What kind of drugs were there during the EB period ? [Archive]

MarcusAureliusAntoninus

11-16-2007, 00:30

Alcohol was big almost everywhere. Poppies and canabis was grown in the east and shipped across the Mediterranean. And the Gesatatae obviously had something good.

russia almighty

11-16-2007, 00:49

I'm not asking were to buy them . I'm asking what did these users use back then . We know our naked gallic friends had something to put there mind in another world before battle .

russia almighty

11-16-2007, 00:50

Wait they had ganja back then ?

MarcusAureliusAntoninus

11-16-2007, 00:53

CaesarAugustus

11-16-2007, 00:58

What was the drug that the Gaesatae used to make them all... well, invincible?

russia almighty

11-16-2007, 00:59

Probably some sort of PCP like drug . Then again I find that a little weird because supposedly weren't they pretty disciplined considering there whole gig ?

Sakkura

11-16-2007, 01:04

I bet the gaesatae invented the 'shroom-eating that viking berserkers later developed into an art form. Well, a messy art form. You know, performance art... Performed on... The audience. With axes. :sweatdrop:

MerlinusCDXX

11-16-2007, 01:17

Wait they had ganja back then ?

Yes, they did. The most common recorded occurrences of ancient cannabis use was a Skythian practice known as the "felt tent", whereby the participants in the ritual entered a sauna or sweatlodge type enclosure and put the plant parts onto hot rocks to allow them to smolder or burn. The doors to this enclosure were sealed tightly and all the folks inside just breathed in the smoke. I'm not sure if they did this with or without steam, but if steam was used, the ganja would vaporize instead of pyrolizing, but the net effect is still the same.

[passes 'hubble-bubble pipe to russia almighty]
let's get Skythian, shall we?

Intranetusa

11-16-2007, 01:29

Canabis/hemp is one of the oldest cultivated crops in the world. It is theorized that it originated somewhere near the Hindu Kush and spead westward from there. It was very valuable, you can make rope/twine/clothing out of it, you can eat it (seeds), and you can even get in touch with the gods with it.

The fibers of the hemp used to make rope/clothes is a different species that is different from the type that produces the buds that you can smoke.

CaesarAugustus

11-16-2007, 01:36

"I say, the walls are melting. We should all die...." :laugh4: (That was from HBO's Rome btw)

Were drugs very widespred in the ancient world? Or were they just restricted to the high and warrior classes? Also, were they ever illegalized at any point in time by any 'faction', or were they just viewed in a similar light as alchohol, as a harmless feel-good substance?

Watchman

11-16-2007, 01:55

Outside instances where a given substance was considered to have special "sacred" meanings - and thus be presumably the purview of a rather limited groups of people in specific circumstances - my hunch is the most common (and by far easiest) "control measures" were flat out price and availability; anything that had to be imported from any meaningful distance away, only the at least reasonably affluent could afford.

J.Alco

11-16-2007, 02:01

Actually, I'm just wondering: Were drugs like opium (or other drugs that we associate with smoking nowadays: Cannabis, etc) actually smoked in EB's time period? Only I seem to remember reading somewhere a comment about how people actually mixed the seeds from the flowers (or dried leaves, whatever it was) into wine cups and drank them. Is that what actually happened? Or were the drugs simply smoked like nowadays?

Tellos Athenaios

11-16-2007, 02:21

Sometimes it would be drunk (Saka Haomavarga - Haoma drinking Saka); and Herodotos mentions plants that are thrown on hot stones during a Skythian hot-vapour bath which make the bather enjoy an unexplicable but delightful ecstatic feeling...

Poppy juice (somewhat similar to opium, in fact opium can be seen as some concentrated poppey juice ingredients) was used for the calming effects it had on both body and mind...

Reverend Joe

11-16-2007, 02:32

Outta sight.

Cyclops

11-16-2007, 02:34

I think the obvious examples have been covered.

Prior to our period there is the mysterious "soma" of the Rg Veda. It seems to have been used at feasts and given a "religious" experience.

I think most drugs came with a religious ceremonial culture: Symopsia, Dionysian rites etc.

