My normal army stack consists of 6 line infantry, 2 light dragoons, 2 Howitzers and 2 Howitzer cannons and a general.
So far i cant quite picture grenadiers and light infantry usefull in this army setup or am i missing something?
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My normal army stack consists of 6 line infantry, 2 light dragoons, 2 Howitzers and 2 Howitzer cannons and a general.
So far i cant quite picture grenadiers and light infantry usefull in this army setup or am i missing something?
You still have seven slots left?Quote:
Originally Posted by Explodingcannonballfromhell
Grenadiers and Light Infantry are both Elite units which give you capabilities that line infantry does not.
Light infantry has greater range, skirmishing abilities, and obstacles. Later they also have the light infantry formation. They posess greater accuracy than line infantry but are not melee troops. These types also include riflemen.
Grenadiers are heavy infantry with higher moral, greater accuracy, grenades, and better melee abilities then the line infantry. They can be devastating in a number of ways.
I like to have Grenadiers at about 1 to 2 line infantry and having two light infantry per army. That is if you are going to fight your battles and not auto resolve them. In that case put in Grenadiers to boost that up.
The only stacks I don’t include grenadiers in are my fast troops. These are just light dragoons and light infantry with perhaps some galloper guns, but they do slow it down.
I have 4 lights, and 1 grenader per stack. Light Infantry are great for putting them up ahead of the main army to skirmish, then fall back as the enemy advances. Once the lines engage, the light inf can be used on the flanks to shoot up the enemy from the side.
Grenadiers are great if a melee develops. I make them throw their grenades into the mass a few times, then charge in if the enemy didn't yet break. Otherwise, if nobody commits to a melee, I just keep the Grenadiers in reserve to plug in a gap the lines will leave once their numbers are reduced.
Try playing multiplayer. People really use these tactics quite well.
Well euhm thats gonna cost me a lot of upkeep, but i was actually more interested in how to use the grenadiers and light infantry effectively in battle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fisherking
Up keep has become a big deal of course.Quote:
Originally Posted by Explodingcannonballfromhell
Grenadiers are shock troops. Throw them in to melee to rout an enemy. keep them generally in back of the line until you need them.
Use lights up front to skirmish and fall back weakening the enemy before the line engages. Their obstacles are also the death of cavalry.
Their presences also bolsters auto resolves.
I tend to use grenadiers as assault troops. When the enemy is defending a position like a wall and I have to take it, I usually run the grenadiers up to grenade range, have them toss grenades, then charge. Their stats make them really tough in melee combat, and the grenades usually cause such a morale shock in the foe that you can break a hole in short order. Then you quickly exploit the hole.
Grenadiers are shock troops. In an open battle, pin your target with Line infantry, then have your Grenadiers toss and charge - preferably in the flanks, although they do good enough front up. You should also use them in an opposed fort assault. Their small unit size and excellent stats means that you can get far more hitting power up those walls than using a standard Line. Once again - support with line, assault with Grenadiers.
I rarely use light infantry, so I cannot comment much on them.
Honestly, I do not see much use for grenadiers in the game. Their stats, on the surface, seem better, but they suffer from the 50% unit size + they do not use bayonets. Once one adds the bayonett bonus (+ attack and + charge), it seems, their slot is better used by another unit of line infantry, at least for the nations that have good line infantry (such as GB and Prussia).
And don't get me started on the 'defense' stat of line infantry. Those guys have been made into melee gods by CA... Come on, body armor was not invented in the XVIII century yet. Where did the line infantry's huge defense value come from? From their wool uniforms? I think not. Neither could it come from their superior skill parrying with a baoyneted musket, which is a clumsy defense weapon at best.
On the same token, CA has given puny defense values to specialist, sword melee troups, which does not make much sense. Someone specializing at using sword should be able to defend himself better than someone parrying with a musket.
They dont use bayonetts? I'm almost sure that they do. I think its light infantry that doesnt use bayonetts
Regardless, Grenadiers are some of the best troops in the game, period. If properly used, they cause casualties out of proportion with the handicap of their half size units.
Line troops are good enough but the sheer hitting power of the Grenadiers grenades on engaged enemy line troops followed by accurate fire or, even better, melee engagement will easily roll up a unit and possibly an armys entire flank.
I guess, my anti-aliasing setting was set too low and the bayonets did not display correctly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Phog_of_War
Hmm well i gues i would add 2 grenadier squads to my stack then, i will be mainly using them to toss grenades into the melee engaged line infantry. As for light infantry i will not include them but i might make a light infantry army supported with grenadiers.
Probably not a good idea. Both Grenediers and Light Infantry are half-stacks compared to Line. This means you'll be heftily outnumbered against any similarly sized stack. You can hit harder, further, but can't take the pounding.Quote:
Originally Posted by Explodingcannonballfromhell
If you're going with a Grenedier/Light army, make sure you support it well with both cavalry and Gallopers. You'll be relying largely on shock and firepower to overwhelm your opponent - getting involved in a drawn out shooting match against a bunch of well supported Line will see your Grenadier/Light forces annihilated.
Personally, my stacks always go something like: 8 Line, 6 Grenadier, 5 Cavalry, 4 Artillery, General.
I have a bit of a love/hate relationship with Light infantry. I would love to be able to use them properly and when they do play a pivotal role in battle I feel vindicated in not having just recruited more cavalry or line inf. My performance with them tends to be hit and miss though.
My problem is essentially ensuring the survivability of the unit, whilst ensuring that they play a useful part in the battle that is also sufficiently daring to live up their reputiation.
I have a particular soft spot for those units that remain hidden whilst moving (native american indian muskets & bowmen, Pandurs, Kurdish hillmen...) and can hence sneak up on un-guarded or isolated artillery units -but that involves my units also being out on a limb -and alone in the face of a cavalry charge...
Ranging ahead of a deployed battle line (as opposed to on the flanks) gives mixed results -again probably because i leave them unsupported or don't follow up their advance with that of my main line.
When I have tried commiting a protective force for light infantry (e.g. a couple of dragoons, standing off), I maybe get a bit over confident as what i intend as light skirmishes on the flanks can sometimes turn into the main engagements of the battlefield, as more and more troops get sucked in.
Anyone have any particular advice or little strategies/tactics for using light inf?
Also, anyone actually use the dispersed order formation? I find it buggy in that if the unit fall back in skirmish order, they end up facing the wrong direction... What does this formation actually do other than reduce the casualties per hit from cannon fire? Does it provide any bonuses to hiding, damage or moralle?
I've never had the occasion to use a fougasse either -they sound nasty though...
I always use my light infantry with the light infantry behavior on. It's still bugged and takes micromanagement because of it but if they eat a volley on normal formation, there goes 40% of your unit and that is not good. I use them the same way as velites and peltasts in RTW; out in front spread out, backing off and running to the flanks when the enemy closes. My light units generally get around 100-120 kills a fight each.
I like putting grenadiers behind my line infantry in the center, right in front of my howitzers. Always trust the AI to aim their infantry attack at your artillery, so when they start bunching up in the middle and charging my line infantry, I lob grenades over my line infantry at the bunched up AI. 1 or 2 grenade volleys usually sends them running.
Of course, couple times (maybe 1 out of 10) the grenades blew up prematurely and it wasn't a pretty sight back there! :laugh4:
My full stack is 1 general, 2 heavy cav, 2 light dragoons, 3 howitzers, 6 line infantry, 4 light infantry, and 2 grenadiers.