View Full Version : Utah Says: Gay Uncle No Good, Break Up the Family and Dump the Kids in Foster Care
This story (http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/10/meanwhile_in_utah) really makes me want to scream.
A woman that can’t care for her four children—she’s got a drug problem, the father is not on the scene—begged her uncle to take in her children. He’s already raising two children but he did the right thing and took in his niece’s four children—kids that range in age from 10 months to 11 years old. Enter the state of Utah. The man that took in his niece’s four kids is gay and lives with a male partner. The state of Utah wants to remove the four children from the home of Michael Gregg Valdez—he’s the uncle—and Michael Oberg and put them in foster care. [...]
The men have been together for five years, both are natives of Utah, both are employed, and neither has a criminal history. The state will have to split the four siblings up if it succeeds in removing from their uncles’ home; it’s almost impossible to find a foster home that will take four children. [...]
Finding foster parents for four siblings ranging in age from 10 months to 11 years is nearly impossible. Finding adoptive parents for a sibling group that large is utterly impossible. But the law in Utah is clear: These four children should be tossed into the foster care system, potentially separated from each other for the rest of their lives, and if their mother loses custody permanently, denied any chance of a stable home. Because it would be illegal to place these children in the care of a loving, stable same-sex couple that they’re related to.
As a parent, I can only imagine the fear and pain the kids must be feeling at the prospect of being separated and removed from their family. What a mess. What a nightmare for the kids.
Strike For The South
10-06-2007, 05:00
WOW
Crazed Rabbit
10-06-2007, 05:21
Sounds terrible.
But that said - The Stranger?! Come on, that's a liberal 'alternate' newspaper from Seattle. And by that I mean they don't even try to be objective, like mainstream papers.
Why not link to the original article:
http://www.heraldextra.com/content/view/238993/1/ ?
Or did it not have enough Utah-bashing? The law says that even if the uncle were straight, he couldn't adopt the kids if he was living with a girlfriend.
CR
But that said - The Stranger?! Come on, that's a liberal 'alternate' newspaper from Seattle. And by that I mean they don't even try to be objective, like mainstream papers.
I don't know jack about The Stranger, but I've always been fond of Dan Savage. Good writer. I'll take his summation and link to it as I please. Screams of "Bias!" will be noted and ignored.
If the couple were heterosexual, they would have an easy solution to the law: get married. Utah just passed a constitutional amendment preventing this couple from doing so. 'Cause they're so pro-family, and all that.
I can only see two legal solutions to keep their family together: Move to another state, or hope the judge will do an end-run around the law by appointing the uncle "guardian," a status not covered by the idiot law. Even that won't stand up to a protracted legal assault, though.
They're going to have to quit their jobs and change states if they want to do right by their blood relations.
Sounds terrible.
But that said - The Stranger?! Come on, that's a liberal 'alternate' newspaper from Seattle. And by that I mean they don't even try to be objective, like mainstream papers.
Why not link to the original article:
http://www.heraldextra.com/content/view/238993/1/ ?
Or did it not have enough Utah-bashing? The law says that even if the uncle were straight, he couldn't adopt the kids if he was living with a girlfriend.
CR
But if he was living with a girlfriend who wanted to marry him, as is the case here, there wouldn't be a problem at all.
Indirectly, at least, it does seem to be because they're gay :wall:
AntiochusIII
10-06-2007, 06:15
Prosecutors with ambitions don't care about such trifles as humanity, compassion, and common sense. :yes:
Edit: Oh, and in before "sensible people" start pointing out the thousand flaws in the case, promoting States' rights, Democracy (Utah voted for anti-gay legislation after all), and all the Good Things of Good Old America.
Crazed Rabbit
10-06-2007, 08:12
I don't know jack about The Stranger, but I've always been fond of Dan Savage. Good writer.
Throws in enough chum for the swarm, I suppose? If we're to discuss issues, you'd think we'd want an objective basis. Mr. Savage is a opinion writer, with a very liberal bent and hardly a great deal of eloquence to appeal to anyone but the left. Heck, he got angry when the top Seattle Times editor scolded his employees for cheering at Rove's resignation. Apparently, objectivity isn't so important when you really hate a guy; Mr. Savage wrote that even Mr. Rove's spit "was a lie". Not exactly rational.
