View Full Version : Global Cooling
link (http://www.dailytech.com/Temperature+Monitors+Report+Worldwide+Global+Cooling/article10866.htm)
Twelve-month long drop in world temperatures wipes out a century of warming
Over the past year, anecdotal evidence for a cooling planet has exploded. China has its coldest winter in 100 years. Baghdad sees its first snow in all recorded history. North America has the most snowcover in 50 years, with places like Wisconsin the highest since record-keeping began. Record levels of Antarctic sea ice, record cold in Minnesota, Texas, Florida, Mexico, Australia, Iran, Greece, South Africa, Greenland, Argentina, Chile -- the list goes on and on.
No more than anecdotal evidence, to be sure. But now, that evidence has been supplanted by hard scientific fact. All four major global temperature tracking outlets (Hadley, NASA's GISS, UAH, RSS) have released updated data. All show that over the past year, global temperatures have dropped precipitously.
A compiled list of all the sources can be seen here. The total amount of cooling ranges from 0.65C up to 0.75C -- a value large enough to wipe out most of the warming recorded over the past 100 years. All in one year's time. For all four sources, it's the single fastest temperature change ever recorded, either up or down.
https://img88.imageshack.us/img88/4219/7390hadcruttm8.jpg
So, are we doomed?
Sasaki Kojiro
02-28-2008, 20:29
IN JUST ONE YEARS TIME
hahaha
TevashSzat
02-28-2008, 20:39
North America has the most snowcover in 50 years
I would actually strongly disagree with this. Over here in Maryland, we had literally no more than 3 inches of snow this whole winter season and this lack of snow has been occurring for like the past 3 years already.
Anyways, global warming is bit of a misnomer, climate change is a better word since all Co2 does is increase how much the temperature changes by, not necessarily just warming it even though thats the whole media perception
Conradus
02-28-2008, 20:39
Actually here we have one of the hottest winters I can remember. No snow yet this year, none last year either
link (http://www.dailytech.com/Temperature+Monitors+Report+Worldwide+Global+Cooling/article10866.htm)
https://img88.imageshack.us/img88/4219/7390hadcruttm8.jpg
So, are we doomed?
Well as your graph excellently proves, the temperatures have decreased before, only to rise to new heights.
On a sidenote, where I live there has in the time period December - today only been 1-2 days of snow. From my own personal weather notes from 2003 I read that there were more than 15 days in total of a substantial snow layer on the ground in the same period as well as generally lower temperatures. This does of course not disprove that the temperatures on Earth on average currently are lower.
I would actually strongly disagree with this. Over here in Maryland, we had literally no more than 3 inches of snow this whole winter season and this lack of snow has been occurring for like the past 3 years already.
Maryland and Virginia are special cases. There is a bubble of hot air coming from DC, this tends to turn potential snowfall into rain and ice. :yes:
It has been pretty cold here though, and the midwest has been getting pummeled.
The obvious question is: If global warming is driven by CO2 and CO2 is even still increasing to ever more dangerous levels, how do we ever have cooling? CO2 didn't decline, did it?
Anyways, global warming is bit of a misnomer, climate change is a better word since all Co2 does is increase how much the temperature changes by, not necessarily just warming it even though thats the whole media perceptionActually, no. The argument has always been that CO2 traps heat. Or are you referring to a "Day After Tomorrow" type apocalypse?
Tribesman
02-28-2008, 21:58
Interesting blog .
Baghdad sees its first snow in all recorded history.
kinda funny though , the link it uses as its "source" doesn't say that :oops:
perhaps they linked to the wrong story:yes:
Interesting blog .
kinda funny though , the link it uses as its "source" doesn't say that :oops:
perhaps they linked to the wrong story:yes:"in recorded history" is a pretty ambitious claim. They could've played it safer and taken Reuters' approach:
Snow falls on Baghdad for first time in memory (http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSL1146182220080111)
I have no idea how you'd find out whether it has ever snowed in Baghdad in all of recorded history before this, but it does seem to be the only time anyone is able to recall seeing or even being told of snow in Baghdad- significant in itself. :shrug:
Tribesman
02-28-2008, 22:18
I have no idea how you'd find out whether it has ever snowed in Baghdad in all of recorded history before this, but it does seem to be the only time anyone is able to recall seeing or even being told of snow in Baghdad- significant in itself.
well apart from the bloke who said remembered when it had snowed in Baghdad before but it wasn't like this snow .
