PARIS (Reuters) - A French judge has ordered two departments and seven prominent members of the Church of Scientology in France to stand trial on charges of organized fraud, a judicial source said on Monday.
The case is the latest in a series of legal battles that have pitted the French judicial system against the Scientologists, who could be forced to stop their activities in France if found guilty.
The latest suit centers on a complaint made in 1998 by a woman who said she was enrolled into the Church of Scientology by a group of people she met outside a metro station.
In the following months, she said she paid 140,000 francs (21,340 euros) for "purification packs" and books which she said were a fraud. Other complaints then surfaced, prolonging the investigation.
Judge Jean-Christophe Hullin ruled that the Scientologists' Celebrity Center, bookstore and seven Church leaders should be tried for fraud and "illegally practicing as pharmacists".
The Church of Scientology is registered as a religion in the United States but has struggled to be accepted in Europe, with French authorities seeing it as a sect masquerading as a church to make money.
The Church of Scientology denounced Monday's ruling, saying it was being "stigmatized" by the courts.
"The special treatment reserved for the Church of Scientology Celebrity Center raises questions about the equality of the justice system and the presumption of innocence," it said in a statement.
The public prosecutor had said the case should be shelved. In a relatively rare move, Judge Hullin ignored the recommendation and ordered a trial, which is not expected to start for at least six months.
The Scientologists said the suit was "empty and concocted", adding that the original plaintiff had been reimbursed.
The Church of Scientology, which counts actors Tom Cruise and John Travolta among its members, was founded in 1954 by science fiction writer L. Ron Hubbard.
It has faced numerous setbacks in France, with members convicted of fraud in Lyon in 1997 and Marseille in 1999. In 2002, a court fined it for violating privacy laws and said it could be dissolved if involved in similar cases.
France, I salute you :2thumbsup:
09-10-2008, 10:41
JR-
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
hehe, go france. :D
09-10-2008, 11:08
Tribesman
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
The Scientologists said the suit was "empty and concocted", adding that the original plaintiff had been reimbursed.
Since they paid the money back does that mean that they admit the "services" and goods they sold her were indeed crap and the transactions fraudulent ?
09-10-2008, 12:16
pevergreen
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
This makes me proud to be of French descent.
09-10-2008, 12:39
naut
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Thank you, France. :2thumbsup:
09-10-2008, 14:02
Rhyfelwyr
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
:bow: to :france:
09-10-2008, 15:41
drone
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Hail Xenu, er, I mean France! :2thumbsup:
09-10-2008, 15:52
Fragony
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
They that powerfull?
09-10-2008, 16:51
lars573
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
In the US. Where they have enough financial and celebrity clout to get away with almost anything.
09-10-2008, 18:06
Louis VI the Fat
Re : About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Good. Next, the papists and the muslims. :knight:
Too much agreement in this thread. :whip:
Quote:
In the US. Where they have enough financial and celebrity clout to get away with almost anything.
Not to mention, too much respect for freedom of religion. America is a Navarosocracy. That is to say, faith is placed above freedom and equality. 'One nation under God', to quote the most ignoble words in US history.
09-10-2008, 18:29
Viking
Re: Re : About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
Good. Next, the papists and the muslims. :knight:
Too much agreement in this thread. :whip:
Not to mention, too much respect for freedom of religion. America is a Navarosocracy. That is to say, faith is placed above freedom and equality. 'One nation under God', to quote the most ignoble words in US history.
:smash:
09-10-2008, 20:20
Martok
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
~:cheers: to :france: :2thumbsup:
Granted, I have an inherent distrust of most organized religions, but few are so blatantly fraudulent (or absurd) as Scientology. Here's hoping the French can keep the cancer from spreading!
lars573 & Louis VI the Fat: It pains me to say this, but I think you're probably right about why Scientology has flourished over here. (That, and/or we're that much more gullible than Europeans.) :embarassed:
09-10-2008, 20:23
TevashSzat
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Good job France.
