The Warhammer Campaign

[Steel*Faith]

I wanted to know how the Greenskins lifespans for their leaders were gonna work? They really don't have a natural age of death, so could a successful Orc leader live as long as he isn't killed in the campaign?

[Maniacus]

Could have an above average life span and then have his death be explained by being succeeded in orcish style (1 v 1 combat) by a rival (heir).

[Eufarius]

In the game I dont think that you can tell a character to die at a certain age, maybe you can put it in as an event but I dont think the engine can do that.

[Maniacus]

Nah i meant simply change the message of your king has died that is currently used in medieval to something like: "The warboss of your clan was challenged and beaten by an orcier orc"

It would be a pretty simple solution if it is possible to change

[Jargon]

I think the problem with tailored messages for each race is that other races sharing the same culture or religion will also reiceve that message. So if orcs and chaos have the same culture, then Chaos will also recieve the Warboss death message.

There has been previous discussion regarding culture and religion in other threads, but I don't think Bwian has yet to lay out a set structure.

[WereVrock]

Nah i meant simply change the message of your king has died that is currently used in medieval to something like: "The warboss of your clan was challenged and beaten by an orcier orc"

It would be a pretty simple solution if it is possible to change

But generals those aren't faction leader also die. I don't remeber the original message but I think it also must be changed to something like: "Your warboss killed him beacuse he did something wrong" or "he has been killed when he challenged the warboss of your clan"

[Decker]

Have you guys discussed the issue about armies rebelling when they are too far away from "home?"

I was thinking one day, that my armies always rebelled on my when I would play vanilla M2TW and it would tick me off (even when those buggers were in my borders right next to my capitol!!)... Then I thought... how would rebellion work in Warhammer Total War!?... So I'm here asking you guys (discussing the workings of the campaign), how it should/could (if possible) be implemented.

Like a lone Empire army makes a foray into Chaos territory but their commander doesn't have the strength/piety so-to-speak and his army becomes a Chaos army/brigand army. Whereas an Empire force with a stronger commander has an extremely smaller chance of "turning to the dark side" if in the same situation. And on the other hand a Chaos army has little chance of turning good or turning what-so-ever whenever an army, no matter the strength/piety of its commander.

Just wondering if it's possible to mod in or even mod at all 'cuz I don't know those/these things.

[Jonlissla]

I don't get it, what's your point?

[Decker]

I don't get it, what's your point?
My point is, is that will armies be more tolerant to becoming "rebel" armies as it seems that in the warhammer world that unless chaos is involved in some way, there is little doubt that anyone would rebel.

[Jonlissla]

My point is, is that will armies be more tolerant to becoming "rebel" armies as it seems that in the warhammer world that unless chaos is involved in some way, there is little doubt that anyone would rebel.

That's not entirely true. Generals might think that they are a better leader, and might go for the kill. Orks will problably betray you because they want a good fight and so on. Skaven might think that their leader is weak, and want to replace them.
Just because the Empire has their kind of propaganda, doesn't mean that everyone would gladly sacrifice their lives for the Emperor.

There are plenty of reasons to WHY a general should betray their leader. Chaos might be an option when your troops are stationed in their territory, but they would no less be rebels, because Chaos isn't united, more like divided. There are plenty of Chaos cults through out the land, and they are FAR from friends. :beam:

[Decker]

That's not entirely true. Generals might think that they are a better leader, and might go for the kill. Orks will problably betray you because they want a good fight and so on. Skaven might think that their leader is weak, and want to replace them.
Just because the Empire has their kind of propaganda, doesn't mean that everyone would gladly sacrifice their lives for the Emperor.

There are plenty of reasons to WHY a general should betray their leader. Chaos might be an option when your troops are stationed in their territory, but they would no less be rebels, because Chaos isn't united, more like divided. There are plenty of Chaos cults through out the land, and they are FAR from friends. :beam:
O well it was just a thought.

[Jonlissla]

I also had a small thought, and that's about castle walls. Will Orks have simple palisades while the Empire has enormous stone walls etc? The game would be pretty hard if you're playing any of the "barbarian" races.
However, I do think that Orks would rather be on the field than sitting in a dark corner in a large castle. Perhaps that's the solution?



And it would be really fun if you could change the language into Orkish, you know, like "Red unz goes fasta!". :2thumbsup:

[Abokasee]

I also had a small thought, and that's about castle walls. Will Orks have simple palisades while the Empire has enormous stone walls etc? The game would be pretty hard if you're playing any of the "barbarian" races.
However, I do think that Orks would rather be on the field than sitting in a dark corner in a large castle. Perhaps that's the solution?



And it would be really fun if you could change the language into Orkish, you know, like "Red unz goes fasta!". :2thumbsup:

"Boss! your maties juzts got stabbed in da night night!!"

"Your boys are no betta than da little rat men! they run from orcs do da best!"

"Boss! Boss! da enemy is arda than we think-ed first! the ave took a settlement!

[Spankfurt]

Pertaining to character age...It's unnecessary to have every race's characters age differently, and too much work...I say just let them age as they do in M2TW.... Maybe for Elves make it start at like 58974 years :clown:

[Silaris]

I feel different. I believe it is an important part of the mod to have ages set to a level akin to that which they should be. It would make little sense for Malekith to die of old age after 15 turns, for example.

