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What I query is why so minimal charges and why only one of them?
Surely an adult beating up a child would get far worse?
And two adults together, even if one doesn't do the swinging but ably aids and abets the other by holding the child down?
Or is there somewhere in the law that states cops can do whatever they want and their superiors will let them off?
15-year-old girl 'assaulted' in jail cell: policeman charged
Woah, the way he flipped in that video really took me by surprise. :sweatdrop:
The situation doesn't add up from the video, I can only guess he must have been under real stress or something like that, especially considering the way he flails out rather than doing more professional looking moves.
Of course it doesn't make what he did OK, but even policemen are human I suppose.
was just watching this earlier. Boy does that guy not take to kindly to shoes being flung at him. I guess the girl must of also said something to him that really pushed his buttons.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr
I trust the courts will deal with this case.
I was going to make a joke about "kid didn't get off their lawn" but it doesn't really fit. :/
Can anyone with some legal knowledge weigh in on how the charge was 4th degree assault? What the hell is first degree? Rape? I must be missing something here
:dizzy2:
From what I observed, only one officer used excessive force. The other only helped to put on the handcuffs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Papewaio
As human as anyone, with all the foibles & weaknesses that implies. The knothead will pay a hefty price, maybe even lose his job. Many city & state lockups have video coverage; I can't imagine he wouldn't know that....Quote:
Of course it doesn't make what he did OK, but even policemen are human I suppose.
I can't believe you people, haven't you ever heard of shoe guns and sock bombs and shoe-lace bio toxins. They had to get that other shoe off her before she hurt someone.
I suppose you think it's wrong to charge people with battery on a police officer when they fart at them, too? http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/2687768
Next you will tell me that cops shouldn't be allowed to:
Demand free food
http://www.boston.com/news/odd/artic...ree_starbucks/
Assault the wal-mart greeter for doing his job
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php...cle=1&catnum=9
Taser a pregnant woman holding a child and post photos on myspace of guns, drugs and recklessness
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=2aa_1197076807
This story is good:
Allegedly arrest the wrong person while the dash cam is mysteriously not on, then forcibly strip search her with male cops, and leave her naked in the cell for 6 hours, and sue the station that airs the video for "invasion of privacy"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fvr3...alled-for.html
and my personal favorite,
fart on unconscious woman's head
http://www.8bm.com/diatribes/volume02/005/097.htm
Sorry, got google happy
so did anyone ever hear how that case in LA county turned out with the deputy who told the air force guy to "stand up" then shot him in the back? I can't find anything new on the story
Wait I forgot about this old one, I love this one.
Cop pepper sprays girl for possible shortchange in the drive-thru
I ain't got no 20s
http://www.videosift.com/video/Polic...r-Short-Change
Bullies whom never grown up.
Woot check out the shiners on this lady and check out the pool of blood on the floor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB_H...eature=related
People who like to boss others around look to drill seargents as a nice career to have, people who like to bully others and impose their "authority" look to the police force as a nice career.
The more I read and hear other peoples testimony, the more I think this is true.Quote:
Or is there somewhere in the law that states cops can do whatever they want and their superiors will let them off?
The people in this video have the same mindset as rapists. Rapists dont rape for sexual release, they do it for the feeling of domination and control.Quote:
This story is good:
Allegedly arrest the wrong person while the dash cam is mysteriously not on, then forcibly strip search her with male cops, and leave her naked in the cell for 6 hours, and sue the station that airs the video for "invasion of privacy"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fvr3d...alled-for.html
They. Are. Police. That is the reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by Papewaio
My Friend Got Charged With Fourth Degree Assault For Spitting In The Face Of A Guy Who Had Just Spit In His Face. In The Same State.
It's unwritten - the blue wall of silence. Much, much more effective than any 'stop snitching' program.Quote:
Or is there somewhere in the law that states cops can do whatever they want and their superiors will let them off?
Take a look at this story. Cops brutalize a man, and one officer from another country spoke up about it at the trial of the brutalized man (as often happens, the police charged the victim with crimes to cover up their own.)
Now, does the Sheriff punish the cops who beat up the victim? No; he calls the boss of the cop who told the truth and complains about him. The cop who tells the truth is put under investigation for wearing his uniform while testifying for the defense.
His boss also apologizes for the honest cop who had the gall to tell the truth:
“As Secretary of the APOA i feel it is my duty and responsibility to apologize to you and your officers. Ofc. Sam Costales does not represent APD/APOA. The majority of our officers look at the BCSO as our brother and sisters in blue. We are embarrassed and ashamed of Ofc. Costales's testimony in the Unser trial. If there is anything we can do to rebuild the damage caused by Sam please let me know.”
