m:tw battles v s:tw battles (which do you prefer)

[AlanH_30]

Just wondering what your views are on Medievals battles compared to Shoguns.

Can anyone tell me if the battle engine used in Medieval is a direct port from Shogun or was it re-written from scratch?

[ToranagaSama]

IMO, its too early to tell, but then I suppose it depends, whether your talking MP or SP.

I couldn't comment on MP.

On SP, like I said too early to definitively comment as the variety of units is FAR greater than STW.

Though tactics are fairly similar, high ground and mucho arrows, the play is somewhat different.

For example, the spear throughing cavalry (Jinnetes, I think) are a PITA. No equivilent in STW, unless those spear chucking Koreans in STW:MI are similar. I wouldn't know as I got MI quite late and then MTW came out.

One comment though, personally, give me Samuri and "The Way" over Chivalric Europeans any day.

[Inferno]

I've found MTW to be a bit harder than STW, which is a good thing. This may be partially due to me not being as familiar with the units and their strengths/weaknesses, but MTW is definitely a bit tougher.

[Hertston]

Have to say I prefer the battles in Shogun (though the Medieval strat game is far superior).

It's hard to say, I just prefer the unit mixes I think - it just seems more tactical finesse is possible. Not to mention the totally different approach the Mongols require - all the Medieval factions seem very "samey" to me. Sure you have a lot more units, but most have similar if not identical stats to many others and are used in an identical fashion - just national variations that look much the same anyway.

Shogun just had class in the battles, and I'd happily have paid full price for them alone. Medieval is all about the strat game for me with the battles as an extra - I really can't see me doing much MP with M:TW. The battles don't stand on their own in the same way.

As to the original question, it's very much the same engine. A few tweaks to gameplay and graphics (scenery is better, soldiers are not noticeably improved). It says in the manual somewhere they play differently - they do, but not that differently.



[This message has been edited by Hertston (edited 09-05-2002).]

[ToranagaSama]

Is it just me, the STW battles seem to be a lot more "fun". The additions and improvements to STW:MI was even more fun. Loved the Naginta (sp?) Cav!

MTW battles are a bit more like work, somewhat enjoyable work, something you need to master, but still a bit of a chore to endure quickly so you can get back to the Strat Map!

[Draksen]

perhaps too early to answer but ...

I like both.
MTW is clearly the "next generation", an improved STW.

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"De gueules aux deux léopards d'or, armés et lampassés d'azur, passant l'un sur l'autre."

[Iced~Metal]

Maybe because STW didn't have too much to do on the map, that's why the battles are so enjoyed. And because it was a unique game in its own class, it leaves a bigger impression on your minds.

[Draksen]

Do you mean that MTW is NOT a unique game ?
or ?
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

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"De gueules aux deux léopards d'or, armés et lampassés d'azur, passant l'un sur l'autre."

[ltj]

Quote Originally posted by Hertston:
(scenery is better, soldiers are not noticeably improved).
[/QUOTE]

i'd have to disagree with you there. the soldier sprites look MUCH better in m:tw.

[bruteztrausen]

The soldiers fight more realistic in medieval and the soldiers are more similar to the human body than the samurai of shogun.
The battles are like braveheart and the soldiers look big , not than shogun who were very little.

[Ottoman]

Generals in MTW are very exagarated. I had a rebel general that took me 10 min. to kill with hundreds of troops.
On the contrary, in Samurai armies, Generals and officers had much better training than normal footsoldiers, and i never had any problems with any generals in STW.

[Orda Khan]

The only way I would improve Shogun is have cavalry break formation while on the move, then reform at their destination.
How can anyone say Shogun sprites are not detailed?
I've not played MTW yet but if the sprites are the same as the demo then it will be a disappointment.

........Orda

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" Send us your ambassadors and thus we shall judge whether you wish to be at peace with us or at war..if you make war on us the Everlasting God, who makes easy what was difficult and makes near what was far, knows that we know what our power is."

[Dionysus9]

I really liked Shogun, but if you notice, I'm playing MTW now. Its still too early to say which I prefer, but with all of the fixes and additions to the interface in MTW, it will be hard to go back to the old "group" system of STW...

I am looking forward to a Shogun Mod for MTW, using the same units and stats as 1.02 or 1.03.... it would be the best of both worlds.

[Puzz3D]

You've got a considerably stronger rock, paper, scissors in WE/MI v103 than in MTW which gives you sharper tactics between infantry, ranged and cavalry units. MTW represents a return to original STW type gameplay where infantry is the most important tactical arm, but with the addition of better and more survivable cav than in STW. The improvements to the battle engine certainly gives the edge to MTW, and units fight long enough so there is plenty of time to send other units around for flank attacks.

The battle engine is the same, but has some enhancements such as, the ability to disengage, combat bonus for fighting in multiple ranks for many unit types, shields with front to back modelling and less rigid hold formation. There may be some other improvements that I missed.

[Cheetah]

I have played only mods for the demo battle so far, so the full game night be diffferent. However, based on what I have seen I agree with Yuuki:

Quote Originally posted by Puzz3D:
You've got a considerably stronger rock, paper, scissors in WE/MI v103 than in MTW which gives you sharper tactics between infantry, ranged and cavalry units. [/QUOTE]

and IMO this holds not just for 1.03 but for 1.02 as well (I know Yuuki that you love 1.03 http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif As far as I can see MTW is more realistic but (or perhaps exactly because of this) lacks the crisp logic of STW/MI battles. STW/MI has much fewer units but each unit has its place in the rock-paper-scissor system. In MTW the RPS system is more fuzzy, and IMO there is more stress on the "elite" unit types (various knights, ghulam cav, etc).

[MagyarKhans Cham]

in my Khans op[inion the sprites of teh unist in twm are much better than the demo and better than stw. some units even look a bit photographic.

the overall battle engine is better now, more realistic. although a bit harder to control.