Dead General's and their bodyguards.

I'm not really sure if this is meant to happen, or if so, what to do about it. However, a growing number of general's in my Ottoman Campaign are dying of old age, but their bodyguard units remain in the army.

At first I mistook these for a new version of general's unit especially as they seem to have a personal name associated with them, but they don't seem to accumulate expereince so more recently I've been recruiting new general's and using these extra bodyguards as small cavalry units.

Has anyone got any more information of these units or suggestions on what to do with them?

I disband them. A normal cavalry unit has more use and strength.

In my Marathan campaign a general died under suspicious circumstances and his bodyguard disappeared. A bug?

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Originally Posted by Monsieur Alphonse

I disband them. A normal cavalry unit has more use and strength.

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that is most certainly NOT true. they are much better than normal cavalry, at least in the early period. right click a regiment of horse and then right click a generals bodguard. much better than the regiment of horse.... plus less upkeep :beam:

I usually use them as disposable heroes once the general dies (suicide charge). Better they die serving the unity than just go away.

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Originally Posted by Dead Guy

I usually use them as disposable heroes once the general dies (suicide charge). Better they die serving the unity than just go away.

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Um! thats the point...they don't go away.

Like you in previous TW titles I got used to using any surviving general's bodyguards as suicide troops if I lost my general in battle. It was sensible because as you say any survivors simply dissappeared after the battle anyway, but it seems they don't anymore.

yeah. save them as much as you can. they have a low upkeep and can destroy any other horse cavalry 1-1. retrain them immediately too, as they must have suffered heavy losses if your general is dead.

I don't think they should hang around after the General dies, that's kind of the point of a bodyguard or staff in that without someone to guard or wait on, there's no point to them.

Either you should be able to somehow retrain them and "implant" a new general into the squad or they should disappear. What army would keep spare general staff around if they had no general?

i suppose logically they would just become heavy cavalry, but an army would not let such excellent cavalry simply leave and go to waste. it makes sense to keep them around, just as heavy cavalry rather than a bodyguard.

From a game point of view, yes. But realisticaly, it doesn't make sense for them to remain as an independant unit.

I always disband them too, but early on they are better than regiments of horse and provincial cavalry, they're like an early heavy cavalry but without armour and with more morale.

I think their unit size negates these extra little stats though, so they aren't really worth keeping.

if you are fighting a proffesional army, then yes, they are pretty worthless on their own. but if you defeat that army and then move on to the regon capital and only have to fight mobs, they are very effective at routing them. since they kill faster and are fighting mobs they will lose almost no one and cause a mass rout.

I wouldn't mind if a general's heavy cav unit became a new general. One would think someone in his staff would take over.

its only like 1300 if you want another...

as maratha, your general and bodyguards ride on elephants rather than horses - i used this to my advantage (a bit of an exploit) by simply packing my forces full of as many generals as i could afford. suddenly, i have an army of powerful elephant gunners and its only 1710 - and even if the generals die i still retain the unit.

lol exploiting new system much?

It's just like exploiting the old system really... Having half your stack made up of generals when playing as an eastern faction with extremely powerful cavalry.

the difference however is that now you can recruit elephants with musketeers for a very low upkeep and keep them until the entire unit is wiped out! i know that in real life they would keep the elephants, but it is just unbalanced here.

off-topic: can you recruit cannon-elephants? because i know for a fact that elephants were sometimes mounted with small, anti-infantry 3 or 6lber swiveling cannons.

Technically I don't even think the general's bodyguard should be effective in battle in a direct sense, but shouldn't they just boost morale/maybe give a slight speed boost to troops to simulate the effects of a staff that gives better orders and coordination to the army. My point of view is that if they are considered staff than they should give bonuses along those lines.

yeah i was kinda hoping they were too small to fight, but even 36 of them is enough to wipe out entire units. they should have been non-combat units.

It's easily fixed once the game is moddable. Generals in this period sat way back on the battlefield on hills with a good view, with only a tiny handful of exceptions where generals actually took part in battle.

At best a generals unit should be no better than Cuirassers...

Perhaps even lower? Yeah, lower i'd say. I've seen enemy generals go through a unit of my line infantry with ring bayonets like a hot knife through butter. Granted they were the worst line infantry in Europe, Russian, but still, they shouldn't have that kind of stopping power.

provided there is no unit size requirement, we could probably make them only like 4-6 men with horrible stats. then you would be stupid to put them into battle (except for elephants of course)

I like the dynamic of giving a general powerful bodyguards. It presents an interesting choice. Risking your general in combat has the potential to turn the tide of battle both for and against you. A unit of weak bodyguards presents only one choice: never, ever use your general and tie up resources to make sure he doesn't die. It would be more realistic but that's one case where I would happily toss realism aside.