But here try this , since this blog is apparently about climate change ....
All show that over the past year
...what will any climatologist tell you about the use of a single years figures and their relevance to any study?
Would it be
nothing
nothing
nothing
or perhaps errrrrrr.....nothing .
well apart from the bloke who said remembered when it had snowed in Baghdad before but it wasn't like this snow .I knew you were going to grab that and try to run with it. :laugh4:
Nevermind that the distinction was clearly outlined in the article- you still couldn't resist.
"When I was young, I heard from my father that such rain had fallen in the early '40s on the outskirts of northern Baghdad," Abdul-Hussein said, referring to snow as a type of rain. "But snow falling in Baghdad in such a magnificent scene was beyond my imagination."
Even the "bloke" in question recognizes the difference between the outskirts of northern Baghdad and Baghdad proper... you didn't notice that I guess? :shrug:
But here try this , since this blog is apparently about climate change ....
...what will any climatologist tell you about the use of a single years figures and their relevance to any study?
Would it be
nothing
nothing
nothing
or perhaps errrrrrr.....nothing .I think any scientist would tell you not to make too much of short term events. What remains to be seen is whether or not the cooling will continue. It is however interesting to see how one unusually cold year can put us at temperatures on par with the turn of the century before global warming was thought to be a problem. As I've said, if we're supposed to be suffering from catastrophic warming caused primarily by CO2, how can an off year override all the CO2 caused warming? I think that in itself suggests there are more powerful forces at work in our climate than CO2.
woad&fangs
02-28-2008, 23:26
Snowfall is not good evidence of global cooling.
Tribesman
02-29-2008, 00:08
Even the "bloke" in question recognizes the difference between the outskirts of northern Baghdad and Baghdad proper... you didn't notice that I guess?
So that would be the difference like between North London and South London
:idea2:
:oops: Sorry thats way too big an area , how about the difference between North Dublin and The Southside .:yes:
We still didn't get any real snow, I'm not impressed! :furious3:
CrossLOPER
02-29-2008, 01:08
IN JUST ONE YEARS TIME
hahaha
https://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o273/CrossL/8DCat.jpg
seireikhaan
02-29-2008, 01:39
:inquisitive:
In Iowa, we've gotten 20 inches of more snow than average...
Oh, and I'm gettin' really irritated with it too.
Uesugi Kenshin
02-29-2008, 03:14
We still didn't get any real snow, I'm not impressed! :furious3:
I agree. If we're going anecdotal we may as well mention that the area of Germany that I stayed in last year hasn't gotten much snow at all, in fact they've gotten less snow than last year when they got snow a total of two or three times, and only a dusting each time!
CountArach
02-29-2008, 06:24
Snowfall (http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23295798-2,00.html?from=public_rss) in the Australian Summer... beat that...
The obvious question is: If global warming is driven by CO2 and CO2 is even still increasing to ever more dangerous levels, how do we ever have cooling? CO2 didn't decline, did it?
It is pretty much answering itself as CO2 is a greenhouse gas and requires thermal radiation from the surface of the Earth. If the incoming heat from the Sun declines, then the green house effect will decline also.
It is however interesting to see how one unusually cold year can put us at temperatures on par with the turn of the century before global warming was thought to be a problem.
It has happened before, now it is happeneing again. The average temperatures of the decades is what you should be looking at, not year to year averages.
As I've said, if we're supposed to be suffering from catastrophic warming caused primarily by CO2,
The global warming is not supposed to be "catastrophic" at this time.
how can an off year override all the CO2 caused warming? I think that in itself suggests there are more powerful forces at work in our climate than CO2.