[Romavictor12345]

That's not entirely true. Generals might think that they are a better leader, and might go for the kill. Orks will problably betray you because they want a good fight and so on. Skaven might think that their leader is weak, and want to replace them.
Just because the Empire has their kind of propaganda, doesn't mean that everyone would gladly sacrifice their lives for the Emperor.

There are plenty of reasons to WHY a general should betray their leader. Chaos might be an option when your troops are stationed in their territory, but they would no less be rebels, because Chaos isn't united, more like divided. There are plenty of Chaos cults through out the land, and they are FAR from friends. :beam:

They had better sacrifice their lives FOR THE EMPEROR!!!!

[Jonlissla]

"Boss! your maties juzts got stabbed in da night night!!"

"Your boys are no betta than da little rat men! they run from orcs do da best!"

"Boss! Boss! da enemy is arda than we think-ed first! the ave took a settlement!
PRICELESS! :beam:


It would make little sense for Malekith to die of old age after 15 turns, for example.

Yeah, imagine the headlines: "Archaon, Lord of End Times, Bringer of Darkness, The Herald of Chaos, the man destined to rule the Old World, the man which the Chaos gods themselves unites behind.... died of old age this morning."
It doesn't really sound that good. :laugh4:

[Enthes]

i have to admit i laughed :laugh4:

i have to agree but i am not sure if anything can be done about it as i think it is hard coded

[Silly Knicket]

Any modifications to aging affect all factions and characters.
In a small, predetermined campaign, it could be accomplished by triggers, and killing off named characters, but in a random campaign, I doubt it.

[DaCrAzYmOfO]

I think EB or RTR has a character trait that makes a certain character immortal....it was given to leaders of rebel settlements and stuff...

Well anyways yeah someone could check up on that or ill do it later...although im pretty sure its RTR...

[Spankfurt]

Any modifications to aging affect all factions and characters.
In a small, predetermined campaign, it could be accomplished by triggers, and killing off named characters, but in a random campaign, I doubt it.


Exactly What I was thinking.

[Severe]

[QUOTE=DaCrAzYmOfO]I think EB or RTR has a character trait that makes a certain character immortal....it was given to leaders of rebel settlements and stuff...QUOTE]

IIRC there are in fact traits that prolong the lifespan of Characters. The value by which they increase the lifespan could then possibly be tampered with.

[Revan-Shan]

I don't know how but I knew it had to do with your father. Well, good bye Bwian, we'll miss you.

Now, this mod is still alive! So what I've thought is: it's a good time to make a BETA RELEASE, at least for random and historic battles. We have the Empire, the Tomb Kings... even if we just have one unit for an entire faction it's worth it. We must atract more modders and members!

lets make a start:

--Historical battles (taken from warhammer books)

1-The Battle for Skull Pass - Orcs and Goblins (goblins) VS Dwarves

A horde of vicious Goblins is attacking the Dwarf mine at Skull Pass, intent on slaughter and looting. The Dwarfs rally around their General to defend their precious gold.

Regiments in this battle:

Orks and Goblins (Orc or Goblin Captain):
1 Night goblin spearmen
1 Night goblin archers
1 Forest goblin spider riders
1 Big boss and bodyguard
1 Trolls

Dwarves (Dwarf Captain):
1 Dwarf warriors
1 Dwarf thunderers
1 Dwarf miners
1 Dwarf thane and bodyguard
1 Dwarf cannon


2-Assault on the Lizardmen: Mercenaries (Pirazzo) VS Lizardmen
Pirazzo must survive.

Many Tileans have travelled to Lustria to find treasures. And it doesn't matter if the owner is the leader of an entire Lizardmen army.

Regiments in this battle:

Tilea - War Dogs (Pirazzo)
2 Mercenary pikemen
1 Mounted pistoleers
1 Mercenary arquebusiers
1 Pirazzo and bodyguard

Lizardmen (Lizardman Captain)
1 Saurus warriors
1 Skink spearmen
1 Skink archers
1 Temple Guard
1 Lizardman commander and bodyguard


3-The Battle of The Iron Cliff - Dwarves (King Alrik) + Empire VS Orcs and Goblins (Orcs)
King Alrik and at least 5 imperials must survive.

The Iron Cliff has been reached by an enormous Orc army and the Imperial army defending it has been decimated. King Alrik has arrived just on time to save the remaining Imperials and defeat the invading horde.

Regiments in this battle:

Dwarves (King Alrik):
3 Dwarf warriors
3 Dwarf thunderers
1 King Alrik and bodyguard
1 Dwarf cannon

Empire (Imperial Captain):
1 Arquebusiers
1 Swordmen

Orks and Goblins (Warboss):
6 Orc boyz
2 Ork archers
1 Warboss and bodyguard


4-The Battle of the Black Fire Pass - Empire (Karl Franz) + Empire VS Orcs and Goblins + Orcs and Goblins
Karl Franz must survive.

An Orc Waaagh has reached Averland and both Imperials and Dwarves are in peril. To defend this location the Emperor Karl Franz and his army have taken the orcs to the Black Fire Pass in order to make them unable to use their number superiority. The battle is great and the Imperial army had no problems until a giant arrived. In order to save his troops Emperor Karl Franz, mounted on his loyal griffon (Death Claw), has attacked and defeated the monster. He is safe and sound but Death Claw is severely wounded so he has moved to the rear.
But the Imperial troops of Stirland don't arrive and new enemy reinforcements appear, hundreds of orc boar boyz ready to attack the Imerial left flank.
The Reiksgard is outnumbered but this noble, loyal, well armoured and trained knights will give their lives to make a way for Karl Franz so that he can kill the ork Warboss and demoralize the enemy army.

