Roman Armor

[worlddomination88]

In the imperial Roman time they are shown allot with armor worn like shoulder pads on football player it looks like and had strips of metal horizontally covering the chest and back. I thaught this was historically correct but I dont see in EB I just see chain mail. Why ?

[Hax]

*cracked up*

Oh man, this is awesome.

[Megas Pyrrhos]

Wow. I couldn't count how many threads there are about lorica segmentata, and still have time for a battle today. :dizzy2:

[Foot]

This is a good thread. Lets see how it runs.

Foot

[CaesarAugustus]

At least he didn't say the forbidden LS word...

[zzrowgraff]

lorica segmentata's {spoken with fake Texas accent}

[cmacq]

Just when you thought it was safe...

:holiday2:

the sharks begin to circle...

:sharky:

but don't worry they eat...

:wizard:

only after the meat, is in the water.

:titanic:

Beware, of the Crazy Tejonos.

:skull: :skull: :skull: :skull:

[Atilius]

In the imperial Roman time they are shown allot with armor worn like shoulder pads on football player it looks like and had strips of metal horizontally covering the chest and back. I thaught this was historically correct but I dont see in EB I just see chain mail. Why ?
This armor type may have come into use only in the last decade of the EB timeframe. It certainly was not used extensively at that time.

[worlddomination88]

I see makes since the only thing I have sean was movies for reference wich obviously isn't accurate so ya thought id ask thanks.

[Hax]

It's not you, worlddomination (love yer name), it's just that we get so many of these threads.

Actually, we haven't had one for 2 months, and this was the first. Good, I was starting to get worried.

[worlddomination88]

No big deal thanks I took no offense just laughed I realize im not knowledgeable in history thow I really instead now that I got time to read actually and stuff.
But ya thanks.

[Mouzafphaerre]

It's not you, worlddomination (love yer name), it's just that we get so many of these threads.

Actually, we haven't had one for 2 months, and this was the first. Good, I was starting to get worried.
.
You missed the monthly LS thread? :gah:
.

[Hax]

Ouch, good one.

[TWFanatic]

It's not a joke, he's serious. There was a thread titled: "The Monthly LS thread". :clown:

[Spartan198]

Wow. I couldn't count how many threads there are about lorica segmentata, and still have time for a battle today. :dizzy2:

It's all Hollywood's fault. Though the segmentata is undoubtably cool,they never seem to bother with the historicity of its use. Just wait until the next big Roman war movie comes out,and marvel at the (possible) rediculousness of early Roman hoplites or triarii wearing lorica segmentata and gallic helmets,throwing their equally-out-of-place pila at Leonidas and his 300 Spartans at the "battle of Marathon". :laugh4:

Well,wait a minute... Knowing my bizarre taste in movies (I seem to like everything that flops in the box office,and hate nearly everything that doesn't),I'd probably enjoy that,too. :embarassed:

Please don't throw a pilum at me... (ducking beneath desk)

[Mouzafphaerre]

.

It's all Hollywood's fault.
Apparently you've never seen Arabic movies/series depicting 7th C. AD Eastern Roman military clad in LS and red cloaks. :yes:
.

[Centurion Crastinus]

.

Apparently you've never seen Arabic movies/series depicting 7th C. AD Eastern Roman military clad in LS and red cloaks. :yes:
.


What did 7th century Byzantine soldiers wear anyway? Spearman with swords and a round shield?

[beatoangelico]

afaik in 7th century most ERE army was a mercenary/foederati one, and the few "true" roman foot troops probably had still chainmail, round shields and some kind of spatha or spear. This until the creation of the themes. But I could be completely wrong :laugh4:

[Watchman]

Spatha, spear and oval shield was the norm AFAIK. Maybe some throwing-spears in the mix too, but I understand that'd have been uncommon. Body armour, when worn (and a fair few infantry in particular didn't), was the usual gamut of scale, mail and lamellar - segmentata pretty much went extinct already in the troubled 4th century or so.

The thematic reorganisation AFAIK didn't particularly change the basic armament setup, just the organisation principles and suchlike.

[worlddomination88]

I hear when you see in movies the romans always weiring red was also false becaus of the expense it took for the dye. Some people somewhere on these forums were talking about that.I thought it was interesting how Hollywood really doesn't seam to put any effort into authenticity

[Watchman]

In all fairness, they are in the business of making fantasy rather than documentaries. But I'll give you one often wishes they'd put a little more effort into the homework.

