eat it up in regards to certain games. Bioware and Mass Effect 2 in particular, but DLC should never be the only way a game world feels complete. I should be able to play a game through from start to finish and enjoy it fully without the need to download anything extra.

If the developers wanted to make a third-person, narrative driven shooter then they should have made one. Being linear is only a bad thing when you try to pretend your game is something it's not, which is what Mafia 2 feels like to me.

The game is incomplete, I agree. Also, it is a quite expensive considering it is Mafia II when Mafia I was probably the same price but much more content wise. In other words, it shouldn't be based on Mafia I and use this as a selling point when the game falls short of what the predecessor was. I again agree that the game shouldn't be touted as something it isn't, ie. real world city (that they say is breathtaking and full of life) that only functions when you adhere to the chosen path. Again, calling it a Mafia game when Mafia I was nothing like this. The story and gunplay might be engaging, but again, we fall back to cashing in on the previous title. However, where we stray from like opinion is where I feel the game is good but could be better. A reasonably priced DLC that livens up the city and offers a free ride mode for a linear shooter that I found entertaining would be a good thing to me. I wonder how this would be done assuming the coding is set in stone, but for the sake of argument let's assume that it is possible. Perhaps 50 dollars is a bit much for a game that says it is better than Mafia I considering it's shortcomings, but alot of FPSs that are similar to Mafia II are realatively the same price (as far as I know). Therefore, if I enjoyed the game for what it is, despite the prequel having more substance, I would shell out some money for a DLC that offered more substance to the linear experience I bought and enjoyed. Perhaps I am selling out to a greedy game developer, but that is the choice I will more than likely make (if I buy the game and enjoy it). :)

I have never been one to express my opinion with much structure of content, hopefully this makes some sense!

Mailman653

08-24-2010, 02:44

Well, I caved and pre-ordered it. I'll probably get it in a week, ha ha ha. Hopefully some good news comes out during that week while I wait.

A Nerd

08-24-2010, 17:10

Well, I caved and pre-ordered it. I'll probably get it in a week, ha ha ha. Hopefully some good news comes out during that week while I wait.

I will have many questions for you! ;)

edit: and I hope you like it!

Forward Observer

08-25-2010, 03:50

Here's another review from Eurogamer. Sorry to say panned it pretty badly---giving it only a 4 out of 10. ---and wouldn't you just know that my copy just arrived today by UPS. Oh well---at least I had a $20 discount coupon from Amazon for pre-ordering Red dead Redemption, so I'm only out $29.99 US.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2010-08-23-mafia-ii-review?page=2

Maybe it will have some redeeming value and maybe they will offer a free roam as a future DLC--one can hope.

Cheers

Mailman653

08-25-2010, 04:41

The Eurogamer sites are divided between themselves:

eurogamer.fr - 10/10
eurogamer.cz - 9/10
eurogamer.it - 8/10
eurogamer.net - 4/10

A Nerd

08-25-2010, 18:46

I was hoping one of you guys would have tried it by now. I am eager for some impressions! I am on the fence, but even the 4/10 rating write-up still made it sound appealing to me.

Forward Observer

08-26-2010, 01:23

I only got to play about an hour last night, but so far it was quite entertaining and the game play seemed very much like Mafia I. The tutorial aspect of it is more integrated into the game story than the first.

The 1st chapter actually involves some combat in Sicily during the war II.

The background music is quite fun since it is all period stuff like Bing Crosby, the Andrews Sisters, and big Band--at least for the war years. Obviously from the demo, you know it progresses to rock and roll in the 50's. However, unlike the first game there is no haunting memorable main theme that I could detect. The intro is simply cut scenes using the game engine narrated by Vito telling of his family coming to in America from Sicily and how he grew up.

I thought the driving was fine although I have not changed yet to simulation mode. In the first game, I used a joystick (it was the only way I could beat that damn race mission), and I will try to do that tonight.

In the early game it is winter in the city so all the streets are covered with ice and snow, but I did not feel like I was sliding around that much--it may be more pronounced in simulation mode. Last night I was doing pretty well only using the WASD keys to drive with. There are several driving views just like the first including one from inside the cab although driving in 3rd person mode makes it easier to maneuver through intersections and traffic.

The only downside so far is that one may not really have any empathy for Vito as they might have had for the main character Tommy in the first game. I think that may be because in the first game the prologue has Tommy meeting a detective in secret to offer inform on his bosses to protect and get immunity for his family.

In this game Vito seems to have no moral center at all, and he seems pretty much willing to do anything criminal that will be asked of him. He does have a mother and sister to help, and maybe that will come into play at some point. However, from the Eurogamer review I posted, the reviewer pretty much said the same thing about the main character of the game

More later.

Paradox

08-26-2010, 11:36

I'll be getting the game soon, probably tomorrow. I have played the demo though, and it's quite impressive. I'm surprised how underrated this is, but the reviews for it aren't bad. It really captures the time period and that hasn't been done a lot in next-gen consoles. I'm talking about the console version of course, I don't know about PC. I still haven't figured out how "simulation" driving option works.

According to most reviews, it's the story that makes Mafia II such a great game, just not GOTY potential.