Regiments in this battle:

Empire (Karl Franz):
1 Great cannon
1 Helblaster Volley Gun
1 Mortar
2 Reiksgard (with + Expertise)
1 Karl franz and bodyguard (with Ghal Maraz and mounted in his black horse)
1 Commander Leitdorf and bodyguard (mounted bodyguard)
2 Militia
1 Crossbow militia

Empire (Imperial Captain):
4 Spearmen
2 Halberdiers
1 Mercenary arballesters (war dogs)
2 Arquebusiers
1 Captain + 1 Greatswords

Orcs and Goblins (Warboss):
6 Orc boar boyz
1 Orc Warboss and bodyguard (Orc boar boyz)

Orcs and Goblins (Orc Captain):
4 Goblin
4 Orc boyz
1 Captain + 1 Orc boyz
1 Giant


5-The Battle for the Mourkain Ruins - Vampire Counts (Vorag) VS Orcs
Vorag must survive.

Vorag, in his search for power, has led his undead army South, to orc barren land. But Orcs will not loose their land without fighting.

Vampire Counts (Vorag):
4 Ghouls
1 Dire wolves
1 Skeleton warriors
1 Zombies
1 Undead archers
1 Vorag (!-Strigoi vampire, different look) and bodyguard

Orcs and Goblins (Orc Captain):
2 Orc boyz
1 Orc arrer boyz
1 Savage orc boyz
1 Trolls
1 Goblin
1 Night goblin
1 Captain + Orc boar boyz


--phrases (the ones that appear when the game is loading):


War is more hopeless each year. - Hieronymus of Nuln

Know that under my will and my steel all your overcautious nations will succumb. - Archaon, Lord of The End of Time

We'll fight them with our steel, with our bravery, but, above all, with our faith in Sigmar! - Emperor Magnus

Kill them, kill them all. - Malekith after apprehending Eltharion

Rise, oh Dead!, as there can be no rest for you underground. - Spell of the Death

Fight-fight! They'll die easily. - Kreesqueek, skaven master assasin, before being killed by Rametep, a non dead monster

Three things make The Empire great: faith, steel and gunpowder! - Magnus the Pious


--background for downloading periods are in previous posts in this thread (both with either WH drawings and WH Total war mod pics)


--Names, cities, traits, ideas, every thing is in previous post in this thread, use anything you find of use.

[Solus]

phrases (the ones that appear when the game is loading):

War is more hopeless each year. - Hieronymus of Nuln

Know that under my will and my steel all your overcautious nations will succumb. - Archaon, Lord of The End of Time

We'll fight them with our steel, with our bravery, but, above all, with our faith in Sigmar! - Emperor Magnus

Kill them, kill them all. - Malekith after apprehending Eltharion


Have patience though lad, though this might be the right time for a release, there still are factions that lack core units (Bretonnia doesn't have knights yet for example, which might make it a little crickey)

Rise, oh Dead!, as there can be no rest for you underground. - Spell of the Death

Fight-fight! They'll die easily. - Kreesqueek, skaven master assasin, before being killed by Rametep, a non dead monster

Three things make The Empire great: faith, steel and gunpowder! - Magnus the Pious

a few more:

There's one thing better then a dead dwarf, and that's a dying dwarf telling you where his friends are hiding! - Greenskin proverb

Honour is all. Chivalry is all. - Kinghtly vow

That which is sacrosanct I shall preserve. That which is sublime I will protect. That which threatens, I will destroy, for my holy wrath will know no bounds - Grail vow

[Cambyses]

Re Immortal characters. The simplest way IMO is to make these powerful very long lived Elves (and Dwarves?) into unique buildings. I know people want to get Malekith and use him on the battlefield. But how often did he really lead him armies out to fight? Just let the normal elves do it...

That way these mega characters can be in the background and have a strong influence on the game but we will not have the ridiculous situation as mentioned above of Malekith/Teclis/Nagash/Wood elf king whose name Ive forgotten etc dieing of old age. Also the whole balance issue becomes irrelevant.

Simple solutions are often the most effective...

[Gorthuar]

The colours are placeholders - they WILL be changed.

https://img441.imageshack.us/img441/8578/factionszh0.png
High Elfs: White
Lizardmen: Light Green
Dark Elfs: Deep Purple
Orcs: Dark Green
Tomb Kings: Light Blue/yellow
Chaos: Black
Dwarfs: Blue
Vampire Counts: Red
Bretonnia: Blue/Red
Empire: Black/Yellow
Skaven: Green/Brown

Do I see a Skaven territory all over the northern shores of the Sour Sea? Blasphemy! Tis' the land firmly grasped by the Iron Hand of the Great Necromancer, ever since He recaptured it from the Skaven over 2,500 years before the current Warhammer time. *Very* powerful Tomb King rebels should be occupying it, or it should belong to the Vampire Counts, or ideally to the second Tomb King faction I've been ranting about :egypt:

Their other stronghold could be the Black Tower of Arkhan (with the swathe of desert on other side of the current Tomb King territory), and maaaybe Mourkhain in the centre of the Badlands (though that has been overrun by Greenskins, and making it a priority region to reconquer is a better idea). Or the territory attatched to Nagashizzar/the Cripple Peak could be split in two. East of Nagashizzar is the Plain of Bones, and once a Vampire named Vorag forced some tribes of Ghouls to build his fortress there. Having it recrewed by the Nagashite Tomb King faction isn't much of a stretch...

