View Full Version : Placing obstacles.. an expansion feature?
Sorted mentioned something about setting up wooden spikes in the battle of agincourt. I think it's really a great feature to have. Costing a certain amount of florins, defenders get to buy and setup obstacles like wooden spikes for defence. Dig cav traps on the ground. Maybe a feature for the expansion set? With that part built into the game engine.. it may be employed for WW2: Totalwar or something, setting up minefields, etc.. a good investment for CA I think.
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tootee the goldfish,
headmaster of Shogun-Academy (http://shogun-academy.tripod.com)
loyal roach of Clan S.G. (http://thesilvergazwa.tripod.com)
'Pa Si Buay Chao! Si Liao Ka Song!'
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I WANT A MINEFIELD AND CLAYMORES!!1
Sanpedrito
09-13-2002, 01:24
I agree...I like the idea of being able to place items on the field of battle if you are the defending force. That would bring a even more realistic touch to this already wonderful game. Setting up something like from the movie Brave heart... ( you know where they shoot the flaming arrow into the oil soaked ground under the British troops.)
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Pain is temporary, but honor is forever !!!
Cousin Zoidfarb
09-13-2002, 02:44
Excellent idea. Wooden stakes were used by the Turks at Nicopolis and by the English as well, other field obstacles included caltrops, logs studded with spikes ( called abatis I think).
Emperor Theodoripiklos IV
09-13-2002, 04:35
Siege towers and being able to put troops on the walls...would add to game play...
All excellent ideas but I wonder if it's possible to add that to the game in an expansion or if it will have to wait until the next game engine from CA before that is possible?
Would be SWEET to set up some stakes and such in front of your defensive position during the Setup time at the beginning of a battle.
But think about being the attacker - it's already hard enough to have to attack stationary "fortresses" of soldiers layered three deep and mixed with missile troops and cavalry to protect their flanks. Imagine having to do that AND deal with obstacles that would wreck your cavalry and slow your infantry... it'd be beyond Not Fun and straight to Defense Always Wins. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif
Hakonarson
09-13-2002, 05:21
Not only defending forces - the English were the invader at Agincourt, and the Turks were at Nicopolis!!
Yes they should be allowed - as part of a troop type or perhaps an upgrade. They should take time to be placed and pulled up (if appropriate - like the English stakes at agincourt)
also there needs to be more terrain effects - the English sheletered behind hedges at Poitier, which stopped the French getting at them properly - muc the same as stakes. But they seem to have no effect at all in the game.
also some allowance for mud tiring trops out would be good - given the number of times I end up playing in rain!! lol
Quote Originally posted by Hakonarson:
Not only defending forces - the English were the invader at Agincourt,[/QUOTE]
You're confusing campaign invader with attacker in battle. The British were defending their position at Agincourt, hence why the enemy came to THEM and why they bothered putting stakes in the ground - if they were advancing, obviously any static defense would be pointless.
RageMonsta
09-13-2002, 08:34
They were runnin for the coast until they realised it was only a bunch of Frence blokes carrying onions and riding bikes after them!
I mentioned rocks didnt I before? are they still impassable when used in map editing....it isnt perfect but it could work for now....*hides claymore mine ready for newbie ruushers*
Dionysus9
09-13-2002, 08:38
Incredible idea tootee, why havent we been asking for this all along?!
If American Civil Total War is indeed the next step... I know bulwarks and all types of hastily prepared wooden barriers were used extensively by both sides...
Hmmm... cannons...tar pits!
That would be great fun.
Major Robert Dump
09-13-2002, 09:13
"This side Towards Enemy"
Emperor Theodoripiklos IV
09-13-2002, 09:17
Trench Warfare http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
Hakonarson
09-13-2002, 09:24
Quote Originally posted by JRock:
You're confusing campaign invader with attacker in battle. The British were defending their position at Agincourt, hence why the enemy came to THEM and why they bothered putting stakes in the ground - if they were advancing, obviously any static defense would be pointless.[/QUOTE]
No - I'm not confusing anything, but the MTW terminology is confusing.
Sure the English defended in the battle, but in MTW they would have been the "attacker" because they invaded the province.
In MTW there are differences based on whether you're invading or not:
Invaders cannot place individual units - they can only chose an army formations
Invader get to chose whether to "attack" or not - they can chose the weather. But in this context "attack" only means whether to play the battle or not - it doesn't mean the invader has to actually attack during the battle.
There's nothing to stop an invading army adopting a defensive stance, or a defending army adopting an attacking stance.
Quote Originally posted by Hakonarson:
Sure the English defended in the battle, but in MTW they would have been the "attacker" because they invaded the province.[/QUOTE]
Right, but the positions would need to be reversed and the British would have to play the defensive roll in order to make it work since it is the attacker's role to advance while the defender holds ground.
Well, this should be easy to implement, no ?
We already have static units in the game, that can be set up at the start of the battle: siege weapons.
Make them larger, different graphic, set collision to true with troops, and there you go: stakes in the ground.
Would not damage the attacker, though. But would YOU get hurt by stakes burried in the ground you can see from miles away ? No. Stakes are to force the attacker to attack at certain points, not to kill directly.
As for tar pits that are ignited with the enemy on top: Has this really ever happend outside a movie ?
I would think that the average peasant can recognise a small river of oil on the ground, and smell the trap. (And I always thought that lamp oil or similar was very expensive in the medieval time. Could have hired a host for that money.)
Of course I am talking about open field here, fire used by the attacker in sieges was common troughout the ages.
RageMonsta
09-13-2002, 17:18
Trenches!.....and I though we had enough 'campers' already....sheeeeeeesh...next!
Field defences probably shouldnt hurt the attacker, or if they do it should be a very low chance ('Oops! bob just tripped & fell onto a stake').
What they should do is remove a units charge bonus when passing through them (at least from one side).
Kraellin
09-13-2002, 20:38
ummm, before we start adding stakes and other obstacles, i think we'd better ask for a better 'impassable ground' handling routine. the ai already has troubles with getting around certain obstacles. the ideas are good ones, but the priority is off.
K.
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