Grand Campaign Hotseat 2: The Rising Storm

[Zim]

The year is 1080 A.D. After centuries of fighting to expand, strong powers are coaslescing in Europe, North Africa, and Asia. For any one of these power to become dominant, others must be destroyed. Religious and secular conflicts are driving some together and far more apart. Rumors of war are arising all over the region, and it is only a matter before it is caught up in a tide of Total War.

Welcome to the second hotseat campaign for the Grand Campaign. I've been hoping to start one of these, and some interest has been showed in the poll thread, so this is the official sign-up/OOC thread for my Grand Campaign hotseat.

Here are the factions, and their players if assigned.

England-AskThePizzaGuy
France-TuffStuffMcGruff
Holy Roman Empire - Cecil XIX
Spain-Mrs. Zim
Venice- Zim
Sicily-Elite Ferret
Milan-rossahh
Scotland -Ignoramus
Byzantine Empire-Tristan de Castelreng
Russia-Ichigo
Moors-General Hankerchief
Turks-Overknight
Egypt-Ramses II CP
Denmark- deguerra
Portugal-gibsonsg91921
Poland- FactionHeir
Hungary-turcoman

Reserve Players:



This will be version 1.3, and an admin enabled game. I'll have a longish list of rules in a bit, culled from the other hotseats (including mine :clown: ).

Here's a tentative list of rules:


1. MTW2 version 1.3. FactionHeir has been kind enough to work on a few files read at the beginning of the game to make for tougher AI factions. It does not require anyone to change their files but the host, me.

2. 24 hours to play a turn, 48 if the GM is notified. Otherweise the turn will be skipped.

3. When you finish your turn, post a link to the save here and pm the next guy in line.

4. No reloads.

5. As a courtesy, inform your victim OOC if you do anything to them that they would find out about in the beginning turn announcements in a SP game. Think battles, or settlements of their's you take.

6. Diplomacy can take place via pms, in the diplomacy thread that will be opened, or just through the in-game mechanics available to diplomat agents. There is no obligation to keep deals made, but don't be surprised if you become very unpopular or even a target if you break deals all the time.

7. No obvious exploits. No parking a stack of merchants in a fort on a resource, or exploiting crusade/jihad mechanics. I won't do anything silly like say you can only take x settlements in a crusade, but please don't blitz across the whole map with one, taking several dozen settlements. It makes the game less fun for others. :no:

8. Important, since the turn limit is fairly short, try to designate another player or other ORG member to sub if you can't make it. I will be glad to fulfill this role if you give me permission. Also, pm your passwords to me so I can give them to a sub or skip the turn if neccessary.

9. Crusades/Jihads should be announced in the Council thread.


Player Deaths:
Ignoramus, King of Scotland, at the hands of Tran, King of England.
gibsonsg91921, King of Portugal, at the hands of GeneralHankerchief, Emir of the Moors.

[Zim]

Ok, the player I thought would play Turkey is out, so all unassigned factions are open. I'm thinking at least 1-2 more before we talk about starting. :yes:

With the way Muslim factions get knocked around in-game, and the many crusades that might be sent his way (lots of catholic factions) I don't mind if Ramses has the first chance to consolidate the middle-east, but an HRE or French player would be especially welcome to fill in that central European area.. :yes:

[RoadKill]

Sign me up for France, but I may need to be subbed in since I will be away for a week.

[Privateerkev]

Here are my thoughts for now:

1.) Lets try to fill all the factions if possible. It would be infinitely more fun. And it shouldn't take too long.

2.) 24 hours from post of save game if possible but 48 is allowed. More than 48 requires prior notice to at least the GM.

3.) Post your save in here in a link and do it with a brand new shiny post so that it bumps the thread up.

4.) Diplomacy does not have to be agreed to first in PM's but it does speed the process up if it is.

5.) No reloads. You play it once and deal with what happens.

6.) Anything goes with playing your faction. You can play your faction however you want as long as you observe the few rules. No "house rules". Feel free to play your faction IC, OOC, random, or erratic. Do not be surprised if your backstabbed. Do not be surprised if your eliminated in the beginning of the game. Just play your faction however you wish within the confines of the rules that the GM sets up.

7.) As a courtesy, inform your victim OOC if you do anything to them that they would find out about in the beginning turn announcements in a SP game.

These are just the rules I use for my games. Zim can pluck from these, modify, or ignore as he sees fit. :yes:

[Zim]

Welcome to the game Roadkill. If you give permission, anyone can sub your turn, even me if you'd like (may be hard to find peiople outside the game to do so, since so many throne room regulars are in it).

PK, most of those are along what I was thinking. I'll leave the signup open another day or two, although I may put the Council thread up late tonight for public diplomacy.

Faction Heir has some ideas to make AI factions tougher without anyone (but me) having to download files. :yes:

One thing I'll add to the rules is a requirement to pm the next guy. With so many players, that will be important to keep things moving.

Also, limits on time to take turns will be greatly relaxed until after New Year's, when all our lives return to normal.

[Zim]

Ok, I have a tentative set of rules up in the first post. They are still very flexible, and I'll gladly take suggestions. :2thumbsup:

Overknight , I need confirmation on your faction. You had told me you considered playing Milan, but stated in the other thread that you wanted to wait until more people had chosen factions. Just tell me if you need me to change your assigned faction. :yes:

[OverKnight]

I'm pondering, how much of a disadvantage would it be to take an Orthodox or Muslim faction?

Edit: Sorry for the indecision, but I'm new to this.

[Zim]

That's fine. Given that turns would move slow over the holidays anyway, I'm leaving the signup list open at least one more day. There's no hurry. :yes:

Muslim factions have slightly weaker autoresolve units, but the main weakness is that they're outnumbered, so a lot of crusades could be headed their way. This could be negated largely by engaging in diplomacy with A. Ramses, playing Egypt and B. some of the Catholic factions.

Orthodox factions' main weakness is no crusades or jihads, but I'm hoping players won't abuse the Crusade/Jihad mechanics to conquer vast swaths of territory. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Hey guys, my wife expressed interest in playing one of these games a while back. Would her entry into the game bother anybody considering I'm the GM? It would mean an 12th player. :2thumbsup:

[Ramses II CP]

Well I'd say Orthodox factions have it the worst because they can't crusade/jihad. Muslims are going to get gangbanged and no mistake, but never underestimate the power of the turn 1 jihad. Seriously. I took Egypt because we need a Muslim power to make the bloody game interesting.

Speaking of which, I need to line up some alliances dangit.

:egypt:

[Ramses II CP]

Speaking of crusade/jihad abuse, I promise not to use my first jihad on a player faction (But don't get in my way! :p). How's that?

:egypt:

[Zim]

There's nothing stopping you from making any, Ramses. :clown:
OK, Turkey might be a good one if you're interested in a Muslim faction. Then, even if the Muslim factions get ganged up on, you have a potential ally in the region (Ramses).

[Zim]

There, we now have a Council thread. Private deals by PM are still encouraged, but now negotiation, declarations, etc. can be made in public as well. :beam:

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1784541#post1784541

[gibsonsg91921]

We need only six more players. Cmon, baby!

[Zim]

We need only six more players. Cmon, baby!

That could be five if more people answered my question. :clown:

"Hey guys, my wife expressed interest in playing one of these games a while back. Would her entry into the game bother anybody considering I'm the GM? It would mean an 12th player. "

[Ramses II CP]

Err, I don't see any reason why anyone would object except for the whole girl cooties issue, but I checked with my wife and she says you can't get those over the 'net.:dizzy2:

:egypt:

[gibsonsg91921]

Umm, I trust you won't cheat or double-team anyone. We'll have to clean up the place a bit, kind of like when EternalOlympia temporarily was part of KOTR.

[Zim]

Interesting, I kind of thought rules here were strict enough that that wouldn't be neccessary (like swear words being replaced by mods with flower smilies). :clown:


Umm, I trust you won't cheat or double-team anyone. We'll have to clean up the place a bit, kind of like when EternalOlympia temporarily was part of KOTR.