Of course, the CO2 is not the Earth's heatsource. One year of low temperatures is not overriding anything.
Snowfall (http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23295798-2,00.html?from=public_rss) in the Australian Summer... beat that...
http://www.yle.fi/news/id83953.html
Warmest winter in Finland in over 100 years, beat that. ~;)
An inconvenient inconveniance :beam:
HoreTore
02-29-2008, 11:19
We had 15 degrees celsius in January. 'Nuff said.
Supposedly that wasn't enough to prevent the average global temperature to sink, though.
Global cooling?
All I know is it's -33 outside right now, and on Monday it's going to rain. Welcome to Quebec. :sunny:
Over here we had a warm winter with almost no rainfall at all....when it is normally the most rainy season over here....
:inquisitive:
In Iowa, we've gotten 20 inches of more snow than average...
Oh, and I'm gettin' really irritated with it too.
here in virginia we get ball freezing temperatures, but when the sky decides to sprinkle a bit of precipatation, it warms up.
rain<snow
Conqueror
02-29-2008, 12:33
Interesting that some of the traditionally cold areas are seeing record-high temperatures this winter when at the same time some of the traditionally warm places are unusually chilled/getting show. It's almost like winter has shifted geographically :shocked3:
Louis VI the Fat
02-29-2008, 19:01
I, for one, have never believed in the Global Warming hoax and have warned you people all along for this Global Cooling. But no, you 'skeptics' wouldn't listen :no:
Teh epic war never seen:
Global warming versus Global cooling.
Actually it has been going on for quite long; increased amount of aerosols (small particles of different compositions crucial for cloud formation; clouds effectively blocking out the sunlight) from industries/cars vs the CO2 from the same pollutants. The aerosols rains down while the CO2 stays.
Tachikaze
02-29-2008, 19:30
Conservatives are still trying to prove the Sun revolves around the Earth so they can go on doing environmental damage as if it has no affect on the world (or maybe they just don't care if it does).
Global warming disrupts normal weather patterns. It doesn't mean the temperatures of all places will be higher at all times. Overall, world temperatures are undeniably higher, but weather is inter-related and hot weather can cause short-term cooling reactions. On the long term, we are losing glaciers at a shocking rate. Glaciers are long term indicators.
The evidence for human-caused global warming is overwhelming, just like for the Earth revolving around the Sun (which the Catholic Church tried to suppress for many years, because it didn't fit their agenda). The conservatives are trying to suppress the reality of global warming, because it doesn't fit their agenda.
Crazed Rabbit
02-29-2008, 19:54
Global warming has nought to do with environmental damage, pollution etc.
CO2 is not a pollutant. It has not been proven to raise the earth's temperature, and temperature fluxes have occurred before in earth's history.
Global warming via man is not proven, and is used as an excuse to impose socialistic regulations on the economy.
CR
Global warming has nought to do with environmental damage, pollution etc.
CO2 is not a pollutant. It has not been proven to raise the earth's temperature, and temperature fluxes have occurred before in earth's history.
Global warming via man is not proven, and is used as an excuse to impose socialistic regulations on the economy.
CR
CO2 is recognized as a green house gas, so it is safe to assume that increased amounts of CO2 leads to increased temperatures.
Increased presence of CO2 is the leading theory to explain the global warming that we can discern from looking at the temperature recordings from more than a hundred years back in time. By continuing the releases of CO2 we are conducting an experiment on our own atmosphere, and ulitimately upon ourselves, whose final outcome we have only vague ideas of.
CountArach
03-01-2008, 02:48
Conservatives are still trying to prove the Sun revolves around the Earth so they can go on doing environmental damage as if it has no affect on the world (or maybe they just don't care if it does).
Global warming disrupts normal weather patterns. It doesn't mean the temperatures of all places will be higher at all times. Overall, world temperatures are undeniably higher, but weather is inter-related and hot weather can cause short-term cooling reactions. On the long term, we are losing glaciers at a shocking rate. Glaciers are long term indicators.
