View Full Version : Hoplite Spears
This is a transfer of a thread from tw, since it didn't get a team response.
Basically the hoplite spears in 1.0 are far too big. I was wondering if someone could change the model so that the spears are the same size as the German ones. :beam:
Cheers, Ano2
NeoSpartan
12-10-2007, 20:14
This is a transfer of a thread from tw, since it didn't get a team response.
Basically the hoplite spears in 1.0 are far too big. I was wondering if someone could change the model so that the spears are the same size as the German ones. :beam:
Cheers, Ano2
No they are not....
here I will let these fellars to the talking for me, they got good info:
http://www.4hoplites.com/Hoplites.htm
The General
12-10-2007, 20:35
https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/8741/hop2gt5.jpg
*Shrug*
Callicles
12-10-2007, 21:16
I was always under the impression they were around 9 feet long. I don't see any problem with the hoplites in the game.
Maybe I'm wrong.
Intranetusa
12-10-2007, 21:28
No they are not....
here I will let these fellars to the talking for me, they got good info:
http://www.4hoplites.com/Hoplites.htm
The armors and helmets of the hoplites in the picture seem anachronistic...?
Post Alexander era armors with Greco-Persian era Corinthian helmets?
TWFanatic
12-10-2007, 21:36
Indeed they look to be 12 feet long to me, which is innacurate. They should be 8 to 9 feet long. What you need to do is add the "short_pike" attribute (which gives them 8 to 9 foot spears and makes them fight in a tight hoplite phalanx, as apposed to a messy loose formation). See more info on it in my mod (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=94341) (mods feel free to remove this if you see it as advertising).
Accounting that they favored long lances i assume they are just right. What makes you think their spears are FAR to long?
https://img243.imageshack.us/img243/7281/phalanxyh8.jpg (https://imageshack.us)
Pharnakes
12-10-2007, 21:49
That's an alexandrian phalanx though.
The General
12-10-2007, 22:15
Sarissas ftw.
http://www.clas.canterbury.ac.nz/graphics/sarissa_1b.jpg
I do know that.
That means they're not hoplites. And that they use a completely different kind of spear.
anubis88
12-10-2007, 23:10
Sarissas ftw.
http://www.clas.canterbury.ac.nz/graphics/sarissa_1b.jpg
jesus christ! now that's LONG!!!
quackingduck
12-10-2007, 23:28
does it really matter that the spears might look to be a few feet longer or shorter than they actually were?
That means they're not hoplites. And that they use a completely different kind of spear.
Do i have to repeat myself? I know they are phalangites, and they used "FAR TO LONG" lances.
Whatever...
I just took a closer look at it and twice as long as the bearer, they really seem a bit to long. Never noticed that before.
The General
12-10-2007, 23:38
does it really matter that the spears might look to be a few feet longer or shorter than they actually were?
Oh, but it is of most utmost importance, no such, flagitious error should be let exist!
Watchman
12-10-2007, 23:40
It's my understanding 7-8' (ca. 2.1-2.5m) was pretty much the "universal standard" maximum lenght for an one-handed fighting-spear. If cavalrymen are to judge by, a considerably longer one (up to over three meters) is still manageable with the underhand grip, but for formation use only (à la Iphicrateans).
quackingduck
12-10-2007, 23:43
while we're on the subject of big errors i think that my general has to long of a nose? can some one make a mod to help me?
Their spears are about 12 feet long, its rediculous. Compare those spears to the German spears (Who also fight as hoplites) and you'll see the massive size difference.
And thankyou for your sarcastic comments, good to see such a high level of maturity from some members.
Do i have to repeat myself? I know they are phalangites, and they used "FAR TO LONG" lances.
Whatever...
I just took a closer look at it and twice as long as the bearer, they really seem a bit to long. Never noticed that before.
It just seems a bit irrelevant to talk about phalangites in a thread about hoplites is all.
Intranetusa
12-11-2007, 00:41
Long sarrissa pike ~ 18 feet
Hoplite spears ~ 8-12 feet
Standard spears (size of an average person) ~ 4-6 feet
Short Spears ~ 2-4 feet
pezhetairoi
12-11-2007, 01:13
Don't worry about them, ano2, you get all sorts of people on a forum. Sometimes people just don't get the thread of the argument and go off on a tangent. You're making sense here, and I agree with you on the spear issue. I'm going to use TWFanatic's mod, that's for sure.
Megas Methuselah
12-11-2007, 01:53
It is a good mod, though. It really does make sure the hoplites fight in a classic phalanx formation, with a good push factor.
:wink2:
Cheers guys, could I get a link for TW's Fanatic mod plz?
Intranetusa
12-11-2007, 07:36
Cheers guys, could I get a link for TW's Fanatic mod plz?
Go to the unofficial mod section of these forums. While you're at it, pick up some of the other great mods - including the one that got merged with TW Fanatic's. :D
The General
12-11-2007, 13:25
Their spears are about 12 feet long, its rediculous. Compare those spears to the German spears (Who also fight as hoplites) and you'll see the massive size difference.
And thankyou for your sarcastic comments, good to see such a high level of maturity from some members.
Oh, do cheer up.
I was just making a humoristic point about the sillyness of the "arguement", on a simply graphical bug, especially since there's an easily-available fix for it, like the TWFanatic's mod (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=94341).
Also, if sarcasm puts you off as much as you say, it'd make sense not to use it yourself.
Anyways.
Friends again, eh? Hugs?
;o
Pharnakes
12-11-2007, 14:16
People, this is the org. For years it has been known as one of the politest online comunities out there. Lets keep it this way, yes?