[Mrs. Zim]

Hi everybody, I'm obviously Zim's wife. I've played the game a teensy bit and thought it'd be fun to try out the multiplayer. My husband has been telling me about so here I am. I'm playing as Spain if that's cool with everyone. I predict that I will either rise in glory or go down in flames with the game, either one I'm good with. :creep:

[phonicsmonkey]

welcome to the Org Mrs.Zim!

[OverKnight]

Egad, I need to start recruiting my own family members to form an alliance, but knowing my family they'd be the first to back stab me. "Sorry Son, it's strictly business. You shouldn't have crossed my line of death."

:laugh4:

Anyway, I'm feeling indecisive. A part of me wants to play a familiar faction, such as HRE or the Byzzies, but I don't want to leave Ramses all by his lonesome, so the Turks or Moors, who I've never played, would be interesting. Of course Iberia is looking crowded. . .

Thoughts?

Either way, I'll probably be pwned.

[deguerra]

hi Zims wife! I'm usually the one hes chatting with when he up half the night. well one of the ones. when hes not being annihalated as jerusalem or as novgorod anyway :P

[Zim]

OK, I'm not sure about my wife but I know my brother and father would backstab me at the first possible chance, as well as most of my old friends. :sweatdrop:

deguerra, I'm playing Turkey in the Crusades game and doing well. As for Novgorod, well, no comment. :clown:

[Mrs. Zim]

Hey everyone, thanks for the welcome. It's nice to "see" and "meet" who my husband's been talking to. I hear him laughing whenever he's on the computer chatting on the boards. :laugh4:

It would be funny if more people recruited their family members. Unfortunate on the whole backstabbing issue. Course, you could be the first to backstab them and destroy any evil plans they may have. Just a thought, trust no one. :dizzy2:

[Zim]

OK, I'd say the HRE or Turkey. The HRE fills a big empty spot in central Europe, while Turkey could take the place of Byzantium while preventing Ramses from being on his own in the Middle East.

Or course, the Moors would provide some real competition(three factions!) in Iberia...

[Privateerkev]

If we simply get players for all the factions, then FH's AI fixes will be quite moot.

(not a fan of mods or anything)

Welcome Mrs. Zim! You can partially blame me for your husband being on the computer so much. ^_^

[Cecil XIX]

I'll make OverKnight's decision easier and choose HRE.

[OverKnight]

Turkey it is then.

Of course if Ramses and I follow historical precedent, we'll spend more time fighting each other than the Europeans. Of course the same would hold true for Europe.

[Zim]

If the other factions fill, or we end up with only a couple, I might tell him it's not neccessary. Still, I'd like to stress that FH's mod would only be neccessary for me, and only when I first start the game. :yes:

[Privateerkev]

I would love to see this game with all factions player controlled. Except for the Papacy, Mongols, Timurids, and Aztecs of course. And it's not just to avoid of mod. It's because it will be much more fun. :yes:

[Zim]

Even if no more players join, we've got 13 and filled almost the whole map! This will be great! :2thumbsup:

Everyone, I will need passwords to be pmed to me in case someone can't play a turn. :yes:


I would love to see this game with all factions player controlled. Except for the Papacy, Mongols, Timurids, and Aztecs of course. And it's not just to avoid of mod. It's because it will be much more fun. :yes:

[OverKnight]

Can anyone steer me in the direction of a good FAQ or thread on how to play a Hotseat PBM?

[deguerra]

excellent. cecil, you and I need to talk

[Privateerkev]

Can anyone steer me in the direction of a good FAQ or thread on how to play a Hotseat PBM?

There really isn't one yet. Basically, play like an SP game but talk a whole lot to the other players. Also, for better autoresolves, put your heavy infantry in the front of the stack. It makes a difference.

[Zim]

Can anyone steer me in the direction of a good FAQ or thread on how to play a Hotseat PBM?

Hmmm, there's a pbm FAQ but I'm not sure about a hotseat one. Since you play KOTR I know you know how to upload files. :yes:

The first time you download and play your turn, you'll need to come up with a password. When you finish the turn, hit end turn and a screen asking the next guy's password will come up. Hit esc to go to the menu, then save, then upload. Repeat continually, except after that you'll just type in the password you'd first used. :yes:

PK is right, diplomacy is big in these games, sometimes public (Council thread), more often private (pms).

[OverKnight]

Heh, I'm Turkey do I even have Heavy Infantry for the first 100 turns?

:laugh4:

I'll spend some time poking around.

Passwords? Any restrictions on length or characters?

Edited: Nevermind, Zim got it.

[Privateerkev]

Passwords? Any restrictions on length or characters?

Probably something simple so you don't forget it like a certain someone who will remain Gibson... :clown:

Either way, Zim can reset it or change it to anything he wants so it's not too big of a deal anymore.

[Cecil XIX]

Don't know about any FAQs OK, but seeing as I'm participating in the first I can tell you how it's down.

1. Download the save from the filespace and load it up. All save files, when loaded, show Campaign status and password input screen.

2. Imput password, hit the enter button, and play campaign as normal. Note that in Hotseat campaigns there are no status messages at the start of the turn, except those that requre a yes/no choice. Also, every single battle is auto-resolved.

3. Once your turn is complete, hit enter and the password input screen for the next faction will appear. Save game, upload file, PM next in line. Remember that you must save when you are at the next player's password screen, or else the save file will show your password screen when loaded.

EDIT: Wow that took a while to type.

[OverKnight]

Question: Are there any rules for Crusade or Jihad?

IE, Can anyone call a crusade if they're able to do it ingame? Or is only the Pope allowed to call one?

In SP I like Crusades, but the thought of a horde of zero upkeep death stacks descending on my Sultanate from multiple Catholic Lands is a bit alarming.

[Privateerkev]

Zim has something vague about not taking too many settlements with one. I would prefer there be no rules with Crusades/Jihads because specific rules would A.) be hard to agree to, and B.) be even harder to enforce.

I say, if the game allows it, let it go. Because sooner or later someone will do it anyways. But that's me.

*edit*

By the way, to mister diplomacy over there! (Cecil)

Clear your PM box if you want a reply!

:D

[Zim]

That's something I've been wondering about. Although I warned against people using a single Crusade to conquer half the map (a la Askthepizzaguy), I'm loath to tell anyone not to use a regular game mechanic. I think heavy diplomacy will be the key to keep everyone from joining crusades against you, and possibly coordination with Ramses. Of course, you can always call a Jihad, without worrying about a pope-o-meter. :yes:

All I know is, that if someone's territory number jumps up by 10+ after crusading everywhere but the target, Venice is encouraging everyone to attack them. Think of it as an informal excommunication.

[Privateerkev]

That's something I've been wondering about. Although I warned against people using a single Crusade to conquer half the map (a la Askthepizzaguy), I'm loath to tell anyone not to use a regular game mechanic. I think heavy diplomacy will be the key to keep everyone from joining crusades against you, and possibly coordination with Ramses. Of course, you can always call a Jihad, without worrying about a pope-o-meter. :yes:

Yeah, I much rather figure out as a group what to do "in the game", rather than try to hammer out some sort of guideline. I say lets just set up some OOC rules to the game as a whole (which we have), then just let the game go, and see where it heads. :2thumbsup:

[deguerra]

im happy with informal rules. also, zim, youre welcome to sub for me anytime if i cannot make it, but I will try my utmost to keep you informed

[Zim]

Ok, deguerra. :yes:

To everyone, should you want the GM (me) or anyone else to sub for you in case of emergency (say, your computer dies for a couple days and you miss the deadline completely), tell me. I'll type up a list and that way emergencies will not screw over people's factions.

[Cecil XIX]

Room has been made. Looks like it's time for me to sort through all of Sigismund's old correspondence.

[Ramses II CP]

Well, it's just one of those things like Scotland-England. Eventually somebody's going to be on the bad side of a crusade. I knew that going in as a Muslim, but rest assured a united Islam will be a bad force to face if we answer a crusade with a jihad. Our mercs aren't as good as yours, but they're soooo cheap it's scary. By turn ten we could each have 3 or more stacks of mercs without abusing the jihad mechanic to capture huge territories.

