The Battle of the Basileis

The Battle of the Basileis

Background:

The War of the Four Basileis is officially heating up. Mere weeks after the opening salvos were fired between Andronikos Komnenos and Ioannis Tagaris in the Battle of the Iron Bridge, the scale of the conflict escalated exponentially. On the same day, all four claimants to the Byzantine throne would see themselves put to the test as three separate, simultaneous engagements would play out.

The northern shore of Anatolia plays host to two of the three engagements, mostly thanks to the massive forces of Ioannis Komnenos III finally entering play. Unconsciously, the forces of Ioannis Tagaris and Kousinos Sophianos have both realized that "Augustus" Komnenos is far too powerful to be left unchecked for much longer. As a result, all three of his commanders find themselves under attack.

At the lead of his column, the Komnenian commander Arintheos Voutoumatis, realizing that the Tagarian general Helarionas Anargiros would catch up in his pursuit, turned around his army at the instruction of Ioannis and prepared to intercept Helarionas. The would-be Augustus quickly followed suit, although he would not arrive in time to initially deploy along with Arintheos. Finding himself heavily outnumbered, Helarionas will have to buy some time along the Coastal Road before he can safely withdraw and fight another day.

The third army in the Komnenian U-Turn belonged to Isaakos Komnenos, who quickly found himself cursing the turn in luck. He was trying to keep up with Ioannis's and Arintheos's counter-march, but found it to be a losing battle. Desperately focused on trying to catch up with the other two armies, he failed to cover all of his basics, reasoning that his forward scouts had seen no sign of any enemy anywhere near ahead.

However, this did not account for the entirely mounted contingent of Ioannis Erotikos, crossing the mountains of Anatolia in record time, hell-bent on throwing a wrench into the situation. With only minutes to prepare, Isaakos would now have to fight off a sizeable amount of cavalry while quickly letting the other two generals know that he would not be able to assist in their own effort.

Ioannis Erotikos's ambush was not the only sign that Kousinos Sophianos and his forces had officially entered the fray. Kousinos himself arrived at the great city of Antioch with his own men... just as Andronikos Komnenos and Nikitas Moschos, victors at the Iron Bridge, were preparing to assault the remnants of Ioannis Tagaris's and Vartholomaios Ksiros's armies.

With three separate forces meeting head-on at Antioch, none of them allied with the others, an interesting drama is sure to play out, as all three of them jockey for position and wait to see how the other two react before making any moves. Combine the situation at Antioch with the two separate engagements on the south coast of the Black Sea, and the War of the Four Basileis is about to take an extremely bloody turn.

General:

The Battle of the Basileis is actually three separate battles, however, as they are all occurring simultaneously I have decided to group them all in this thread for aesthetic purposes. The three individual conflicts are as follows:

The Battle of the Coastal Road:
Helarionas Anargiros (YLC)
vs
Arintheos Voutoumatis (Zim)
Ioannis Komnenos III (Ignoramus)

The Battle of the Rear Guard:
Isaakios Komnenos (flyd)
vs
Ioannis Erotikas (Ramses II CP)

The Battle of Antioch (three way conflict):
Kousinos Sophianos (Cecil XIX)
vs
Andronikos Komnenos (woad&fangs)
Nikitas Moschos (Ituralde)
vs
Ioannis Tagaris (TheFlax)
Vartholomaios Ksiros (Rowan)

The Battle of the Coastal Road and the Battle of Antioch will your standard Throne Room Tabletop PvP battle, umpired by me (with assistance from TinCow) and in the style of previous battles such as Trent, the Iron Bridge, and, specifically in the case of Antioch, Bern. The Battle of the Rear Guard will be fought by flyd and Ramses online in Total War multiplayer, under specific guidelines. They will then report the results back to myself and/or TinCow. As such, much of what is posted here does not apply to them.

Orders and resolution:

Players are to draft concise, in-character orders every turn and send them to me along with a map diagramming their movements. If orders are too complicated they run a risk of confusing the division commander and causing inaction. All divisions, unless being one of the two nearest the commanding general, are subject to an orders test (my rolling the die). 2-6, orders are executed, 1, they are not and the units are inactive for that turn.

To properly simulate medieval combat, orders will be given on a divisional level rather than a regimental one. Refer to the Word document (see below) to see a list of proposed divisions. Division commanders are generally experienced people and know how to execute operations such as wheeling, pivoting, and flanking. If you tell them to flank the left side of the line, they don’t need more information, such has how to do it in detail.

An ideal example of how to give orders is provided below:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

BILLYBOB'S ORDERS
Infantry: Advance in line with the rest of the army and attack the enemy's infantry in front of you. We outnumber them by one regiment of DFKs so I want them to wrap around and hit them on the flank.

Archers: All fire is to be concentrated on the enemy general unit. If you are charged then fall back to the spearmen.

Spearmen: Guard the archers, but if it becomes apparent that the enemy cavalry is going to make an attack then shadow them and respond as necessary.

