The sweet smell

of socialism is in the air!

It is a good smell.

Yeah, it is a great smell.

lenin96, the new hardcore :beam:

by the way it stinks

http://vincentderoeck.blogspot.com/2...y-repeats.html

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Originally Posted by Fragony

lenin96, the new hardcore :beam:

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Yeah... more people could call me that...

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Originally Posted by Fragony

by the way it stinks

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:no::whip::skull:

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Originally Posted by lenin96

:skull: <------------ :no::whip:

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fixed :beam:

Hmmm..... what does this rearagement of smilies mean...?

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Originally Posted by lenin96

Hmmm..... what does this rearagement of smilies mean...?

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THE TRUTH

Communism in smiley's by :help:

:book: ---> :furious3: leads to :whip: on :inquisitive: leads to :no: ---> :skull:

:yes:

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Originally Posted by Fragony

THE TRUTH

Communism in smiley's by comrade Fragony. (edited by Generalissimus Lenin to be more accurate)

:book: ---> :idea2: leads to :smash: on :furious3: leads to :yes: ---> :2thumbsup:

:yes:

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I see what you mean now...

OH GOD I CAN FEEL IT

I am convinced, who's with me! heh everybody naturally

VIVA LA REVOLUTION

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Originally Posted by Fragony

OH GOD I CAN FEEL IT

I am convinced, who's with me! heh everybody naturally

VIVA LA REVOLUTION

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:laugh4:

Give it a rest Vuk... This is a Corporation VOLUNTARILY being Nationalised.

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Originally Posted by CountArach

Give it a rest Vuk... This is a Corporation VOLUNTARILY being Nationalised.

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People saying no to a bag of free money that secures their comfortable future, who would have thought. GM should split up in smaller bite-size healthy segments that can be taken in by other company's, who can compete with the state? Doesn't matter what GM wants they aren't in a position to want anything. What good is it a good thing to put GM on the costly breathing machine as a whole. It's idiocy.

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Originally Posted by CountArach

Give it a rest Vuk... This is a Corporation VOLUNTARILY being Nationalised.

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ummm...so what?

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Originally Posted by Just Vuk Again

ummm...so what?

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You seem to be saying (Though it is hard to tell given that you didn't actually make a point at all) that a Corporation voluntarily giving itself to a government is Socialism. This is not the case - Socialism is the seizing of private property by the working class. Yes, many Socialists (including myself) believe this is a good thing, but it should be noted that the fact that 50% of the company remains in private hands indicates it cannot be a Socialist creation.

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Originally Posted by Fragony

GM should split up in smaller bite-size healthy segments that can be taken in by other company's, who can compete with the state?

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No one can compete with the State and that is usually the point. In this case it isn't a matter of competition - it is a matter of saving the jobs of those who work there. By being subsumed into the government their jobs are less likely to be lost in the near future. The government should make an effort for this to become profitable and then spread this around for the public good.

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Originally Posted by Fragony

Doesn't matter what GM wants they aren't in a position to want anything.

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Why not?

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Originally Posted by CountArach

No one can compete with the State and that is usually the point. In this case it isn't a matter of competition - it is a matter of saving the jobs of those who work there. By being subsumed into the government their jobs are less likely to be lost in the near future. The government should make an effort for this to become profitable and then spread this around for the public good.

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I disagree with this on the most basic level, artificially keeping this clumsy monster alive is a mistake. In the end the result is that everybody who has a bright idea will be placed out of the market, how can anyone compete with this? Why would anyone want to innovate? It's a killer.

Haven't General Electric/General Motors been using their lobbying power to feed off of government subsidies for quite a while? And that is why much less of their value is in foreign assets compared to European companies?

You Yanks are commies, come over to Europe if you want to compete in a real free market!

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

You Yanks are commies, come over to Europe if you want to compete in a real free market!

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Better at least. I am almost getting the feeling that the Obama administration is trying to harm the American economy. America should play to it's strenghts, if it loses the edge in r&d it's little more then the concert playing on the Titanic.

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Originally Posted by Fragony

I am almost getting the feeling that the Obama administration is trying to harm the American economy.