The evidence for human-caused global warming is overwhelming, just like for the Earth revolving around the Sun (which the Catholic Church tried to suppress for many years, because it didn't fit their agenda). The conservatives are trying to suppress the reality of global warming, because it doesn't fit their agenda.
*Hides under the table*
Which conservative is willing to take the bait?
Tribesman
03-01-2008, 03:50
CO2 is not a pollutant.
~:rolleyes:
CO2 is a pollutant , simple as that:yes:
(or would you like the less simple version that shows you are competely wrong ?):laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:
Crazed Rabbit
03-01-2008, 04:01
Ah, that must be why plants need it to live.
CR
Tribesman
03-01-2008, 11:10
Ah, that must be why plants need it to live.
So because plants need it to live you think it isn't a pollutant :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:
Oh dear Rabbit you really should think before you try and make silly claims .
CO2 is not a pollutant.
Yes it is :yes:
Ignoramus
03-01-2008, 11:17
"Warming Period of the Middle Ages" anyone? Despite what you may try and dig up, I doubt you'll be able to find a shred of evidence that the people of the Middle Ages were major produces of greenhouse gases.
"Warming Period of the Middle Ages" anyone? Despite what you may try and dig up, I doubt you'll be able to find a shred of evidence that the people of the Middle Ages were major produces of greenhouse gases.
There are many factors that can lead to climate changes. The greenhouse effect is one of them; you cannot dispute that simple fact.
Ah, that must be why plants need it to live.
CR
Plants also need light but that does not prevent us from having terms like Light pollution.
If the scientists are indeed correct about its impact then its certainly fair to call CO2 a pollutant.
CBR
Plants also need light but that does not prevent us from having terms like Light pollution.
If the scientists are indeed correct about its impact then its certainly fair to call CO2 a pollutant.
CBR
Then very breathing animal is a polluter since we all release CO2 as part of the breathing process.
Yes CR CO2 released by factories is considered a pollution because its far beyond the normal process of life.
Ironside
03-01-2008, 13:56
The obvious question is: If global warming is driven by CO2 and CO2 is even still increasing to ever more dangerous levels, how do we ever have cooling? CO2 didn't decline, did it?
One important factor for the stock market increase is inflation. So can we have inflation and a stock market decrease?
You're aware that there's multivarible analysis tools these days right? :inquisitive:
CO2 is not a pollutant. It has not been proven to raise the earth's temperature
FYI, CO2 is poisonous in higher concentrations. Admittably, reaching those concentrations in the atmosphere is pretty hard.
Did you know that CO2:s greenhouse effect was discovered in 1859 and that the estimations on man made CO2 increase by 100% (2x more CO2 than from the start) at 1896 was 5-6 degrees warmer climate?
See, those socialists have worked with this cunning plan for over 100 years :laugh4:
Tribesman
03-01-2008, 14:10
If the scientists are indeed correct about its impact then its certainly fair to call CO2 a pollutant.
A simple experiment should be sufficient to show correctness of the thoughts on CO2 ....what happens if you increase CO2 levels in a greenhouse ?
Or to take it further , use this....
Then very breathing animal is a polluter since we all release CO2 as part of the breathing process.
and ask what is the effect of increased CO2 levels on the breathing process of animals ?(you could use the greenhouse example again:idea2: )
and finish by taking this...
Yes CR CO2 released by factories is considered a pollution because its far beyond the normal process of life.
and asking what are the regulations on exposure to CO2 in factories and during industrial processess that produce CO2 ?
why are there limits if it isn't a pollutant ? after all its good for plants so it can't be bad .
Soooooo.......yes it is a pollutant Rabbit , simple as that :yes:
FYI, CO2 is poisonous in higher concentrations. Admittably, reaching those concentrations in the atmosphere is pretty hard.