Cavalry: Once the enemy flank is engaged then swing around and hit the enemy's rear.

~~~~~~~~~

include the map of course as well.

---

Should combat arise, either TinCow or I, depending on real-life schedules, will resolve it via playing both sides from a custom battle in M2TW and sending the results to me, where they will be implemented at my discretion. We will be using the custom PvPMod that I mentioned in the Edessa thread that gives Egypt (a dead faction in-game) Byzantine units to make things fairer. All combat, unless it is a large infantry engagement, usually along the main battle line, will only take one turn to resolve. This includes operations that unbalance the line, such as throwing in reserves or a flank/rear attack. Losing units will be removed from the map, and victorious units, if necessary, will face a fractional reduction of their numbers.

Battle structure:

The sides and what turns they may arrive are as follows:

Coastal Road:

Tagarians:

• Helarionas Anargios (YLC) - deploys immediately, may withdraw after Turn 2.

Ioannian Komnenians:

• Arintheos Voutoumatis (Zim) - deploys immediately, may withdraw after Turn 2.
• Ioannis Komnenos III (Ignoramus) - has a chance of reinforcement starting Turn 2, latest possible chance is Turn 4.

Antioch:

Tagarians:

• Ioannis Tagaris (TheFlax) or Vartholomaios Ksiros (Rowan)

Andronikian Komnenians:

• Andronikos Komnenos (woad&fangs)
• Nikitas Moschos (Ituralde)

Kousimos Sophianos/Constantinos Ksanthopoulos (hereby referred to as the former for the duration of the battle):

• Kousimos Sophianos (Cecil XIX)

In Antioch, all armies may deploy at the start of the battle.

The turn structure is the standard PvP turn structure with no changes:

• Turn 0: Deployments
• Turn 1: Early morning
• Turn 2: Mid-morning (earliest chance Ioannis Komnenos III has of deploying)
• Turn 3: Late morning
• Turn 4: Early afternoon (latest possible time Ioannis Komnenos III will deploy)
• Turn 5: Mid-afternoon
• Turn 6: Late afternoon
• Turn 7: Early evening

A night turn and additional day turns will be added as needed.

Antioch errata:

As the Coastal Road is a standard field battle between two sides, no unique features/mechanics are required. However, this is a different story for Antioch, as the fact that it is a city battle between three hostile sides makes things quite complicated.

First of all, Andronikos and Nikitas, being prepared for a city assault, have constructed several engines. Woad and Ituralde must figure out for themselves which regiments (if any) will carry their ladders, battering rams, and siege towers. Please make a little designation on your map by using the letters L for ladders, R for rams, and T for towers and putting them next to the appropriate regiments. You may not exceed three of any siege engine, although you can choose to use less.

Secondly, there is some ambiguity as to who commands the Tagarian forces inside Antioch. While Ioannis Tagaris is the faction leader for the Tagarians, he only got one regiment aside from his own bodyguard out from the Iron Bridge: a unit of archers. On the flip side, Vartholomaios Tagaris answers to his Basileus, but most of the armed defenders of Antioch answer to him. As there aren't enough troops to split up between the two of them, the two commanders must work out who will take direct command of the battle and PM me with their decision. In the case of the designated commander being inactive, the second commander may send in orders for the army, however, the orders test will be made more difficult to pass.

Finally, as this is a three-way battle, there is bound to be some on-the-spot diplomacy and dealmaking. Any commanding general may communicate with an enemy commanding general if there is a free line of communication. Even then, these missives will face the standard orders test:

Roll 1: Communication gets intercepted by the third party.
Roll 2: Communication gets lost.
Roll 3-6: Communication arrives safely.

In summation, if there are soldiers in the way of sending a communication, there is no possible chance of it getting through. If there are none, then the result varies as above. The thing to remember about this is that ALL INTER-ARMY COMMUNICATIONS ARE TO BE SENT TO ME ONLY. DO NOT DIRECTLY PM THE OTHER COMMANDER UNLESS I SPECIFICALLY ALLOW IT. If you don't go through me first and I find out, the penalty will be harsh.

In addition, commanders may want to fake messages as being sent by one of the opposing generals. The same rules apply (although make sure the general you wish to "emulate" has a clear line of communication with the general you send the message to, otherwise the receiver will be pretty suspicious), albeit with a slightly altered orders test:

Roll 1-2: The receiving general's agents recognize it is a fraud.
Roll 3: Communication lost.
Roll 4-6: Communication goes through undetected.

If "opposing" armies are near each other but without orders to attack each other (say, for example, the generals have an agreement with each other), they still stand a 33% of attacking each other without orders. After all, battlefield diplomacy is a very shaky thing and much less reliable than standard diplomacy.

Divisions and deployment:

Attached in the Word Document below is a list of pre-created divisions for every army. You may rearrange these as you see fit, however, there are restrictions as you will see in the document. Mainly it comes down to the amount of divisions every general is allowed to have: Aspiring Basileis command six, everybody else commands five. More divisions, more army flexibility. You will be copy-pasting these regiments directly from the Document onto the map and sending it to me along with your orders for every turn.

Forces:

All forces listed here are tentative and subject to my adjustment. The units pasted in the Word document below are the final ones.

Battle of the Coastal Road:

Helarionas Anargios (YLC):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...sileis/ylc.jpg

Arintheos Voutoumatis (Zim):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...sileis/zim.jpg

Ioannis Komnenos III (Ignoramus):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/.../ignoramus.jpg

Battle of the Rear Guard:

Isaakos Komnenos (flyd):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...ileis/flyd.jpg

Ioannis Erotikos (Ramses II CP):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...eis/ramses.jpg

Battle of Antioch:

Kousinos Sophianos (Cecil XIX):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...leis/cecil.jpg

Andronikos Komnenos (woad&fangs):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...ileis/woad.jpg

Nikitas Moschos (Ituralde):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...s/ituralde.jpg

Ioannis Tagaris/Vartholomaios Ksiros (TheFlax/Rowan):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/.../tagarians.jpg

Maps:

For the Battle of the Rear Guard, flyd and Ramses will use the closest match to the Coastal Road map below.

Coastal Road:

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...leis/1_pre.jpg

Antioch (sniped from econ21's Bern map):

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...leis/2-pre.jpg

DEPLOYMENT INSTRUCTIONS FOR TURN 0: All commanders taking part in the Battle of the Coastal Road and the Battle of Antioch, save for Ioannis Komnenos III (Ignoramus) are to PM me their reworked divisions (if there is any reworking to be done) provided in Basileis_units. In addition, they are to deploy their forces in the appropriate zones. Finally, I must hear from TheFlax and Rowan about who will command the Tagarian forces in the Battle of Antioch.

DEADLINE FOR TURN 0 ORDERS: April 19th, 12:00 GMT-5.

Note: At the close of the battle I will edit this and all future posts to include orders from all parties and umpire notes. For now, you will be receiving basic public feedback in this thread from the viewpoint of GeneralHankerchief (I got tired of RPing different viewpoints, sue me), who is intimately familiar with every intricate detail of the battles. More detailed information will be sent via PM.

Preliminary communications

To flyd and Ramses:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

As you will see in the Word document, the forces you are to use in the battle are up. You guys know the setup and how everything's to be fought, so you may do so at your leisure. I just need confirmation (ideally a screenshot) that you're using the exact forces as outlined, and of course the results.

Best of luck to you both.

GH

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Hey GH,

I don't know if your aware of this or not, but the Grandmaster and Constantine have secretly allied. Constantine is currently planning on sending him both a message and a flag as soon as the battle begins. It's his hope that during the battle both he and the Grandmaster will fly the same flag, hopefully reducing the confusion and possible friendly-fire.

I hope it was helpful to tell you this, I thought that maybe knowing what Constantine is planning sooner rather than later would make things easier to figure out. Certainly it will be affected by whoever ends up commanding the Tagarites.

-Cecil XIX

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Hi Cecil,

Thanks for telling me this, yes. :yes: Ideally I would like the Grandmaster (Rowan, right?) to confirm this, but at the moment, consider communication cut off unless it comes through me. If everything goes according to plan, I'll reduce (or eliminate, haven't decided yet) the possibility of friendly fire.

As far as your first question goes, deployment *does* affect the probability of messages going through. Say Andronikos and Nikitas put everybody to the southwest of Antioch. You'd have the standard orders test until one of the enemy forces interfered, if they would at all.

Hope this answers your question - let me know if you need more.

GH

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Glad to know that deployment affects communications, friendly fire could be reduced, and that it was a good idea to tell you. :2thumbsup:

I do have one more question, if it's okay for you to tell me. If Vartholomaios (Rowan, indeed) is given overall command, what can Ioannis Tagaris do if the Grandmaster declares for Constantine? If the Basileus is given overall command, will it affect the Grandmaster's ability to come over to Consantine's side?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

1. I imagine that Ioannis would be pretty much screwed.

2. I may have to do an orders test for Bart's regiments if this is the case, similar to the Illuminati flips in Trent.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zim

I can't believe this is pretty much my first tabletop battle (tiny force at the Battle of Trent excepted). I recall there were limits on the number of divisions in some old battles. Will that hold true for this one? If so can the divisions be as large as I want?

Also, assuming the battlefield can be crossed within two turns (if so I'm going to try to force a battle...) if a division doesn't get orders but every single other division around them are marching forward, would they sit there or at least assume they are part of the general advance?

Lastly, I'm guessing I can't try to sway the troops of Arintheos' I lent Helarionas some time ago to attack or at least distract him. Sounds more like something the gms would allow the underdog in the battle more than the guy with the massive army I guess. :laugh4:

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

1. Yup, there will be a divisional requirement. It'll all be in the Word document I'm working on. :yes: As far as division size, we'll talk later when I see what exactly you want to do. Just remember: if you have a really big division, they have to operate together. No split-offs.

2. Sorry, an inactive division is an inactive division.

3. See, I was much more prepared for this sort of thing in Trent when I knew what the Illuminati were going to do beforehand. :laugh4: Exactly what troops did you lend him and how long ago did you do so?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheFlax (to Rowan)

Hey,

Seeing as you didn't get to take part in the Battle of the Iron Bridge, would you like overall command for this battle? I really would not mind. :yes:

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rowan

I'll be taking command of the Battle.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Hey Rowan,

GH wants you to confirm that Constantine and and Vartholomaios has a secret alliance. Since they currently can't communicate, let's wait until the battle starts to discuss it ourselves.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rowan

Yup, Bart and Constantine have an 'understanding' at the moment.

And this is the only communication Cecil will be getting from me until communications have been re-established.

---

(Note: I allowed this communication to go through as it would affect the orders tests I would give later.)

Orders

Coastal Road

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YLC

Please just have me auto surrender[.]

---

After some discussion I complied with YLC’s request.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zim

I rather like the divisions as given. Wish I could divide my cavalry but it doesn't look like that's going to happen.

Just in case the battle does continue and I'm not online in time for more detailed orders:

I'd like Division III (militia and infantry) to form a mediumish thick line (3-4 rows) in the front of that army, We shall name them Division Meatshield.

If formation for single divisions are possible I'd like the units on each end to be slighty behind and overlapping their fellows, sort of like this
______
- -

They can move to loose formation if harassed by Helarionas' foot or horsearchers

The idea being that those units on each end form a partial shield for the archers.

Division IV (missiles) will either form a thicker line right behind 3 of if I don't have to keep them in a single line they'll form two thin lines, crappy peasants plus one other unit in the foremost (to make up a bit for their weak range). They can go into loose formation if involved in a missile duel.

Division II (non-crappy infantry) follow right behind the archers in a single line 4 or so deep. They have orders to plug any gaps if a charge or melee on the meatshields of divison III occur and to protect the archers.

Division I (Arintheos) will stay just behind II. Generally speaking he should avoid battle, although he will charge and withdraw if he sees an opening.

Division V (Cavalry) will stay just to Arintheos' left flank. Their orders are to charge if Helarionas' foot archers or a small number of his cavalry become isolated (assuming Ben separates his horsearchers intwo two divisions, for example), although to avoid any counter charge (if Helarionas' cavalry look antsy they should return behind lines). They can also loop around and charge if Helarionas' cavalry become tied up in melee, or if Helarionas himself is tied up and his guard has weakened a bit (until he's weakened they should take potshots at him from behind, assuming Helarionas' horsearchers aren't in play and nearby, in which case I'd rather they exchange missile fire with them.) They can go into loose formation if a missile duel occurs.

All divisions are to advance on Helarionas' position. Should the archers not respond to orders and stay still, Division II can move in front of them to protect them. If the cavalry or any other division falls behind and a melee seems imminent if the army were to continue forward (as opposed to a missile exchange between both sides) they should all halt. This does does not cancel other orders (regarding plugging lines, etc.), only the general advance order.

If more than one of Helarionas' missiles units come within range and fire the army should halt for the missile duel. All of Division IV would fire on them, as well as division V (going around to flank the forward enemy units if feasible without exposing them to a charge).

Arintheos' old units in Helarionas' army are the two Dismounted Lancers and single Balkan Archer unit, as I had thought. If I'm allowed to make a play with them I'd like it to occur with the unfurling of a flag with the symbol for Epirus from Europa Barbarorum (dark green background with Molossian Hound in the foreground, I can get a picture if need be). That flag will be unfurled on turn two, most likely, with the goal either being to turn the melee that turn against Helarionas or prevent a retreat. When the flag is unfurled they are to attack Helarionas' other infantry.

---

Antioch

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Men, before the battle starts I have one important announcement:

With battle at hand I can now tell you that the Grandmaster of the Knights of St. John has previously agreed to join me as my vassal. Indeed, the reason we are here is to save him! Andronikos does not know this, and thus does not know the danger he is in.

Therefore, I am ordering you all never to engage the Tagarians without my direct orders. Any regiments found responsible for bloodshed between ourselves and the Tagarians forfeit their share of the loot taken from Andronikos' men! Do I make myself clear?

In other news, the army is to be organized as follows:

Division 1: My Personal Guard (1)
Division 2: The Heavy Infantry (3)
Division 3: The African Mercenaries (3)
Division 4: The Spearmen (5)
Division 5: The Militia (3)
Division 6: The Archers (6)

(OOC: Basically your suggestion, except that I made a seperate regiment out of the Africans and bumped the Archers down to Division 6)

We'll deploy in a strong defensive formation. I believe Andronikos will try to focus all his might against one opponent first, attempting to achieve superiority in one area. This formation shall protect us if he should choose to go after us, and if he decided to focus on the Tagarites then the formation may convince him that we intend to wait out such a battle before sweeping in and eliminating the survivors. This could cause him to commit his forces against the Tagarians, leaving him less able to oppose us.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img504.imageshack.us/img504/9908/antioch.jpg

OOC: The black lines indicate which direction each division is facing. I hope it's clear.

Now then, to battle! When this is all over, only one enemy shall remain!

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by woad&fangs

OOC:

I don't have any changes in the structure of the divisions. The commander of the militia is Manuel, the spears is Cyrus, the cavalry is Callistus, and the foot archers is Ammonathas.

IC: Men! Prepare to assault the western wall! Spears to the north and militia to the south. Archers, cavalry, and myself will be behind them. Cyrus, have one of the byzantine spearmen man a seige tower. Manuel, your men will man the ram, ladder, and southern seige tower.

OOC: skeleton orders for Ituralde if he doesn't send any. Prepare to assault the southern wall. Infantry in front and other troops behind them. 1 ram, 1 tower, 2 ladders.
````````
map

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ituralde (to woad)

Hey there,

Could you maybe post the movement for my men this turn. I'm having a tight schedule this weekend and just won't be able to make it in time otherwise. I'm sorry.

CCed to GH so he knows about this.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rowan

Hi

If I wish to have the gates open to Cecil's troops do I a) need to get a unit next to the gate to do the opening or is there b) assumed to be a gatekeeper guy to do the opening if ordered to?

Reworked divisions:

Division 1: (depends on the above)
Bart
If B then also Ioannis Tagaris

Division 2: Peasants
3x 112 man peasant unit (1 with armor upgrade)

Division 3: Militia
3x 90 man (town?) militia (1 with armor upgrade)
1x 77 man (town?) militia with armor upgrade

Division 4: Archers and Infantry
2x 112 man spear infantry
1x 90 man archer unit
1x 16 man archer unit

Division 5: (depends on the gate opening mechanic)
Great Cross
If A then also Ioannis Tagaris


Deployment:
Division 1 (Bart + Ioannis?) is stationed on the north side of the town square, next to the western road leading to north gate.

Division 2 (peasants) will guard the southen gate, between towers S4 and S7

Division 3 (militia) will guard the western gate, between the towers W3 and W6.

Division 4 (archers and infantry) is the reserve and is stationed at the southwestern corner of the town square.

Division 5 (Cross + Ioannis?) is stationed on the south side of the town square, next to the road leading to the southern gate.


If you need clarification, I'll send you a map after I know where I'm putting Ioannis ;)

Cheers,
Rowan

---

Umpire notes for Turn 0:

YLC’s decision to surrender was a decision more OOC than anything else, thus I removed a lot of information from his PM. That simplifies things for me as the only battle I have to run now is Antioch.

