This is real Rap [Archive]

naut

10-09-2007, 09:53

HoreTore here, lyrics (http://www.lyrics007.com/Immortal%20Technique%20Lyrics/Dance%20With%20the%20Devil%20Lyrics.html) via Google. ~;)

Deep stuff.
I beg to differ, its all narrative until the last stanza, and even then it is not exactly enlightening. It's just a disturbing story, that briefly offers insight into the harsh realities of "ghetto" life and closes with a "clever" yet clichéd resolution. It is however better than the usual crap that rappers usually talk about, e.g. their hummers and hos etcetera. But, if you want something truly deep, read a Robert Frost poem, or a T.S. Eliot poem, or an Alexander Pope poem, hell listen to some Pink Floyd, I can pick out plenty songs with much greater depth in their lyrics.

Note this is simply my meagre and humble opinion, and I hope that it didn't sound aggressive.

Husar

10-09-2007, 12:46

It's a sad story. :no:

The Celtic Viking

10-09-2007, 13:38

Yeah, heard this one before. Great song, great artist. His other songs (that I've heard) are a little bit different though. They're a little bit more... political. Like "The 4th Branch", "Bin Laden", "The Poverty of Philosophy" etc. Good stuff, that too - and I usually don't listen to rap.

Sasaki Kojiro

10-09-2007, 15:16

I liked it.

But I feel the tendancy to measure the quality of a song by it's "depth" is misguided. It's one way to have quality, but a song with trivial lyrics and a good melody/beat is quality song and I would choose to listen to it over this one 95% of the time.

edyzmedieval

10-09-2007, 15:28

Not impressed. Sounds like every Bronx/Queens resident who has dreams.

DemonArchangel

10-09-2007, 17:42

Not impressed. Sounds like every Bronx/Queens resident who has dreams.

Maybe this is true, but at least Immortal Technique is speaking out against the shallow materialism, and promise of easy wealth so prominent among poor blacks (and whites) today, which is not something that many rappers are willing to do.

Fragony

10-09-2007, 18:21

Well I AM impressed. I know nothing about what they talk about when you accidently hit a drumcomputer but there is a real message here, and I like the angel analogy, could be better, I get the falling but not the being angel part

Viking

10-09-2007, 18:36

It's not deep, it merely shows the naivity of people.

Edit: Though I must admit he really got his point through.

Radier

10-09-2007, 19:18

Rap and rap-getto-culture can go to hell.

The Wizard

10-09-2007, 19:25

Technique's one of the most skilled MC's out there. Also one of the most aggressive, I might add, but that's part of what makes him so awesome. He combined the full-frontal aggression of Jedi Mind Tricks with a lyrical finesse which isn't often heard in rap, and a story-telling skill thar rivals those of Slick Rick and Rakim themselves; for some of his finest work you should check out his track Dominant Species, or if the aggression is bothering you, You Never Know.

Underground rappers like Technique, Cannibal Ox and others just blow poppy morons like 50 Cent clear out of the water. If you're comparing this to that then you need to go listen again and make sure to pay attention this time. This ain't no crystallized pop version of so-called degenerate "gangsta" culture at all. Also, you haven't heard the diss that's included after the track on the album itself -- if anything that's even better than the story he tells (and a whole lot more offensive and aggressive too, I might add ~;)).

Also guys, this is pretty old. 2001... don't treat it as a massive novelty now ~;p

KrooK

10-09-2007, 22:21

And this is Peja
probably best rap artist in Poland

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbX-MbCtsXE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7i6Xbp-nb8

and this is nice song
official song of polish hooligans and unofficial song of...
polish police

Navaros

10-09-2007, 23:03

Oh my goodness. What obscene drivel that was!!!

I don't even know what the point of this thread is supposed to be?!

I listened to that crap linked to in the OP to see what all the posters here are going on about, since no one provided any details in this thread of what it's about.

It links to a 7 minute rap song which ends with an incest/gang rape and murder of a woman, which the rapper himself states that he participated in. Hands-down the most obscene, perverse, disgusting "song" I'd ever had the great misfortune of being subjected to. :furious3:

If there was ever a rock-solid argument for why free speech must be limited, then that "song" would be the ideal poster child for why free speech must be limited.

