Qarthadast early Survival guide

For all those fans of the noble Qarthadastim, I'm starting a guide to surviving in style in the early game. I am still working off of 1.0 because of a very fun current game, but as soon as I'm done with that, I will update the guide to 1.1. AFAIK, there is not a whole lot of difference in the early game for Qarthadast, so most of this information should still be valid.

Game Start

The most important thing for you to do is to Activate the Script!!!!!!!

After you have activated the script, you have two strategic options: instant offensive action or long-term economic savings. I usually prefer the second option since as Qarthadast, you don't have very many enemies around you (actually none at the start).

To start your economic savings plan, begin by deciding what is the minimal military forces that you need to accomplish three core things: public order through garrisons, brigand hunting, and border protection. The areas that need the largest garrisons are in Sicily and Iberia. This is where you have the greatest chance of fighting a war. Normally, all you will need for the early game in terms of garrisons to keep public order is an FM to govern and one or two levy/militia units of around 200-240 (on huge) men each. Your most expensive units, your cavalry and navy, should be disbanded as soon as you don't need them. I usually transport several units from Karthadast and Atiqa to Lilibeo for defence and future needs. I also make sure that all of my cities either already have a governor or can get one in the near future. This means that you may want to keep your navy around for a year or so, but no longer.

After you have disbanded your navy and extra land forces, you should raise your taxes in all cities as high as possible while maintaining public order of at least 100% and population growth of at least .5% in your main cities (Karthadast, Atiqa, Mastia etc.) and at least 1% in the rest of your cities.

On your first turn, you will have more money than you will have for a while, so spend it all on economic buildings. Roads, farms and markets are key, as well as coastal clearings for future ports. You should also make sure that you can recruit units in all of your main areas. This means that after the basic roads, farming and health buildings are queued, you should build the lowest level of MIC where you can train troops. Most of time, this will be a regional MIC, but this should not worry you, as these are often of better quality than your factional troops, especially in Iberia.

Be prepared for a long period of debt or bare neccessity income, sometimes only a few hundred mnai a turn. However, you should be able to raise your income above your first turn budget by the tenth year of this plan. By around 260, you should have around 10000 mnai. An important part of this plan is spending, despite the irony of the name (eg. economic savings). Every turn, you should spend as much as you can on buildings, primarily ones that directly in increase money, with health, pop growth and public order buildings also appropriate. The reason that you want to spend all of your money, is that this way it isn't lost to corruption or future debt. Also, if you use the money immediately, then your economy will reap the benifits quicker.

By around the 260 or 255, you should start thinking about rebuilding your military. Keep in mind that every unit you train should have a specific purpose. So decide where you want to start conquering and only train units for that campaign. Good early targets are Sucum-Murgi, Kirtan, Baikor, Siga and Arse. In Iberia at the start, Baikor has the most troops of these close towns, while Arse has a large wall that is difficult to deal with (at least for your early armies). To take these first targets, you will need at least a half stack for each. However, you can economize and save money by taking these towns in sequence, rather than at the same time. For example, I started by building a small, mostly Carthaginian army with Numidian archers as support which I used to take Kirtan (however, the attack was very costly for me). Once I had taken the town, I quickly built the smallest ship in Mastia and transferred most of the army to Iberia to capture Sucum-Murgi (with the help of locally raised Iberian troops).

A key thing to keep in mind whenever you are deciding which troops to train, remember to check which units are the largest (both for combat and for garrison), which are the cheapest and which units compliment each other. This means that you will want all troop types in your armies. For example, my army which took Kirtan had about 4 Libyan Spearmen, 4 Numidian archers, 2 Carthaginian Citizen Cavalry and 1 general (numbers are approximate). In dealing with North African and early Iberian armies, archers are perfect for taking out the unarmored skirmishers and cavalry. They can be especially devastating if you use the flaming arrow option to scare and kill enemy troops. However, as good as missile troops are, you will need infantry to protect them from the many enemy cavalry that you will encounter in North Africa and Iberia. Also, archers are not as useful against armored soldiers, which is where you will want to use slingers. Slingers can be trained in many places, but for Qarthadast in the early game, the best that you will find are the Balearic Slingers. I found myself training them in groups of 4 or 6 and transporting them to every region of my empire. At 4 units per army, the slingers were able to terribly weaken an enemy force before they even got within javelin range. For my first invasion of northern Italy in around ca. 240, I had 4 Numidian Archers and 4 Balearic Slingers, so that 40% of my force consisted of missile troops.