I wonder about the putative geseatae drugs: I don't dount thay had extensive herbal knowledge but I'm sure it wasn't a real-world potion of superheroism.

No doubt there's a host of common household substances with little known psycho-active properties: look in your spice rack. Maybe they used known drugs as an enabler and part of the effect was self-generated?

Just rambling really, is it possible that their powers were as much due to self motivation and rage and the drug party could even have been a mild anaesthetic?

I guess their secrets have died out.

MerlinusCDXX

11-16-2007, 03:09

The fibers of the hemp used to make rope/clothes is a different species that is different from the type that produces the buds that you can smoke.

Actually, both varieties are of the same species, the differences in the two are the result of selective breeding programs to emphasize either stalk development (case#1-fiber) or flowering traits (case#2-bud/resin development). The confusion that seems to result in the "species argument" are that other species of hemp-like plants (jute/sisal etc.) that are used for their fiber. Of the plants mentioned, hemp (c. sativa) is the strongest and most prolific. The case#1 growing methods are a lot less labor intensive than the flowering method for c. sativa or the growing methods for the "imitation hemp" fiber plants.

russia almighty

11-16-2007, 03:12

Makes me wonder what the equivalent of a crack whore back then was .

MerlinusCDXX

11-16-2007, 03:15

Makes me wonder what the equivalent of a crack whore back then was .

I would guess that it was something along the line of "opium tent happy girls"
:laugh4:

russia almighty

11-16-2007, 03:17

Merlin are you a user .

Olaf The Great

11-16-2007, 03:24

I would guess that it was something along the line of "opium tent happy girls"
:laugh4:

No, Spear-Women(ala Gaestae, except women) :)

MerlinusCDXX

11-16-2007, 03:30

Merlin are you a user .
why whatever gave you that idea?:hippie: ~:smoking: ~;)

russia almighty

11-16-2007, 03:34

Don't worry . One of the EB team members has dropped hints he or she is in the brotherhood too.

MerlinusCDXX

11-16-2007, 03:39

Don't worry . One of the EB team members has dropped hints he or she is in the brotherhood too.

sweet...count me in on the next batch of brownies

cmacq

11-16-2007, 04:35

I wonder about the putative geseatae drugs: I don't dount thay had extensive herbal knowledge but I'm sure it wasn't a real-world potion of superheroism.

No doubt there's a host of common household substances with little known psycho-active properties: look in your spice rack. Maybe they used known drugs as an enabler and part of the effect was self-generated?

Just rambling really, is it possible that their powers were as much due to self motivation and rage and the drug party could even have been a mild anaesthetic?

DWK

Doing-battle While being-Kelt

mAIOR

11-16-2007, 10:45

Danest

11-16-2007, 12:58

In other words, did Rome have a serious drug problem? Other than alchohol, I haven't heard anything of the sort on a serious scale in Rome, so I'm curious too.

Tiberius Nero

11-16-2007, 13:25

In other words, did Rome have a serious drug problem? Other than alchohol, I haven't heard anything of the sort on a serious scale in Rome, so I'm curious too.

Not really, if drugs were used, they must have been used by members of cults in rituals, never heard of such a thing as a recreational drug in Rome, and afaik Latin doesn't even have a word for it, unless this is hiding under "venenum" = "poison", "magical potion".

MiniMe

11-16-2007, 13:34

2 RA:

Merlin are you a user .
this one

Probably some sort of PCP like drug . Then again I find that a little weird because supposedly weren't they pretty disciplined considering there whole gig ?
is obvious evidence on who's got the experience ;-)

blank

11-16-2007, 13:57

Don't worry . One of the EB team members has dropped hints he or she is in the brotherhood too.

Only one? I could name you at least 4 :beam:

edit: he or she? There are no female or transsexual members at least to my knowledge :sweatdrop:

blitzkrieg80

11-16-2007, 15:16

Remember, Blank is an expert, because he DOES come from E-'stone'-ia ~;)

Sakkura

11-16-2007, 17:51

Remember, Blank is an expert, because he DOES come from E-'stone'-ia ~;)
Hehe. One of the first things Denmark did after the viking age ended was go crusading in Estonia. If we don't get to be wasted, why should they?! But of course the Germans had to come along and ruin it all :wall:

Primative1

11-16-2007, 19:06

I think the drugs around that time were Opium based and Cannabis. other than that, the drugs we know(cocain, etc) couldn't exist back then.