Then again, in good old days you had Spartacus fighting legionaries in leather segmentata... :skull:

[machinor]

AFAIK Red was one of the cheapest dyes if not THE cheapest, so it was quite common. Also, some dug-out rags of Roman clothing found somewhere in Germany (Mainz or Köln most likely) together with imperial time equipment (weapons, belt, imperial gallic style helmet) suggested that Red was a common color for Roman legionaire clothing.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Actually, they just wear a Greek Spola, I think. In any case they did do their homework, most of the stuff we have now was found after 1970 and those films were in the 50's-60's, the bits they do get right are pretty exacting, such as the Imperial Italic helmets.

[cmacq]

Red may have something to do with the dress and desire of Aries, or was that Mars, as well as the internation colours of Necormongers United and all those born and bred to war?

[Watchman]

I think it was just an easily aquired due and hence cheap. Blue was another similarly popular one - it was more or less pure chance the Puritans' New Model Army ended up with red coats.

[cmacq]

Just like the Black Hessians?

[Constantius I]

How accurate is the HBO/BBC series ROME? I know it is fiction and highly entertaining (I recommend to anyone here) but how accurate were the roman soldiers uniforms portrayed?

[machinor]

I think they were quite accurate. The helmets looked a bit odd, like a Montefortino-attic(?)-mix. The shields were too rectangular and too "flat", I think; they also looked a bit small. Not sure about the size, though.

[Centurion Crastinus]

How accurate is the HBO/BBC series ROME? I know it is fiction and highly entertaining (I recommend to anyone here) but how accurate were the roman soldiers uniforms portrayed?


The gladius was pretty goofy looking in certain episodes. They looked way to narrow in certain episodes.

[Hax]

How accurate is the HBO/BBC series ROME? I know it is fiction and highly entertaining (I recommend to anyone here) but how accurate were the roman soldiers uniforms portrayed?

Well, it's way more historically accurate than some other series, and personally, I don't really mind. Only a small percentage is interested in complete historical accuracy, but HBO needs to entertain the other huge percentage of the viewers.

Well, their armour is pretty historically accurate, IIRC.

[worlddomination88]

What about the helmets in Gladiator was there any time when they wore the helmets like that?

[Centurion Crastinus]

Are you referring to the gladiator's helmets or the legionary's helmets?

[Disciple of Tacitus]

Throwing my 2 cents in here regards to Roman Armor, although I know this horse has been beaten. Worlddomination88, you have legitimate questions and you are new to the forum. First, welcome. Second, we welcome your questions. You will find the EB lot a friendly bunch for the most part and educated in their respective fields - my field is caipirinha makin' and pint quaffin'.
For an in-depth but easily digestible book about the Roman Army, I point you towards Adrian Goldsworthy's "The Complete Roman Army" It covers the western roman army in the time period that we have solid evidence for, i.e., from about 300 BC to 400 AD. Although much of his evidence is of western european origin (mostly British and the cooresponding continental coastal areas), it is a great starting point - especially for an English speaker.
We might also point you in the direction of the "stickied" Europa Barbarorum Bibliography. Poke around and look up what catches your interest.
Cheers.

[pezhetairoi]

And may I add, on the lines of caipirinha making, do come over to the EB Tavern and introduce yourself to the merry (a bit TOO merry) bunch there, we all have a drink after work in that thread.

...Amazing, this LS thread is really civil, no rhomphaia being broken out yet, unlike in the Tavern... XD

[Constantius I]

I may have too, but where my good man is this tavern? I am the master at missing the obvious so please dont be too harsh !!!




Edit-IF IT WAS A SNAKE IT WOULD HAVE BIT ME. Disregard this post please, I will leave it up though for a bit of a giggle hahaha

[pezhetairoi]

Um,the tavern is always on the main EB forum screen, somewhere. It is labelled, obviously, 'The EB Tavern'.

...You really miss the obvious, don't you? ;-)

The tavern is never allowed to disappear off to the second page, or else on the rare occasions it does, the people whose post after which the EB Tavern grows silent are branded Conversation Killers in aeternam.

[pezhetairoi]

Hax holds the dubious honour of being Tavernum Discussio Terminalis twice.

[Spartan198]

How accurate is the HBO/BBC series ROME? I know it is fiction and highly entertaining (I recommend to anyone here) but how accurate were the roman soldiers uniforms portrayed?

I agree. HBO Rome is quite accurate,though not 100% (to our current knowledge,I mean). Plus the sudden skip-over of the battle of Actium was a big disappointment to me. But I'm a history nut,though,and I tend to spot every little inaccuracy in movies and shows like this (such as the above-mentioned gladius issue and the Myrmidons use of a testudo-like formation in Troy).