Even though there was no express Overall Commander mechanic like in the Iron Bridge or Trent, I deployed Nikitas’s men based on woad’s skeleton orders, using the reasoning that since the troops were already in place at the start of the battle, it wouldn’t be too much of a stretch.

Rowan’s orders PM included a couple of mechanics questions. I sent the following reply:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

I won't have you place a regiment to open the gate, but I will do an orders test for the invisible gatekeeper.

---

No orders test was done this round as Bart didn’t open any gates and since this was only the deployment round.


Public feedback for Turn 0

Coastal Road:

Arintheos Voutoumatis places his men down on the battlefield, taking great care to perfectly maximize his advantage and doing everything he can to win the day. After this is done, he finally spares a second to glance down the field at his enemy... and finds none. Perturbed, Arintheos wonders how Helarionas Anargios was able to run away in a hurry. Surely it would have taken Helarionas at least half the morning to withdraw...?

After some time, a rider bearing a white flag approaches Arintheos's command headquarters. Adhering to standard diplomatic/military protocol, Arintheos receives the rider, alone, save for a couple bodyguards. The rest of the command staff waits outside of the tent, in anticipation. A minute later, Arintheos steps out of the tent with a bemused expression on his face.

"Well boys, it looks like you got a reprieve. Helarionas has unconditionally surrendered to us. Battle's over, folks!"

The news quickly spread to the rest of the army, and while the men were in good spirits, their thoughts still were to the east, where their comrades led by Isaakos Komnenos were in a very sticky situation.

Antioch:

The Andronikans are in a difficult situation, as they face the possibility of being sandwiched in by the forces of the Tagarians as well as Kousimos Sophianos. It is up to them to decide which army they want to meet in battle first, as surely trying to take on both at once would be suicide, the enemy forces being at odds or not.

It becomes very apparent to the non-Andronikan forces that Andronikos and Nikitas Moschos have chosen the losers of the Battle of the Iron Bridge as the focus of their efforts. Their forces are lined up to the south and west of the city along with their siege engines, clearly prepared to make an assault. In addition to their preparations, they have also chosen a spot that is far away from the very large variable that is Kousimos and his army.

Luckily for the Tagarians, whoever is command of their forces correctly predicted that Andronikos would try as much, and deployed his men accordingly. The initial phase of the Battle of Antioch is going to be a dogfight between Andronikos and the Tagarians, this time winner-take-all. In addition, due to the placement of the forces, Kousimos may find himself shut out of the battle, as he has no siege engines. He may very well have to use Andronikos's engines on his way to claim the city for himself!

As the sun climbs higher into the sky, it is going to be another very long day in the desert.

Map:

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...ileis/2_00.jpg

DEADLINE FOR TURN 2 ORDERS: April 21st, 12:00 GMT-5.

OOC note: YLC has surrendered unconditionally, no tricks or anything. The Battle of the Coastal Road is over before it has even begun. The remainder of this thread will focus on the Battle of Antioch with a resolution to the Battle of the Rear Guard being posted when appropriate.

Turn 0 feedback:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Kousimos

You deploy your men in the only place you can - northeast of the city - and put them in a strong defensive formation, anticipating heavy pressure from Andronikos Komnenos and Nikitas Moschos. However, no such pressure comes. Andronikos and Nikitas have evidently decided to go for Antioch itself first, putting Ioannis Tagaris and more importantly, Vartholomaios Ksiros, at a grave risk.

Further complicating the situation is that you still do not know who is in command of the city's defenses. You could certainly send in a relief force... but you may not know how it will be greeted. O, the tragedy of ignorance. This is making you tear your hair out.

While the placement of the other two forces is encouraging for your own army's personal preservation, you would ideally like to emerge out of here with some of Bart's men intact as well. Clarification would certainly be helpful.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Andronikos and Nikitas

(OOC: I sent this to both of you as there's no real difference in what to say. Later on in the battle you will receive unique feedbacks.)

You deploy your forces to the south and west of Antioch, as far away from the imposing-looking army of Kousimos Sophianos as humanly possible. Ideally your goal is to go in, kill the Tagarians, and get out, but of course it may not be that simple. For one thing, the Tagarians already correctly predicted your first move, meaning that you will be facing fresh troops as opposed to men who had to scurry across the city in order to meet you.

With your men lined up and with Kousimos's sure to approach, there's really nothing to do but press forward and begin your assault. The gauntlet of tower fire begins. It's time to kill Ioannis and Bart once and for all.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Bart

Well, Andronikos and Nikitas certainly aren't taking any chances with Kousimos Sophianos - they've deployed just about as far away from him as you can get. Bad luck for you as it means you'll almost certainly have to face them alone for a while while Kousimos finds a way in.

You have ceded the walls to the Komnenians, although the placement of your forces ensures that the all-important towers will still be manned. Make sure that once Andronikos's and Nikitas's men are over, your own guys are out of tower range.

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Orders:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Men, we march! Andronikos has deployed opposite the city from us, so let us get into column and march!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img183.imageshack.us/img183/9908/antioch.jpg

OOC: I'm not sure how far the soldiers can get in the alotted time, but this is where I'd like to end up anyway. If Constantine knows how far he can march, he'll purposefully feign having trouble forming the column so that they reach the position at the end of the time period without obviously stopping and waiting. If the enemy should approach and put Constantine in danger, he'll retreat clockwise around the formation in order to get away. Also, I assumed that the towers can't fire arrows if there are not defenders in the vicinity, like in the game. If this isn't true, then Constantine would choose to end up just outside of their range, but otherwise right in front of the gate.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by woad&fangs

Towers and ladders, advance. Kill any men on the walls and then open the gate. Manuel and Cyrus, bring your non-assaulting troops closer together.