Next time someone makes a thread about a song about incest/gang rape and murder or otherwise obscene content, please put warnings about that in the OP rather than just say "This is deep!" and linking to the crap as if it's a decent thing to listen to/watch/read/whatnot. :idea2: :wall: :furious3:

Tribesman

10-09-2007, 23:16

If you are so offende by the content Nav then you had better get hold of that bible you say you read and throw it on the fire because it is disgusting some of the rape murder andincest stuff written in there:dizzy2:
Clearly Nav didn't understand any of the lyrics:thumbsdown:

Husar

10-09-2007, 23:20

I have to agree with Tribes, you obviously didn't get what the rap was about Nav.

Navaros

10-09-2007, 23:40

I think I "got it" pretty well.

The rapper thinks that because some Angels fell from Heaven according to the Bible, he too is a fallen Angel like them. Therefore in his own mind, this justifies him and his friends participating in incest/gang rape and murder as "not so bad".

RoadKill

10-09-2007, 23:42

Navaros he's trying to put a message out, he didn't actually take part of it, it was just the song he wrote, in the interview he said he wanted to show being hardcore isn't that simple, and also he's trying to put the message out that gangs and stuff like that isn't cool at all, he just had to distrubute the message in a more disturbing way, see how many people he got to think about it and really reflect about it, that was what he was aiming for.

Geoffrey S

10-09-2007, 23:49

I think I "got it" pretty well.
What little there is to actually 'get', I don't think you did.

Tribesman

10-10-2007, 01:03

I think I "got it" pretty well.
:laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:

The rapper thinks that because some Angels fell from Heaven according to the Bible, he too is a fallen Angel like them. Therefore in his own mind, this justifies him and his friends participating in incest/gang rape and murder as "not so bad".
really?????
So you don't get it at all then:thumbsdown:

DemonArchangel

10-10-2007, 03:07

Oh my goodness. What obscene drivel that was!!!

I don't even know what the point of this thread is supposed to be?!
*Snip*

Well dude, if "rape, being gangsta and other assorted criminal behavior is bad" is a message you find obscene, then you are a rather odd individual.

Samurai Waki

10-10-2007, 03:35

The Bible does get a little hazy on whether they support rape and pillage or not... maybe thats why 'Da OG lifestyle is so prominent in some places.

Devastatin Dave

10-10-2007, 03:53

LOL, in the time here that this "[-----]", as he so elequantly said about 20 times in the song, wrote this crap he could have filled out atleat two applications for employment. I just know that my tax dollar is going to him, the mutiple females he's banging, allowing with the 12 or so crack addicted babies he's "fathered". Yippee, maybe next week he can rap about Katrina and put it on youtube with the laptop he probably stole. But, your are right, this is definitely real rap and definitely what the mindset leds too.

Geoffrey S

10-10-2007, 10:41

Yeah, down with black artists finding their own way out of poverty by making their money off their music and setting up their own underground music production company. Boo, self empowerment!

For the record, I don't like the song. Its a cliched story with a simplistic moral message wrapped in rather predictable and simple lyrics. But I don't see it representing anything worse than poor music, and applaud the attempt at distancing himself from gangster culture.

The Wizard

10-10-2007, 12:15

LOL, in the time here that this "[----]", as he so elequantly said about 20 times in the song, wrote this crap he could have filled out atleat two applications for employment. I just know that my tax dollar is going to him, the mutiple females he's banging, allowing with the 12 or so crack addicted babies he's "fathered". Yippee, maybe next week he can rap about Katrina and put it on youtube with the laptop he probably stole. But, your are right, this is definitely real rap and definitely what the mindset leds too.Maybe you should try thinking about what you heard next time you listen. Equating 50 ******* Cent with Immortal Technique is like trying to compare Mein Kampf with Othello.

Yeah, sorry for fulfilling Godwin's so quickly. But it just sounded so nice

naut

10-10-2007, 12:25

Well dude, if "rape, being gangsta and other assorted criminal behavior is bad" is a message you find obscene, then you are a rather odd individual.
QFT.

Devastatin Dave

10-10-2007, 14:36

Yeah, down with black artists finding their own way out of poverty by making their money off their music and setting up their own underground music production company. Boo, self empowerment!

.
Yup, it did Tupac and Biggie good. All the money gets blown on gold teef, hos, and expensive cars and houses which gets repode after all the moneys gone from the one CD produced by Puffy P-Diddly Whatever the hell his name is Combes. Much like aspiring to be an NBA player, not many make it and waste their youth and education of these wasteful pursuits instead of "Uncle Tomming" it and, gasp, learning in school and becoming a productive member of society. You should come visit me and we'll drive through East St Louis and I can introduce you to about 500 wannabe rap "artists" and a few thousand future wannabe NBA ballers. Too bad less than half can read a job application much less fill one out. The rap industry has destroyed another generation of blacks and its a shame.