The other troop type that you want to keep in all of your armies is the Libyan Spearmen and Iberian Scutari. These are almost the same unit, but the Scutari is just a little bit better/more expensive. The great advantage to these units is there ability to throw javelins and use spears to defend against cavalry. Around 4-6 of this troop type accompanied all of my armies. The other great benefit of using Scutari over the Libyans is the greater unit size; 200 as opposed to 160 on huge size. However, the Libyans are recruitable in more regions, make retraining easier.

As far as cavalry goes, the Carthaginian Citizen Cavalry is good for the early stages until you can afford to recruit the Liby-Phoenician Cavalry (which are far superior and can be used even against more elite enemies). However, they are somewhat weak in a melee and can only be trained in the area around Karthadast. In Iberia, the Iberi Curisi are a much better buy. As far missile cavalry goes, I haven't found myself using them that much, but this more of a personal preference, especially since I have distinct memories of the Numidian Cavalry inflicting serious casualties on my troops. However, I usually used my unmounted missile troops to deal with enemy skirmisher cavalry.

For battle tactics, I placed my infantry in a single line with my archers behind and my slingers/skirmishers in front with the cavalry drawn up behind each flank. I have found that if you keep your cavalry behind the infantry line, the AI is much less likely to try to flank you or prematurely attack your cavalry. My general(s) was placed behind the center of my line. If I had two generals, I would space them out behind the line at intervals of a third of the line. I always kept my missile troops on hold ground rather than skirmish to prevent them from moving at the wrong moment. When the enemy came too close to my slinger/skirmisher line, I would manually pull it back behind the main battle line.

That's all for now. I will continue to update as I can or think of new advice.

Feel free to comment, ask questions or give ideas.

Chairman

Well done!:2thumbsup:This should be sticked

The military of Qarthadast
An in depth guide to units
Factional units

Misteret Ezra'him – Poeni Citizen Militia

Practically the same as Hopltai Haploi but with one point more defence skill. Their disadvantage is their extremely high cost (300 upkeep for a militia unit of 160 men on huge). This is the only thing that prevents them from being a truly good garrison unit, that and their limited AoR, around Karthadast and in Lilibeo.

Parasim Ezra'him Ponnim – Carthaginian Citizen Cavalry

These are essentially Prodromoi (non-Thracian variety) with 2 less defence points but a higher melee lethality. They are also slightly cheaper in cost. They are good for chasing skirmishers or routers, but don't overestimate their ability in a melee, as they tend to take casualities quicker than you might expect, though not too much. Against local African forces and supported by infantry and missile troops, they are good for early expansion.

Aanatim Leebim – Libyan Spearmen

These are identical to Thureophoroi, but are about 50 mnai more expensive on upkeep. However, for Qarthadast, these are excellent troops. The only place that a more suitable unit on same level exist is in Iberia with the Scutari who benefit from more soldiers per unit and all around better melee and missile attack values. The main advantage of the Libyans over the Scutari is their three higher defence points. Against most enemies, these troops are quite decent and capable. Above all, they are available in all of Qarthadast's starting territories except for the three islands.

Aanatim Leebim Mesoorianim – Libyan Heavy Spearmen

Dorkim Libi-Ponnim Mookdamim – Liby-Phoenician Infantry

Identical to Hoplitai except for one less morale point, these are good, reliable troops. They especially stand out in Iberia to make up for the lack of other anti-cavalry infantry and in general until Qarthadast gets pikemen. They do very well when combined with the Libyan spearmen to form a front battle line.