ooc: skeleton orders for Nikitas. Attack the walls with the towers and ladders. Kill any men on the walls and then open the gate.
```````
map

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rowan

(OOC: For some reason I forgot to explicitly state that I wanted the troops ON the walls, not behind them... oh well)

Dispatch riders will be sent to the east and north gates with orders to open the gates for Kousinos Sophianos' troops.

Message to division 2 (peasants): Every unit will move on the walls, between towers S1 and S4! Face the enemy ladders and tower! Drive the enemy from the walls if they dare set foot on it! Give no Quarter! Stay steady, reinforcements are on the way.

Message to division 3 (militia): Move on the walls between towers W2 and W7. Face the enemy ladders and towers! Drive the enemy from the walls if they dare set foot on it! Give no Quarter! Stay steady, reinforcements are on the way.

Division 4 (reserve) will move to block the gates if enemy ram succeeds in breaking it.
Archers will stay behind the spearmen. Do not fight to the death but make a fighting retreat towards the town square if overwhelmed by the enemy.

Division 5 (Great Cross) will follow Div4(res) to the western gate where it will give the men courage and help guard the main road to town square.

Saddle up men! We (Division 1) will ride against the enemy in the south! We will sally forth and charge their ram! After exiting the gate we will make a small detour left and strike their flank! If Nikitas tries to intervene out superior numbers will crush him down!
(OOC: Try to charge the infantry pushing the ram from the flank. Do not be distracted by the horse archers but if they are caught in a melee then all the better. Countercharge Nikitas if he intervenes, our superior numbers (Ioannis has 43 BG) and quality (Bart has 9 exp) should overwhelm him easily. I do not know how long the turn lasts but if the charge and battle against Nikitas are successful the archers are next priority. If Nikitas doesn't charge withdraw back behind city walls.)

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

http://www.niksula.cs.hut.fi/~marpih/ant2_00.jpg

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In addition, two messages were sent this turn:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Constine decide that, first of all, he must attempt to establish contact. He summoned a messanger, giving him the following instructions.

"Raise the white flag, and go to enter the city through the east gate. I shall take the army counterclockwise past the north gate (OOC: Orders to follow), so they will have little to fear from you and should let you in. Do everything you can to deliver this message to Vartholomaios Ksiros, Grandmaster of the Knights of St. John, as well as this banner."

The Message:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Grandmaster,

At last, we meet as allies on the field of battle! First things first: I've sent a banner with this messenger, displaying my personal arms. I will display mine for all to see, and I want you to do the same with yours. This should reduce the likelyhood of friendly fire between our forces, and perhaps also send panic through Andronikos' men! Second, I want my men to enter the city and help you repell the enemy from the walls. My army shall march beyond the range of your towers until we see the flag raised, once that is done we shall enter through the north gate and move to repell the attack. Finally, I ask that you send me a message back to indicate that you've received this.

Sincerely,
Constantine

The Banner:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img165.imageshack.us/img165/3121/myarms.png

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rowan

Message to Kousinos Sophianos (CecilXIX):
I am ordering the east and north gates to be opened for your troops. Hurry!

Orders forthcoming.

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Umpire notes for Turn 1:

Roll for Kousimos’s message to Bart: 4 (gets through).
Roll for Bart’s message to Kousimos: 2 (message lost).

In addition to the standard orders tests, Bart also decided to open the northern and eastern gates to Kousimos’s men.

Roll for northern gate: 2 (gate opens).
Roll for eastern gate: 2 (gate opens).

Units failing orders test: None. Random.org was exceptionally kind this round.

Kousimos’s troops will reach Cecil’s specified position just at the end of the turn, also when the northern and eastern gates open. He will be in position to enter the city next turn. He and Bart will gain knowledge of this happening, but Andronikos and Nikitas may not because the only troops in position to see this are on the walls on the opposite side of the city. Decided to roll. 4-6, they find out. 1-3, they don’t. Rolled a two.

I PM’d TC what to do:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Hi TC,

There's a few engagements to fight out this turn. Andronikos and Nikitas are going for the walls.

In the west, Andronikos is deploying all of his ladders and towers (but not his ram) to the walls, where Bart's four regiments of militia are climbing up to the walls to meet him. The battle spots are marked on the map below. The towers will be firing for most of the time.

For the western assault, I've noted that there are backups for every siege engine. I imagine you'll have to send them up as well, because I doubt the first wave will be successful (aside from the northernmost engagement). Once Andronikos's men inevitably kill all of the wall defenders they will be allowed to gain control of the gatehouse, but will not be able to move down into the city.

For the south, it's pretty much the same thing, but a bit more complicated. In addition to the battle for the walls, Bart has also ordered a sally/charge by his two generals against the enemy ram. Woad's provided orders for Nikitas (Ituralde's been busy) mentions nothing about a reaction, so I would leave the troops carrying the other siege engines out of this one. He didn't say anything for Nikitas, but I imagine that Nikitas, sensing a threat to the ram, would charge anyway, with or without orders. Your call if you want to get the missiles involved.

Rowan's orders were to first flank the ram troops, then go after Nikitas if he moves to intervene. After these two fights, depending on how much time passes he wants his generals to go after the archers. I don't think the fights against the ram troops and Nikitas will last that shortly, however, so the archers will most likely live to fight another day.

In terms of gatehouse mechanics for the south gate, Rowan's moved his infantry and Great Cross down from the town center to right behind the south gate. Not sure if that affects control of the gate or not since Nikitas's men will probably hold the gatehouse proper.

Let me know if you have any questions.

GH

Map:

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...ileis/2_01.jpg

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TinCow’s response:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Ok, done. :sweatdrop:

I'll spare you the intimate details. In summary, I ended up simulating it in three separate battles. The west wall assault, the south wall assault, and the south sally. The setups were pretty standard, except that in order to simulate the double size Basileus bodyguard, I used two identical general's bodyguard units in the battle, since that's about the same thing.

West Wall Assault:

The town militia do a surprisingly good job of defending the walls in all scenarios, probably due to the lack of swords for the attacking units. Spears just aren't good at storming defended walls. All three units up the ladders/rams in the first wave are destroyed for the loss of less than 1 full defending town militia unit. However, the gate is broken down about the same time as the first wave is routed, and the gate is undefended. It's sensible to assume that at least some of the nearby second wave units would thus use the gate instead of going up the defended walls. Thus, infantry use the gate and then go up the towers to flank the wall defenders while they remain engaged with the remnants from the first wave and the second wave attackers who do choose the wall. This results in a quick destruction of all defenders. Flanking is king on walls.

End result: All defending units are destroyed. For the attackers, all first wave units are destroyed, plus the equivalent of 1 more town militia unit in the subsequent fighting. Gatehouse and all of the western wall is captured.

South Wall Assault:

The unit that unloads into the defending peasants actually takes decent losses, proving yet again that defended walls are a significant obstacle to overcome. However, the unopposed ladders are a huge move. Since they are ladders, they get up the walls quickly and can flank on the walls quickly. It doesn't take long to reach the fight on the walls, and the remaining peasants are quickly destroyed. With that part of the wall secure, it makes sense to move on to the next bit, and those peasants are also destroyed relatively easily, since their defensive wall bonus is lost.

End result: Tower town militia unit is destroyed, along with the two westernmost peasant units on the wall. Time in this phase runs out before the third unit can be engaged. Thus, end position is two attacking town militia on the wall to the west of the gatehouse and one defending peasant on the wall to the east of the gatehouse. Gatehouse is not captured.

South Wall Sally:

This is the one bright spot for the defenders of Antioch. Despite it only being a sally by two units, they are very beefy units. One is a double sized bodyguard, and the other has triple gold chevrons. Given the proximity of the horse archers and Nikitas to the ram unit, I assumed they would get involved when they saw what was happening. Not only is it wise to defend their best infantry unit, but they have an opportunity to kill an enemy Basileus right there.

However, the sheer power of the sallying bodyguards is immense. A third of the ram unit evaporates in the charge, and the rest is quickly cut down with little loss. The horse archers get off a couple volleys during the charge (well within range) then they too charge into melee into the rear of the engaged bodyguards, as does Nikitas. However, the size of the Basileus' unit and the experience of the other general's unit are decisive, and the battle is clearly theirs.

As I see it, Nikitas and the horse archers are very mobile and near friendly units. The infantry unit cannot escape, but they can. After a few minutes of melee with the sallying bodyguards, they realize their situation and get the hell out of there. I would say they move west to take some shelter behind the ranged missile power of the archers.

End result: Ram infantry unit is destroyed. Nikitas' bodyguards and the nearby horsearcher units are both reduced to half strength. For the sallying bodyguards, the doublesized Basileus unit is reduced to half strength, but the triple gold unit remains intact.


Does that all make sense?

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As there was one discrepancy, I sent this follow-up:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Based on what you've seen, how do you think the western wall battle would have gone were the gate not broken (since Andronikos didn't actually order his ram forward)?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Very bloody. The problem is that the only real advantage to the towers is the initial rush of ~20 guys. After that, it's just a single trickle of men. As such, with the exception of the initial assaulting unit, if you're going to assault into a defended position, ladders are actually better since at least then you're putting ~4 guys on the wall at the same time instead of just 1.

What probably would have happened is that the ladder assault would eventually have routed the defender at that spot on the wall, and then with that avenue open the rest would have poured up onto the wall and destroyed the defenders with flanking. It probably would have cost the entire second wave of the assault though. In any case, that would have taken so long that it wouldn't have fit into the time frame for this round. We would have to figure out some point in the midst of all the melee to halt it for new orders.

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After this exchange, I decided the time would end on the western part of the battle with the second wave of Andronikos’s troops just about to hit.

Public feedback for Turn 1:

Antioch:

Several horns sound to the south and west of the city. Andronikos and Nikitas are going in. They've brought several siege engines with them, and enough men to use them as well. The Tagarian troops, having raced up to hold the walls, the best of them being mere town militia and the worst of them being pure peasants, look somewhat frightened as the veterans - lower-end soldiers, but veterans nonetheless - of Andronikos's many campaigns begin heading straight for them.

Luckily, they have support from several of the city's towers, While it is not enough to destroy any of the engines, it does drop a decent amount of Andronikan soldiers. Off to the west, Andronikos looks on, cringing as he sees every man go down. All of these battles, all of this bleeding, is starting to take a real toll on his numbers. These damn Tagarians sure knew how to pick their defensive positions.

As the towers stopped wheeling and reached their targets, there is a moment of brief silence, broken only in the north by Kousimos Sophianos's marching, as well as some shifting going on in the city itself. Then, the usual sounds of battle began anew as Andronikos's and Nikitas's men started up the ladders and the towers. Interestingly enough, their rams did not move. Perhaps Andronikos was confident that they would not be needed.

He never gets the chance to find out if this is the case in the south. Right as the majority of Nikitas's infantry is committed to the walls, the gates burst open and 60-odd heavily-armed horsemen come charging out. Ioannis Tagaris and Vartholomaios Ksiros, having been chased around for the majority of the campaign, are finally on the offensive. They are making up for lost time with a fury, first wheeling to the east and then slamming into the ram troops on the flank. Completely shocked at this turn of events, Nikitas hesitates for a moment. This was not expected in the least. He has to make a judgment call.

Nikitas thinks for a second. These are the enemy generals, one of them being the rival Basileus. They are strong, yes. They have momentum, yes. But they're attacking his best regiment of infantry remaining - infantry, being oh-so-valuable anyway in this age of Byzantine bankruptcy, but doubly so in a siege assault - and are threatening his entire army. This cannot be allowed to happen. Nikitas orders a cavalry charge, roping in the horse archers along with him.

The charge is moderately unsuccessful. The infantry cannot be saved, and Nikitas realizes that Ioannis and Bart simply have too many horsemen, as he realizes that half of his own riders have fallen. Grimacing, he orders a withdraw, having only accomplished halving Ioannis's bodyguard at the cost of his Dismounted Lancers and half his cavalry.

On the walls, things aren't much better for Andronikos. Buoyed by their defenses, the Tagarians held on, obliterating Andronikos's first wave to the west. Andronikos's second wave is already on their way up and will hit within a minute. To the south, Nikitas's lucky infantry that survived the cavalry charge flanked and destroyed most of the peasants holding the walls. They will now slug it out with the one remaining regiment of peasants. Neither gatehouse has been captured.

The two armies seem to be bleeding themselves out, both of them apparently unconcerned about Kousimos Sophianos's force, appearing more imposing every minute, now close enough to the unmanned northern gate where one of the regiments can knock on the door.

Map:

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/..._01_public.jpg

DEADLINE FOR TURN 2 ORDERS: April 25th, 12:00 GMT-5.

Turn 1 feedback:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Kousimos

Ordering your positions abandoned, you first send your messenger off into Antioch, hoping that first, he gets there, and that second, he is received by Vartholomaios Ksiros as opposed to Ioannis Tagaris. Once this is done, you take your entire army and have them march within range of the northern gate, pacing yourselves so as to not get there and linger too early.

You are so focused on the pace and the flags from inside the city (although they're difficult to see now; the commanding flags appear to have moved beyond the southern wall), that you don't notice a welcome sight until the end of your march: The northern gate of Antioch is open.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Andronikos and Nikitas

Eugh... this isn't your finest hour. Ordering your troops onto the walls without ram support probably wasn't the best idea. You don't doubt you'll win, but the Tagarian troops made mincemeat of the first wave to the west, and while holding the clear advantage to the south, you haven't finished the task and gained control of the gatehouse yet.

In addition, Ioannis and Bart caught Nikitas napping and their unexpected sally has caused further complications. You whittled down Ioannis's numbers, but at far too great of a cost. In addition, you have pretty much zero infantry that can face him down now, should the Tagarian cavalry decide to press with the sally.

Your second wave it about to hit to the west. It's your call about whether you want to support it with your ram or not, or even if you want the third wave to follow them up in support. In addition, Nikitas's troops on the southern wall await orders. With some additional Tagarian infantry looming near the southern gate, things could get pretty dicey there as well.

It's been a well-executed campaign, but you start to wonder if it was just too many battles, too many wasted men. You may very well take Antioch, but at what price? The lurking army of Kousimos Sophianos to the north may very well answer that question before the end of the day.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Bart

You send your messenger off to Kousimos, hoping that he'll do as you ask. You don't wait for confirmation on whether or not the gates have opened, however, as you have a bigger problem to worry about. Calling your and Ioannis's horsement together, you order a charge out of the south of the city, hoping to alleviate some of Nikitas's pressure.

The sally, for the most part, works. The ram troops are totally annihilated. Nikitas's personal bodyguard as well as his horse archers lost half of their strength as well in the fighting before they break off and fall back. Ioannis no longer has a super-sized escort, but all in all the numbers definitely went in your favor. It's your call about whether you want to press the attack or not.

Stealing a quick glance at the walls, your men could be doing worse. They're holding Andronikos's personal infantry pretty well to the west, and while this isn't as much the case on the southern walls, you have a couple of options on what to do there. However, a new rider quickly draws your attention away from the infantry duel. He is bearing a white flag and brings a message from Kousimos Sophianos:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Grandmaster,

At last, we meet as allies on the field of battle! First things first: I've sent a banner with this messenger, displaying my personal arms. I will display mine for all to see, and I want you to do the same with yours. This should reduce the likelyhood of friendly fire between our forces, and perhaps also send panic through Andronikos' men! Second, I want my men to enter the city and help you repell the enemy from the walls. My army shall march beyond the range of your towers until we see the flag raised, once that is done we shall enter through the north gate and move to repell the attack. Finally, I ask that you send me a message back to indicate that you've received this.

Sincerely,
Constantine

The Banner:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img165.imageshack.us/img165/3121/myarms.png

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You can only hope that your order to open the gates went through.

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Orders:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Seeing the gates have been opened for him, Constatine pauses to address his army again.

"You see, men? The Grandmaster has opened the doors for us! Do not embarass yourselves and myself by betraying their kindness! Remember that they expect to be saved in return, and we will not dissapoint!

"Archers, spearmen! Your two divisions will continue moving counter-clockwise around the city. The archers shall move into a staggered, spread out formation with the spearmen spaced at equal intervals behind them. Do not fire onto the top of the walls, fire only at the Komnenoi forces who are climbing ladders, waiting inside towers, or who have their feet firmly planted on the ground. I will remind you that those who harm the city's defenders will be punished! Spearmen, stay behind the archers and wait. Do not be goaded out if you should come under fire. Move only if the archers come under threat of melee. Finally, both divisions must keep in formation at all times! Move and wheel as you must in order to get out of the way if the towers fire upon, but otherwise get as close as possible to Andronikos! I shall accompany to help coordinate these important movements.

"The rest of the infantry shall move into the city itself. Again, do not harm the defenders! Take your time moving towards the west gate, making sure you do not appear to linger upon your arrival, and position yourself to block the enemy from descending from the walls if they should overcome the defenders. If you should see men with Komnenoi colors exit the walls and approach you, advance quickly and kill them where they stand! Later in the day I shall order you to surge forth from the gate and attack Andronikos at the same time as myself and spearmen! In this manner we shall flank and slay Andronikos!"

Finally, Constantine turns to his personal retinue.

"Men, raise my standard!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img165.imageshack.us/img165/3121/myarms.png

"And send another messanger to the Grandmaster with the enclosed message and another banner. Have him enter the north gate with the infantry and then head south to the Grandmaster."

Quote:

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Grandmaster,
I do not know if my previous message got through to you, so I shall simply keep sending them until I am certain one has gotten through. I'm positioning my men inside and outside the city to flank Andronikos. In order to avoid death at my hands he must flee, possibly towards your position. I will end the threat to the west gate regardless, and then move to reinforce you. Also, I need you to raise this banner I have enclosed. I will have already done the same by the time you read this, and once you do so as well our forces should know not to attack each other.

Good hunting,
Constantine

The Banner:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img165.imageshack.us/img165/3121/myarms.png

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OOC: As has been mentioned in the orders, the position and orientation of the archers + spearmen has not been specified exactly but has only been approximated. Constantine will personally coordinate their movements to help get them as close as possible while maximizing their field of fire and keeping them save from arrow fire from the towers, should the towers start firing.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img257.imageshack.us/img257/9908/antioch.jpg

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by woad&fangs

Cyrus and Manuel, keep assaulting with the ladders and towers. Callistus, follow me. The dust rising from north clearly indicates that Sophianos is marching towards us. We will ride to the north-west corner of the city and then charge into the front of his army when it turns the corner. With any luck, it will still be in marching formation, with him at its head. Focus on killing, Sophianos. We will fight until he is dead and then withdraw back to near our archers.

Skeleton Orders for Nikitas: Stop Tagaris from re-entering the city. Have the archers fire at him. Intercept him with the missile cavalry if he tries to flee back to the city. Capture the south gate with the militia and close it on Tagaris.
```````````