Maybe one of the Chaos factions could start with one or two provinces in Norsca? Sort of like England has Calais in MTW2. Was there a land bridge between Calais and the Islands? I can't remember, but one would be useful here... Many Norsemen worship the Chaos Gods anyway, and this should make their raids into the Empire easier ~:cool: On the other hand, a buffer zone of rebel Chaos provinces between the Dark Elf territories and those of the Chaos factions would be good. Both cultures would have non-aligned territory to conquer this way.

How about several Dwarf Holds being initially occupied by Greenskin or Skaven rebels? That would give the Dwarfs some non-aligned territories to conquer, and would represent their reconquest of lost Holds very nicely. These would also be great targets for mainstay Greenskin and Skaven factions' expansion. Of course this presents a problem with building types. These should be useful for Dwarfs, Greenskins, and Skaven alike, so that if either faction conquers a territory, it won't require too much rebuilding. These three factions could also live in the mountains between the Empire and Bretonnia, though that means creating brand new regions there.

Rebel Tomb Kings have already been suggested, and that is a good idea. According to the lore (I just hate the word "fluff"), these make their home (wanted to type "live" at first, but then reconsidered it...) to the east of the World's Edge Mountains, and are led by King Phar. These should not be included in the Nagashite Tomb Kings faction, should it emerge, but remain rebels. Also, Lahmia (the northeasternmost region currently held by the Tomb Kings) should ideally have *Vampire Counts* rebels, but with no general, just troops.

Vast majority of the Greenskin territory should be turned into rebels, or else the Greenskins should be split into 3-4 factions. These need little-to-non differences regarding the units can they recruit and buldings they can build, but it will make other factions' lives easier.

Bretonnia can expand into Estalia, I guess, and the Empire can invade Kislev and the Border Princes... but maybe they ought to start out a little smaller and expand on their own lands first? around 1,500 IC Gilles le Breton only *started* uniting the Bretonni tribes into the modern Kingdom of Bretonnia. At the same time the Empire was ravaged by civil wars. That's an ideal opportunity to make several of each states' provinces rebels (I know I ranted about splitting the Empire into several factions, but I had a change of heart). That'd make the Vampire Counts' life easier too!

The easternmost Lizardmen province should really contain the High Elf settlement of Arnhelm/Arnheim. As has been suggested, these may be rebels, so that the High Elves have something of their own culture to conquer too. The fun part is that I belive a land bridge between Ulthuan and Arnheim would be a good thing.

Also, note: more often then not, the Dark Elves occupy (or attempt to occupy) Ulthuan's outer northwestern provinces, which are their own ancestral lands. They once managed to hold these lands for almost 1,000 years. The game could start with a large Dark Elf army there, ready to begin conquest, or maybe even with a province or two under Druchii control! With unrest and whatnot, because the locals are of Asur stock and freshly conquered, of course. That would bring conflict to the otherwise secluded Ulthuan early on, and would somewhat protect the Dark Elves from being crushed between the Lizardmen and the closest Chaos faction. This loss of High Elf provinces could be easily made up by splitting some of their larger territories, making up settlement names, if need be.


I thank you for your time


Lord Gorthuar de Veris
Cult of Nagash

[Gorthuar]

Since for some strange reason I can't edit my own posts, here goes another!

I just noticed that the four great Imperial City-States are separate provinces. Good call! This made me think... perhaps that would be a way of strenghtening the Vampire Counts faction, which currently seems hard pressed. Make castles such as Drakenhof and Vanhaldenschlosse provinces in their own right, separate from Sylvania, and voila! Cheating a little, I know. But hey, it works (:

Also, the Bretonnian province of Moussillon should be crawling with either rebel Vampire Counts, or outright belonging to the faction. Since someone saw fit to introduce a Skaven territory in the middle of Bretonnia (the Black Chasm, iirc), why not make the Massif Orcal a Greenskin province? Even if only rebel...

Final suggestion for today: some of the Badland and even Border Princes provinces could contain rebel Undead of either kind. Not nearly enough to overshadow the Greenskin eminence in the Badlands, but still, these regions are littered with burrow mounds from the time of Mourkhain (these would be Vampire Count rebels), or even earlier Nehekharan (Tomb Kings rebels) tombs.

I thank you for your time


Lord Gorthuar de Veris
Cult of Nagash

[Casuir]

Well, first off that map was never intended to be a final representation of the factions and area they control. Nor is it completely accurate in terms of regions, theres already been some changes since that was posted and will probably be more in the future. Anyways to answer your points.

Crippple peak is skaven yes, havent done the research on it yet but it could be changed. Anything involving Nagash is very important lore wise so dont count on having a faction led by him. Remains to be seen whether anyone whos loyal to him is important enough to deserve a faction slot.

Arkhans tower is on the map but I'm not sure who actually controls it yet, Mourkain is in ruins and to the best of my knowledge nobodys there. Theres one of the strygoi controlling a region in the border lands, whether thats part of a faction or rebel remains to be seen. Plain of Bones and the ruined fortress of Vorag are off the map.