I know Juta should be pretty popular among soldiers considering the effects.

Cheers...

I'm sure I read that traces of cocaine, as well as tobacco, has been found in/on Egyptian mummies. Used as part of the mummification process iirc.

blank

11-16-2007, 19:08

Hehe. One of the first things Denmark did after the viking age ended was go crusading in Estonia. If we don't get to be wasted, why should they?! But of course the Germans had to come along and ruin it all :wall:

Yeah everyone wants to take our stash - Danes, Russians, Germans, Swedes etc :beam:

I'm sure I read that traces of cocaine, as well as tobacco, has been found in/on Egyptian mummies. Used as part of the mummification process iirc.

Hehe i also saw that in tv, but they also thought the plants had come from America, so... :whip:

Pharnakes

11-16-2007, 19:09

I'm sure I read that traces of cocaine, as well as tobacco, has been found in/on Egyptian mummies. Used as part of the mummification process iirc.

But IIRC cocaine comes from Coco, which is a new world plnat, so how is this possible?:inquisitive:

Decimus Attius Arbiter

11-16-2007, 19:10

I read that Carthaginian quinquireme rowers used cannibis instead of listening to satellite radio like the rest of us.

MarcusAureliusAntoninus

11-16-2007, 21:11

I doubt the tobbaco anc cocaine on the mummies thing, since tobbaco and cocaine come from the new world and I've never actually seen any of the evidence of the find - only hearsay.

Don't worry . One of the EB team members has dropped hints he or she is in the brotherhood too.
"There is a time and place for everything, and it is called college." :juggle2:

cmacq

11-16-2007, 21:38

Your very right, yet there it is.

Actually, the cocaine and tobacco claim was about five or six years ago. At the time it seemed up and up, not from contamination, but I'm always mistrustful. I think from Greek and Roman period mums? Not sure what happened with it since?

sgsandor

11-16-2007, 22:57

I think ancient peoples just like us are looking for the meaning behind life and just like us some of them probably got into a few catergories
1 became very religious
2 looked for answers via chemical ingestion
3 thought the answers where there somewhere but had other things to worry about (taxes, family)
4 some combination of the other 3
I am sure that if anything was there and had the potential for abuse(from food to cannabis to alcohol) it probably was
As for myself i smoke 3 packs of cigs daily, eat anything i can find, drink way to much, and find new and interesting ways to distract myself from my everyday life (ok not to the extent i just said but you guys are smart and get what i am saying)

I dont think back then anyone cared what you did as long as you stayed in place did your duty(to city-state or whatever) and payed your taxes.

I know that for myself, I could not imgaine how difficult life was for them back them. They did not even have aspirin.

sgsandor

11-16-2007, 23:00

So besides opium, cannabis, and alcohol and (Juta sp?)

What did they have?

(black lotus like in Conan the Barbarian?)

Tiberius Nero

11-17-2007, 00:08

There is no evidence in literature of drug use for recreational purposes, the only excessessive abuse of "substances" mentioned as such by moralists of the period is eating one's way to oblivion and drinking insane amounts of wine in order to throw up what one ate previously. That practice seems to have been the equivalent of getting high, and of course it wasn't a practice affordable by most.

Primative1

11-17-2007, 02:28

But IIRC cocaine comes from Coco, which is a new world plnat, so how is this possible?:inquisitive:

Yea, that was the point, that a global trade network was ongoing long before anyone thought possible.

Primative1

11-17-2007, 03:14

http://www.druglibrary.org/SCHAFFER/Misc/mummies.htm

I dont know how kosher it is so dont blame me if it's crap...

Cyclops

11-19-2007, 03:13

Makes me wonder what the equivalent of a crack whore back then was .

I have a vague memory of a kind of crony in Republican/Early Imperial Rome depicted in wall paintings. These grinning fools would sit around and accept verbal abuse from whoever would buy them wine. Ancient equvalent of drunk-fighting.

Very very sad institution. Can't find the image on-line, but I have seen it before.