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:inquisitive:

I'm not sure that would get him re-elected...

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Originally Posted by CountArach

:inquisitive:

I'm not sure that would get him re-elected...

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I said almost, but I don't like him, there is something wrong with that guy. What he does is good for the shareholders but not for the ecomomy, what he has done so far makes little sense to me. Buying up just about everything that is unhealthy because of a few workers, yeah right. Should have elected Ron Paul.

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Originally Posted by Fragony

Better at least. I am almost getting the feeling that the Obama administration is trying to harm the American economy. America should play to it's strenghts, if it loses the edge in r&d it's little more then the concert playing on the Titanic.

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That's all good and well. But, the auto-industry employs a huge number of people, with both GM and Ford one quarter of a million people worldwide, a third of which employed in the US. And in this current highly volatile and fragile environment the government cannot afford either to collapse. It only takes one crack to burst the dam wall.

Edit: They'll bring it down to the bare-bones and rebuild from there. As much as you'd like to think they are, they aren't all idiots.

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Originally Posted by CountArach

:inquisitive:

I'm not sure that would get him re-elected...

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Who said he is keeping elections going? Hitler nationalised companies, next thing you know there are no elections.

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Originally Posted by Psychonaut

That's all good and well. But, the auto-industry employs a huge number of people, with both GM and Ford one quarter of a million people worldwide, a third of which employed in the US. And in this current highly volatile and fragile environment the government cannot afford either to collapse. It only takes one crack to burst the dam wall.

Edit: They'll bring it down to the bare-bones and rebuild from there. As much as you'd like to think they are, they aren't all idiots.

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Most company's have various brands, that is very easy to split up, and very easy to trade individually, peanut butter, that stuff. Why gob the entire thing up, I mean it isn't like people are strarving because of our excellent programs, and there would be even more money to give to them because our excellent programs would lose less money to bad business.

It's a very capitalist government that gains capital in this way, if the companies cannot outcompete the government, they might get bought by the government. ~D
Creates some healthy competition.

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Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr

Who said he is keeping elections going? Hitler nationalised companies, next thing you know there are no elections.

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To pull that off in the US you'll need to be immensly popular (that's why the Bush conspiracists could easily be identified as conspiracists) . :book:

Old hat.

This is less fresh
Than a bunch of Texans
Talking about
How their state can and will
Secede from the union.

The union of states
Has regularly gone
Through periods
Of over regulation
Then under regulation.

Over regulation, then under regulation.
Over regulation, then under regulation.

It fluctuates like the tides:
A response to gravity and the shifting ground beneath

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Originally Posted by Yoyoma1910

Old hat.

This is less fresh
Than a bunch of Texans
Talking about
How their state can and will
Secede from the union.

The union of states
Has regularly gone
Through periods
Of over regulation
Then under regulation.

Over regulation, then under regulation.
Over regulation, then under regulation.

It fluctuates like the tides:
A response to gravity and the shifting ground beneath

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Waves rise high, then fall low.
We are used to this, I know.
We have weathered them all,
The dikes did not fall.
But some waves are too great,
And dam has to break.
And if things keep going at this rate,
That, I fear, is our fate.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Just Vuk Again

Waves rise high, then fall low.
We are used to this, I know.
We have weathered them all,
The dikes did not fall.
But some waves are too great,
And dam has to break.
And if things keep going at this rate,
That, I fear, is our fate.

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Uh I'm from New Orleans. The Dykes did fall. They fall all the time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yoyoma1910

Uh I'm from New Orleans. The Dykes did fall. They fall all the time.

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Cities can be rebuilt Yoyoma. The US cannot. It was created in unique circumstances that allowed for its creation. If the US falls, you will never see its like again in history. And I am not sure if you noticed, but bad things happened to the inhabitants when the dykes broke. The point, generally, is to prevent that.

Maar jij kunt dansen op de woeste golven. Zout op je lippen, je haar in de wind. Bijna door de zee bedolven, maar als je blijft staan heb je zeebenen kind.

"But you can dance on the waves, salt on your lips, hair in the wind. Almost overtaken by the sea, but if you stand tall you have sealegs my dear"