Norscans are not true chaos worshippers, just heavily tainted humans. They do normal stuff like trading so get treated seperately. That said we want to bring chaos down from the north some helping might be needed. Theres a couple of things planned for this, remains to be seen how the ai will handle them. some one I think earlier in this thread mentioned the high number of provinces in norsca, that was a decision made from a fear the ai would get bogged down up there, it will be probably be adjusted when testing is done. Norsca is a pretty large area and its almost all mountains and forests, pathfinding is a concern.

Far as the other side of the map goes probably a slaanesh faction would be the best choice for here, they should head south but the dark elves shouldnt really be trying to go north, their interests lie southward.

Having dwarf settlements held by orc or skaven well, thats the way the map is now, dwarfs should really be starting at war with those two and not be worrying at all if they're part of a faction or rebel.

Can you quote a source for the king Phar lore, as for Lahmia its my understanding that the tomb kings drove the vampires north to the silver pinnacle.

As I already said, that map isnt a final representation of the factions. Orcs wont start with that much.

Yet to fully agree on the time the mod will be set but it probably wont be then.

Arnheim is the settlement above the lizardmen provinces, and it nominally High Elf at the mo as I havent found a concrete source stating it as such. High Elves fighting eachother doesnt sound likely to me though. High elves arent really the conquering type and the way the ai handles them should reflect imo.

We'll be looking at ways to bring the Dark Elves down to Ulthuan, their victory conditions will be the capture of it for example. Any army though that far away from its homeland will have a limited chance of survival unless it can take and hold quickly.

Sylvania isnt important enough to warrant splitting into many regions, sorry but this is warhammer total war not nagash total war. We'll be looking at ways of making things a bit easier from any vampire factions but

Theres a limit to the amount of provinces we can have, dont think its worth wasting one here. Black Chasm is an important enough Skaven settlement to warrant one but I fear its one with a limited lifespan. Dont see anything in the new VC armybook about Mousillion to suggest any VC presence here.

There will be some undead presence in the border regions, badlands is orc turf though. Undead have their main playground to the south and its fairly secure, dont see any reason to make life easier for them.

[Gorthuar]

I understand that the map is not final. That's why I hope my suggestions will be helpful.

A table on page 53 of the new Vampire Counts army book describes Nagashizzar as under Nagash's control. It goes to say that "after the last Chaos incursion, Nagash is almost ready to strike." The timeline in the same book does not mention that Nagash purged it of Skaven, but timelines in older books do. It happened a few decades before the birth of Sigmar.

The idea behind some of the Skaven and Orc-held Holds being rebel was to give those factions something non-aligned to fight too. It's usually easier to conquer lands belonging to rebels then to full-fledged factions in the earlier stages of the game.

King Phar is mentioned in the current Tomb Kings army book on page 65. He's the King of Mahrak, the city which lies at the eastern entrance to the Charnel Valley, the only valley which connects eastern and western Nehekhara. After a description of his struggle against Settra, we're given this: "Even in death, King Phar continues to fight against Settra, and his Undead legions wage war against all who try to subject him to their will."

The other cities east of the World's Edge Mountains include Lybaras, Rasettra and Lahmia, but save for the last one their status isn't really clear. Lahmia was conquered and left ruined. Having done that, the Nehekharans left it generally desolate and empty. That either means that it shouldn't be a province in it's own right at all, or it should house the remnants of the Lahmian Undead army - thus I suggested rebel Vampire Counts, but with no general (the Vampires themselves were, as you correctly point out, driven away). Lybaras is ruled over by Queen Khalida, but her attitude to Settra's imperial ambitions is unknown. Rasettra was built by Settra after he finally crossed the Charnel Valley (not before Phar died of old age and could no longer defend it's exit), but that's all we know.

Too bad about the Bretonnian and Imperial timelines. I'm just throwing ideas on how to make them less powerful, so that other factions stand a chance...

Regarding the Dark Elves, they could be already in control of one province on Ulthuan. As I said, they managed to conquer and hold one for almost 1,000 years (per the timeline in the current Dark Elf army book, iirc). That would make their presence there more stable, yes? Of course conquest of the remaining High Elf provinces would be their priority. Malekith certainly wants his throne back.

Now, the whole "nagash total war" comment was uncalled for. True, I'd like to see a Nagashite Tomb King faction, but powering up Vampire Counts has hardly anything to do with that. I've just noticed people's concerns that they'll be quickly overrun by their many neighbours, and tried to suggest a possible solution ~:(

Since 2300, when Duke Maldred died, Mousillon remains unclaimed by any other Duke, "and the Undead walk amongst the ruins" - timeline in the new Vampire Counts army book, page 31.

How is having rebel Undead territories strenghtening the faction? Is that because they'll already have the same culture when they're conquered? Well, in that case the greenskins are a major problem, what with all the territories of their culture, even if they're initially rebels. Inserting only a few rebel Undead provinces into the Greenskin turf would, perhaps, make their easy expansion less of a problem. Anyway that was my line of thought when I made the suggestion.

I thank you for your time


Lord Gorthuar de Veris
Cult of Nagash

[Casuir]

They are.

Missed that, interesting. Skaven are gone from there so. Like I said though his return would be a big thing for the warhammer world so that would have to be thought out, a powerful character/general like Nagash would have a big effect on that area.

Thats true, although retaking the old holds hasnt been easy for the dwarfs so far, dont see why we should make it easy ingame. Dwarfs should play similar to high elves, very strong on the defense but find conquering difficult.