:egypt:

[Zim]

Are you saying it will be a united Islam then, Ramses? ~;p

I actually think the Muslim factions have one advantage. While it is pretty much assured someone will declare a crusade on the Moors or the Levant, their are far more targets for Jihads, and the Muslims can use the threat of one to get the Christians to back off if they play their cards right.

[Ramses II CP]

Hah, until about 10 minutes ago there was only one Islam, so it was pretty united. :p

I expect OK to realize that if we're deep into a war with each other then the first crusade will be the last we live to see, but you know Antioch is the richest city in the world. Who's going to end up with it?

:egypt:

[OverKnight]

Actually, I'll be decamping all my forces and moving to southern Russia, as suggested by one of the posters in the Turks guide.

:clown:

[Zim]

New rule,
Everyone has to abandon their starting provinces and move somewhere else far away on the map. :clown:

[deguerra]

bags italy! :clown:

[Zim]

Nah, Denmark can have Tbilisi. :clown:

Hey, what difficulty would people like this to be?

[deguerra]

will difficulty influence auto-reslove results?

[Ramses II CP]

Egypt will move to Rome, of course, and after evicting the current unsightly occupiers will expect her neighbors to be more peaceful.

AFAIK any changes to auto-resolve from difficulty will be universal and so irrelevant.

:egypt:

[gibsonsg91921]

Probably something simple so you don't forget it like a certain someone who will remain Gibson... :clown:

Either way, Zim can reset it or change it to anything he wants so it's not too big of a deal anymore.

I went back to my standard always-hotseat password for safety, and I already PMed it to Zim.

Hey, Mrs. Zim! Welcome to nerd-dom!

[Zim]

Ok guys, one more day has passed and no new players (not a complaint, we've had a ton of people coming into the game). How long should the cutoff date be for us to get started?

[Privateerkev]

We can bump the thead in the Citadel with an update and list of available factions. Then give it another day.

[FactionHeir]

Zim, you still need to send stuff :tongue:

[Zim]

~;p I just did.

One more day then, and I'll post a list of factions in Gibson's thread in the Citadel. I do have one person promising to check it out, so we may get at least one more.

Ok, we're starting this weekened, so if any important diplomatic deals need to be made, get them done soon! :beam:

[Cheetah]

I think we definitely need players for Russia, Milan and for the Moors. Byzantines can be played by the AI :clown:

TBH I would love to play both Russia and the Moors. Can I? :clown:

[Zim]

No. :clown:

I hope we get a few more as well, but we'll see.
On a side note, we have our second conflict. In addition to the Scottish/English conflict, which will most likely result in war, we have a German/Polish territory conflict, consisting of Germany's claims on lands east to them. Some things don't change, I suppose. :clown:


I think we definitely need players for Russia, Milan and for the Moors. Byzantines can be played by the AI :clown:

TBH I would love to play both Russia and the Moors. Can I? :clown:

[Zim]

Allow me to rephrase that. You can change your faction to one of them, but no playing multiple factions. :clown:

[Cheetah]

I know that ofc. ~;) I was just jesting. :clown:

And I wont change Hungary. ~;)

[Privateerkev]

I Some things don't change, I suppose. :clown:

Don't tell me that you now have a house rule where we all have to be nice to each other IC.

"Medieval 2 Total Peace"

:clown:

[Zim]

Don't tell me that you now have a house rule where we all have to be nice to each other IC.

"Medieval 2 Total Peace"

:clown:

Actually, I was thinking of the "Germany claiming Polish lands" thing. Kaiser Heinrich is setting a precedent Germany will follow until after WW2. :clown:

[deguerra]

AFTER ww2?

can't we all just get along. There are 4 territories. Split them evenly. At least some of them are arguably german :D

[Zim]

Isn't that the last time Germany tried to invade Poland?


AFTER ww2?

can't we all just get along. There are 4 territories. Split them evenly. At least some of them are arguably german :D

[deguerra]

hence, until ww2. the german state is no longer claiming any currenly polish lands.

[Zim]

Right, hence they continued to do so until after WW2. If I just said "until WW2", in English it might sound as if I'm saying they stopped when WW2 started, rather than afterward. :clown:

I suppose "until the end of WW2" might have been more accurate, but I didn't think of it at the time.

[Ramses II CP]

Not today, but (Not to raise the spector of dead history) depending on how you view the East German state and the Soviet Union's collective intentions you could well call it a territorial ambition.

Which is not to impugn the modern German state, of course, as we're past all that.

:egypt:

[Zim]

Ok, after deguerra gets to response I say we have a moratorium on talk about English grammar. If we're going to talk off-topic, I'd say something more light-hearted is in order. :clown:

[Ramses II CP]

'...we're past all that.' not meant to suggest I'm German either. ;)

:egypt:

[Privateerkev]

can't we all just get along. There are 4 territories. Split them evenly. At least some of them are arguably german :D

People can claim all the territory they want. It's a matter of getting them and defending them that is difficult. ^_^

And it is a matter of getting others to respect your claims. Hence the massive importance of diplomacy. :D

[Zim]

Ok, I still need...just about everybody's password. We're starting in two days, so lets get that done as soon as possible. :yes:

[deguerra]

oh yes, it wasn't a serious post. I don't want Medieval 2 Total Peace either :D

Will PM you my password Will


People can claim all the territory they want. It's a matter of getting them and defending them that is difficult. ^_^

And it is a matter of getting others to respect your claims. Hence the massive importance of diplomacy. :D

[Zim]

I think it's interesting that in contrast with the Britannia game, most of the early public announcements in this one have been about divying up the rebel settlements.

[deguerra]

well theres not much else denmark can feasably do :D

[Zim]

Well, I think that's true of most factions, since there are relatively few bordering ones, and lots of rebel territory.

I admit to being surprised Denmark wasn't interested in Hamburg. Way back when I started playing the game, almost every single post in the guide thread suggested taking it first. :clown:

[FactionHeir]

Why Hamburg if you can take Nottingham :clown:

[Zim]

Or Stettin.

Bwahaha, if we do this right we can have every faction in the region concerned about Denmark. :clown:

[FactionHeir]

How about we catholic nations call an inofficial crusade on HRE, since they'll end up attacking the pope anyway. Pre-emptive strike and all :grin:

[deguerra]

I want good relations with the HRE. That is unlikely to happen if I take Hamburg. No, I think I will take Scandinavia and then see how things go. Perhaps crusade, perhaps look east

[Zim]

I don't know, then Sicily might lose their dramatic role of burning Rome to the ground to rescue the Pope. :beam:

[FactionHeir]

"Oops, I thought we were to burn the pope and rescue Rome"

deguerra: East? That best be Middle-East, not Eastern-Europe *shakes fist*

[deguerra]

Come now, I am sure there is enough of Russia for the both of us, especially with your extensive claims on your western border:beam:

[FactionHeir]

Sorry, gave half of Russia to another ally already :laugh4:

Y'know, dividing the world early means less squabbling later.

[deguerra]

I am uncertain Russia is the Pole's to give away. And there is probably still enough of it if we threesie it. In any case I am not making any claims here, just thinking out loud

[FactionHeir]

You get Helsinki, Riga, Moscow and Novgorod and Bulgar if you really want if you take Hamburg and Frankfurt and help us bash them HRE back to stone age :grin:

[Privateerkev]

Why Hamburg if you can take Nottingham :clown:

Hmm.. someone is smarting from rejection...

:inquisitive:

:clown:

As for divvying up rebel territory first, it is because it is easier than fighting a human. (trust me...)

Also, I still hold out hope for a player controlled Russia. (as well as all of the "normal" factions)

[FactionHeir]

So, anyone taking bets on which faction is the first to go?

I'm thinking its either Milan, England or Scotland.

[deguerra]

alternatively, i back the empire, smash the crap out of you and take it all?

:clown:

[Privateerkev]

So, anyone taking bets on which faction is the first to go?

I'm thinking its either Milan, England or Scotland.

It's usually the one that keeps bringing up "faction destruction", and war with human players, the most in the OOC thread...

