The Wrath of Caen

We all know that if we put a spy in someones city or castle there is a chance that he will open the gates. It is also known that the AI uses this tactic also. The remedy against this is to put a spy in your own castles as well.

So here I was with my citadel Caen held by my brave Portuguese. Denmark attacked after a short siege and when the battle started the gates were down (or in this case open). I won the battle and put a spy in my castle, actually three spies. Of course Denmark attacked again and the gates were still open, of course. That Danish spy is probably very good so after I had won the battle some more spies were added to the defense of Caen. And some more and some more etc. I have had maybe ten attacks by Denmark and I have now 20 spies in Caen but still the gates are open when the battle starts. This spy from hell is trained by the CIA, FBI, KGB, Mossad or at the MacDonald's Hamburger University. Don't tell me that my spies are little puppies because they are all trained in Rennes which is the capital of sin with a highest level of a brothel and a master thieves guild. I don't even dare to let my family members come near that place. I have a general in Caen who is slowly getting some dread.

The big question is: what now? Is this a bug? I can't put more spies into Caen. Assassins won't work. Does anyone have a brilliant idea?

To be honest, in all my M2TWing I never had the AI open my gates with a spy. Ever.

However, to catch a spy, especially a high level one, you want to train your spies to a higher subterfuge level. A lot of low levels can be useful, yes, but each level means a lot more and its easier to stay inside a town than it is to infiltrate. So you can use your 20 spies to spy on nearby Danish armies before sending them back to defend.

Also, having a general with high public security helps. That involves being around when a spy dies in your town, so its not overly common.

Outside of that, take the bordering Danish towns and they should normally remove the spy. I think the AI has a tendency to only infiltrate bordering settlements.

The problem is that most of them have a lot of subterfuge. And twenty spies should be more then enough.

But I will try your idea. Thanks for the quick response.

Well, the alternative is to let them have Caen and then assassinate the spy and retake the place :grin:

Or you could just wipe out the Danish. That'd be my preferred path. :beam:

:egypt:

Are you sure the gate just hasnt been destroyed and you arent repairing it? :grin2:

@Pevergeen: No. When I start the battle that guy who is always shouting that my men are under attack starts with: someone has opened our gates. Besides that: the Danes are racing to all the gates.

@Ramces: They are on my list, but at the moment I am quite busy in Egypt. I have actually a quite interesting campaign with Egypt controlling the Middle East, central Europe and southern Germany. I control with Portugal: southern France, Italy, Iberia and Africa. Next target is Gaza. If I capture Jerusalem the campaign is won, but I want to continue to fight the Timurids.

@Faction Heir: No way. Many brave soldiers have given blood to defend Caen. Most units are either gold or silver veterans. Besides that is not the issue here. The question is how is it possible that an enemy spy stays alive for quite some times and isn't caught by my twenty spies.

Is your general/family member open to foreingers or does he have other -public security traits? I had same-like problem with 3 enemy spies, but they didn´t manage to open city gates. Are you sure there is a spy so it´s not just a bug? Try hiring assassin and attempt assassination in your own city, not sure does this work but at least you can assassinate own spies in enemy cities.

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Originally Posted by FactionHeir

However, to catch a spy, especially a high level one, So you can use your 20 spies to spy on nearby Danish armies before sending them back to defend.

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this is pretty much the best way to lvl a spy up, even a hi-lvl spy will get xp from consistently spying on opposing forces tho not as often as a lower 1. The spy may also get xp from defeating an asassination attempt (if its in a stack) tho I cant say im 100% on that.

I have had a few instances of troublesome spies, once they prevented me from pacifying Antwerp for what seemed like 100 years. Everytime Id build it up theyd open the gates and destroy it. This angered me, so I exterminated the city back to the stone ages instead.

Its been awhile since I posted here.. HAPPY NEW YEARS to all the Org's! :2thumbsup:

I would save the game, give Caen to another faction, and use assassins to see if there be any enemy spies and what level. To be that successful I bet that there must be more than 1 very high level spy in there. To kick out a high level spy you will need some very good spies and it still might take over 10 turns - if that really does even help. I have never been able to figure out a way to test it that would not bore me to death. Then again, if you get him kicked out, he may just go back in immediately unless you can assassinate him forthwith or block his entrance. I don't imagine even 20 level 3 spies would catch a level 10 spy. I have had enemy spies open my gates, but never repeatedly. Apparently the Mongols and Timurids don't start with spies; do they ever recruit them? Or assassins?

In the end I conquered the Belgian cities and because of that Caen lost its strategic importance. I have never known if it was a glitch or a super spy. If so he must have been a medieval 00VII.:laugh4:

Something to remember about spies, multiple spies increases your chances of opening gates. As such if you have 5-6 lvl 5 spies you will have over 100% chance to open the gates. Because of this, if you flood a city with spies, you can almost assure yourself you will get in.

One counter is to surround your city with small stacks. Let the enemy attack one then gang up with ALL the troops you can bring in. It is still a fight, but one that doesn't risk you loosing your city.

When I play as the Scots (with pikemen modified to have no secondary weapons) I love it when spies open my gates because the enemy concentrates on coming through them which gives them (even the Mongols) no possibility of winning, if I can get a pike unit to the gate before they enter - which has never remotely been a problem.

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Originally Posted by Old Geezer

When I play as the Scots (with pikemen modified to have no secondary weapons) I love it when spies open my gates because the enemy concentrates on coming through them which gives them (even the Mongols) no possibility of winning, if I can get a pike unit to the gate before they enter - which has never remotely been a problem.

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I play Portugal for precise that reason. I have the secondary weapons of the Aventuros removed to create nice pike and musket armies. Last night my citadel of Acre was attacked by two stacks of Mongols. One had two rocket launchers and two trebuchets. They managed to breech the wall only to meet their doom onto the pikes of my Aventuros. And some dead cows my trubuchet unit fired at them. I am a sadistic son of a B....

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Originally Posted by Ramses II CP

Or you could just wipe out the Danish. That'd be my preferred path. :beam:

:egypt:

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It's the only true solution to any problem in M2TW: brutally crushing the skulls of your enemies under the hooves of your massive all-cavalry armies, which is second only to the all-general armies in terms of evilness.

By the time you gain a big enough economic base to train a vast legion of spies and assassins to take down the enemy spy network, others might be picking the remnants of elephant out of their teeth using a Mongol bone, and vaguely remembering something called "opponents". It's far more efficient to destroy everything than to look for spies and hunt them down individually. No reason to spy for a king that no longer has a kingdom, or money to employ you with, or a head.