Missed that too, but I havent looked at the tomb kings much yet bar pick out the regions.

Lahmia is the only one of those thats on the map, if its rebel its rebel tomb kings, the vampires were originally part of Nehekhara and were driven out before the kingdom was turned to undead by Nagash, stands to reason their dead would have awoken along with the rest of the area.

Aye but theres other ways to do that, balancing isnt just a matter of giving everyone the same amount of rebel territorys to conquer.

I guess thats a matter to be determined by the timeframe of the mod. The map there has already been changed there as per the new high elf book by the way. Giving a province there to the Dark elves doesnt give them much better chance of survival though, any foothold you give them would have to be pretty powerful to survive. DE have good expansion options to the south though, dont really see a pressing need to give them a headstart.

Ok maybe it is, was meant light-heartedly though. Anyways I got distracted while I was typing there and got a bit confused when I went back to it, I was going to say theres a limit on the amount of regions we can have and adding more there is not really that good an option. There are other ways to beef up VC in this area, particularly if we go with the current warhammer timeframe.

I said I see nothing to suggest a VC presence here, not an undead presence.

Weakening one faction strenghtens its neighbour. Tomb Kings start off fairly well established and with only any greenskin factions there are to pose them any threat. Stopping the orcs from getting too powerful is a concern but so also is preventing TK from steamrolling them which was my line of thought when I answered you.

[Revan-Shan]

Good suggestions, but you've missed the whole point: Lets release a BETA!

There are enough units to create a beta, with custom, quick and historic battles (plus their description). I have posted the info about the historical battles, and if it's needed there is a post about traits, retinues and relics on this thread. If it's needed I can make the texts for the units, look earlier posts, we even have the factions descriptions!


Alletun and Krazysigmarite! Please, create a beta version.

I'm sick of playing custom battles with the Holy Roman Empire as The Empire, with Hungary as Bretonnia and with heavy axemen as Chaos units.

And if you do so then I will be able to make a new promo vid for youtube.

[Goncalou]

PRICELESS! :beam:



Yeah, imagine the headlines: "Archaon, Lord of End Times, Bringer of Darkness, The Herald of Chaos, the man destined to rule the Old World, the man which the Chaos gods themselves unites behind.... died of old age this morning."
It doesn't really sound that good. :laugh4:
that's hilarious, f'ing classic, man.

[Goncalou]

[QUOTE=Revan-Shan;1749941]
-DARK ELVES. Strenghts: Very well trained infantry. Gelids make cavalry quite more dangerous Weaknesses: Poor archers.

QUOTE]Even though you posted this along time ago, i just read it and I have to say the the DE also have an excellent navy, considering they have a lot of Black Arks which in reality are just floating fortresses. Also I have more ideas for the sayings on the loading screens,
There are three thing that make the Empire great, faith, steel, and gunpowder. Magnus the Pious

These next ones i made up but they should fit in perfectly.

Wars are won with stength, valor, and numbers, especially numbers.

Win together die alone!

Fighting for the right reason is itself a source of strength.

[Pumpavius]

You all will like to read this. The overview of each faction (the one that appears when you get before clicking on the faction you are gonna play):

-THE EMPIRE. Strenghts: Good all-around. Good navy. Weaknesses: Has no monsters.

-HIGH ELVES. Strenghts: Very well trained infantry and archers. Good navy. Weaknesses: Poor artillery.

-DARK ELVES. Strenghts: Very well trained infantry. Gelids make cavalry quite more dangerous Weaknesses: Poor archers.

-DWARVES. Strenghts: Good infantry and artillery Weaknesses: Lacks cavalry.

-ORCS AND GOBLINS. Strenghts: Can afford large armies Weaknesses: depend too much on hand to hand fighting.

-SKAVENS. Strenghts: Good singular units and unusual powerful weaponry Weaknesses: Lacks missile units and cavalry of all type. Weak basic infantry.

-VAMPIRE COUNTS. Strenghts: Has a wide selection of infantry Weaknesses: No archers and artillery. Its armies depend too much on the general.

Relatively expensive units.

-KHEMRI. Strenghts: Equilibrated non dead army Weaknesses: Its armies depend too much on the general. Relatively expensive units.

-LIZARDMEN. Strenghts: Strong infantry and monsters Weaknesses: No technology.

-CHAOS. Strenghts: Outstanding basic infantry and demons Weaknesses: Lacks archers. Poor artillery.

-BRETONNIA. Strenghts: Can afford large cavalry armies Weaknesses: Lacks artillery and elite infantry.

-----------Possible future factions-------------

-TILEA. Strenghts: Elite infantry, cavalry and missile unites, good navy and outstanding pikemen Weaknesses: Almost no mages or witches, very expensive

armies.

-KISLEV. Strenghts: Strong militia, good infantry and cavalry Weaknesses: Lacks artillery

-WOOD ELVES. Strenghts: Outstanding archers, good missile cavalry. Can use war dancers and treemen Weaknesses: No artillery and a short variety of

hand to hand infantry.

-ARABY. Strenghts: Good navy. Good mixture of cavalry, infantry and archers? Weaknesses: Lack of artillery?

-ESTALIA. Strenghts: Navy and infantry? Weaknesses: ?

-CATAI. Strenghts: Great armies? Weaknesses: Lacks Navy/Artillery?

-DEMONS. Strenghts: Very powerful units Weaknesses: Very expensive armies.