:evil:

[Ramses II CP]

I think, honestly, that if a player takes the HRE the smart thing for everyone around him to do is band together and destroy him immediately. Otherwise he should be able to destroy them one by one fairly easily.

:egypt:

[Privateerkev]

I think, honestly, that if a player takes the HRE the smart thing for everyone around him to do is band together and destroy him immediately. Otherwise he should be able to destroy them one by one fairly easily.

:egypt:

Technically, the smart thing for everyone to do, is to make exactly one enemy, and have the rest as friends.

But, no one said we had to be smart.

And this is to everyone,

Do we really have to keep discussing war and such in the OOC thread? Let it play out in the game. Make some PM's. Make some Council declarations.

Too much OOC talk about who should be jumped first seems "campy".

Just my opinion...

[deguerra]

cecil has taken the HRE, and king knud of the danes will not take kindly to that kind of talk :D

[Cecil XIX]

EDIT: Forget what I said, I agree with Privateerkev. This entire page is inappropriate.

[FactionHeir]

Eh, are you saying Knud and Jalal are incompetent?

[Privateerkev]

Eh, are you saying Knud and Jalal are incompetent?

Without a smiley, that almost looks like "baiting" FH.

I'm not saying people shouldn't organize a "pile on" if they want to.

I'm just asking if we can keep the "propaganda" out of here...

[FactionHeir]

I coulda sworn I added in a smilie, but if you insist, you can have this one: :clown:

Nothing much to do IC as all that needs to be said has been said and we are more or less waiting for the game to start.

[Cecil XIX]

A thought just ocurred to me: Would there be any in-game penalty for marching troops across foreign lands if you had an in-character but not in-game agreement of military access?

[FactionHeir]

Well, you get a relation penalty (not that it matters among humans) and I think a very minor penalty with the pope too.

[Privateerkev]

Nothing much to do IC as all that needs to be said has been said and we are more or less waiting for the game to start.

Seeing as you felt the need to make the case in this thread, for everyone to war against HRE, you obviously felt that there was more that needed to be said.

Maybe it is how I see "OOC threads" in these games. I see them as a place for the community to come together, ask questions, banter good naturedly, bring up topics, and keep the game running smoothly.

Unless you want to plan the whole game out ahead of time, which seems less fun, I like actually playing the game and seeing what happens. If you want to organize a pile-on, I assure you it is quite possible to do so in the game. Some well placed PM's to the right people and some coordination is all it takes. If you can't find enough allies to join in your quest, then lobbying the players of the game in the OOC thread just seems to be the wrong way to go about it.


Would there be any in-game penalty for marching troops across foreign lands if you had an in-character but not in-game agreement of military access?

The "devastation mechanic" cares not for what you have agreed to in a PM. Whatever causes "devastation" will do so unless you do the in-game diplomacy.

As far as I know...

[FactionHeir]

Devastation only affects factions at war.

And I got my allies IC already. The OOC is friendly discussion, albeit more aggressive than KOTR obviously.

[Privateerkev]

Devastation only affects factions at war.

ah, thanks! :2thumbsup:


And I got my allies IC already. The OOC is friendly discussion, albeit more aggressive than KOTR obviously.

I guess I saw no reason why it had to be "aggressive" at all. Keep the angst in the game I say... :yes:

[Ramses II CP]

Sorry, I meant my comment in a more generic, 'this is what I see in the map' kind of way. If I was the HRE I would immediately move to smash one of my surrounding enemies and I don't believe any of the nations around me could stop it, so...

Point taken though, I won't discuss specifics of the matter here in regard to this game. :2thumbsup:

:egypt:

[Privateerkev]

Sorry, I meant my comment in a more generic, 'this is what I see in the map' kind of way. If I was the HRE I would immediately move to smash one of my surrounding enemies and I don't believe any of the nations around me could stop it, so...

Point taken though, I won't discuss specifics of the matter here in regard to this game. :2thumbsup:

:egypt:

Well you were certainly non-aggressive about it. But, I guess even discussing basic vulnerabilities and strategies could become too much. It's like when I was playing Risk with my old gaming group. Every Risk playing group has that one guy who very obviously says, "Wow look, Kevin left Kamchatka totally open. You could sooo break his continent." :beam:

[Ramses II CP]

Heh, I was never much of a Risk guy, more into Diplomacy where that kind of comment is expected and usually returned with interest. :laugh4:

:egypt:

[RoadKill]

Zim would you mind subbing for me as France for the week I am gone?

[Zim]

Zim would you mind subbing for me as France for the week I am gone?

Sure, just pm me directions if you want anything in particular done.

[Zim]

While I'm not going to tell people they can't do some OOC planning in here, I'm not sure it's a wise idea to talk about carving up a faction's territories. For one thing, it's likely to make you look bad. For example Poland's territorial claims will look much weaker if people think they're just trying to goad the HRE into a war with its neighbors.

However, speculative stuff (wow, I wonder why Zim betrayed his wife to the French :clown: ) is fine, and lots of fun. :yes:

[gibsonsg91921]

I feel like if I went all out and got "expansionist" with Spain then I would be accused of picking on the girl.

Don't worry, I'm not going to as far as I can see, but it will get crowded in the Iberian Peninsula.

[Zim]

Just watch for those triple gold chevron stacks I'm giving her. :clown:

Seriously, although I'd expect Spain and Portugal to cooperate in the short term (reconquista and all), I don't think anyone will be extremely offended if you tried to take out Spain later, least of all me or Molly.



I feel like if I went all out and got "expansionist" with Spain then I would be accused of picking on the girl.

Don't worry, I'm not going to as far as I can see, but it will get crowded in the Iberian Peninsula.

[GeneralHankerchief]

I'll play as the Moors if you'll still have me.

I've never touched the faction before and, TBH, haven't even picked up M2TW in a while so it should be fun. :yes:

[Zim]

Glad to have you, GH. You'll need to pm me your password. :yes:

I'd advise talking to the other Muslim factions and possible neighbors, although it might be tough with the Iberian factions, what with the Reconquista and all...:dizzy2:

[GeneralHankerchief]

Gotcha.

PMing shortly.

[deguerra]

two questions:

1. in the timeframe it was not uncommon for rulers to pawn off their lands to others for a set time, in order to raise enough money for crusading or warring. is this a bad idea in m2tw for any reason? (obvioulsy would be advisable only with human factions, and even then its obvioulsy risky. have fun trying to convince the AI to give back a settlement:laugh4: )

2. i realise the thought comes quite late for our game, but why does nobody do a hotseat campaign based on one of the more popular mods (lusteds lands to conquer or stainless steel say)?

[Zim]

1. I suppose you could try that with Human players, assuming they have enough florins for it to be worth it. There's no mechanism other than maybe public opinion (via the Council) to ensure players keep that kind of deal, though.

2. I think it's because it's hard to get that many people to download a mod just to play a hotseat game. KOTR is the only exception I can think of, and they worked to make it so the mod wouldn't affect your normal games.

[deguerra]

1. yeh I wasn't meaning for there to be some sort of OOC enforcement mechanism. Obviously it would be at your own risk.

2. well personally, I have an obsession to download and try out quite a few mods, so I guess to me thats no problem. I guess more vanilla-ey people, and esp. those with worse internet connections would be left out, especially bad when you have as many people as you need for a grand campaign. was just thinking...

[phonicsmonkey]

deguerra, I think there will be a few people around interested in playing a Broken Crescent hotseat when (and if) it's ever ready

I know I'm itching to play it, and Sinan has also made it clear he'll be up for BC in multiplayer

[Zim]

I'd join a BC hotseat, although last I ehard the version they were working on was for 1.2, and not compatable with 1.3.

Almost all factions are filled, and we've had plenty of time to negotiate. I'm going to start this tomorrow, as soon as I get the last few passwords. :yes:

[Privateerkev]

I'll bump the Citadel thread and announce the three vacancies. :beam:

[Csargo]

I'll take Russia.

[deguerra]

excellent. that ought to make poland a little less of a powerhouse :D welcome ichigo!