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img18.imageshack.us/img18/6397/antioch2.jpg

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ituralde

Orders:

The Infantry has to push forward to gain the gatehouse.
The Archers shall hit the sallying forces with one or two volleys of arrows to soften them up while Nikitas takes his bodyguard and the cavalry to engage the men and hopefully drive them back to the gate.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rowan

Bart sends Kousinos' messenger back with a message that he will do as requested and has already ordered the gates opened. Also, help is mostly needed on the west gate.
Another messenger is sent to the north gate, again with orders to open the gate to Kousinos' troops and fly the banner included from it's towers.

Orders to the Division 4 (Reserve): Engage the enemy! Up to the walls! Keep the gatehouses at all costs or your general will be shut outside! Take courage in the sight of the Great Cross! The enemy are tired from their climb up the walls and fight atop. Crush them!

Orders to what's left of Division 2: Secure the gate! Keep the gatehouse at all costs! Protect your families inside the city!

Orders to the troops at western gate (Division 3): Keep up the fight! Do not let the enemy gain a foothold on the walls. All units engage the enemy! Protect your families inside the city! This is what you have trained for and you are doing well! Kousinos' banner is also sent to them and they are to fly it.

Bodyguards! We have disrupted the enemy! Moschos the Pig runs, let's finish him, FORWARD WITH ME! CHAAARRRGE! (A general charge against the foot archers and Nikitas, with Nikitas being the prime target if he stays to fight. If he runs focus on the foot archers and then return to the city by south gate. Same rules regarding the horse archers as last turn: i.e. ignore them if they stay out of melee and do NOT pursue them).

-Rowan

Ps.
I'll be out of town until Sunday evening and probably won't be able to check things until then, so no hurry in resolving the battle until then ;)

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Umpire notes for Turn 1:

There were two messages sent this turn: Kousimos’s second message and Bart’s implied reply. With the southern gatehouse still in Tagarian hands, the path between commanders was clear, thus allowing for the possibility of delivery.

Roll for Kousimos’s message: 2 (message lost)
Roll for Bart’s implied reply: 2 (message lost)
Roll for Bart’s putting the flag above the northern gate: 2 (passed)

Units failing orders test: None.

I had a few separate conflicts to resolve this turn:

The battle on the southern walls.
The battle on the western walls.
Bart and Ioannis’s continued sally.
Andronikos’s charge against Kousimos.

Southern wall battle: Nikitas’s militiamen and Bart’s peasants charged each other, meeting at the gatehouse. The peasants took a beating but were soon relieved by archer fire and Bart’s spearmen pouring up the walls. The southern walls were secure but at the cost of half the peasants and half of another spearmen unit.

Western wall battle: As TinCow determined in the previous turn, the lack of ram usage proved costly, and Andronikos lost his entire second wave in the assault. Eventually the third wave defeated the exhausted defenders with little loss.

Sally battle Mark 2: The arrow volleys that Nikitas ordered on the generals did very little. All four cavalry units charged each other. The ideal pairing for the Tagarians would be that Bart, having the three gold chevrons, would have Nikitas and that the weaker Ioannis unit would get the horse archers. Since there was a double charge, the one archer unit in between Nikitas and Bart was not a factor.

Eventually, the dream scenario for the Tagarians won out and the powerful Bart unit got paired with the bloodied Nikitas unit. After simulating both sides (in order to properly account for the half-size Komnenian units, I simply doubled the Tagarians’ unit count), the results were clear, although it took some time: the Tagarians won out, although Nikitas’s fate was unclear. Decided to roll – 1-3 he dies, 4-6 he is captured. Rolled a five. After the battle, if the Tagarian forces are victorious, they will exercise total control over Nikitas Moschos. If the Komnenians win out, he will be returned to command without any consequences. For now, though, he is out of the battle.

Ioannis also eliminated the horse archers without much loss. Nikitas’s remaining units (his archers) will now be under the command of woad&fangs, as he has a free division to spare and has already exercised minor control over them.

Andronikos’s charge to the northwest: An important part of this simulation mechanic was at what point the enemy would come into view. Unfortunately for Kousimos, from his point of view the charge would look like an “oh, *#%!” moment as he was at the vanguard of the flanking maneuver, very near the corner when the Komnenian cavalry came into view, and his foot troops were not yet in battle formation. Therefore, Andronikos’s (superior) horsemen had a decent amount of time to ravage Kousimos’s bodyguard before the spearmen had time to respond and get into the action. Another factor that harmed Kousimos was the AI’s tendency to have the cavalry walk faster than the infantry, drawing an already-in-the-lead Kousimos even farther out.

Andronikos’s HAs hit first, which probably wasn’t the best strategy for the charge but that’s the way it happened. A little later the bodyguard hit and that’s where the real damage was done. Kousimos’s bodyguard got savaged. Interestingly enough, in my two-sided simulation Kousimos died when I was simulating his side of the battle and survived when I was Andronikos. Decided to roll for his fate: 1-2 dies, 3-4 captured, 5-6 survives. Rolled a five. Kousimos will be without a bodyguard for the rest of the battle. The spears then (finally) tightened up and closed in, dropping a few Komnenian horsemen before they withdrew.

Public feedback for Turn 2:

Antioch:

After last turn's disastrous events for the Komnenians, this latest phase of the battle has seen a mixed bag for them. All sides, starting to see the desperation of the situation, have started to seize the initiative, and for the most part they have been rewarded for it. The generals, if they have not yet lost their nerve after the most recent events, now have Antioch open as an option to them as parts of all three armies have cracked the city in one form or another.

To the south, Ioannis Tagaris's and Vartholomaios Ksiros's sally continues, as do the good results arising from it. While this time he was ready, Nikitas Moschos's efforts to counter it achieved little, mostly due to the quality of forces available to him. His archers, ordered to fire at the Tagarian bodyguard, accomplished almost nothing. Quickly seeing this, Nikitas ordered his depleted cavalry to countercharge the enemy horsemen, which were charging at him. Unfortunately for him, he found himself battling the incredibly experienced soldiers of Vartholomaios Ksiros as opposed to the bloodied and less-scary forces of Ioannis Tagaris, which were busy taking down his remaining horse archers.

While Nikitas fought hard, there was just no way that he could overcome Bart's superior quality and numbers. He distinctly remembered the feeling of being dehorsed, and then the painful blow of hitting the ground head-first. Barely conscious, Nikitas caught a glimpse of the victorious Tagarian horsemen finishing off the last of his cavalry before passing out from heat exhaustion.

While Nikitas did not shift his gaze over to the walls to see how they went before he lost consciousness, it was probably for the best as the last of his infantry is gone. Both regiments charged the Tagarian peasants still manning the wall, and while they were making good work of them, there was no flank involved and thus the hammer blow would not come. However, the Tagarian troops directly below, seeing what was going on, decided to intervene. Quickly, Nikitas's militia found themselves facing not only peasants, but archer fire as well as legitimate spearmen throwing themselves into the fight for the south gatehouse. Eventually, they evaporated, although their effects will definitely be felt by the spearmen and peasants.

All that remains of the forces that Nikitas Moschos took into the battle are his three archers, which face a heavily-manned southern gatehouse and two strong bodyguard units that while bloodied, are thirsty for more.

The battle for the western walls is over as well, although this time the decision is in Andronikos's favor. His hesitation to use the ram he constructed probably cost him dearly, as there was no hope for Komnenian infantry to take the streets and storm up the walls from the back way. Andronikos, after bloodily dealing with the exhausted Tagarian militia that guarded the walls, now has three regiments of infantry remaining - one of which is still manning the ram. He now has control of the western gatehouse, rendering the ram's purpose moot.

However, Andronikos himself spent little of his time observing the battle for the walls, as he was elsewhere. Taking a leaf from the Tagarian sally that ravaged Nikitas's men, Andronikos took his horse archers and promptly galloped to the north, rounding the corner of Antioch. This move caught Kousimos Sophianos completely by surprise, as he was far in front of a a small column clearly designed to flank and intercept Andronikos from outside the city.

Grinning furiously at this gamble that had clearly paid off, Andronikos took a great pleasure in hacking down Kousimos's men. He tried for Kousimos himself, clearly the effort of the charge, but the general was wily and strong and unable to be struck down. Eventually, his spearmen entered battle formation and charged past the archers, arriving at the fray. Recognizing danger when he saw it, Andronikos broke off the combat and withdrew. To the east, much to his dismay, he can see an unprotected Kousimos, clearly shaken, but still alive nonetheless.