Dorkim Libi-Ponnim Mesoorianim – Liby-Phoenician Heavy Infantry

Dorkim Libi-Ponnim Aloopim – Elite Liby-Phoenician Infantry

Parasim Libi-Ponnim – Liby-Phoenician Cavalry

Slightly worse than Lonchophoroi Hippeis (lower lance lethality, 1 point lower defence, higher cost), these are excellent heavy cavalry for Qarthadast. They are very good at defending flanks and can deal with any enemy cavalry in Iberia or Italy except for the Lanceari. Against infantry, their rear and flank attacks are devastating. Their shield and good armor allow them to engage in melee, but caution should be taken as they are not cataphracts. Unfortunately, their shield value is probably 1 too low given that it is an aspis. As compared to the citizen cavalry, they are much superior.

Dorkim Aloopim – Elite African Infantry

Aanatim Aloopim – Elite African Pikemen

These are Qarthadast's best option for a phalanx capable unit, as the Sacred Band Phalanx has too few troops to make them efficient. With twice as many soldiers per unit, these pikemen more than make up for any stats disadvantage when compared to the Sacred Band. To show just how effective these troops are, only four units are needed to cover the relevant part of the battlefield in any battle against most western enemies (especially the Romani). If the flanks are protected, these troops are unbreakable in frontal combat. The only western unit that stands a good chance in getting to hand-to-hand combat with them is the Camillan Triarii, who can even then usually be held at bay. In terms of kill/casualty ratio, the African Pikemen are capable of gaining chevrons at a greater than normal rate for Qarthadastim units.

Dorkei Hatkafa Iberim – Iberian Assault Infantry

HaDorkim HaQdosim – Sacred Band Infantry

HaParasim HaQdosim – Sacred Band Cavalry

These super elite cavalry have been called unbreakable and unstoppable. They are even superior to the famed Iberi Lanceari in lance, melee and morale points and have equal defense stats, with only a higher cost as a downside. However given the nature of warfare in the west, the Lanceari usually prove to be more efficient based on their lower cost and greater range or AoR. Thankfully, all Qarthadast's FM's have a (smaller) unit of the Sacred Band Cavalry as their bodyguards, which means that all of Qarthadast's enemies will be forced to face them in battle.

Elephants

In terms of elephants, unless you are expecting to fight an elephant-dominated war in which every stat point is crucial, it is better to go with the regional Numidian elephants, as these have much lower costs and are essentially the same as the factional elephants that Qarthadast can train in her core cities. Not only are the costs lower, but the regional elephants can also be trained in a much greater number of provinces, from Sala to Adrumento.

One of the greatest use of elephants, as mentioned by some on the forums, is as very powerful and frightening mounted archers. This means that you should shield your elephants with infantry in the opening phases of set piece battles until the enemy has expended their ammunition (they can still have arrows, but their javelins and sling stones are the killers), and then use them to attack enemy cavalry or already engaged enemy infantry (from the rear). One of the best ways to do this is to engage your infantry with the enemy's battle line, and then place your elephants directly behind your troops so the elephants can shoot the enemy and be close enough that the enemy receives fear penalties from the elephants. The combination of being in combat and under fire with fear penalties can cause enemy units to reach the verge of routing, with only a charge in their rear necessary to break them. This is usually the best time to send in your elephants. Direct them around the engaged troops, deal with any enemy cavalry (another one of elephants' great abilities, and charge straight or diagonally into the rear of the enemy troops. Charging diagonally allows your elephants to cause a wider spread rout and to kill more troops. Having your cavalry follow right behind the elephants in their paths allows them to drive off enemy skirmishers who pose a danger to your beasts and to participate to greater effect in the rear charge and chase.

Units that do not have a description are ones that I do not have experience using in campaign.

Feel free to comment, ask questions or add any thoughts.

Chairman

Thanks Leviathan! Glad to know that somebody likes it.