Just for future reference, be wary when your religion is based off of the thinkings and works of a science fiction writer
09-11-2008, 05:52
Strike For The South
Re: Re : About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
Good. Next, the papists and the muslims. :knight:
Too much agreement in this thread. :whip:
Not to mention, too much respect for freedom of religion. America is a Navarosocracy. That is to say, faith is placed above freedom and equality. 'One nation under God', to quote the most ignoble words in US history.
I have one god but I care not if my neighbor has twenty. Freedom first and foremost is the ability to do what you want until you impede on someone else's freedom. If these people want to believe let them. If they want to try and convert people let them. It is only when a scientologist (Or a catholic muslim or baptist etc.) tries to use his religious principles as the guiding force in the way he believes the country should be run does it become a problem. The governments bible is the constitution and its ten commandments the bill of rights. What you do in your off time is not my concern
09-11-2008, 05:54
seireikhaan
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
I salute our wine-sipping, non-showering, white flag waving allies! :2thumbsup:
09-11-2008, 05:57
Strike For The South
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaikhaan
I salute our wine-sipping, non-showering, white flag waving allies! :2thumbsup:
This is reverse bigotry
09-11-2008, 06:03
seireikhaan
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strike For The South
This is reverse bigotry
Pardon? Towards the French or the whackos?
09-11-2008, 06:05
Strike For The South
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaikhaan
Pardon? Towards the French or the whackos?
the whackos.
09-11-2008, 06:09
seireikhaan
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Well if they're blatantly ripping people off by telling them they have to donate their cash to get to meet Xenu or whatever, than that is fraud. Now in this case, they apparently reimbursed the person, but they're still so full of crap they don't know which end it comes out of.
09-11-2008, 06:15
Strike For The South
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaikhaan
Well if they're blatantly ripping people off by telling them they have to donate their cash to get to meet Xenu or whatever, than that is fraud. Now in this case, they apparently reimbursed the person, but they're still so full of crap they don't know which end it comes out of.
They didnt force her. Organized religion has been taking money for hundreds of years its just mostly in smaller bits. Who is the government to stop these people? Ever heard of tithing? For years my relatives gave 10% of their yearly earnings to the church and trust a couple of thousand could've helped with kids. Spare me this line of the government is protecting the people Scientology is a scapegoat and France wants to feel enlightened. Whatever
09-11-2008, 07:39
Papewaio
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
I wonder what Voltaire would think?
A fool and their money are soon parted.
I like this almost as much as the LHC... viva La France!
09-11-2008, 09:37
Sigurd
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strike For The South
They didnt force her. Organized religion has been taking money for hundreds of years its just mostly in smaller bits. Who is the government to stop these people? Ever heard of tithing? For years my relatives gave 10% of their yearly earnings to the church and trust a couple of thousand could've helped with kids. Spare me this line of the government is protecting the people Scientology is a scapegoat and France wants to feel enlightened. Whatever
In the early church, people gave everything they owned.
In fact wasn't this the reason the rich young man walked away sorrowful? He wouldn't sell everything he had and give it to the poor.
09-11-2008, 10:34
Ronin
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strike For The South
They didnt force her. Organized religion has been taking money for hundreds of years its just mostly in smaller bits. Who is the government to stop these people? Ever heard of tithing? For years my relatives gave 10% of their yearly earnings to the church and trust a couple of thousand could've helped with kids. Spare me this line of the government is protecting the people Scientology is a scapegoat and France wants to feel enlightened. Whatever
Well unfortunately we didn´t have civilized governments when the catholic church started laying it´s tentacles around the world....you are absolutely right, what they did back in the day was no better than this.
But the truth is that we can´t get rid of them now....they have become part of the social fabric unfortunately and are not going anywhere...but to say that just because we couldn´t do anything about the old threats that we should do anything about the new one just to maintain some sort of "balance" is ridiculous.....one does what one can.
09-11-2008, 10:47
TB666
Sv: Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strike For The South
They didnt force her. Organized religion has been taking money for hundreds of years its just mostly in smaller bits.
Actually scientologists do force people to pay if they wanna be apart of the cult.
While I have no respect for christianity or the other religions, they atleast don't require you to pay them money.