Taking a look around, he wonders where the rest of Kousimos's men are, since only a small amount was a part of the flanking column. Then, he sees it - a strange flag has gone up on the northern gatehouse. It is the same standard that is currently raised above Kousimos's own position. To the south, on the western wall, his remaining infantry are gesturing frantically. They are making motions that indicate heavy reinforcements currently approaching their current position.

Andronikos puts two and two together and realizes that Kousimos Sophianos has somehow gained access to Antioch. Out of the three sides, all are vulnerable right now - Andronikos and the Tagarians because of the loss of the men, and Kousimos because of the loss of his bodyguard. Antioch is still anyone's game.

Map:

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...ileis/2_02.jpg

DEADLINE FOR TURN 3 ORDERS: April 28th, 12:00 GMT-5.

Turn 2 feedback:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Kousimos

Raising your standard, you split your forces - most will enter the city and head for the western gatehouse, the rest will hit Andronikos from the north, outside the city. While you hear nothing from the Tagarians, you are heartened to see your standard be raised from the northern gatehouse.

Eventually though, you have bigger problems to worry about. While having your spearmen and archers in marching formation, with you at the vanguard, you have very little time to react as the bodyguard of Andronikos Komnenos and his horse archers round the city's northwestern corner and charge straight for you. You know it's going to be a bit before your spearmen can tighten up and assist, so you just brace yourself and hope for the best.

You survive, but it is very bloody. As your spearmen relieve you, you make your way behind your archers. You are the only horsemen to do so. Andronikos's charge, obviously aimed at killing you, has failed, but you are now incredibly vulnerable. A charge that gets around your spearmen, a stray arrow... a lot can bring down a man.

You hear word that the rest of the men have entered the city and are in position to contest the western walls, which Andronikos's men now hold. Complicating things is the fact that they hold the western gatehouse, which means you're bound to lose some men to tower fire. On the plus side, there's no Tagarian force anywhere near your men, which means there will be little if any confusion.

You now outnumber the combined forces of Andronikos Komnenos and Vartholomaios Tagaris. However, you are still vulnerable. Tread carefully.

(OOC: losses this turn: entire bodyguard unit minus Kousmos.)

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Nikitas

Ordering a concentration of fire on the Tagarian cavalry accomplishes little. You quickly realize that if you are to deal with them, you must do so personally. Unfortunately for you, you lack both quantity and quality of melee troops to do so. Desperately charging Vartholomaios Ksiros's bodyguard, you pray for a miracle.

Unfortunately, you don't get one. Bart's horsemen whittle down your men one by one, until you are the last man standing. The inevitable blow comes, and you are dehorsed. However, the wound isn't bad. You're still conscious, which is a plus, and you can still see what's going on around you.

You try to get up, looking for Bart, trying to cut his horse out from under him, but the desert heat works its deadly magic on you and you soon lose consciousness. You're not sure when - or where - you'll wake up. You can only hope that Andronikos has enough skill to carry the day without you.

(OOC: You have been "captured" by the enemy troops. Your future situation now depends on who is victorious. Should the Tagarians win, you will be a prisoner of Vartholomaios Ksiros. Should Andronikos win, it will be as if nothing happened and you will still retain command. Should Kousimos Sophianos win, your status will depend on how the enemy flees.)

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Andronikos

You and your horse archers immediately charge to the north, abandoning personal viewing of the battle for the walls. This is probably for the best, as your later indicates that it was a bloody, perhaps Pyrrhic victory.

Your effort to charge and kill Kousimos Sophianos is a mixed bag. On one hand, you catch him completely by surprise and eliminate his entire bodyguard at a relatively small cost - half your horse archers. On the other hand, Kousimos still lives, having retreated behind his spearmen and archers. Further efforts to take him down will be difficult, as a wall of spearmen currently lies in between you and him.

Further developments to the battle are... interesting, to say the least. Kousimos Sophianos's standard flies over the northern gatehouse, and your men on the walls are strongly indicating that they face a lot of troops and will re-enter battle soon. Evidently, the general has gained access to the city, unfortunately for you.

Another problem is your utter failure in the south. The Tagarian generals pressed their sally, capturing Nikitas Moschos. In addition, their reserve infantry scaled the walls, turning the tide in the battle for the southern gatehouse. The south is now all but sealed off to you, as all you have there are three regiments of archers that face Tagarian heavy cavalry and are answerable to you.

You have two regiments of infantry (one spear, one militia) holding the western wall. The western gatehouse is now yours. Outside the city, you still command your archers and one regiment of militia attached to the ram. However, this is pretty much it. It will require all of your skill and cunning to turn this mess into a victory.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Bart

You quickly steal a glance to the north, seeing Kousimos Sophianos's standard being raised over the gatehouse, as ordered. Excellent - his men are probably streaming into the city at this very moment.

You order the sally be pressed - and you are successful at it too, unhorsing Nikitas Moschos and annihilating his cavalry. Nikitas will now be your prisoner unless Andronikos can somehow turn the tide or if Kousimos stabs you in the back. All that remains to be dealt with in the south are three regiments of archers.

In the city, your reinforcements, buoyed by the Great Cross, stormed the walls and eliminated Nikitas's infantry. To the west, your militia were finally overcome, but not before they destroyed another wave of Komnenian infantry. With Kousimos poised to take over the bulk of the fighting, your work is almost done here. You had better hope he holds true to his promise, however.

(OOC: Units remaining to you: All southern archers, 1 1/2 regiments of spears. 1/2 a regiment of peasants. The Great Cross. 1/2 of Ioannis's bodyguard (i.e. it's now at normal strength). 1/2 of your bodyguard.)

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Orders:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Heavy Infantry Division - Advance onto the walls via towers W3 and W2 quickly, preventing them from firing. You will attack Andronikos' militia from both sides and destroy them. Finally, you will descend from the walls and onto the field outside via the siege tower between towers W3 and W4.

African Division - Advance onto the walls via towers W6 and W7 quickly, preventing them from firing. You will attack Andronikos' militia from both sides and destroy them. Finally, you will descend from the wall and onto the field outside via the siege tower between towers W6 and W7. If you can engage Andronikos' cavalry in melee, do so.

Miltia Division - March through the west gate and slay the archers and miltia outside, then form up facing Andronikos if he has not already engaged you. If he decides to charge you, fight to the last man. If you can attack him, do so.

Now then. Archers, Spearmen! We shall remain in our current formation and wheel around to face Andronikos and his cavalry archers. Archers, target Andronikos as long as he is not engaged in melee, otherwise target his cavalry archers. If the are both engaged in melee target neither. Spearmen, prevent Andronikos' cavalry from flanking us while the archers fire. If he tries to go around our left, have our left half of spearmen move to block him while I place myself so that our the right half of the spearmen can protect me. If he goes right, vice-versa. If he himself goes one way and the cavalry archers go the other, have both halves advance to block their respective opponents. If both units of enemy cavalry become engaged in melee, rush to attack them. If not, keep in formation to block whatever enemy cavalry the archers can target.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img147.imageshack.us/img147/9908/antioch.jpg

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by woad&fangs

Callistus, fire upon Sophianos. Ammonathas, fire along side Callistus. Manuel and Cyrus, abandon the walls. I will run around Sophianos' lines and attempt to engage him again.