I'll take his summation and link to it as I please. Screams of "Bias!" will be noted and ignored.
Bah. Like the left isn't fond of crying bias when something isn't from The Guardian, or *Gasp!*, Fox News.
If the couple were heterosexual, they would have an easy solution to the law: get married. Utah just passed a constitutional amendment preventing this couple from doing so. 'Cause they're so pro-family, and all that.
It's a bad law that doesn't allow relatives to adopt. But you think that marrying is some trivial matter? Hey honey- I want to adopt my sister's kids, so let's get married!
I can only see two legal solutions to keep their family together: Move to another state, or hope the judge will do an end-run around the law by appointing the uncle "guardian," a status not covered by the idiot law. Even that won't stand up to a protracted legal assault, though.
They're going to have to quit their jobs and change states if they want to do right by their blood relations.
The law does not just affect gays, and no matter how you try to spin marriage as some easy weekend fix, it affects straight people as well. All you have to do is make an exemption for relatives.
CR
The law does not just affect gays, and no matter how you try to spin marriage as some easy weekend fix, it affects straight people as well. All you have to do is make an exemption for relatives.
No, that's not good enough. This is about gay marriage, damn it! Legalization of it would be the only acceptable outcome. :wink:
Screams of "Bias!" will be noted and ignored.Neat, I've got to start posting stories from rushlimbaugh.com . :beam:
InsaneApache
10-06-2007, 09:00
That's so sad. Sad for the kiddies, sad for their mum and sad for their uncle. He obviously loves them, otherwise he wouldn't have taken them in.
I just fail to see what your personal sexual orientation has to do with bringing up children in a loving household. :dizzy2:
Unless....Oh Noes! their uncle is a poof and the kids might 'catch' it! It rubs off you know. 'Tis true. Never, ever pick up a glass/cup/spoon etc that a gay has touched. Your wife will never walk the same again.
It would be pathetic if it wasn't so serious. :thumbsdown:
Terrible and all but they are in foster care because she is on drugs.
The law says that even if the uncle were straight, he couldn't adopt the kids if he was living with a girlfriend.
Way to make this a gay issue. It might not the be the most elegant solution though, but this is just one sad case. One sad case vs gays adopting kids, I'll take this one sad case over that. Flush the heroin.
CR, Savage is a very funny writer. Reading his Savage Love column kept me laughing through many a boring lunch break. His politics are left, sure, but that doesn't stop him from being hilarious. P.J. O'Rourke's politics are right, and that doesn't stop him from being funny either. Hate on him all you like, however.
But you think that marrying is some trivial matter? Hey honey- I want to adopt my sister's kids, so let's get married!
The law does not just affect gays, and no matter how you try to spin marriage as some easy weekend fix, it affects straight people as well.
The process of marrying is trivial, in terms of effort required. You can get married tomorrow at the courthouse. Getting your driver's license is much more involved process.
If you have been living with your girlfriend for five years, already had two kids, and had already taken in four of your sister's kids, then yeah, I don't think marrying the woman who had been through that with you would be a big issue. Anybody who's willing to raise kids with you has already jumped through the hardest hoop on that front.
Neat, I've got to start posting stories from rushlimbaugh.com . :beam:
And this would change the tenor of your posts how, exactly?
-edit-
Xiahou, CR, you're very interested in pulling at threads on the margins, but I can't help but note you haven't had much of anything to say about the reality of the situation. "Change the law" won't help in time for this family. Do you have any bright ideas, any reaction to the actual subject at all?
Del Arroyo
10-06-2007, 17:24
Well, aren't you also proposing a law change, Lemur? I don't think the point of this discussion is to come up with a plan of action to help the kids, the only angle people like us would be interested in (because we are not the judge or the lawyers involved) would be possible changes to the law.
Crazed Rabbit
10-06-2007, 17:39
I've given you my reaction, Lemur:
Sounds terrible.