~:grouphug:
The General
12-11-2007, 15:18
People, this is the org. For years it has been known as one of the politest online comunities out there. Lets keep it this way, yes?
~:grouphug:
I'm just angry because I've got no balloons.
I WANT MY BALLOONS.
~:mecry:
I wasn't referring to The General, I was referring to quackingduck lol.
Anyways, d/l fanatic's mod and its great for hoplites, only bad thing is that if the rear ranks are engaged, they hold their spears at about a 60 degree angle towards the sky.
Strategos Alexandros
12-11-2007, 16:36
I'm just angry because I've got no balloons.
I WANT MY BALLOONS.
~:mecry:
Have a balloon :balloon2:
The General
12-11-2007, 17:59
I has a balloon!
*Cries of joy*
quackingduck
12-11-2007, 23:02
I wasn't referring to The General, I was referring to quackingduck lol.
Anyways, d/l fanatic's mod and its great for hoplites, only bad thing is that if the rear ranks are engaged, they hold their spears at about a 60 degree angle towards the sky.
sorry, just seemed to me that a few feet on a spear was insignificant on a game. but i supose it would matter if you were trying to fight in a certain way like the hopilites.
Perturabo
12-12-2007, 10:43
I have never really noticed before, but yeah, the Classical Hoplites spears do seem excessive in length. The 'other' greek spearmen seem to have a more realistic length to their spears. However it doesn't really have that much effect on gameplay but from an aesthetic viewpoint being a bit shorter would be very nice!
NeoSpartan
12-12-2007, 16:49
I don't know what u guys are talking about... :inquisitive: to me the hoplite spears are fine
MarcusAureliusAntoninus
12-12-2007, 21:18
https://img102.imageshack.us/img102/3979/rometw2007112322373823bx5.png (https://imageshack.us)
take a look at Pontic spearmen. those are the guys with truly excessive, sarissa wannabe spears.:laugh4:
Pharnakes
12-12-2007, 21:45
Yeah, there's a couple of others like that, germanic lancemen, Thorakitai Argyrispdies, I think the romanii bronze breastplate people, can't remeber the name.
The General
12-12-2007, 21:47
https://img102.imageshack.us/img102/3979/rometw2007112322373823bx5.png (https://imageshack.us)
Doesn't look that stupid with the spears held like that, but try to imagine those being wielded one/over-handed, heh.
Intranetusa
12-13-2007, 03:14
https://img102.imageshack.us/img102/3979/rometw2007112322373823bx5.png (https://imageshack.us)
Wow....those are like, what 15 foot spears? Almost as long as a sarissa pike! >.<
Maybe there is a basis to this complaint afterall...
antisocialmunky
12-13-2007, 17:01
Doesn't look that stupid with the spears held like that, but try to imagine those being wielded one/over-handed, heh.
Until you realize about 1/4 of the thing is sticking in the ground.
The General
12-13-2007, 18:04
Until you realize about 1/4 of the thing is sticking in the ground.
... When the spears start looking idiotic even when held like that.
If that's indeed true, are they holding... Sarissae in their hands, then? Then it'd certainly be quite a big bug, instead of a mere small one. :p
antisocialmunky
12-14-2007, 16:09
The really weird bit is when they start fighting with it and the spear magically look longer because of that fact.
Then you start thinking about the Monkey King and his extending power pole.
Puupertti Ruma
12-14-2007, 16:22
Chill out people!
The overhand spear animations are made by EB, and they affect other animations for the spear wielding units. I'm quite sure all of the imperfections you are crying and mulling over are simply not just ready yet.
I think these two screens should illustrate the issue adequately:
https://img146.imageshack.us/img146/3389/hoplitespearsql8.th.jpg (https://img146.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hoplitespearsql8.jpg)
https://img212.imageshack.us/img212/2720/hoplitespears2yu4.th.jpg (https://img212.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hoplitespears2yu4.jpg)
The Levy & Classical hoplites (Spartiates too I think) have much longer spears than the Epilektoi & Ekdromoi (Theureophori have about the same length as the latter also).
Pharnakes
12-15-2007, 16:25
Hmmm, I also am starting to think this should be changed.
Or if the long is correct, make the epilektoi long as well. (I can see why the Ekdromoi ight have shorter spears).
TWFanatic
12-15-2007, 16:28
Chill out people!
The overhand spear animations are made by EB, and they affect other animations for the spear wielding units. I'm quite sure all of the imperfections you are crying and mulling over are simply not just ready yet.
Nope, they're there to stay. Your only options if you want to fix them is to download a mod or do it yourself.
Senatus Populusque Romanus
12-15-2007, 16:29
No they are not....
here I will let these fellars to the talking for me, they got good info:
http://www.4hoplites.com/Hoplites.htm
Nice source, NeoSpartan.:book:
NeoSpartan
12-15-2007, 17:36
I think these two screens should illustrate the issue adequately:
https://img146.imageshack.us/img146/3389/hoplitespearsql8.th.jpg (https://img146.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hoplitespearsql8.jpg)
https://img212.imageshack.us/img212/2720/hoplitespears2yu4.th.jpg (https://img212.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hoplitespears2yu4.jpg)
The Levy & Classical hoplites (Spartiates too I think) have much longer spears than the Epilektoi & Ekdromoi (Theureophori have about the same length as the latter also).
see the spear sticks out just like the Levy, Classical, & Spartans.
https://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g75/Neospartan/PropPory.jpg
the Epilektoi (the new fancy cool looking ones) should have their spears longer.
vBulletin® v3.7.1, Copyright ©2000-2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.