A Nerd

08-26-2010, 17:09

I broke down and downloaded the game yesterday. Put in two hours and didn't want to stop! I found the few missions I had done so far engaging and the city was full of life, despite some reviews saying it was dead off the beaten path. You can dilly-dally around the city between missions, making your own free ride if you want. And there are things to do, such as restuaraunts, bars, gas stations, clothing stores, gun shops and places to sell stolen cars. I started to upgrade one car and will continue to do so as I earn more money. The police aren't very vigiliant as far as chasing you when you are wanted, but any more than they are and 'free ride' might be hindered somewhat. I like the lock picking minigame, though there is no negative effect should you just opt to break the window, none that I have seen anyway. Took me 2 hours to get half way thru chapter 3 so, we will see if the game seems too short or not. I don't mind the red line on the map that tells you how to get to mission objectives either. It changes depending the route you take. All in all it's fun, I wonder what DLC will be available in time!

Mailman653

08-28-2010, 00:21

https://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b344/Officerpuppy_/M2/Ghost.jpg
Doesn't look like they are hiring right now.

Mailman653

08-29-2010, 20:37

I am enjoying the game so far. Although the missions feel a bit short, at least from what I've played. I'm currently on Chapter 5 I think.

A Nerd

08-30-2010, 01:29

I am enjoying the game so far. Although the missions feel a bit short,

I agree. I am playing on normal difficulty, I wonder if there would be anymore enemy AI on hard? I spend alot of time driving around the city having gun battles with the police and the like. Robbing stores, selling cars, exploring, going postal, etc. I found one wanted poster and two pin-ups, I am in chapter 6. I have put in ten hours already! Missions could have had alittle more depth though.

naut

09-01-2010, 06:36

Review by a mate of mine:

Mafia 2 Review: Take the most violent modern times in the US, with all the 'bootlegging' and extortion, prohibition’s effects are still fresh in the memory and WWII surplus weapons and ammunition are bountiful. Lets combine this with a time frame from 1944 till around 1954 – a ten year gap where loads of political and artistic transformations occur – most notably the massive crackdown on organized crime and the rock n roll revolution. With all this in mind, let’s take a few final sources of inspiration from fantastic mobster movies like The Godfather I and II, The Goodfella’s and Scarface. Does this not sound like an unreal game? Not to mention the GTA clone sandbox; hordes of vintage cars, aesthetics in clothing/decor/post-war propaganda/music: this sounds like a fantastic setting to act as Capone did back in the 1930’s, or as Vitto Corleone in The Godfather? The idea is solid; watertight even – the execution however, really disappointed me.

Graphically, the game is good; details in the cars, and posters on walls even down to floating bits of trash which catch the breeze – all of this is done very well. Apart from a few texture loads, and the occasional screen tearing between cinematic to gameplay; the graphics are rock solid. Audio plays a massive role in a ‘period piece’; and the good people at 2K and 2K Czech have done their up-most to really immerse the player in the environment; authenticating the radio’s static to the announcers wacky over-the-top antics as all good 50’s radio hosts did. Mind you, commending 2K with immersion is a little like applauding a BioWare game for its strong, rich narrative – yes they do it well, but then that’s what made 2K famous. See, BioShock, Borderlands and Civ. 4.

In terms of Gameplay; this is where Mafia II takes a turn into the wrong neighbourhood, breaks down, then gets beaten up and mugged by Greasers. Cars handle like shopping trolleys with one wheel; gunplay is way WAY too easy, the developers ...focused far too fiercely on useless details such as ‘turn light on/off’, ‘turn faucet on/off’ among other similar ‘mechanics’ which are not need at all. To top it all off the game is just one long in-game cinematic with tiny bits of aimless driving, a sandbox world which feels tacked on much like that of Wolfenstein. Sure you can go wherever you want; so long as it’s in the general area of your next objective. Not that you would really want to do much else less than go to your next objective – I found that the gunplay, car chases and even the methods of avoiding police were all a joke. Not only is it impossible to drive, you cannot shoot whilst driving – and if you’re on a mission where ‘Joe’ (stereotypical Italian Mafioso “ayeee.... faggedaboudit...” kind of character) and he is shooting at *insert bad guy* then your out of luck because he couldn’t hit air with the millions of bullets he fires from his barrel-drum Thompson. Even whilst quite literally on top of the enemy car, it STILL took him 3 or 4 hundred rounds to shoot the guy – even though he was driving a roofless car...

Gameplay aside, the narrative is good. Great even – with brilliant locations to visit, all with their own uniqueness to it. The game starts brilliantly, pitting the recently incarcerated, then drafted Vitto Scaletta (that’s the player by the way) against Mussolini’s soldiers in Sicily. From here, to Empire Bay – the New York replica which is 1/10th the size; where you journey from rags, to riches, to gaol, to rags to riches to... well I won’t ruin the ending.

If 2K had tweaked the driving to not be horrible, made the sandbox world an actual sandbox and, well, overall made a better gameplay mechanic – Mafia 2 would have been Game of the Year no question. The narrative was brilliant, locations, characters and even subtle nuances were all done superbly. The cars and the gunplay let it down. But mostly the cars. :daisy: cars.