Chairman

This is an excelent overview for anyone wanting to try their hand at Carthage - good job

One point to add is the regional units available for Carthage.
Classic Hoplites - are an excellent addition to the army.
Gallic heavy infantry can prove unstoppable when added to the traditional makeup of the Carthaginian army. The rebel cities of the southern Gallic coast can provide these - so it may make sense in taking these, rather than the east african cities, early in the game.

The military of Qarthadast
An in depth guide to units
Regional units

The Numidians:

Mitnag'him Numidim – Numidian Skirmishers

An all around ok unit, except for the smaller than normal (for skirmishers) unit size (only 200 on huge), these Numidians should probably be replaced by the cheaper, larger and better Garamantine infantry. Their main advantage is their greater number of javelins and better missile kill value. However, as I don't usually bring skirmishers along in field armies, their high upkeep and smaller size prevents them from being good garrison forces.

Qala'im Numidim – Numidian Slingers

Kasatim Numidim – Numidian Archers

These are the earliest archers that Qarthadast can recruit in the game (if you don't blitz Sicily that is), and they are one the best units for dealing with the locals. Against unarmored foes, these archers will deal death much better than your heavy factional infantry or even skirmishers. Even in Iberia, these soldiers still have their uses, in hurting the lighter armored of the Iberian armies that you will fight, especially before you have to deal with the Lusotannan. By the time that you reach Gaul or begin to fight the Romans, you should probably replace them with slingers or skirmishers. However, don't underestimate the power of fear that a volley of flaming arrows has over an advancing or retreating enemy force. These troops are also excellent in siege battles and as garrison troops. While slightly worse than the Celtic archers (Sotaroas) in bow and melee values, they have many more arrows and are slightly cheaper. There is also no comparison to the much worse (albeit much cheaper) Toxotai.

Parasim Numidim – Numidian Cavalry

Gldgmtk – Numidian Nobles

Dorkim Garamantim – Garamantine Infantry

These are perhaps the best garrison forces recruitable in Africa. Their good attack, large size and relatively low upkeep makes them great for this job. The other advantage is that, unlike other “skirmishers” these troops carry the title of “infantry” which their stats prove true. So in a garrison versus garrison battle, the side with the Garamantines would win. This means that you don't have to worry as much about border town garrisons and filling them with more expensive main line infantry. Too bad their AoR is not as big.

Dorkim Maurim – Maure Infantry


The Iberians:

Iberi Velites – Iberian Skirmishers

Velites fall into a similar category to other skirmishers for me; the cheapest, largest possible unit is the garrison unit. Velites are slightly more expensive than some other units of their class, but they also have accordingly higher stats (not terribly higher though). Use them as either the cheapest garrison unit in Iberia or as a good source of extra firepower for a cheap buck. The advantage for Velites is that while most other units in Iberia carry two to three javelins, Iberi Velites carry TEN!!!, the most for any skirmisher on that side of the map (or maybe even the game?). THAT'S TEN JAVELINS THAT YOUR ENEMY WILL BE FEELING IN NO TIME, AND THEY CAN BE YOURS FOR THE LOW PRICE OF 247 MNAI A SEASON!!! Ok, salesperson voice off. But Iberi Velites are great as garrison soldiers or in assisting brigand-hunting bands.

Trokalobutiamm – Shephard Slingers

Iberi Caetrati – Iberian Light Infantry

Caetrati are all about surprise. They can hide well and ambush their enemies from the trees; they can crouch in the middle of the field and startle an unsuspecting opponent with a deadly volley of solifera and following falcata attack; and they will surprise you with how determined and reliable they are. Really, they aren't deserving of the term light infantry, since they much more than mere skirmishers, though they are fully capable of filling this role. Since their falcata is better at attacking than defending, use them to cover the flanks and deal K-O attacks to the enemy's rear rather than hold against cavalry or the main assault. Or let them catch an enemy off guard and break their attack before they have time to register the ambush. Against similar troop types, Caetrati will generally have an advantage even simply because of their great numbers (200 on huge). They also serve as great brigand hunters and garrisons in towns that can expect attack.