It's a bad law that doesn't allow relatives to adopt.
I've said the law should be changed. It'd be good if the judge kept the kids at the Uncle's house.
What more am I supposed to do? Should I gnash my teeth and tear my cybernetic hair? Bash Utah a bit, demand gay marriage? That seems to be what this is about.
CR
Sasaki Kojiro
10-06-2007, 17:39
No, that's not good enough. This is about gay marriage, damn it! Legalization of it would be the only acceptable outcome. :wink:
Neat, I've got to start posting stories from rushlimbaugh.com . :beam:
What do you think about the family being broken up and sent to foster homes?
HoreTore
10-06-2007, 17:41
My opinion of the US is getting trashed these days. First that curfew law, now this.
This is simply moronic. And yes, it is a gay issue. The kids would NOT have gone into foster care if they were straight, as they would have the option of getting a quick marriage to solve everything.
But then, gay people are horrible sinners who will all burn in hell for eternity, I guess... So much for love thy neighbor...
woad&fangs
10-06-2007, 17:47
My opinion of the US is getting trashed these days. First that curfew law, now this.
Don't base your view of the USA off of Utah. It's a state run by a religious cult. But yeah, there is a lot of stupid laws in the US.
What more am I supposed to do? Should I gnash my teeth and tear my cybernetic hair?
That would be way cool. I'll give you five bucks if you'll do it.
HoreTore
10-06-2007, 18:09
Don't base your view of the USA off of Utah. It's a state run by a religious cult. But yeah, there is a lot of stupid laws in the US.
The curfew was in Florida... Which I thought was a rather european place, kinda like new york or something.
woad&fangs
10-06-2007, 18:12
The curfew was in Florida... Which I thought was a rather european place, kinda like new york or something.
I know that the curfew wasn't in Utah. I've never heard Florida referred to as european though.
HoreTore
10-06-2007, 18:17
I know that the curfew wasn't in Utah. I've never heard Florida referred to as european though.
Well, european as in liberal :yes:
woad&fangs
10-06-2007, 18:24
Well, european as in liberal :yes:
They are split nearly 50/50 between democrats and republicans. They were the state that kept having the recount in the 2000 election. George Bush's little brother is governor of Florida(or at least he was, I don't know who is now).
Back to topic.
Most of the gay/bi people I know are pretty awsome and I see no reason why he shouldn't be allowed to take care of them. Actually, I just found out that a girl I've been friends with for about 4 years is bi. That kind of shows how little a persons sexuality matters in what kind of person they are.
Samurai Waki
10-06-2007, 19:11
I've come to the conclusion in my life, that at some point most Women are Bi.
However, this is a real tragedy and shows that Fear almost always trumps rationality.
IrishArmenian
10-08-2007, 03:31
Prosecutors with ambitions don't care about such trifles as humanity, compassion, and common sense. :yes:
I couldn't agree with you more, Antiochus.
Papewaio
10-08-2007, 03:36
For family I'd move state and/or country. Keeping family together is more important then where they are living.
ajaxfetish
10-09-2007, 04:12
Not a proud moment to be a Utahn. My state has a very deep anti-gay bias, which I don't see going away anytime soon. Of course we also have a very strong pro-family bias, but it seems it's not strong enough to overcome the anti-gay one. I'm glad to see the judge is a little more open-minded, and hopefully he can keep the family together. My family had a run-in with DCFS years ago. I wouldn't trust them to take care of a hamster, let alone human children.
And re: Waldinger, two things. First, as far as HoreTore is concerned, America is a state run by a religious cult. Why shouldn't he base his view on Utah. Second, Florida, for all it's 50/50 Republican/Democrat, is one of the two other states listed (along with Mississippi) that outright bans homosexual parents, though theirs is more explicit than Utah's.
Ajax
HoreTore
10-09-2007, 07:18
First, as far as HoreTore is concerned, America is a state run by a religious cult.
Nah, I do know that there is some hope for you yet ~;)
I'd say "capitalist cult" is more fitting.
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