-NORSCA. Strenghts: Good hand to hand infantry and light cavalry Weaknesses: Lacks archers and artillery.

-OGRE KINGDOMS. Strenghts: Can use fearsome ogres or large hobgoblin armies Weaknesses: Short variety of missile units and artillery.

-ALBION. Strenghts: Powerful mages and treemen Weaknesses: Small armies.

I disagree with some of the things said here:

Empire: is not good all-around, in fact they are really standard, not really good or bad in any aspect, they have a good cavalry and a really powerful artillery (best cannons in the old world!), they also have a good variety of units, with fast cavalry, heavy cavalry, lancers, halberdiers, militia, great swordsman, arcabucers, etc. Their weakness: Average infantry.

High Elves: With they new army book for 7th edition, are the fastest (they always strike first in the tabletop game) and have really good infantry and cavalry, also really powerful magic and navy! Their weakness: really bad toughness (like any elve!), extremely high costs and really small armies!

Dark Elves: good infantry units but usually with average strength, good cavalry with their cold ones (causes fear!) and powerful ranged attacks with their repeater crossbow and reaper bolt thrower. Also powerful and destructive magic! And don't forget the best navy in the old world! Their weakness: Poor toughness (like any elve!), high costs (but cheaper than HE) and small armies.

Dwarves: Great infantry, powerful artillery, really though and well armoured troops, and don't forget the highest of moral, a dwarf never flees the battlefield! Weakness: Lack of cavalry, slow movement, small armies.

Orcs and goblins: Powerful infantry, good variety of troops (we have -yes, I'm green!- light cavalry, heavy cavalry, heavy infantry, light infantry, good artillery with the goblin diver, monsters, really destructive magic, etc), big armies and orcs are really though. Weakness: Goblins have low moral (but orcs don't care about them!), poor archers and animosity orcs and goblins are rather indisciplined!

Skaven: Enormous armies! good artillery (their strange cannon, jezzails, etc), swift attacks, lots of skirmishers!. Weakness: really low moral when they lose ranks (strength is in the numbers they said!), lack of any cavalry or flying units. They don't have bows, but they have lots of thrown weapons and the rattling gun and flame-thrower!

Vampire counts: Hmm... the whole army causes fear!, they have the most powerful cavalry in the world, the blood knights! and don't forget the black knights! Ethereal units, and they are all unbreakable. Weakness: Depends too much on the general (if he dies, the entire army becomes dust!), don't have any artillery or archery. Expensive units.

Khemri: Lots of Light chariots, causes fear, unbreakable army. Weakness: can't march ever, they become dust if the hierophant dies.

Lizardmen: Great skirmishers (skinks!), good heavy infantry and monsters (kroxigors and saurus!), powerful magic (the slann), good morale ("cold blood" army rule!). Weakness: poor selection of cavalry (just the cold ones!), lack of artillery and in general poor technology.

Chaos: Powerful infantry and cavalry, great hand to hand combat, good armour, daemons (but now they are a different army for 7th edition with their own army book). Weakness: lack of long range missile units (just the barbarian cavalry with javelins), poor artillery (just the hell cannon), small armies, high costs.

Bretonnia: Great cavalry!, powerful flying cavalry (pegasus knights OMG I drool myself of just thinking about it!), good morale, bowmen can use stakes!. Weakness: lack artillery and elite infantry.

For the future possible factions, I agree on the most of what revan-shan said, except maybe with a few changes:

Wood elves: the best archery in the old world, everything can hide in the forest, bonus fighting in the forest, great light troops and forest spirits (dryads, treeman, etc). Weakness: really poor armour and toughness (they are almost naked elves!), lacks of artillery.

Araby: Good navy (pirates!), a good selection of light cavalry and camel cavalry, good archers, can use elephants! Weakness: Poor infantry (they only have the warriors from araby and the black guard)

*I took this references for araby from the warmaster army that was released on February, and also you have ti remember, araby is a mixture of the moors, Persia and the turcomans!

Estalia: Just think of Spain...

Albion: army based on monsters, giants, and powerful druids and mages. Weakness: lacks of artillery, small armies.

Well that... I tried to keep the spirit of the armies as you see them on the tabletop game, just a few changes to what revan-shan early said.

I hope it helps!

Keep on working guys this WILL be the best mod to M2TW!!!!

[Revan Shan]

I disagree with some of the things said here:

Empire: is not good all-around, in fact they are really standard,
...

I agree with all that, but remember that these are just little descriptions for the faction selection, we cannot have a whole text

Araby: Good navy (pirates!), a good selection of light cavalry and camel cavalry, good archers, can use elephants! Weakness: Poor infantry (they only have the warriors from araby and the black guard)

*I took this references for araby from the warmaster army that was released on February, and also you have ti remember, araby is a mixture of the moors, Persia and the turcomans!

Estalia: Just think of Spain... I did

Albion: army based on monsters, giants, and powerful druids and mages. Weakness: lacks of artillery, small armies. Just what I said

Well that... I tried to keep the spirit of the armies as you see them on the tabletop game, just a few changes to what revan-shan early said.

I hope it helps! Yes, averall the info about Arabia, I thought it was something like that (i even knew the thing about pirates) but I couldn't probe it.

Keep on working guys this WILL be the best mod to M2TW!!!! Of course it will! :yes:

P.D: I may correct some of the descriptions.

[Revan Shan]

P.D: I may correct some of the descriptions.