[Zim]

Welcome to the game. :beam:

Pm me your password when you get a chance. Check the Council thread if you want to claim territories or engage in public diplomacy (beyond whatever pm diplomacy you engage in). :yes:


I'll take Russia.

[phonicsmonkey]

sorry to continue with the thread hijack, but I was under the impression that patch 1.3 did nothing for the game anyways, except to make multiplayer battles compatible between 1.2 and Kingdoms....

am I wrong?

[Privateerkev]

sorry to continue with the thread hijack, but I was under the impression that patch 1.3 did nothing for the game anyways, except to make multiplayer battles compatible between 1.2 and Kingdoms....

am I wrong?

No, your right. 1.3 makes sure that all the Kingdoms owners can play with all the non-Kingdoms owners.

[phonicsmonkey]

I never play mp battles, so I never installed it

anyways, I'll shut up now :sorry2:

[Privateerkev]

Well, you obviously have Kingdoms, therefore, you have a version of 1.3

[Zim]

I know 1.3 does almost nothing, but not only are 1.2 PBMs incompatible with 1.3 saves, but in the BC forum a couple months ago when I last looked, they said the saves were incompatible the other way, also. :sweatdrop:

[phonicsmonkey]

oh. does it automatically update the main game, like BI did for RTW?

hey, you tempted me into spamming again!

:oops:

[gibsonsg91921]

it does update the main game.

[Zim]

Yep, Kingdoms adds 1.2 and then 1.3, if you're lacking them. :yes:

You wouldn't be spamming if you joined the game. :clown:

[phonicsmonkey]

I wouldn't be married for much longer either

two hotseat games is enough for mrs monkey, three would be pushing it

:whip:

EDIT: please feel free to nominate me for "most appropriate use of the whip-smiley award 2007", or invent such award for me if said award does not exist

[Privateerkev]

hey, you tempted me into spamming again!

It doesn't seem like we have to twist your arm much. You gonna dance all night or are you gonna come and join us. :beam:

*edit*

Nevermind, PM was posting his reply when I was writing this.

[rossahh]

Hello everyone! Long time reader (as guest), first time poster.

I've been to the guild thousands or times and always enjoyed reading other's opinions on the game, but by far I'm most intrigued with hotseat-multiplayer as it's something I've never done nor contemplated. However, I've emerged from my shell and would be happy to fill in for you as Milan, if you would like me to.

I've played all the TWs for years and love 'em to bits, and am totally ready to get beaten senseless :whip: by some real people, something the AI has never managed to achieve.


I do have some quick questions though - where do you upload the files? and do you have to have a 'vanilla' version of 1.3 (mtw2 + kingdoms) and by that I mean have nothing altered like descr_strat?

[Privateerkev]

I do have some quick questions though - where do you upload the files? and do you have to have a 'vanilla' version of 1.3 (mtw2 + kingdoms) and by that I mean have nothing altered like descr_strat?

Hi! :beam:

Upload here:http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/Uploaders/pbmupload.php

And you can do it with just Kingdoms and it doesn't have to be "pure" as far as I know but FH would be able to answer that better than I.

[Zim]

Welcome rossahh!

Since PK was nice enough to post the upload link, I guess the only other one you might need is this one. It's the Council thread, where you can make public declarations, hash out deals in the open, etc. I think a lot of players are using it to lay claim to the rebel territories they want.

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=96832

Stay away from Florence, Venice called dibs! :whip:

~;)

[Zim]

Ok, I need a few more passwords pmed to me.

One from our new player Rossahh, of course, and Ignoramus, Cheetah, and Elite Ferret.

If I've already received your password and you're on that list, please send it to me again. I may have misplaced the old pm. :sweatdrop:

Ok guys, I think we need a vote. With only one faction (which may get filled before we start :yes: ), Faction Heir's mod (which would only need to be downloaded by me, the save "remembers" the changes after I start the game) may not be neccessary. I'd like to know who would sitll want it in. :yes:

[Privateerkev]

I'm torn. On one hand, I don't want to use a mod. On the other, I wouldn't want the Byzantines to be a cakewalk because they'll just get "farmed" otherwise.

Though, they'll get creamed anyways if they are AI controlled mod or no mod. All the neighboring factions will pick them apart like vultures. :yes:

Maybe we'll luck out and get a player. I edited my post in the citadel to show that they are the only one left.

*edit*

Just put me down as a "no" vote. No matter how much they are modded, the Byzantines are going to get pawned if they are in the middle of human controlled factions. Might as well get it over with. And I am no where near that part of the map so this certainly isn't out of self-interest.

[rossahh]

Thanks guys, I'll try to last a few turns, perhaps double figures?

PM on the way Zim.

[Zim]

Alright, we have just about all of our players (all if noone takes the Byzantines), with only a few more passwords needed. I'm setting a tentative starting point of about 12 hours from now (maybe a bit more, as I understand, the first player works until the afternoon anyway).

With the holidays coming up very soon, and some new players (and a lot of players period), turn limits will be greatly relaxed until New Year's when our lives return to normal.

Now would be a great time to post if you have a person in mind to sub in an emergency. I'll make a lists of subs to use if I don't hear from a player within the time limit. That way, no turns will be skipped because someone's interenet connection had a bad day or something. :yes:

It can be any other player or ORG member, even me.

So everyone knows, I will be subbing Roadkill's first turn, and he's left rather detailed instructions. I'm not sure if he has internet access this next week he can't play, but if not he won't be able to get back to people on diplomatic offers.

Half a day left until go time! :2thumbsup:

[Privateerkev]

(maybe a bit more, as I understand, the first player works until the afternoon anyway).

It is a half-day at work tomorrow because of the holidays. I work for a college and get the next week and a half off. Our break from work starts tomorrow at noon. So, I can play my turn around noon in US CT. :2thumbsup:

[Zim]

Sounds good, PK, although it might be abit later than that when I get the save up. :yes:

I just noticed something from the diplomacy thread for the first game. In that one, Ignoramus put up a list of alliances declared in the thread, and current wars. Would people like any kind of notice like that in the Council thread?

Lastly, would people like a salon thread like the one for the Britannia Hotseat? Basically, it's a place where players and non-players can role-play and speculate about what's happening in game.

[_Tristan_]

Zim, are the byzzies still free ?

I'll be putting my life at risk (from the lady) but those Grand Campains are much faster than any other of the Kingdoms one ?

I'll happily play the part

[Zim]

Indeed they are. :yes:

Looks like Pk was right. We managed to fill every faction! :2thumbsup:

[FactionHeir]

Ok guys, I think we need a vote. With only one faction (which may get filled before we start :yes: ), Faction Heir's mod (which would only need to be downloaded by me, the save "remembers" the changes after I start the game) may not be neccessary. I'd like to know who would sitll want it in. :yes:

Its mostly for ensuring that factions that are abandoned (i.e. a human player cannot find the time to continue and is replaced via console with the AI) are not easily stomped. With all factions taken, I would expect that people drop out eventually and it would be difficult to refill them with so many players already involved.

[Zim]

So as long as every faction has a player, it won't change anything?

[FactionHeir]

Not much besides ensuring that everyone starts off at an even level (in terms of purse and starting florins) and there is somewhat less delay between each mongol/timurid invasion (and hopefully make them actually attack rather than walk around dong nothing).
More than that would require everyone having files. The current batch will only require you to have them when you start the game (you can discard them afterwards).
Once the game has started though, you cannot apply it retrospectively, so I would leave it in as a safety measure.

[Zim]

In that case, I think we should still use them. :yes:

[Ferret]

I'm happy to have them and Zim, you can sub for me if I'm going to be away, so long as you remain a trusted ally and good player that is.

[Privateerkev]

In that case, I think we should still use them. :yes:

We're modding the game even though we don't need to?

I rather do this as "vanilla" as possible.

Also, I wish this was made more clear from the beginning because it could be deal-breaking for me, if the changes are too extensive.

Our resident modder has arbitrarily decided to change the game on us. And our GM has not adequetly informed us, probably because he didn't know.

I thought we were just giving the AI a little boost in King's Purse.