Tribesman

10-10-2007, 19:02

The rap industry has destroyed another generation of blacks and its a shame.
I suppose country music destroyed another generation of good 'ol boys what with songs of prisons , murder drugs and alcohol .
"I can't forget the day I shot that bad bitch down" .....Hmmmmm tupac or cash ?
All they dumb hicks sitting out on the stoop picking on the geetar dreaming of making it to the grand oprey or even San Quentin instead of gitting theymselves sum real edumacation

Navaros

10-10-2007, 20:14

Maybe you should try thinking about what you heard next time you listen. Equating 50 ******* Cent with Immortal Technique is like trying to compare Mein Kampf with Othello.

50 Cent, and to their credit, most rappers, although having no talent, at least do not rap about, brag about and glorify extremely obscene crimes. Like is so done in the "song" linked to in the OP. Yes I know the normal rappers do rap about crimes and hoes and drugs and things like that, but they at least have the human decency to draw the line before committing incest/gang rape & murder of an innocent woman and then making a "song" about it.

Therefore the quoted comparison of Mein Kampf and Othello is in reverse of actuality. The "song" in the OP is much more right up Hitler's alley than any of 50 Cent's, or most other rappers' songs are.

DevDave's posts on this subject are lumping in the sicko "artist" in the OP with other much more morally-decent (by comparison) artists who although lacking in talent and having a bad impact on society, are much, much less offensive or harmful to society than the sicko "artist" in the OP is. The extremely depraved rapper promoted in the OP should never be lumped into the same category as rappers in general - that would be morally wrong and unfair to the other rappers.

Fragony

10-10-2007, 20:19

50 Cent, and to their credit, most rappers, although having no talent, at least do not rap about, brag about and glorify extremely obscene crimes.

Doesn't sound like bragging to me. 50 cent, and other change, do. This sounds genuine to me, and the message is regret.

Husar

10-10-2007, 20:19

You still didn't get it Nav, you might want to listen to it again, however dangerous you might think that is.

Tribesman

10-10-2007, 20:28

Nav , would you be the sort of person who thought "trainspotting" glorified herion addiction:laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:

You still didn't get it Nav
Husar , look back at how many people have wasted their time pointing out the obvious to Nav .
Perhaps he is on the wind up like he is with the crazy fundamentalist christian and muslim stuff he posts:idea2:

Lemur

10-10-2007, 20:35

Forget this stuff. I got some real rap for you right here (http://www.morsekode.com/SAP/ERPofCentury.mp3).

Navaros

10-10-2007, 20:41

Doesn't sound like bragging to me. 50 cent, and other change, do. This sounds genuine to me, and the message is regret.

I certainly do get it. It seems nowadays it is "chic" to make songs/movies/books/whatnot about the most horrific, obscene crimes imaginable. But all those crimes are "okay" and it is a deep, sacred piece of artwork if a "but now the devil is watching me from the shadows!" is slapped onto the tail end of it. Although "popular opinion" may be this, in fact it is not deep, it is not art, and it is not justified behaviour by way of slapping some marginal fear of the devil onto it.

As for "it is a message of regret". If he really regretted participating in an incest/gang rape and murder of an innocent woman then he would:

1. Confess all his crimes to the police, plead guilty to all the charges and insist on being imprisoned for them.

2. Give the full name and info of "Billy" and all the other participants of the crime to the police.

3. Remove himself from the planet so that he does not engage in further crimes against humanity.

4. Not make a song to glorify and profit off of this behaviour, and send other sickos the warped message that doing it is fine and dandy so long as ya pay the trivial consequence of it that is "be sure to fear the devil afterwards."

But of course, the "regret" is not sincere enough for any of that to happen. Instead, he makes one of the most obscene songs if not the most obscene songs ever in the history of mankind in order to try to turn a profit off of his crimes against humanity. Him having regret is rubbish.

Fragony

10-10-2007, 20:54

But it's just a matter of speech calling it the devil. I don't have any sympathy for this person and he would get nothing from me despite him being sorry, if he's really sorry he shouldn't feel sorry for himselve. But I think he is really trying to get something across, if good intentions don't matter what does.

Sasaki Kojiro

10-10-2007, 22:50

I certainly do get it. It seems nowadays it is "chic" to make songs/movies/books/whatnot about the most horrific, obscene crimes imaginable. But all those crimes are "okay" and it is a deep, sacred piece of artwork if a "but now the devil is watching me from the shadows!" is slapped onto the tail end of it. Although "popular opinion" may be this, in fact it is not deep, it is not art, and it is not justified behaviour by way of slapping some marginal fear of the devil onto it.