Really, apart from global warming, the big reason why CO2 can be considered a pollutant is because if mixed with water, it forms H2CO4 (carbonic acid). Increased atmospheric consetrations means this reaction will become more common and that the ocean will thus get lower a pH, which is certainly not a good thing.
Ironside
03-01-2008, 16:51
Really, apart from global warming, the big reason why CO2 can be considered a pollutant is because if mixed with water, it forms H2CO4 (carbonic acid). Increased atmospheric consetrations means this reaction will become more common and that the ocean will thus get lower a pH, which is certainly not a good thing.
It's H2CO3*, but yeah that's one effect that will happen and is already happening.
I suspect that's the thing that kills you of CO2 poisoning aswell, but haven't seen anything more than that it isn't the O2 loss that's lethal.
Kaidonni
03-01-2008, 17:11
Global warming disrupts normal weather patterns. It doesn't mean the temperatures of all places will be higher at all times.
I will paraphrase off of this and say that people might be mixing up weather and climate. Warming during an inter-glacial period does not mean we will get searing hot winters and be able to sit on the terrace with a parasol over us on Christmas Day in Quebec (sorry, couldn't resist :laugh4:). Likewise, it doesn't mean we can't still get freak weather and be putting the family jewels into cryo-genic stasis.
Weather cycles won't change so much to create either of these circumstances, and freak weather still happens. If they did change this much, though, we'd be screwed anyway. Over 250,000,000 years ago, we had Pangaea - the supercontinent. And we had the Permian-Triassic extinction. Pangaea was a massive desert at that point, and although some life survived there, a lot died due to massive global warming. 90% or so. I'd quote Wikipedia, but it's not the best source...and I don't have any books at hand. A large amount of life died out, though, if we skip figures.
If we had winters where it was 30 degress Celsius and more, then we probably wouldn't actually be having this debate. Such extremes can't simply happen just like that. There are all so many factors. Politicians, the media, and scientists like sensationalising the issue for their own vested interests. Me? I'd like Humanity to behave for once and stop messing about with the planet like it's a toy, I don't care for monetary wealth or power.
I think all Humanity really needs to do is stop polluting this planet, regardless of whether we are increasing warming. Then, we need to accept we are over-populated. Then, we also need to accept that global warming and cooling happens, regardless of whether we want it to or not. Ice ages and inter-glacial periods are the way of the world, vital to the cycle of life and death. I'd go as far as saying that we shouldn't try to affect the course of either of these events beyond any contribution we might be making - we don't know what we're messing with, and we'll probably screw something up in the long term if not the short. People always have to peck away and mess with things...
It's H2CO3*, but yeah that's one effect that will happen and is already happening.
Oi, that is correct; H2CO4 is purely hypothetical. The reaction is already happenening, that's what I ment by it becomming more common; though that is an unaccurate term. :whip:
I suspect that's the thing that kills you of CO2 poisoning aswell, but haven't seen anything more than that it isn't the O2 loss that's lethal.
Lowered body pH? :inquisitive:
In the "famous" accident in Lake Nyos in Cameroon, the CO2 released from the lake replaced the normal air since it is heavier, thus leaving no oxygen left.
Ironside
03-02-2008, 11:25
Oi, that is correct; H2CO4 is purely hypothetical. The reaction is already happenening, that's what I ment by it becomming more common; though that is an unaccurate term. :whip:
Then it should be H4CO4. ~;)
Lowered body pH? :inquisitive:
In the "famous" accident in Lake Nyos in Cameroon, the CO2 released from the lake replaced the normal air since it is heavier, thus leaving no oxygen left.
Your blood uses CO2 as a pH-buffer.
The nausea caused by hyperventilation and holding your breath is because of the changed CO2 levels BTW, not oxygen content.
Too much CO2 in the blood is called hypercapnia, hypercarbia and the acidic blood due to this is called respiratory acidosis. Better google-fu this time.
7-10% is lethal (no matter the oxygen content), while above 1-2% will start to be increasingly uncomfortable.
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