I mean: this week ( I have tons of things to do )

[Pumpavius]

Well, just wanted to help ^^

Here are some frases that could be used in the loading screen... I took them from the 6th edition warhammer basic rulebook (I have it in Spanish so forgive me if the translations aren't the exact ones)

"If you kill a man, you're a murderer.
If you kill ten, you're a monster.
If you kill one hundred, you're a hero.
If you kill ten thousand, you're a conqueror! -Boyard Alexander from Kislev"

"Kill them with swords, kill them with lances and spears. Kill them with the bolts of your crossbows. Kill their warriors, kill their women and their children, their elderly and their sick. Kill their hounds, cattle and their livestock. But above all, kill with pleasure. -Dark Elf captain Daerkhil of the Black Arch-"

"Where do you march, men of Reikland, where do you take your halberds and swords?
We march to war, to face the chaos horde.
Tomorrow we'll be buried in the cold tombs that are waiting for us.
And when the war is over, and my body lies on the field at night.
Hear my prayer, save my soul. Sigmar, oh lord, take me to your light! -Old Reikland soldier's song-"

"There¡re countless worlds beyond the void of Chaos, infinite realms to conquer, cities to loot, forest to burn, warrior to kill by millions. But, for Khorne, I've chosen this world to conquer: And I will, even if it takes me a thousand millennia. -Khastarax, Demon Prince of Khorne-"

"There is no problem that can't be solved with cannons -Engineer in chief Boris Kraus of Nuln-"

"Sinister and dangerous is the world. A place full of conflict. -Hieronymous of Nuln-

"Warriors remember, we fight for this lady's honor; that probably is more than what she ever did! -Anonymous Bretonnian Knight-"

"Agile like a wild cat. Deadly as a snake. Strong like a bear. Smart as an eagle. Be afraid my enemy! Because the wardancers lurk you! -Wardancers battle hymn-"

"Fill the moat with the bodies of your comrades. Step their inert bodies to reach the walls. Take them down with the weight of the deads -Arbaal the Invincible-"

Hope it helps!

[Goncalou]

i agree with all the faction decriptions now except for the DE they have best navy in warhammer!:furious2:



oh yeah Revan why did you make another account with the albino celt guy?

[Revan Shan]

i agree with all the faction decriptions now except for the DE they have best navy in warhammer!:furious2:



oh yeah Revan why did you make another account with the albino celt guy?

? I didn't

[Pumpavius]

A question: wich ones will be the playable campaigns?

I suppose Empire... but who else?

In my opinion the playable factions in campaign mode could be:

- Empire: Conquer a certain number of regions and hold 3 important regions, maybe Reikland with his capital Altdorf, Middenland with the city of Middenheim, y Nuln (the second largest and important city in the Empire). After all, the empire is always been invaded by orcs, chaos, etc. Missions given by the Emperor himself.

- Orcs: Conquer a LOT of regions. Missions given by Gork and Mork (or at least that's what they think xD)

- Chaos: Conquer a certain number of regions including Altdorf. Missions given by the dark gods.

- High Elves: Conquer regions, hold Ulthuan. Mission given by the Phoenix King

- Dark Elves: Conquer region, take Ulthuan. Missions given by Malekith, the Witch King.

- Dwarfs: Conquer certain number of regions, hold 3 mayor dwarven fortress (karak azul I think is the most important one). Missions Given by Thorgrim (or I don't know, I'm not sure if they've some kind of Elder council, I can't remember right now)

- Skavens: Conquer a lot of regions including Altdorf and some important place in Lustria perhaps?. Missions given by the Council of 13.

- Bretonnia: Conquer a certain number of regions, hold... I don't know the name of the bretonnian mayor castle xD. Missions given by the King, or maybe a holy mission given by the Lady of the Lake.

Now, I don't know if it's possible, but if you could use different systems for each faction's campaign it would be great!

For instance, orcs could just have to do the missions commended by Gork and Mork, no "pope" sort of speak, but with the empire it could be different, they should have to accomplish the missions given away by the emperor and the missions from the sigmarite cult (in this case, acting like the Pope). Skavens could have their clan leader giving them missions and in the other hand, the council of 13.

Well, hope it helps as always ^^

Once again sorry if my english is too bad xD

Bye!

[errrrrrrrrframbo]

for what i have seen now releasing a beta is quite difficult. I will prefer and wait a year or two if neccesary and plain a whole campaign on the warhammer map than hanging around fighting only withsome units if you release abeta now some people may think its the whole mod and may only download the beta and soon some may lose intrest on the mod :thumbsdown:



although all the work the team memeber has done is really impresing so what the guy who is incharge of putting up videos should start doing some more to catch people attention and possibly some good moders are intresting on joinning :egypt: and the work could start gaining some speed

good work until the moment continue like that!:2thumbsup:

[Goncalou]

I did, I played as Spain and conquered all america. i had to wait to 1800 to see some british ships. They never landed.

So one thing could be done, make the armies of the important factions appear in Albion about 100 turns after starting the campaign.

Woohoo spain. its the only faction i like in MTW2 besides Milan and Denmark. and why are there no pictures on this thread anymore?

[Spankfurt]

So... Any official news from the official team on the official campaign and its official brainstorming?

[Revan Shan]

Well, I shall continue brainstorming in the near future... Krazy's plans are to release this beta and then work on a Empire Total War version. Imagine... Imperial galeons!