Iberi Milites – Iberian Light Spearmen

The Milites are usually classed as a militia unit mainly for garrison purposes. They are very good for this but are capable of doing more if used correctly. They are very similar to the Garamantine infantry in stats, size and price, but with slightly less javelins, worse attack, better defense and 2 (yes, only two) mnai higher upkeep (303 vs 301). If used as flanking or support troops, Iberi Milites can reduce dependence on more expensive units like Scutari. They do well as a reserve second line to back up infantry-of-the-line units, where their javelins still deliver the same deadly punch to the enemy but their price delivers a less deadly punch to your treasury. However don't be mistaken in thinking that they should be used on an equal footing with their betters (aside from numbers).

Iberi Scutari – Iberian Medium Spearmen

What if the Qarthadastim could recruit their own version of the Principes but with more men in unit and overall better stats? Oh wait, that's the Iberi Scutari who can be recruited in South&Eastern Iberia. Good for the wilderness skirmish, good for the siege assault and good for the set-piece battle that determines the fate of nations, the Scutari are excellent troops who will do your bidding on the battefield. Even given the similarity of stats, I often found myself recruiting Scutari instead of Qarthadast's own Libyan spearmen, often simply for the more men and better attack, despite the lower defense. These are the backbone of armies in Iberia, ready to hold the line when nothing else matters and ready to take the fight to the enemy when the battle is all but won. If backed up by their tougher cousins the Loricati and protected by cavalry, the Iberi Scutari can make the best of any situation.

Loricati Scutari – Iberian Heavy Infantry

These are essentially the Iberian version of Cohors Reformata, and if you compare the two stats, you will notice that while the C. Reformata have better (only by 1) sword attack (and .03 higher lethality), more men (slightly), 1 higher shield value and are slightly cheaper (only 543 to 571), the Loricati Scutari have much higher javelin value (6 vs 2), same # of missles, and are available to the Qarthadast. So while the Romani have to wait until the Marian reforms, the Qarthadastim only have to build up their starting Iberian MICs. The Loricati Scutari are truly strong troops, capable of holding the battle line and dealing out whole worlds of hurt to those who get too close. The only problem is that compared to other Iberian and Gallic infantry, these troops only come in units of 160 (on huge) wheres the others come in groups of 200. However, that's like saying that you only have 10 Maclerans and everyone else has 15 Mustangs. As you can see, it's not much of a comparison. Though that shouldn't be seen as a discouragement from recruiting other troops. In fact, using Iberi Scutari and Loricati in concert allows you to create your own answer to the Polybian legion, except that yours troops are better.

Iberi Equites Caetrati – Iberian Light Cavalry

Iberi Curisi – Iberian Medium Cavalry

As the only medium cavalry in Iberia, Curisi fulfill the roles of flanking, flank guarding, skirmisher chasing, delivering the coup de grâce and pursuit of a broken foe with the same determination and fierceness that characterizes all of the native Iberians. Only slightly weaker on all counts than the Carthiginian Citizen Cavalry, Curisi can provide an excellent replacement when you choose not to transport the Citizen Cavalry all way from Karthadast (I only transported them once under a specific situation). If used with heavier cavalry like the Lanceari, Curisi can provide the necessary numbers to overwhelm even some the hardest enemy soldiers. They are useful in balancing one flank if the Lanceari are on the other or in following behind the heavies in a mass final charge on a sector. However, if you don't have anything heavier, Iberi Curisi are still reliable cavalry capable of the serving in the many roles expected of standard medium cavalry.