As for "it is a message of regret". If he really regretted participating in an incest/gang rape and murder of an innocent woman then he would:

1. Confess all his crimes to the police, plead guilty to all the charges and insist on being imprisoned for them.

2. Give the full name and info of "Billy" and all the other participants of the crime to the police.

3. Remove himself from the planet so that he does not engage in further crimes against humanity.

4. Not make a song to glorify and profit off of this behaviour, and send other sickos the warped message that doing it is fine and dandy so long as ya pay the trivial consequence of it that is "be sure to fear the devil afterwards."

But of course, the "regret" is not sincere enough for any of that to happen. Instead, he makes one of the most obscene songs if not the most obscene songs ever in the history of mankind in order to try to turn a profit off of his crimes against humanity. Him having regret is rubbish.

He didn't commit the crime, the character in the song did, and the character in the song killed himself.

DemonArchangel

10-10-2007, 22:55

Oh well, I've come to the conclusion that Navaros cannot be reformed.

And this is why you shouldn't allow your kids to read the Bible, Quran, Torah (what have you). Too much impact on their impressionable young minds.

Geoffrey S

10-10-2007, 23:01

Yup, it did Tupac and Biggie good. All the money gets blown on gold teef, hos, and expensive cars and houses which gets repode after all the moneys gone from the one CD produced by Puffy P-Diddly Whatever the hell his name is Combes. Much like aspiring to be an NBA player, not many make it and waste their youth and education of these wasteful pursuits instead of "Uncle Tomming" it and, gasp, learning in school and becoming a productive member of society. You should come visit me and we'll drive through East St Louis and I can introduce you to about 500 wannabe rap "artists" and a few thousand future wannabe NBA ballers. Too bad less than half can read a job application much less fill one out. The rap industry has destroyed another generation of blacks and its a shame.
The world is filled with wannabees who fail to achieve their dreams, certainly not limited to rap music. The song is precisely about such a person, taken to extremes, who royally screwed up his life trying to become some kind of gangsta.

AntiochusIII

10-11-2007, 00:04

lol @ trolls in this thread.

:thumbsdown:

Edit: Lemur-san, who are those guys? Never heard of them. Also, I don't get the lyrics >.< Like it though.

Lemur

10-11-2007, 01:57

Lemur-san, who are those guys? Never heard of them. Also, I don't get the lyrics >.< Like it though.
I am a bad person. That's a corporate rap from SAP (http://www.sap.com/index.epx), which I cribbed from my Corporate Anthems thread. Strike's rapper may be an original gangsta, but SAP is the ERP of this century, yo. Rubbin' on the honeys and makin' PeopleSoft pay.

AntiochusIII

10-11-2007, 01:59

I am a bad person. That's a corporate rap from SAP (http://www.sap.com/index.epx), which I cribbed from my Corporate Anthems thread. Strike's rapper may be an original gangsta, but SAP is the ERP of this century, yo. Rubbin' on the honeys and makin' PeopleSoft pay.lol. That's awesome. :2thumbsup:

Corporate anthems are the best after all.

Devastatin Dave

10-11-2007, 04:16

The world is filled with wannabees who fail to achieve their dreams, certainly not limited to rap music.
I didn't fulfill my dream of becoming the worlds first closeted, trangendered, truckstop, hooking for drugs super star and you don't see me busting out some phat beats and sheeet. But what could have been...:no:

Strike For The South

10-11-2007, 04:17

Wow this guy isnt black you jackasses

Ayachuco

10-11-2007, 04:33

Wow this guy isnt black you jackasses
Oh, He isn't? (I can assume that he or she is man, too?) Then what is He??? Is he asian? Plz tell me! I MUST KNOW NOW!!!

AntiochusIII

10-11-2007, 05:26

Oh, He isn't? (I can assume that he or she is man, too?) Then what is He??? Is he asian? Plz tell me! I MUST KNOW NOW!!!Peruvian.

...although I do think I can sniff out a bit of sarcasm in your post, if I'm not wrong...

naut

10-11-2007, 09:30

lol @ trolls in this thread.