Side question: I know it's a bit off-topic,but am I the only one who noticed (in that movie about the Trojan War) the Trojan Apollonians' distinctly Roman fighting style of throwing a missile weapon into enemy ranks before charging in with their swords? I'm not trying to go off-topic,I'm only asking because I'm curious.

Long live Roman chainmail!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Spartan198]

What about the helmets in Gladiator was there any time when they wore the helmets like that?

If you're referring to the helmet that Russel Crowe wore during the battle of Zama,no. Very cool,I admit,but ahistorical.
The legionary helmets,on the other hand,are pretty accurate to my momentary knowledge,though. But I haven't watched it in a few months,so I could be wrong.

[Starance Quintus]

I really don't mind. But yer, Most of the roman armor varies from different parts of the Empire. Alot of the armor was mixed with other cultures armors.

[Hax]

Okay, can we refrain from using the word Troy when it's about the movie here?

/me twitches.

I. Despised. It.

[cmacq]

I'm sure no one here has seen these...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lP6XU_d1boE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xODx3UJ7W7I&NR=1

[Spartan198]

Okay, can we refrain from using the word Troy when it's about the movie here?

/me twitches.

I. Despised. It.

I changed it to "that movie about the Trojan War". Is that okay?

[pezhetairoi]

Heh. I sat in the movie theatre with a pen, paper and a reading light, and when I came out from the Trojan movie (reminds me of how actors call Macbeth the Scottish play), I had a 52-item list of inaccuracies with Homer and accepted knowledge about Mycenae. And to the extreme irritation of my classmates, I went around talking about it and the moment anyone mentioned Brad Pitt for the next one week in class, I would declaim items from my list. XD

And that's only the Trojan movie. We haven't talked about the Spartan movie yet. And I don't mean Meet the Spartans.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Rome and Gladiator were both horrribly inaccurate, visually and in terms of social mores etc. Rome's storyline was also a collection of vicious ancient rumours and hack history.

Rome had some good bits but the reality is, given the information we have now, it was much worse than the films of the 50's and 60's.

[Mouzafphaerre]

Rome and Gladiator were both horrribly inaccurate, visually and in terms of social mores etc. Rome's storyline was also a collection of vicious ancient rumours and hack history.

Rome had some good bits but the reality is, given the information we have now, it was much worse than the films of the 50's and 60's.
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Finally! :2thumbsup: I hated that :daisy: which depicts every single body as an :daisy: from moment one. :wall:
.

[antisocialmunky]

Movies are meant for entertaining. I'd just wish the science TV Networks would stop trying to make edutainment and REALLY bad edutainment at that.:no:

You'd have to admit though, without historically inaccurate, cliche`, and anachronistic movies, there'd probably a lot less historians and archeologists in the world complaining about them.

Its not like little kids have great attentions spans for the radiometric dating of the pottery shards from the Minoan period of Knossos.:dizzy2:

[Wolfman]

Heh. I sat in the movie theatre with a pen, paper and a reading light, and when I came out from the Trojan movie (reminds me of how actors call Macbeth the Scottish play), I had a 52-item list of inaccuracies with Homer and accepted knowledge about Mycenae. And to the extreme irritation of my classmates, I went around talking about it and the moment anyone mentioned Brad Pitt for the next one week in class, I would declaim items from my list. XD

And that's only the Trojan movie. We haven't talked about the Spartan movie yet. And I don't mean Meet the Spartans. I didn't really like "that movie which most not be named". It doesn't help that I loath almost anything that has Brad Pitt in it with few exceptions. Thats right I hate that chimp lookalike dude with a passion! Getting back to the film I felt the same way about "that movie which most not be named" that I felt about the 300. My history loving side (to the annoyance of my parents) couldn't help but critique every historical inaccuracy each movie possessed. But the "Rambo" side of me loved the great fight scenes. There are few movies that are historically inaccurate that i can watch without critiquing it. The ones i don't critique are the following.
1. The Gladitor ( I know that it has some historical errors but the plot is just to wonderful to pass up)
2. Kingdom of Heaven (same as above).

[Spartan198]

But the "Rambo" side of me loved the great fight scenes. There are few movies that are historically inaccurate that i can watch without critiquing it.

That's what I liked about both the Trojan movie and "300",the fight scenes. I mean,just face it: the Myrmidons were pure badasses. And it and "300" are virtually the only movies out there that portray phalanx fighting in a semi-realistic manner,even if it is only at the very beginning of one battle (don't get me started on that "flying V" in "the 300 Spartans") before it breaks down into a melee.