skeleton orders: Keep firing at Tagaris
``````````

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img524.imageshack.us/img524/1378/202u.jpg

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rowan

Message to troops at the southern gate:
Reorganize divisions with all remaining melee troops (spear militia x2, peasants) forming new Division 3.
Archers form new Division 4.
Great Cross still forms Division 5 by itself.

(Ioannis Tagaris' bodyguard will form new Division 2,
while Bart's bodyguard stay as Division 1. (This part not included in the message but I'm including it here for clarity's sake.))

Message continues:
All troops assume defensive positions on the inside of the southern gate, guarding against attacks from all sides! Also, all troops fly the banner enclosed (Kousinos' banner), as well as flying the banner from the top of southern gate.

Another messenger with a truce flag will be sent to the remaining archer units to negotiate their surrender. Any men or units willing to surrender will be allowed to do so.

Those units that do not surrender will be charged by Divisions 1 and 2 (the bodyguards) in a pincer movement. Loose formation.

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Umpire notes for Turn 3:

As they are still under his command, Bart didn’t need a message to send to his troops – it just fell under standard orders. However, since he was doing some rearrangements, I implemented the standard “roll for every regiment” orders test to see if they all passed. I didn’t bother doing a test for Bart’s message to the archers as they went to an enemy unit.

Units failing orders test this turn: Bart’s archers (they passed the reorganization test, though), Andronikos’s militia.

I simmed most of the engagements this time around, although I did delegate the northwestern battle to TinCow.

Western wall battle: Andronikos’s militia unit on the walls got a bad roll and were caught by Kousinos’s swarming infantry. As ordered, the troops continued down the towers (the Africans unopposed as the non-militia spear unit obeyed orders) but time expired before they could influence the western sally.

Western sally: The time period for this battle was shorter as some time was elapsed getting the gatehouse under Kousnos’s control. Once this happened, the three regiments of militia plus the towers had little trouble eliminating Andronikos’s one militia regiment. They then turned on the spear regiment that had just abandoned the walls and also eliminated them. Removed one unit of Kousinos’s militia due to attrition. Andronikos’s foot archers were not present as woad had tapped them to fire upon Kousinos, which I interpreted as the personal bodyguard. They will be in position to do so the following turn.

Southern sally: This one was a bit difficult as Rowan sent a message for peace but woad clearly wanted Bart and Ioannis down. I decided to make the peace offer null and void after the first few volleys, as so often happens in the chaos of war. Rowan’s orders (loose formation, pincer the archers one by one) saved casualties but still lost a lot of guys. Removed the archers and the rest of Ioannis’s bodyguard (Ioannis never died in any of the simulations, but the average BG losses equated to about a unit’s worth. Now it’s just Ioannis left plus Bart and his 12 horsemen).

Due to time constraints, TinCow was in charge of the northwestern battle. This one also proved difficult:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Don't worry, there's only one this time. I took care of the rest, but a Stat exam is looming and I'd like to get *some* studying in.

The northwestern battle is remaining interesting, mainly because of the fact that Cecil hasn't put his character completely out of danger. woad has ordered his horse archers to fire on the Kousinos unit, and frankly, I think he's a goner, as Cecil's main moves for the character were to protect him from a melee charge. I need you to simulate the archer fire on the general unit and let me know how many drop. The general unit will be running around a bit as well. I'll allow for some leeway considering there's only one man left and he is a general, but if he takes a Boromir-esque amount of arrows...

In addition, Andronikos (and only the bodyguard) is trying to wheel around and get in his own licks at Kousinos. However, Cecil has given pretty detailed orders telling his spearmen to respond as necessary (half the line moves to block, depending on what direction Andronikos takes, and Kousimos moves for shelter with the other half), and Andronikos's bodyguard will be undergoing fire from all of Kousinos's foot archers while this is going on.

Please let me know if Andronikos is able to maneuver around the spearmen to kill Kousinos and how many of his guys fall in the process. You may want to do this simulation second, for if you determine that Kousinos falls early, then naturally Andronikos will break off the pursuit.

GH

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by TinCow

This is very difficult to figure out. First, I can't simulate a single character, so the best I can do is have the horse archers fire at a full bodyguard unit. When I did so, it took 4 volleys before the first bodyguard dropped. Shooting at a bodyguard that was facing into the arrows, the entire horse archer unit ran out of arrows before all the bodyguards dropped. There were 6 left (out of 22) when the ammo ran out.

Since Cecil is behind a massive wall of troops, including 5 units of archers, it makes sense that the archers would in turn be firing on the horse archers while this is going on. So, I did that simulation (firing at a general's bodyguard behind that line of archers). The horse archers got off about 5-6 volleys before they lost 30 men (which would be the end of the unit in the battle).

The question then becomes whether the horse archers were able to kill Cecil. I checked in-game, and his traits include Fine Armour (+4 hps) and Shieldbearer (+2 hps). So (1) it took 4 volleys for the horse archers to kill just 1 bodyguard, (2) the horse archers only get 5 to 6 volleys max before they are wiped out, and (3) Cecil can take a lot more hits than a normal bodyguard, my conclusion is that he survives the horse archer attack. The only way this doesn't happen is if Cecil's line of foot archers don't return fire. If they don't, then the horse archers can fire until they run out of ammo, and Cecil certainly dies.

So, assuming Cecil lives, the timing on Andronikos works out just fine. I did this in the same simulation with the horse archers attacking with the line of foot archers present (the spears were also in that simulation). In that simulation, Andronikos was able to circumvent the entire line without melee contact and reach Cecil in almost the exact same time it took for the foot archers to wipe out the horse archers. This is with all foot archers firing at the horse archers, so none are shooting at Andronikos. Since Andronikos is easily able to get around the spears without making melee contact if he wants, then Andronikos essentially arrives in the rear unmolested. Since he has a bodyguard of 33 triple silver chevron men, Cecil is definitely toast. The only way this doesn't happen is if the foot archers shift all their fire to Andronikos, but that leaves the horse archers to fire at will the entire time, which as noted above is also Cecil's death.

If Cecil is able to take shelter inside his spearmen (as is apparently his orders), Andronikos is going to take massive casualties in getting to him. However, he again has 33 triple silver guys, and that's a huge number against poor to medium quality spearmen. I can't see any way that Cecil wouldn't be reached in melee by at least a few of Andronikos men. I'll let you draw the conclusions from that.

Regardless of whether Andronikos kills Cecil, Andronikos is also dead. If he has to cut through the spearmen, he's going to take massive losses and never get out again. If he is able to catch Cecil in the open, all 5 foot archer units can open up on him, which is pretty much guaranteed death.

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Further communication:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

So, if I read your resolution right, the most likely scenario goes out as follows:

1) HAs go for Cecil, the foot archers try for counterbattery rather than seek to eliminate Andronikos.
2) HAs eventually die.
3) An untargeted Andronikos circles around the spearmen and charges Cecil.
4) ...profit!
4) Andronikos dies. Spearmen get ravaged. Cecil's fate uncertain.

Does this sound right to you?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Yes. I didn't try simulating Cecil's fate with the spearmen protecting him, but it essentially boils down to whether the spearmen are effectively able to keep Andronikos completely away from Cecil, based on the orders you received. Since Cecil has taken several volleys of arrow fire solo, he's about used even his own excessive hps. If more than 1 or 2 of Andronikos' bodyguards can cut their way through to Cecil and engage him in melee for a short period, Cecil is dead. If Cecil can manage to keep away from Andronikos, then he should live.

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After this, I went in and did a follow-up simulation myself, first controlling a BG and then changing the formation to make it essentially a single-file line, with the lead guy in with the spearmen. A full charge by Andronikos killed the lead guy when I made him do nothing. However, doing a second simulation, I simply moved him out of the way and he lived. Decided to go with the results of the second simulation for realism purposes. I also decided that Andronikos, quickly seeing the folly of this, would break off the charge before he died. Removed half a unit of spearmen due to taking the brunt of a heavy charge.

So, overall results: HAs dead, both Kousinos and Andronikos live. Andronikos’s BG is down to 12, and Kousinos is out of lifelines, so to speak. If he doesn’t get out of the way of Andronikos’s foot archers next turn, he’s a dead duck.

Public feedback for Turn 3:

Antioch:

Offensives and counter-offensives continue to rule the day at Antioch, where, despite the increasing load of corpses that litter the battlefield, the remaining soldiers are no less daring than they were at the start of the day.

To the south, the sally made by the two Tagarian generals has gone remarkably well, removing all of Nikitas Moschos's army from the battlefield save his archers. Sensing the end of combat to the south, Vartholomaios Ksiros, in command of the Tagarian forces, could be seen writing up and dispatching an envoy to the archers, probably in hopes of getting them to surrender, but the envoy's purpose was soon lost as the archers, now taking orders from Andronikos Komnenos, opened up and started firing on Ioannis Tagaris.

Plan B for the Tagarians was evidently one less peaceful. The two bodyguards moved to loose formation in an effort to minimize arrow casualties and then split further, taking down each regiment one-by-one in a series of pincer movements. When the dust cleared, the last of Nikitas's troops was wiped from the battlefield, leaving only Ioannis, Bart, and twelve bodyguards.

Also wrapping up this turn was the long-running conflict in the western part of the battlefield. Andronikos, sensing his men had reached their high-water mark on the walls, recalled them, but only the non-militia troops obeyed. They were quickly stormed by Kousinos Sophianos's infantry and swallowed up. Kousinos's militia, poised right in front of the gate, calmly waited for the men on the walls to gain control of the gatehouse and then stormed out, attacking first the one Andronikan regiment of militia that never went up on the walls, and then the spear regiment that had just gotten off the walls. Kousinos's men did take some losses, although not as many as it could have been thanks to the western gatehouse and towers now firing at Andronikos. Kousinos's men now stand in control of the western part of the battlefield.

However, Andronikos is not out of tricks yet. Perhaps sensing what was about to take place in the west, or perhaps just wishing for extra firepower in the northwest, the general recalled his foot archers, sending them to march to his location. Meanwhile, he tasked his already-present horse archers to fire at the unprotected Kousinos Sophianos, sending the general scurrying for cover. Quickly realizing the threat to his life, Kousnios ordered his foot archers to counterfire the horse archers and they were quickly annihilated, although not before an arrow made minor contact with him.

All the while, Andronikos, desperately trying to force the issue, was circling around Kousinos's spearmen, trying to kill the rival Basileus in hand-to-hand combat. While easily outmaneuvering the spearmen tasked with blocking this move, Andronikos found Kousnios sheltered with the remaining two regiments, a lone horseman hidden among hundreds of spears. Deciding to take a risk, he charged, hoping that his men would have enough weight to crash through and hit Kousinos. However, the wily general simply moved farther back. Andronikos, sensing the charge was now pointless, broke it off, but not before losing a lot of his escort.

With everybody in the northwest stopping to catch their breaths, Andronikos looks southward at a disturbing sight. Three of the gates now bear the personal arms of Kousinos Sophianos, including the southern gate which is held by the Tagarian forces. Even more damning is the fact that Vartholomaios Ksiros's personal retinue is also waving the flag, as is, Andronikos surmises, his men in the city.

Wondering what he got himself into, Andronikos, now with only a fraction of his bodyguard and his foot archers remaining, ponders what to do next, while Kousinos Sophianos nurses his wound and Bart Ksiros reflects on a hard day's fighting.

Map:

https://i113.photobucket.com/albums/...ileis/2_03.jpg

DEADLINE FOR TURN 4 ORDERS: May 1st, 23:59 GMT-5.

Turn 3 feedback:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Kousinos

In the west, your men make quick work of Andronikos's remaining infantry, losing one regiment of militia in the process. But you were never too concerned about that. After all, overwhelming superiority in numbers and strength usually ensures victory.

Instead, you're focused on your present location, where Andronikos, despite the odds, is still giving you headaches. While trying to circle around your moving spearmen, he has ordered his remaining horse archers to concentrate fire on... you. You quickly order your own foot archers to take care of the greater threat, and they train fire on the HAs instead of Andronikos.

This move has probably saved your life, as despite the efficiency in which Andronikos's missile cavalry was removed, several arrows still flew your way and you even took a couple of hits. One of them even drew blood and will give you headaches for the rest of the battle. One thing is for certain: You can't take much more punishment and still live to talk about it.

After grimacing and checking to make sure the wound isn't life-threatening, you take shelter, moving inside two regiments of spearmen. They brace for an Andronikos charge, as he has circled around the men assigned to block him. The charge hits, and you're barely able to gallop away in time. Andronikos, sensing that the opportunity is lost, withdraws with what remains of his bodyguard. You live to fight another day, at least for the moment.