:thumbsdown:
GAH! But some of the "stuff" here is too good to be true. :laugh4:

The Wizard

10-11-2007, 16:30

Therefore the quoted comparison of Mein Kampf and Othello is in reverse of actuality. The "song" in the OP is much more right up Hitler's alley than any of 50 Cent's, or most other rappers' songs are.Apparently you didn't listen to the part after which he reveals the crime and the woman's identity... Technique isn't glorifying anything here. Rather, it's a cleverly designed polemic against such crimes. Unlike so-called "gangstas" like 50 Cent, Lloyd Banks and other idiots.

cocked the gat to her head, and pulled back the shirt cover
but what he saw made him start the cringine studder
cuz he was starring into the eyes of his own mother
she looked back at him and cried, cause he had forsaken her
she cried more painfully, than when they were raping her
his whole world stopped, he couldn't even contiplate
his corruption had succesfully changed his fate
and he remembered how his mom used to come home late
working hard for nothing, cause now what was he worth
he turned away from the woman that had once given him birth
and crying out to the sky cause he was lonely and scared
but only the devil responded, cause god wasn't there
and right then he knew what it was to be empty and cold
and so he jumped off the roof and died with no soul
they say death take you to a better place but I doubt it
after that they killed his mother, and never spoke about it
and listen cause the story that I'm telling is true
cuz I was there with Billy Jacobs and I raped his mom to
and now the devil follows me everywhere that I go
infact I'm sure he's standing among one of you at my shows
and every street cypher listening to little thugs flow
he could be standing right next to you, and you wouldn't know
the devil grows inside the hearts of the selvish and wicked
white, brown, yellow and black colored is not restricted
you have a self destructive destiny when your inflicted
and you'll be one of gods children and fell from the top
there's no diversity because we're burning in the melting pot
so when the devil wants to dance with you, you better say never
because the dance with the devil might last you foreverRead that over. You are trying to deny the facts, plain and simple. He speaks out directly against "dancing with the devil," such as committing this crime. Doing so he reveals the true face of gang crime in inner city ghettoes, and not the crystallized, sweet-talked, downright fake BS they show in poppy crap like 50 Cent and his lowly peers. The fact that you recoil in horror is good, but the conclusion you tie to it is just wrong plain and simple.

Devastatin Dave

10-12-2007, 03:13

Wow this guy isnt black you jackasses
Who said he was black, and who are you calling a jackass you little texas #### kicker?:beam:

RoadKill

10-12-2007, 03:17

Lets not get racial here.

Strike For The South

10-12-2007, 03:24

Who said he was black, and who are you calling a jackass you little texas #### kicker?:beam:

Lol If were talking about the same east st.louis and the same NBA we both know there aint much diversity there

Ayachuco

10-12-2007, 04:31

Who said he was black, and who are you calling a jackass you little texas #### kicker?:beam:
jackass is a term of endearment where we come from. Okay m8, just sit down and enjoy a tall glass of some iced tea and chill.
ANTIOCHUS III: sorry if I sounded a little sarcastic (my mom was nagging about mopping the floors and I didn't want to leave my computer screen), but since he's peruvian I really like him now (my best friend is part Peruvian). :shame:
Support the Llama(or the hybrid Camas breed);Destroy the Camel.

AntiochusIII

10-12-2007, 06:30

sorry if I sounded a little sarcasticOh no, I didn't mean it in a bad way.

I just thought of the possibility that the question was a rhetorical one 'is all.

Byzantine Mercenary

10-13-2007, 21:37

I certainly do get it. It seems nowadays it is "chic" to make songs/movies/books/whatnot about the most horrific, obscene crimes imaginable. But all those crimes are "okay" and it is a deep, sacred piece of artwork if a "but now the devil is watching me from the shadows!" is slapped onto the tail end of it. Although "popular opinion" may be this, in fact it is not deep, it is not art, and it is not justified behaviour by way of slapping some marginal fear of the devil onto it.

As for "it is a message of regret". If he really regretted participating in an incest/gang rape and murder of an innocent woman then he would:

1. Confess all his crimes to the police, plead guilty to all the charges and insist on being imprisoned for them.

2. Give the full name and info of "Billy" and all the other participants of the crime to the police.

3. Remove himself from the planet so that he does not engage in further crimes against humanity.

4. Not make a song to glorify and profit off of this behaviour, and send other sickos the warped message that doing it is fine and dandy so long as ya pay the trivial consequence of it that is "be sure to fear the devil afterwards."

But of course, the "regret" is not sincere enough for any of that to happen. Instead, he makes one of the most obscene songs if not the most obscene songs ever in the history of mankind in order to try to turn a profit off of his crimes against humanity. Him having regret is rubbish.
Firstly its a song not an account of real events (in the same way than Elton John is not realy a ''rocket man'')

And secondly i reccomend that you read the bible for guidance on judgement and forgivenesss (namely the Gospels)