If you wanna donate money to them then that's fine, that's why they don't pay taxes afterall but it is still an optional thing.
It's not in scientology. If you don't give the church everything you own, then you are out. And the christian church atleast donates some of their money to charity, Scientology don't.
They spend their money conducting espionage on the goverments(they did conduct the largest domestic espionage in the history of the US) and on normal citizens just in case they dare to speak up against them.
And on their spare time they tell people about how psychiatry caused the holocaust and other things.
So the goverment should crack down on them since it's nothing but a cult run by criminals that sucks people dry and in some cases even killed them.
09-11-2008, 10:56
Ronin
Re: Sv: Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by TB666
Actually scientologists do force people to pay if they wanna be apart of the cult.
While I have no respect for christianity or the other religions, they atleast don't require you to pay them money.
If you wanna donate money to them then that's fine, that's why they don't pay taxes afterall but it is still an optional thing.
It's not in scientology. If you don't give the church everything you own, then you are out. And the christian church atleast donates some of their money to charity, Scientology don't.
They spend their money conducting espionage on the goverments(they did conduct the largest domestic espionage in the history of the US) and on normal citizens just in case they dare to speak up against them.
And on their spare time they tell people about how psychiatry caused the holocaust and other things.
So the goverment should crack down on them since it's nothing but a cult run by criminals that sucks people dry and in some cases even killed them.
Back in the day you could be a Christian for free...but you had to pay, and pay heavily to get access to the full "bling-bling upper membership get out of hell free card" status.
what´s a difference between a cult and a religion?...vintage my friend.
09-11-2008, 11:30
TB666
Sv: Re: Sv: Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin
Back in the day you could be a Christian for free...but you had to pay, and pay heavily to get access to the full "bling-bling upper membership get out of hell free card" status.
what´s a difference between a cult and a religion?...vintage my friend.
For me, they are all cults, only difference is the size.
And yes during the old days christianity was "corrupt" you could say but I'm talking about these days.
These days, in secular countries they are fighting to survive.
09-11-2008, 15:14
rory_20_uk
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martok
~:cheers: to :france: :2thumbsup:
Granted, I have an inherent distrust of most organized religions, but few are so blatantly fraudulent (or absurd) as Scientology. Here's hoping the French can keep the cancer from spreading!
lars573 & Louis VI the Fat: It pains me to say this, but I think you're probably right about why Scientology has flourished over here. (That, and/or we're that much more gullible than Europeans.) :embarassed:
Damn right. :thumbsup:
~:smoking:
09-11-2008, 18:37
Strike For The South
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
So we have
Lady vounltary signs up for what she believes will give her peace of mind
Lady gives money
Lady feels no spiritual connection with anything
Lady sues
If this were a normal religion it would be thrown out but since its something like Scientology its a valid case...give me a break. Most of these people qualify for Darwin awards and now when its convenient we say they are duped? There have been threads her before were followers of this religion have been called some not so nice names for being blind and stupid.
09-11-2008, 18:58
lars573
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
You really don't how Scientology works do you? You don't give money. You buy products and services. Books, various pills and tonics, tests. So on and so forth as you climb the ladder of the mystery cult. These goods and services aren't cheap either. Oh sure they'll sell you a theton test for $50. Or a soft cover of dianetics for $40. Those and the promises of fullfilment are just the hook. But the higher you go the more zeroes your adding.
09-11-2008, 19:00
Strike For The South
Re: About time someone stands up to Scientologists
Quote:
Originally Posted by lars573
You really don't how Scientology works do you? You don't give money. You buy products and services. Books, various pills and tonics, tests. So on and so forth as you climb the ladder of the mystery cult. These goods and services aren't cheap either. Oh sure they'll sell you a theton test for $50. Or a soft cover of dianetics for $40. Those and the promises of fullfilment are just the hook. But the higher you go the more zeroes your adding.
and she was dumb enough to sign up and keep giving cash? I didnt know the French took cases based on stupitidy
Religons have been doing this for years. Bigotry Bigotry Bigotry