Some more:
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Nope, haven't read what happened. It's amazing what police get away with - incredible, in that it defies credibility. There are thugs with badges, and there are cops who don't report them. There are precious few 'good cops'.Quote:
so did anyone ever hear how that case in LA county turned out with the deputy who told the air force guy to "stand up" then shot him in the back? I can't find anything new on the story
As opposed to normal people, who would go to jail.Quote:
The knothead will pay a hefty price, maybe even lose his job.
You can't trust the courts or internal police reviews in this country. Cops can, and have, get away with murder.Quote:
I trust the courts will deal with this case.
In summary - Never talk to the police. Never trust them. Never let them in or search anything if they ask.
They are not your friends.
CR
I actually know a lot of good cops, but I'm sure even they could lose their temper if in difficult situations, and sometimes I hear them complain of situations where cops are being punished for something and I think, wow, they are getting what they deserve whats the problems. All in all, it's not a job I would care to have
It's really like any other line of work in that you will have people working there who are not-so level headed. Most police stations do ploygraphs for applicants, which are honestly a total load of crap because they don't prove anything. I think PDs that require their officers to have bachelors degrees prior to hiring typically have a more solid roster of quality cops, but anymore a degree can be obtained fairly easily so maybe it will become irrelevant.
I did, however, finally get rid of my old surveillance equipment from my PI days and buy a small minicam which I usually keep with me. They come in very handy. Had a small mini recorder that looked like a ballpoint pen that actually saved my butt in a wrongful termination lawsuit when I worked for a large retailer. Then I almost got fired for violating company policy by recording. I record everything now, down to the guy on the phone telling me the checks in the mail
Yeah, there are cops who do intend to do good.
But they are, sadly, the same ones who cover for the bad cops.
Being cooperative with most probably wouldn't be a problem. But it can turn into a big problem, and I don't see a reason to take that chance.
Surveillance is always a good idea. The only reason we're hearing about this is because of the video.
CR
Second guy is not charged because he didn't participate and was under training...
...judging by how he stood idle while a grown up man was beating a teenage girl I can say that he is definitely perfect cop material.
It is a sickening assault. Unfortunately the police attracts bullies and good for nothings who want to have power. In Greece (my country) policemen ranks somewhere between slime molds and snails in the great list of things mainly because of only using force (unnecessarily) when the odds are for them.
If that person goes unpunished (and proper punishment would be imprisonment) the respect for police will fall even more and I am also afraid that people might start taking the law in their hands. He should receive exemplary punishment and not a free holiday like he did.
:bow:Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit
Their motto here is:
Your friend and helper.
or
Dein Freund und Helfer.
Some black sheep as well I'm sure but generally I haven't noticed many problems with our police here.
Could be that they require Abitur or so.
I'm sure I've posted this in the past. Anyway about a decade ago I was on holiday in the Algarve and was watching the local Portuguese telly in a bar.
The scene I witnessed was, to say the least, bizzare. There was hundreds of GNR guys beseiging a town police station. The local police were in riot gear and the GNR guys were in full uniform. After a while the GNR guys threw all their weapons into a huge pile in front of the police station door and then a fight started.
I watched, bemused, as they slugged it out, live on screen. I turned to the barmaid and asked her what was going on. She said that two GNR guys had beaten a gypsy to death and had been promptly arrested by the town police. Their colleagues had then marched on the station demanding that they be let out and chanting that they couldn't arrest us, we are the police! :dizzy2:
It cartainly made my day watching coppers bash other coppers. A win win. :2thumbsup: :laugh4:
A cop who has someone in their custody has a duty of care to them. A minor should not be put in this situation where they can be violently assaulted. So why can't the state which is ultimately responsible for these guys be sued?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hosakawa Tito
If Joe Citizen held down a child, held her hands behind her back so she cannot shield her face, and then watch John Doe smash his fist into her head a couple of times, said Joe Citizen would not be charged with aiding a crime?
I do not agree with the idea that cops are above the law. My own view of how the law would be approximately the following:
1. Normal crime, normal punishment.
2. Attack a cop or a judge in uniform, higher punishment for the crime.
3. A crime committed by a citizen who is within the law system and within their purview, the higher punishment for the crime then those above.
Here's a follow up article. He will also face Department charges on top of the criminal/civil ones. Google 4th degree assault in Washington State: the penalty is possible 1 year in jail & $5,000 fine.The officer overreacted to the female kicking her shoe at him. He was well within his right to place her on the wall to subdue/restrain her and place cuffs on her. Taking her down by the hair and punching her on the ground when it was obvious by the video that she was not resisting constitutes excessive force, being a minor has no real relavence, he'd be just as wrong if it was an adult. The second officer involved will be required to provide written testimony on what happened, and with video of the incident there's no way he could lie about it. He will have to testify against the agressor or face criminal and departmental charges himself. Unless one can prove he purposely held the victim down so the other could assault her, which I don't think one can, he was following procedure to restrain and handcuff a person who assaulted (kicking a shoe) at a fellow officer. It's not his fault that the officer used excessive force instead of just restraining/controlling/handcuffing that person.Quote:
Originally Posted by Papewaio
We have been using video's in any of the jails I have worked at for years. I welcome them because they also protect and provide evidence for me and my colleagues from assault and justify our use of force. We don't get paid to be punching bags for every anti-social :daisy:, and aren't required to, but you gotta use your head, know the law and follow correct procedures.