Your best hope now is too have Andronikos see the folly of continued battle and break off. Vartholomaios Ksiros has raised your standard to the south and it is clear that Andronikos faces a unified opponent. All that remains to you now is to stay alive during mop-up duty.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Andronikos

You start to wonder if this is the last gasp of your heroic efforts to control Byzantium. What was once a mighty force that overwhelmed Theo Petzeas at Edessa and smashed Ioannis Tagaris's defenses at the Iron Bridge has mostly evaporated, partly due to attrition, partly to, at last, the numbers falling in the enemy's favor. Nikitas Moschos lies helpless somewhere to the south, waiting for someone to pick him up and take him prisoner. The last of your infantry was swarmed by Kousinos Sophianos's men, one disobedient regiment on the walls and the other two by the men storming out the gate. Nikitas's southern archers too have been destroyed, thanks to the tactics of that damn Ksiros.

Despite this though, you're still game, concentrating your remaining energy on bringing down Kousinos, who apparently was working with Bart all along. You easily circle around his spearmen - luckily, his archers were focused on bringing down your missile cavalry in an attempt to save him - and charge Kousinos, sheltered in a block of yet more spearmen. The impact is terrible, but you see Kousinos, sporting a minor injury, retreating. Suddenly conscious of manpower, you break off the charge. Not many of your loyal bodyguards make it out of there.

Antioch is lost to you. Your main objective in the battle is to make it out alive. However, Kousinos is still vulnerable. He is clearly hurting. One true shot by your foot archers, which survived the massacre in the west by simply marching north, could bring him down. On the other hand, if you're not quick and linger too long... well, you saw what his foot archers and spearmen did to your horse archers and bodyguard.

The time for reflecting on how you got to this point is later. The time for quick acting is now. What will it be?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief

Feedback to Bart

You send out an envoy to Andronikos's archers near you, but its purpose quickly becomes moot as the three regiments open fire on Ioannis. Unfortunately for everybody involved, you now have no choice but to cut them down.

Thus you do so, your tactics of loose formation and pincer movements definitely cutting down on losses. However, you didn't have much horsemen to begin with and that still was a *lot* of archers to kill. Once the deed is done, you take inventory: Ioannis is down his entire bodyguard, and yours has seen better days.

However, your day is most likely done. Your final act was probably to scare the *#%! out of Andronikos by raising Kousinos's standard everywhere you can. Let's hope it's enough to drive him away without further threat to Kousinos. For now, though, you can rest knowing that Antioch is safe.

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Orders:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

"All right, men! Andronikos' dream has been shattered, and now all we have to do is finish this battle!

"Archers, eliminate your counterparts! Spearmen, four regiment will form around me! We'll keep one regiment in the back, and if Andronikos trys to start another fight than that regiment will move to pin him from behind before he gets away! The rest of the infantry will move up to rejoin us!"

Constantine steadies himself for the moment to come.

"I'll have to do everything I can in order to keep away from anymore danger," he thought as he placed a hand on his fresh wound.

"It has been said, 'Never tempt the Lord your God.' "

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://img117.imageshack.us/img117/9908/antioch.jpg

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by woad&fangs

Ammonathas, there is no hope for you to escape. Take Sophianos with you to the grave.
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As for myself, I see no hope of catching either of the two pretenders. I will retreat to the east so I that I may regroup and plan my course of future action.
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OOC: Well, its been fun. I knew that all these battles would eventually be my unduing. I'm planning on removing Andronikos as a contendor for the crown via a story if he escapes. I'm thinking that I'll retire him to some monastery. He was a rather dry character but I liked him all the same.

Of course, I wouldn't mind if my archers got a lucky parting shot in :devil:

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rowan

Orders:
The bodyguards will proceed to the southern gate where they will form up with the remaining troops and proceed to the southern edge of the town square.

Bart has explained the situation to Ioannis Tagaris (TheFlax). If he attempts to flee Bart will let him. If he doesn't send any orders I think we can assume that he's coming peacefully to surrender to Kousinos. If he gets violent, well, it's up to the dice.


Message to Kousinos:
Southern gate secured. Will meet you at town square. Got Nikitas as prisoner.

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In addition, Cecil sent the following message to Rowan:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cecil XIX

Well met, Grandmaster.

The day is won. I would like your opinion on what to do with Tagaris. As his former vassal, I would value it very highly.

Sincerely,
Constantine

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Umpire notes for Turn 4:

Due to the new circumstances, I revised my orders tests for this turn. For the messages, there would be no chance of interception, just of them getting lost (roll 1, loss, roll 2-6, passes). In addition, since it’s clear that Andronikos is deserting the battlefield, his archers have a 50:50 chance of obeying orders (roll 1-3 inactive, roll 4-6 obedient).

Roll for Bart’s message to Kousinos: 3 (passes).
Roll for Kousinos’s message to Bart: 6 (passes).

Roll for Andronikos’s archers: 1 (fails).

With the lack of combat this turn, there were no resolutions to be done and thus the battle is over. With a lack of pursuit from Kousinos, Andronikos was able to make a clean getaway. His archers will surrender to the remaining forces. Nikitas Moschos is the prisoner of Vartholomaios Ksiros.

Overall, things look pretty good for Kousinos. He has essentially removed two claimants to the throne in one fell swoop and gained a vassal, even though Bart’s forces took a heavy beating. He will now have to work significantly to take down Ioannis Komnenos III in the final battle.

Public feedback for Turn 4:

Antioch:

As the city is secured, several more curious and daring inhabitants flock en masse to the northwestern walls, where the battle's final drama is about to be played out. Despite clearly winning the day, Kousinos Sophianos has left himself in an extremely vulnerable position. His lack of bodyguard and visible wounds are a clear indicator of that.

Another sign of the incredibly local scope the battle has taken is the relative lack of noise. Battles, as a rule, are extremely chaotic affairs in which the loudest, most commanding general is at an advantage. Here, however, most of the soldiers were simply inactive, catching a rest, waiting with bated breath as to what Androinkos and Kousinos are going to do next.

"Men!" Andronikos shouts, his voice carrying over the wall of Kousinos's spearmen and archers and reaching his own missile troops. "It has been a wonderful effort, but unfortunately, this is the end! It has been an honor to fight with you through the campaigns and the battles, and no matter our end, I shall see you all in the house of God!"

Kousinos, meanwhile, clearly not liking this, quietly orders his spearmen to form up in a protective wall around him.

"I now take my leave, but if you with to go out in a blaze of glory, and please your general, your commander one last time, you will bring the enemy general down! God be with you, men!" And then, spurring his mount, Andronikos galloped to the east, the rest of his remaining escort following behind.

"Men of Andronikos!" Kousinos now shouts, behind his spear wall. "I have five regiments of archers to your two, every single one of their arrows trained on you. They will fire on a certain cue, with or without my command to do so! There is only one way to avoid your fate, and I'm sure you know what that is. What say you?"

Ammonathas, the commander of Andronikos's archers, steps forward. "I will not throw my men's lives away for a commander who has abandoned us," motioning to the shrinking figure in the distance. "Please do not shoot us. As the seniormost officer of the Komnenian army remaining on the field, I surrender."

"I accept your surrender," Kousnios replies. "All archers, put your bows down. This battle is over."

And thus, the massive clean-up operation begins in and around Antioch. To the south of the city, Vartholomaios Ksiros dispatched a small group of riders to search for Nikitas Moschos, who collected him and brought him back to Bart's position. Upon receiving water and coming to, Nikitas looked around, saw the men around him, and softly cursed.

Meanwhile, Ioannis Tagaris, without a bodyguard and having witnessed his command usurped by Bart, officially surrendered to his former lieutenant. The day was very odd for him, having delegated command to a general that took up the fight against Andronikos with gusto, witnessed his entire bodyguard die around him, and realized that there were greater macchinations being played out, macchinations that he was not privy to.

Nikitas, looking at Tagaris afterwards, widened his eyes in shock. "So you and I are both the prisoner of the same person and it's not Kousinos?"

"You tell me," Tagaris replied.

Some time passed, and eventually Kousinos, at the head of his entire army, made his way into the town square, grimacing as he dismounted and shaking his Grandmaster's hand. "Andronikos?" Bart asked.

"Escaped," Kousinos sighed, shaking his head. "But he has nothing. He has just as little money as the rest of us. Let him rot."

"So what now?"

The two looked at each other, and then took a very long glance to the northwest, site of Northern Anatolia.

"Ioannis."

Meanwhile, somewhere in northwestern Anatolia...

The opening skirmish between the two remaining Basileis, Kousinos Sophianos and Ioannis Komnenos III, has just gone underway without either of the commanding generals realizing the position they were in. Under the impression that this was just a mere surprise attack/harassment operation, Ioannis Erotikos instead took the field for a pivotal conflict.

His adversary, Isaakos Komnenos, had the numerical advantage, although that was almost moot given the current circumstances. Ioannos had two great factors going his way: Maneuverability and positioning. His all-cavalry force had caught Isaakos napping, and now there would be serious blood to pay.

Isaakos, quickly realizing his mistake, moved to reform his troops as fast as he could, hoping only to get into some semblance of a battle formation before the thunder hit. After all, fancy maneuvering and momentum meant very little once the hacking started in earnest. Isaakos, however, braced himself for a storm that never quite hit. Instead, Ioannis was passive, at first attempting to withdraw, thinking himself the better of it, and then settling down to pick off his opponent little by little with arrows. Erotikos's unorthodox plan seemed to be working, as 15% of Isaakos's men were already down by the time he had formed a forward-facing line.

The line surged forward. All the while, dozens more men dropped. Ioannis had succeeded in reducing Isaakos's men by a full fourth before any melee even started. Would it be enough?

Isaakos, perhaps thinking ahead to future engagements, held his infantry back slightly, letting a massed cavalry charge of his own hit Ioannis's men first. It worked, driving back most of Ioannis's cavalry and taking some pressure off his infantry. However, perhaps due to counter-fire, perhaps due to Isaakos's own orders, the bulk of Isaakos's cavalry withdrew before they actually hit. Isaakos Komnenos found himself and his escort caught in a swirl of enemy horsemen with 40% of his soldiers down. This was not going well.

Some of Erotikos's force, including Ioannis himself, stayed, trying to being down the enemy general down early. Some withdrew, continuing to pick off more enemy soldiers from a distance. However, Isaakos, using himself as bait, bought himself enough time for his infantry and some of his cavalry to charge in from several sides at once. Half of Ioannis's army was now in serious trouble as they desperately tried to hack themselves out of the situation.

As Ioannis's Skythikon, definitely not made for the type of mass chaos they were in now, started to rout, the remaining uncommitted regiments rode around the melee, trying to flank the bulk of Isaakos's force in order to ease the pressure. One of them was charged head-on by some of Isaakos's Byzantine Cavalry. The flankers were now, all four regiments, tied up, trying to bag one pesky regiment while the rest of the army completed their work and sent the Skythikon fleeing for the hills. Ioannis was still game, but he was down to ten bodyguards now and most of Isaakos's men no longer had other targets.

He quickly found himself surrounded, relieved only by a belated charge of Lancers. Half of his men were down at this point, as opposed to Isaakos's 56%. However, not all was lost. Isaakos, thinking the battle against Ioannis personally was won, began diverting troops to the aborted flank attempt where the bulk of Ioannis's remaining force was now concentrated before finishing the job with Ioannis and his Lancers. As a result, neither engagement had the amount of men necessary to properly complete the battle. Isaakos soon looked around in shock as his soldiers ran past, routing.

Isaakos, his own bodyguard relatively unspoiled, decided to commit to the larger fight, where his beleagured flank-stoppers and their early reinforcements were dealing with Erotikos's four regiments of cavalry. He got in at around the same time as his later reinforcements did, at the very least stopping the flood of men running. In addition, he caught the attention of his militia cavalry, far away, and motioned them to help out. Now it was Ioannis's men in trouble as they faced themselves with a resurgent threat in front of them and, all of a sudden, a cavalry charge to their rear. A counter-flanking of Isaakos was not enough to turn the tide.

And then, Ioannis, trying to hack his way out of a mass of Komnenian group of infantry, fell. With no commander around to issue orders, the remaining battle quickly turned in a simple, brutal, slugfest: kill one enemy and move onto the next. By this point, Isaakos had established the clear advantage and pressed it all the way to victory.

Looking around after the battle, he could do little more than gaze in belated shock over the quickness and ferocity of the battle. He achieved the primary objective of surviving the ambush, but at a terrible cost. Man-for-man, Ioannis had won the day. However, with Helarionas unexpectedly surrendering without a fight at the Battle of the Coastal Road, was it enough to whittle down Ioannis Komnenos III's men to a manageable amount? Isaakos certainly hoped not.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The following regiments still surviving after the day for Isaakos are:
General's Bodyguard
Skythikon
Skythikon
Dismounted Byzantine Lancers
Byzantine Spearmen
Militia Cavalry

Battle replay:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/local...id=199&id=4880