Now I learn it is more extensive than that.

I don't mean to sound all dramatic, but I don't appreciate being treated that way. We're a community and we should at least be informed of these things. FH is pulling the same thing he pulls in KotR, which is deciding himself what our game experience should be and then modding things without really giving us details.

[Cecil XIX]

I say we vote on whether or not to include these changes. Myself, I'd need to know exactly what these change are before I approve of them. Preferably I'd like FH to copy the relevent parts straight from notepad and post them here.

[Privateerkev]

I say we vote on whether or not to include these changes. Myself, I'd need to know exactly what these change are before I approve of them. Preferably I'd like FH to copy the relevent parts straight from notepad and post them here.

Since I'm always spouting off about GM rights, let me make this clear. A GM can have any mod he wishes in his game.

But I think we deserve to know exactly what that mod is so we can make the decision on whether to play the game.

Having FH decide what is "best for us", and then not informing us of the details, does not make me happy.

[FactionHeir]

I already explained what exactly was changed on the previous page.

[Privateerkev]

I already explained what exactly was changed on the previous page.

Well, I find that post to be vague.

You have a certain way of seeing the game. Not everyone sees the game the way you do. But, you continuously try to push your "vision" for M2TW on everyone in the Throne Room by making mods and then ramming them into every game you play with very little discussion on the matter.

What if I don't share your vision? Shouldn't I at least be reasonably informed, so I can make an educated decision?

[Zim]

Hmm...none of the changes sounded that huge to me (I would like to have known the dates for the Mongols and Timurids).

I guess I'll reopen it for a vote. I'll be starting the game in a few hours. Any players online now tell me what you think about modding the game.

[Privateerkev]

I guess I'll reopen it for a vote. I'll be starting the game in a few hours. Any players online now tell me what you think about modding the game.

I vote No.

Why should we "even out" the King's Purse and starting florins? The factions aren't laid out fair anyways but they are not supposed to be fair. We all new what we were getting into.

The settlement numbers, unit stats, resource allotment, ect... are not fair so why should the money be?

[FactionHeir]

"Just a warning: if we have to start getting 'consent' every time we do a procedure, soon it'll be 'informed' consent they'll want." - House M.D. :laugh4:

How true. And quite a few allegations in there too. Anyway, I'll overlook that and post a few specifics.

All factions start with 8000 florins - 1000 for each settlement they own at the start down to a minimum of 5000.
All factions have an equal King's Purse of 3000 rather than some arbitrary number.
Replaced all instances of balanced smith with other AI behaviors that are quite a bit more aggressive and smarter.
Decreased the interval of horde spawning by a factor of 2.
Added money scripts that check at the start of a faction's turn whether they are still player controlled and if not, gives them 5000-7000 extra cash that turn.

[edit]
Zim: The dates for mongol/timurid invasion are as per vanilla as I didn't change those. I changed the interval between each stack spawn once they actually invade though (so instead of 8 turns between each triple stack, its now 3-4 turns)

[Privateerkev]

"Just a warning: if we have to start getting 'consent' every time we do a procedure, soon it'll be 'informed' consent they'll want." - House M.D. :laugh4:

How true. And quite a few allegations in there too. Anyway, I'll overlook that and post a few specifics.

Yes FH, I demand to know what kind of game I am getting myself into. Zim can run any kind of game he wants. But I have every right to know the details ahead of time. I felt this was all railroaded past most of the players with very little information coming from the two of you.

And FH, your not a doctor...

[FactionHeir]

Yes FH, I demand to know what kind of game I am getting myself into. Zim can run any kind of game he wants. But I have every right to know the details ahead of time. I felt this was all railroaded past most of the players with very little information coming from the two of you.

And FH, your not a doctor...

Quoting only the first part of the post rather than inclusive of the second part which already included the details seems rather odd and nonsensical to me, but certainly understandable that you want to know something.

And quoting a "doctor" doesn't require you to be a doctor.

[Privateerkev]

Quoting only the first part of the post rather than inclusive of the second part which already included the details seems rather odd and nonsensical to me, but certainly understandable that you want to know something.

And quoting a "doctor" doesn't require you to be a doctor.

No but you seem to have this paternalistic idea of what would be "best for us."

I will decide what is best for me. I will decide what kind of games I play. I do not appreciate you trying to alter the gaming experience of 17 people without adequately informing them.

Even the GM did not fully grasp what you were trying to change until I pushed.

If you want to present a mod, then present it to the group and let us know what it would do. Then wait for our feedback. Don't ramrod it through the GM and try to bypass us.

[FactionHeir]

That's a moot point as there is a discussion poll ongoing.

While I expect that people will disagree with changes to the purse, I doubt anyone besides yourself will have anything against an AI that actually does something besides sit around waiting to get beaten into oblivion.

[Privateerkev]

That's a moot point as there is a discussion poll ongoing.

While I expect that people will disagree with changes to the purse, I doubt anyone besides yourself will have anything against an AI that actually does something besides sit around waiting to get beaten into oblivion.

It's not moot. It is at the heart of the issue. If I hadn't made a stink, most of the players would not know what it was that you tried to do.

And again, your making assumptions as to what we would find to be fun.

Why don't you just ask? Don't push it down our throats...:no:

[GeneralHankerchief]

This much OOC drama this early in the game is not healthy. If the issue is not resolved to satisfaction quickly then I'm going to withdraw.

[Ferret]

well so far there are 2 no votes and one yes vote, if you make your decision and so does Gibson then all online players will have oted and Zim can make the final ruling, should happen quickly enough. Don't worry in the other GCH there is close to little arguments and pretty much just playing the game :)

[Zim]

Ok, since there are enough votes for no, one rather vehement, I will be starting the gamy in a bit with no mods. I was afraid if the arguing continued, players would be driven away, and oe has already expressed that sentiment.

Feel free to continue to argue the merits of modding for hotseats in the seperate thread I made, but let's get it out of here now that a decision has been made. If any more personal insults occur in this thread, Ill be making my very first report to a mod.

Come on guys, we have a Grand Campaign Hotseat with every faction filled! This will be great with or witout mods, and it's not worth arguing over. :yes:

[Privateerkev]

Ok, since there are enough votes for no, one rather vehement, I will be starting the gamy in a bit with no mods. I was afraid if the arguing continued, players would be driven away, and oe has already expressed that sentiment.

Feel free to continue to argue the merits of modding for hotseats in the seperate thread I made, but let's get it out of here now that a decision has been made. If any more personal insults occur in this thread, Ill be making my very first report to a mod.

Come on guys, we have a Grand Campaign Hotseat with every faction filled! This will be great with or witout mods, and it's not worth arguing over. :yes:

"one rather vehement"

I should make that my sig...

But on a more serious note, point taken.

FH and I are talking through PM's and as far as I am concerned, the discussion on here about it is over.

We bring you back to our regularly scheduled programs...

[Zim]

Ok, I am starting the game in a moment.

I would like to ask one technical question before beginning, since I don't play hotseat in regular MTW often.


I put this in my config file, correct? Only the number for the line I've put in bold (autoresolve) should be 1?


[multiplayer]
playable = true
hotseat_turns = true
hotseat_scroll = false
hotseat_autoresolve_battles = 0
hotseat_disable_console = 1
hotseat_disable_papal_elections = 0
hotseat_save_prefs = 0
hotseat_update_ai_camera = 0
hotseat_validate_diplomacy = 1

[hotseat]
admin_password = abc

[Privateerkev]

According to FH's instructions in the "admin hotseat" sticky, it should be 0

[FactionHeir]

It doesn't matter for the admin part.
Since we want to have all our battles autoresolved rather than manually fought though, this should be 1.

[Zim]

Well, I obviously wasn't going to have the admin password be "abc". :clown:

Now, will everyone have to put this stuff in their config file, or just me?

[FactionHeir]

Just you, yourself and uh...you. :clown:
And after you start and save the game, you can get rid of it too.