Iberi Lanceari – Iberian Heavy Cavalry

Two words: NOT FAIR! No one else in the west has access to this heavy of cavalry, excuse me, cataphracts! (unless they can steal southern Iberia from Qarthadast, which won't happen when you use these guys!) So the Romans thought they had it good with those powerful allied cavalry (Equites Extraordinarii) and the Gauls thought their knights (Brihentin) were awesome, but ... they ... were wrong. Lanceari will crush anything that's mounted (unless it's the Sacred Band Cavalry). And if you have to be on a horse and your general orders you to charge those heavy Triarii over there, you will want to be one of these guys. Thankfully for Qarthadast, these cavalry have the same AoR as the rest of the Iberian locals; the whole eastern coast of Spain (and the city of Baikor inland). So the moral of the story is that if you can, which you can, then you should recruit these guys, and put at least two in any of your armies that are within a campaign's distance from Iberia. These professional killers (warriors or fighters just isn't enough for them) make all other heavy cavalry redundant and obsolete for Qarthadast (Sacred Band isn't in heavy cavalry, they're in the “OUCH! THAT HURT!” category). With Lanceari, you won't need more than two of these and two generals to supply all of your cavalry needs. But that also means that they shouldn't be wasted since they're expensive (though it's nothing compared to their power) and when you're in Italy, it's a pain to have to move replacements from Iberia (I know from personal experience).

Ibarannta – Ambushers

Milites Ilergetum – Ilergetan Soldiers

Balearic Slingers

These are just about the best missile troops in the west. In my campaign I mass recruited the Balearics and included four units in each field army, eventually replacing the Numidian archers as my premier ranged unit. Against spammed stacks of elite and heavy troops that you might face when fighting the Romani (I faced them every turn) the slingers will be your best chance at hurting them early before they can get to your precious infantry and cavalry. I placed them in front of my infantry line and let them hit the enemy as soon as they were in range. You have to be careful to withdraw the slingers timely though, as they can only be recruited in one province which makes replacing losses difficult. A great use of them is to let them fire until the enemy gets close, and then withdraw them back, around your flanks and then behind the enemy lines and let them hit the enemy in the rear. This can be devastating. 'Nuff said. While the Celtic slingers will better on the attack in melee and have more sling bolts, the Balearics rightly earn their reputation, and once they quickly up chevroned, they are not something the enemy will want to see.

Balearic Light Infantry


Greeks:

Akontistai – Hellenic Skirmishers

These skirmishers have the excellent boast of being nigh on the cheapest garrison unit in the game (practically the only other with lower being the eastern Gund-i Palta), at least for their given size (240 men on huge). All other facts fade away into irrelevance as you realize that recruiting Akontistai instead of any other unit will save you lots of money. Given their wide AoR and ridiculously low upkeep (188mnai!), you can be guilt-free for shipping them to nearby areas of the Qarthadast empire. The closest recruitment zones for Akontistai are in Lilibeo, Massilia, Messana, Syrakousai, Rhegion and Taras. That makes them a cheap and accessible garrison unit for your needs.

Toxotai – Hellenic Archers

The toxotai generally have a reputation as the last pick in terms of archers, and they generally stay true to this reputation. They have much lower stats than most other archers and only have their extremely low cost to make them worth buying. They are best used as supplement to other garrison troops or to provide firepower in reserve/second rate field armies. They are suitable for brigand and rebel hunting though not enough to export them. If other archers (any archers, seriously any) are available, they should replace the Toxotai unless cost is the only selling point.

Hoplitai – Greek Classical Hoplites

Hoplites have the exact same stats, size and price as the Liby-Phoenician Infantry, but are recruitable in a broader (though less concentrated) set of provinces further to the east. Hoplitai are strong infantry capable of both stubborn defense and forceful offense. They do well as either the center of line flanked by thureophoroi type infantry or as flank protectors for slower pikemen. Guard mode is useful on the defense for minimizing casualties and allowing the hoplites to stay in battle that much longer, though it should be turned off if a more offensive role is expected.


Gauls:

Iaosatae – Celtic Slingers

Sotaroas – Celtic Archers

Lugoae – Celtic Levy Spearmen

Gaeroas – Celtic Spearmen

Gaesatae – Gallic Naked Fanatics

Neitos – Gallic Professional Swordsmen

Leuce Epos – Gallic Light Cavalry

Brihentin – Gallic Noble Cavalry


Will fill in the rest of the units as I have time.

Chairman

Great guide Chairman.