Seems to be a lot of assumption & inuendo made here, but cops only seem to make the best headlines when some of them do something wrong. People tend to forget that they are us...
Don't know how true this statement is, but if he's a trainee than that means he's also on probation. So he's at the mercy of the Department and can lose his job even if not charged with a crime. IG will make him a deal he can't refuse.Quote:
Second guy is not charged because he didn't participate and was under training...
I'm sorry. I don't know what universe you inhabit but being a minor in my opinion does make a difference. An adult has full recourse to the law, a minor is a child and as such must be protected at all costs by the law/authorities
Anything else is a travesty of common decency.
He was merely pointing out that the law doesn't differentiate between victims ages unless the law broken was one where a person being a minor is inherent in the law itself, like child endangerment or contributing to the delinquency of a minor. In other words, assault and battery is assault and battery, whether the victim is 27 or 15. If the prosecutor wants something pertaining specifically to the fact that it was a child, there are a whole slew of child abuse/child neglect/sexual assault laws that do take age into account. A lot of states have adopted statutes where sexual assault of someone under 12 is a different and more hefty charge.
Your point could have been made without the verbal slight, IA. Poor form.Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
If you are under sixteen in NSW and you are given dental or medical treatment without your guardians consent. The Dr can be charged with assault and battery.
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Minors generally can't be charged as an adult. And adults that do crimes against children are generally given harsher treatment. Although there are obvious breaches of this (a man who raped a 4 year old got a suspended sentence :wall: ).
I'm merely pointing out that the charge of 4th degree assault & use of excessive force isn't age specific, and minors have as much protection under the law as anyone. Let's also not forget the 15 year old isn't being held for stealing bubble gum. And though the video doesn't show it, judging from the officer's explosive reaction I imagine the shoe struck him in the "family jewels". That doesn't justify use of excessive force, but I wonder what the average person's reaction would be to being kicked in the crotch....Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneApache
You're right, I apologise Hosakawa Tito. One too many before bed. :shame:Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh
Policemen are supposed to be professionals and able to keep their head cool under stressful situations. This guy should be fired and charged for assault :juggle2:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr
And though the video doesn't show it, judging from the officer's explosive reaction I imagine the shoe struck him in the "family jewels". That doesn't justify use of excessive force, but I wonder what the average person's reaction would be to being kicked in the crotch....
I certainly wouldn't explode into violence, i have had a good few situation where i could have hit a minor (with a similar amount of justification to this guy) had a girl half my size jump up and hit me in the eye (it didn't hurt... bit of a shock though) and a little kid poke me in the eye on purpose (though he did apologise just after im sure he did it on porpuse and it stung a little)
I would expect a police officer to be at least as cool headed as me, i would never hit someone who's being restrained by someone else, its just wrong and even more so in this situation...
What should the trainee officer have done ?
Ill admit if i was a trainee i wouldn't be quite sure what to do.... do you stop your senior officer ? can you be sure your supposed to stop your senior officer or if your supposed to handcuff the minor ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleGrizzly
If you see ANYONE hitting a restrained little girl then you should stop them.
I see 3 sets of issues here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hosakawa Tito
1. Violent cop.
2. Systemic corruption in the lack of charges & what would be expected to happen to someone else in the wider community.
3. Failure of duty of care for a professional with a minor in there care.
1 = Bad
2 = Unjust
3 = Unethical
Not sure what video you are watching. Because the shoe doesn't seem to get very high nor very fast, so unless the cop is hung like a donkey (which given his anger levels indicates more like Maradona)... then I don't think it got him in the family jewels.
Nor would it excuse his assault. Nor does it excuse what seems to the rest of the world a systemic problem where the cop is getting a soft touch in charging from his superiors. I do still wonder what would happen to two adults who were not police officers doing the same thing. It seems most people have skirted that. If two adults did this would they expect at worst 4th degree assault for one and sweet nothing for the other? I don't think so. And this is were the law is falling, the moment there is one law for one set and another for the rest it is the very definition of corrupt.
Generally for professionals (Dentists, Doctors, School Teachers) they have a duty of care to minors. This results in the potential for charges to be laid against the professionals if they do something to a minor while they have authority over them, charges that would not be applicable for other adults who do not have a duty of care to them. For instance the age of consent used to be higher for students and their teacher. So I do find it abhorrent that this is a minor who is getting assaulted. Just because the Law does not differentiate this, does not make the situation just.