And the abc part is vital btw. It will not work if its not abc!!!! :clown:

[Zim]

In that case, consider the game to be starting momentarily! :2thumbsup:

[Privateerkev]

And the abc part is vital btw. It will not work if its not abc!!!! :clown:

You mean I wasn't supposed to make the Crusade game admin password abc?!?!

:clown:

[Zim]

Alright guys! I have everything set up. I also did a test run through the turns (without looking at anything) and it worked. Every single faction is in the game, and the admin password works! :2thumbsup:

Save should be uploaded soon. Name will be 2GCH-1-England.

2 since this is the second such hotseat, turn 1 and England's turn.

[Zim]

PK, you're up first.

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-England.zip

[Privateerkev]

Away we go... :2thumbsup:

[Privateerkev]

And we're off...

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-France.zip

[Zim]

Alright. Since I'm subbing for Roadkill today, I'll take the save. Cecil, if you can wait half an hour or so you'll have your turn. My wife is next after that, then me, so we could get five turns (at least!) done today. :2thumbsup:

[RoadKill]

Wait Zim. I havn't left yet. Can I please do the turn.

[Zim]

:yes: Of course.

[RoadKill]

Done. But for some reason. I can't post the link. So I guess the next person in line is going to have to scravage through the directory. sorry

[Zim]

I was digging through the directory for a save for one of my other MP games, and was able to find it.

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-HRE.sav

[Zim]

Ok, I believe I ave everyone's password but Ignoramus' and Cheetah's.I'll need them before I can let you two play a turn. ~;p

[Cecil XIX]

Turn complete and uploaded. (http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-Spain.zip)

[Cheetah]

Well one question. I know we should have settled it before but it only just came to my mind: is it allowed to build merchant forts?

I would say no, as it would only amplify the advantage of provinces with good trade resources by a factor of 20.

[FactionHeir]

Rules in post 1 say no.

[Cheetah]

Ah, fine thx. :beam:

Should read the rules. :wall: :clown:

[deguerra]

just to be sure i get this right:

naming convention for the savegame is:

2GHC-[turn #]-[next player]

and we are posting the savegame here and pming the next player, correct?

[FactionHeir]

yes

[Mrs. Zim]

I'm done with my turn. My husband is going to take his turn next.

[Ignoramus]

I feel isolated up in the colds of Scotland; all the action's taking place on the Continent.

[Zim]

Ok everyone, I have everybody's passwords! :2thumbsup:

Ignoramus, I think it might be fairly exciting in Scotland, given the English ruler's stated intent to take out the Scots. :clown:

Diplomatically it might be boring, but I have a feeling half of Europe will crawl out and congratulate the winner after you and pk fight it out.

[Ignoramus]

We'll inflict many a Stirling on them, don't worry!

[Zim]

It will be interesting to see how things turn out there. :yes:

Fixing dinner right now, but I should be able to get to my save in a bit.

[Privateerkev]

Ignoramus, I think it might be fairly exciting in Scotland, given the English ruler's stated intent to take out the Scots. :clown:

:saint:

[Zim]

Ok, my turn is done!

I got the order wrong in the first post. I'll fix it as we go along (actually, I think it's just the same order as the factions are shown in the Grand Campaign selection screen, from left to right).

Next is Sicily!

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-Sicily.zip

[Ferret]

Milan:http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-Milan.rar

[rossahh]

Milan is done, Scotland's up:

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-Scotland.rar

[Zim]

Cool! 7 turns in less than 24 hours. :2thumbsup:
Ignoramus has informed me he can't play until Monday, which is fine since it will come within the 48 hour maximum limit if I'm informed of a need for more time (he's in Aussieland, so a day ahead of those of us who are in the western Hemisphere).

As a side note, deadlines will be very lenient over the holidays, so if you absolutely can't play your turn right away if it comes up then, just tell me.

Luckily that hasn't been a problem yet, but Christmas is coming. :yes:

[Ferret]

hmmm I wont be able to play from the 25th untill the 1st so you can sub for me if my turn comes up then.

[OverKnight]

I will be gone on Dec 24 and Dec 25, though I don't know if that will effect anything.

I'd prefer to play the first turn myself, but I'll delegate to someone else if need be.

[Zim]

You should be ok, OK, since it's just a couple days.

EF, if we keep up this breakneck speed and your turn comes, I'll be happy to sub. Just send me direction prior to leaving if you want specific things done. :yes:

[Ramses II CP]

I'm out of town until the 26th or 27th, but should be fine to DL a save game and play my turn if we get to Egypt.

:egypt:

[RoadKill]

I'm out in Las Vegas from the 23rd to the 29th. I think I need a sub.

[GeneralHankerchief]

I'll be good to go throughout the season (everyone comes here, which is kind of nice).

[Zim]

Ok, anyone who thinks they'll need one (i.E. who's out more than a couple days), please send me the name of someone you'd like to sub for you. :yes:

[Tran]

If you don't mind, sign me up as reserve. In case someone drops out, I would like to take over the former position (anything's fine, although "southern factions" are preferable)

[Zim]

Done. :yes:

[FactionHeir]

Ramses:

Point taken, they can be seen. But I think we ought to clarify OOC the "discovery" of assassins. Assassins usually tend to be visible if standing next to your town regardless if you have spies there or not. Would this count as "I see an assassin and know which faction it is from"? How about if the assassin attacks but fails (without dying)?
What if one of your armies cross the path of an assassin (if they move over him (including past, not atop of him) they usually become visible.

Personally, I think from a RP standpoint, assassins should only count as spotted if you actually have a spy/assassin of equal or higher subterfuge next to them, not under other circumstances.
Further, I'd say you can only tell the nationality of an assassin if you then either successfully take him out, successfully spy on him, or he dies performing a mission.

What's everyone's take on that?

[Privateerkev]

If I see the assassin, I see the assassin. House rules would just complicate things IMHO.

As for notification, I made up something in the other Hotseats. This is something I use. Feel free to use it if you want but it is not required unless GM says so:

1.) If I send an assassin after you, and he fails, I will tell you OOC because the SP game would tell you.

2.) If I send an assassin after you, and he succeeds, I would tell Zim OOC so he can send you a vague message later in the turn that something of yours was murdered. Because the SP game would not tell you. Then it would be up to you to guess who did it. Maybe you see my assassin wandering around. Maybe you assume it is your warring neighbor.

[FactionHeir]

Hmmm on 1) the game wouldn't tell you if you escaped an assassin. You only get a highpersonalsecurity trait but no feedback message. On 2) the game gives you a message saying "X fallen victim to a foreign assassin"

The game tells you which faction a spy is from if he fails, but not an assassin.
If an assassin dies doing his mission though, the game will tell you (and auto declare war if it was on a family member)

[Privateerkev]

Good points. I might change how I notify. Notification of agent actions is just something I do as a courtesy. There is no rule regarding it. The only rules Zim has regarding notifications has to do with major actions like army battles and settlement takings.

But your original question has to do with "discovery" so I'll say something else about that. I balk at requiring people to "roleplay agent discovery" because there is no rule requiring us to actually roleplay. We can play our factions entirely OOC if we want. You can just play like you play in a SP game and simply ignore all IC PM's. It might make you unpopular in the game but that's your business. :beam:

[Zim]

I'm more than happy to make announcements about people assassinated without giving away the faction that did it. :yes:

As for reporting seeing assassins, when and if you do so is enirely up to you. Personally, the Republic of Venice is not going to say nothing if an assassin is seen traveling towards the lands of a friend.

[Zim]

I see you online, Ignoramus. :clown: How's that Scottish turn coming?

Edit: Drat, he vanished. :clown:

[Ignoramus]

It's done. I just forgot to mention it.

[Cheetah]

It is Tristan then me!

[Privateerkev]

Here's the link for Tristan.

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-Byzantium.zip

[Zim]

Cool, I pmed Tristan. With Christmas eve coming up, I won't push the deadline much for a couple days. :yes:

Since I assume the Anglo-Scottish war is imminent/on now, I want to mention that you two should report battles, either here to to eachother via pm. It's just something the game would tell you in SP. :yes:

[Privateerkev]

Cool, I pmed Tristan. With Christmas eve coming up, I won't push the deadline much for a couple days. :yes:

Since I assume the Anglo-Scottish war is imminent/on now, I want to mention that you two should report battles, either here to to eachother via pm. It's just something the game would tell you in SP. :yes:

Hasn't happened yet unless Ig did it on his turn. Neither has the moves on the first turn to really do it. Well, if one/both go Cav only, they can reach but that's it.