Only thing I would do differently is use more skirmishers! The Numidians and the Numidian Cavalry are both great units and have all the advantages when fighting any other faction's skirmisher troop types until you get to the far east.

The Iberians are pretty decent also, though not as strong in hand to hand combat.

Numidian Skirmishers are easily able to fight and defeat any light cavalry and can jump on the backs of engaged enemies with great success. I would rate them ahead of the Iberians for these reasons. (unless you are in woods of course).

The Numidian Cavalry is excellent light skirmisher cavalry, the best in the game actually IMO. If you are used to using Greek skirmishers and light cav which are just rubbish, and whose only purpose is to soak up enemy missiles, you will be suprised at how effective the African and Iberian skirmisher types are.

Iberians not as strong in hand to hand? A fair few of them have AP weapons with high lethality, that's not to be sneezed at. Balearic Light Infantry are badasses for how much they cost, especially because of their morale.

Thanks for reading! Any input is welcomed and I'm especially eager to hear your advice. Especially, QuintusSertorius, since, though you have only been on the forums for a short while, you already have a name for yourself with your guides and AAR(s)! Again thanks for reading!

Chairman

I've occasionally been tempted to try a Qarthadast campaign, largely on the strength of their Iberian roster. Those guys are brilliant, especially the armoured ones who give you heavies equal to anything the Romans have. Only thing that puts me off is the number of pikemen and spearmen they have.

I have occasionally thought of doing a historical one where I help the AI Romani become a major power and end up destroying myself in 146BC, but not sure how well that would work.

WOW! This guide is excellent. I never did think much of playing a campaign as Carthage, but maybe for once in my life I'll try.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius

end up destroying myself

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Why would you destroy yourself? You should secure a colony in the tin land of Cornwall (Britain), just to make sure you have a place to fall back when the fields of Carthage are sown with salt.

Spanish units are quality indeed.

If only their swords had more lethality... There's a huge difference between 0.1 of a spanish or carthaginian sword and 0.225 of a celtic one...

This is what annoys me the most in Carthage, they have either spearmen (basically hoplites) in their roster or those lame 0.1 swordsmen.

Sending those against 0.13 Principes or 0.225 Neitos makes you cry if you have a stack of heavy infantry and they have a stack of heavy infantry (which means limited flanking chances, just one on one fighting until your cavalry kills their general...). You lose lots of men due to those damned swords.

I just like my units to be better equipped than enemies. That's why I like Macedonia that much (Agriarian 0.165, Thracians 0.285, Scordisci 0.12, Celts in Galatia and Tylis with 0.225 - you have something to send to the flank! (yes, i know those numbers by heart)). Same with Baktria and Guild Warriors (0.285, better than Gauls!).

Carthage? For example, their most elite troops, Iberian Assault Infantry, 14 armour (awesome), 15 morale (or more? awesome) but their swords are weaker than those of a goddamned camillian hastati (same lethality, 0.1 but 10 points of attacks instead of hastati 11 )... :-(

So my question is, why didn't Carthage adapt at least Gladius? Not to mention Celtic swords. They traded heavily with both, must have seen their equipment. At least one good heavy infantry with decent swords to hack through a phalanx would be such a relief for Carthage...

What's funny (I checked that), Liby-Phoenician cavalry (medium one, available since turn one, I think my favourite Carthaginian unit) is equipped with decent 0.13 swords.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius

Iberians not as strong in hand to hand? A fair few of them have AP weapons with high lethality, that's not to be sneezed at. Balearic Light Infantry are badasses for how much they cost, especially because of their morale.

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I was comparing the skirmishers only :book: Iberian skirmishers are armed with a knife vs the Numidian spear if I recall correctly.

Otherwise, yes, the Iberians have great melee infantry. Scutari especially could stand in the main battle line of any faction and give a good account of themselves.

I thought Numidian skirmishers backup was a knife as well?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius

I thought Numidian skirmishers backup was a knife as well?

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no, they use a spear (not very effective though)