Don't worry, you know how I am about notifying people. :yes:

[Zim]

I know, I just wasn't sure about if the rules were the same as in the other Grand Campaign game, so I figured I'd issue a reminder.

Can't the Scottish reach that village you said you took? I kind of figured that might be a focal point for battles between the two of you.

Speaking of rules, would everyone be ok with it if I pmed each person in line? I think some players might forget, so this could make it easier. I'm online a lot, and I can pm people when someone says they finished here in the thread.

[Privateerkev]

I know, I just wasn't sure about if the rules were the same as in the other Grand Campaign game, so I figured I'd issue a reminder.

Can't the Scottish reach that village you said you took? I kind of figured that might be a focal point for battles between the two of you.

Speaking of rules, would everyone be ok with it if I pmed each person in line? I think some players might forget, so this could make it easier. I'm online a lot, and I can pm people when someone says they finished here in the thread.

They can reach it on turn 1 if they go cav only. We'll see how turn two goes...

[Zim]

So in turn two the mighty Anglo-Scottish war begins in earnest?

As one of our two seeming early wars (the other being the "everybody hates the Moors" war), I'm curious how it will turn out. :yes:

[Privateerkev]

So in turn two the mighty Anglo-Scottish war begins in earnest?

Maybe. I don't really know. Do you want to me to lay out in excruciating detail my plan for all to see? :clown:

But, in all seriousness, I don't have a master plan. I've played the English in SP games tons of times but this is my first time playing against a player controlled Scotland.

We'll see if we dance around each other or go straight in. Or, maybe we will find common ground, hug, and live in peace. I'm new to this whole GCMP thing. :yes:

[Ignoramus]

Och aye! You'll nae gan well against us!

[Privateerkev]

Och aye! You'll nae gan well against us!

Huh? :inquisitive:

:laugh4:

[Zim]

Maybe. I don't really know. Do you want to me to lay out in excruciating detail my plan for all to see? :clown:


Drat, another of my dastardly plans deduced. :clown:

I'm just excited about the upcoming turns. The Grand Campaign is so big, it's interesting to see conflicts arising somewhat far away, where I can't affect them but may be affected by their results in the future.

[Privateerkev]

I'm just excited about the upcoming turns.

It's even more exciting if you get your faction embroiled in a climatic war that basically decides the fate of your Kingdom... :clown:

Or do you just like to watch? :laugh4:

Boy that could be taken the wrong way... :beam:

[Zim]

I'm just going to pretend I'm not aware of what a disturbing way that can be taken. :clown: It's nice for a change to not be the one fighting for his life nor the one forcing someone to do so.



It's even more exciting if you get your faction embroiled in a climatic war that basically decides the fate of your Kingdom... :clown:

Or do you just like to watch? :laugh4:

Boy that could be taken the wrong way... :beam:

[Privateerkev]

I'm just going to pretend I'm not aware of what a disturbing way that can be taken. :clown: It's nice for a change to not be the one fighting for his life nor the one forcing someone to do so.

I realized belatedly that I shouldn't have used the word "climatic"... :clown:

But, in regards to what you just said, I have the opposite situation. For once, it's nice to be the one fighting for my faction's existence instead of sitting on the sidelines as others do the heaving lifting. :2thumbsup:

[Zim]

I can see why. :yes: In two of the hotseat campaigns you're far from the center of any conflicts. In one of mine, I'm fighting for my and a nearby ally's life, in another I'm the one who took out a faction, and in the last my choosing a side pretty much made it very difficult for a certain faction to survive, even though I've yet to do much directly in it.

It's nice to be on the sidelines for a change, and to be too far away to affect the result. :yes:


I realized belatedly that I shouldn't have used the word "climatic"... :clown:

But, in regards to what you just said, I have the opposite situation. For once, it's nice to be the one fighting for my faction's existence instead of sitting on the sidelines as others do the heaving lifting. :2thumbsup:

[Privateerkev]

I can see why. :yes: In two of the hotseat campaigns you're far from the center of any conflicts. In one of mine, I'm fighting for my and a nearby ally's life, in another I'm the one who took out a faction, and in the last my choosing a side pretty much made it very difficult for a certain faction to survive, even though I've yet to do much directly in it.

It's nice to be on the sidelines for a change, and to be too far away to affect the result. :yes:

Yeah, one nice thing about picking England is that your guaranteed to not have a boring early game.

But you've certainly earned a quiet game. At least for a little while. :beam:

[Zim]

While I'm perfectly happy to stay on the sidelines and build up what few settlements I can get, I wonder how long I can stay at peace once the rebel settlements are gone.


Yeah, one nice thing about picking England is that your guaranteed to not have a boring early game.

But you've certainly earned a quiet game. At least for a little while. :beam:

[OverKnight]

Well we are playing a game called Total War. This ain't no Model UN or nothin'. If you want I can set up a Hot Seat game of Candyland.

:clown:

[Zim]

I think Candyland might be too competitive. Perhaps Musical chairs with more chairs than players? :clown:



Well we are playing a game called Total War. This ain't no Model UN or nothin'. If you want I can set up a Hot Seat game of Candyland.

:clown:

[FactionHeir]

I had quite an interesting dream just now. HRE took more provinces than we agreed upon and declared war on me. We fought a few turns and the moment one of my generals joined a crusade, Russia and Denmark invaded me too. heh.

[OverKnight]

Kids: [singing to the tune]
I like me
I like me
I'm as good as I can be
With a smile and a wave and a happy melody
I'm as good as... [slowing as they see the teacher reaching
for the record player] I... [slowly taking places]
Teacher: Hooray! Everyone's a winner!
Bart: [groans]

Now let's take out our circle of paper and continue our work on the letter A.

[Zim]

:laugh4: Obviously I've met the master of obscure references to Futurama and The Simpsons.

FactionHeir, Dream or premonition? :clown:


Now let's take out our circle of paper and continue our work on the letter A.

[_Tristan_]

Russia's turn

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-Russia.rar

[Cheetah]

Alright, so what is the order of factions then? Zim could you change the first post to reflect it? Is it then the same as it displayed at the faction choice page of the GC?

[FactionHeir]

Its the order as per descr_strat

[Zim]

I've been editting the order each turn comes. :yes:
I'll just match them up with the list from the faction selection screen tonight.

[Csargo]

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-Moors.rar

GH's turn

[GeneralHankerchief]

Gotcha.

-edit- see below.

[GeneralHankerchief]

OverKnight, you're up.

http://www.totalwar.org/patrons/pbm/2GHC-1-Turks.zip

If OK's active duty list setting is accurate, we'll be chewing on this save for a day or two. In the meantime, Merry Christmas!

[OverKnight]

I won't be able to access the game until the morning of the 26th.

Apologies, I should get a laptop.

[Zim]

Announcement: Given that tonight is Christmas Eve (or last night, for those of you in Aussieland or around that longitude :clown: ), there will be a two day moratorium on turn deadlines.

Merry Christmas, all!

[Zim]

Hey everybody. I finally went about updating the list in the first post to reflect turn order. Sorry, Cheetah, Hungary's dead last. :clown:

Here's everyone from Turkey and down.

Turks-Overknight
Egypt-Ramses II CP
Denmark- deguerra
Portugal-gibsonsg91921
Poland- FactionHeir
Hungary-Cheetah

[Cheetah]

Sorry, Cheetah, Hungary's dead last.

:wall:

Why is it always me? ~;p

[FactionHeir]

Well, I'm pretty much last too.
Looks like we are easy pickings for the people before us.

[Zim]

You're cursed, Cheetah. :clown:

Alright, one more day to normal(ish) deadlines. I'll send OK a pm to remind him, and I think he'll be able to play tomorrow when he gets back into town.