Where do you place the borders of your empire?

I'm just finishing off an Aedui game at the moment and I've beaten the Romani and Sweboz back to a point where they don't pose much of a threat any more.

This got me thinking about where people stop expanding. Do you go for bottlenecks, like the Bosphorus, or continue to expand on all fronts evenly?

Personally I find it difficult to concentrate on more than one front at any time, so I normally try to anchor the others at some strategic point while pushing forward.

I generally try to work towards my victory conditions and only go beyond these if I can shorten my borders by doing so.

Frontier garrisons are usually made up of whatever troops I can recruit from that city, plus four slingers to whittle down any besieging stacks. This approach has stood me in good stead in Italy where I've been constantly attacked by Romani stacks full of Pedites Extraordinarii and Triarii.

I usually place my borders in the most strategic areas. I like to use natural obstructions such as forests and mountains to slow down enemies and give myself time to respond effectively. I expand slowly and try to keep my territory within the victory conditions unless there is a Provence I specifically want for its wealth or possible recruitment.

General Aetius

Convenient natural barriers. I use strongly garrisoned forts in mountain passes and expolit bridges with phalanxes, what a whore I am :clown:

Unfortunately this also deters me from pushing on and I eventually get bored and start again :wall:

Well usually I prefer to have easely defendeable borders or keep myself to the victory conditions most of the time, but I usually consider taking over the world as my final objective - so I voted to the world encircling ocean. (althoug I haven't gotten that far in many campaigns so if there was a choice like "as far as my armies fight victoriously" I would rather choose that one:sweatdrop:)

since the AI does not like to step foot in the water , i say the ocean is always a good border.

Once I find a decent chokepoint, I make some buffer states with whatever protectorate seems best and then I can leave that border to rot :beam:

I expand until i reach the lands i want. With Baktria, i stopped my western expansion at Babylonia and Seleukeia. It's not a natural barrier or other, but i just want those cities because they were Seleukid's main recruitment pools, so i took them. I'm not interested in advancing westward so i stop there and i have to face a Seleukid siege every 2 turns. Boring, but not so difficoult.

If i don't have such objective to be taken, i could stop my advance at a convenient place, like a coast, a natural barrier, or simply a region that makes the map good-looking to me.

Good thing you stopped. My Gaestae would stomp you!



I use natural barriers. Forests, Mountains, rivers, ect. I make my own borders, the border of the province is not my true border. I will move and secure favourable terrain, such as chokepoints ect. My favourite barrier is the mountains around pella. So easy to defend. Getic's dont like to come down into my domain, and I don't blame em, the valley in the middle of Greece is the main encampment of my whole military. the first army (usually the Spartans) is usually fighting a war to the West, securing the Eastern border with Byzantium, or abroad fighting an expedition to a profitable city... like carthage... or my 5 favourite cities to sack (in order of most favourite) Rome, Antioch, Alexandria, Massalia, Syracuse. Massalia. Greece is easy to defend like this Expanding further on the mainland is a security risk, and you'll stretch your men thin. The key is to stay dense and compact, this is where the strength of your borders lie, in the mountains where you chose where and when to fight. Expeditions to far away lands yield lots of mnai, permently settling antioch, syracuse, or massalia (massalia is harder to hold, but it can be done, especially when you've got the massalian hoplites.) holding antioch will put you in terrible favour with Ptolemy, so be prepared to fight tooth and nail for it. I fought such terrible odds in that city... and prevailed.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

http://screenshot.xfire.com/screensh...5e1b27cd2a.jpg

Antioch has no favourable borders or terrain features, So i was forced to stick it out inside the walls. Which proved to be in my advantage, smaller numbers of troops could fight men over twice the size of mine. All their troops in that battle above were of better quality, and type. with the exception of my FM's spartan troops, and his 5 classical hoplites (they'd fought with his army from the begining, and have 2 gold chevs, they basically serve as a guard for the generals peice himself, guarding him from danger. highly effective!) Fighting inside the city gives you such a huge advantage as opposed to the walls. Deploy across teh street, wall to wall, with classical/spartan hoplites, and nothing will get through!


So my final answer? I make my own borders... And fortify them with the corpses of my enemies!


EDIT: on a semi related note... in that battle i only had enough troops to guard 1 of the paths to the city centre effectively... the main route to the city centre was held by a unit of Skirmishers whom had 2 silver chevs... all 227 died (hence their absence in the surviving units on the bottom) but they killed about 300 some men... and the theuropoi with 109 men left... they lost 44 men for 552 kills! Thats what I call dedication!

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Originally Posted by Moosemanmoo

Convenient natural barriers. I use strongly garrisoned forts in mountain passes and expolit bridges with phalanxes, what a whore I am :clown:

Unfortunately this also deters me from pushing on and I eventually get bored and start again :wall:

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Before I launch an attack I study the choke points that divide the region I plan to take from everything else. I decide beforehand how far I want to reach. Usually this means I will have to grab several provinces at once. I will send spys to recon the whole area. And prepare an army large enough to get control of the new choke points and besiege the cities I want to take - so I grab the new region (3-4 provinces) in a few turns.

After conquering a block of provinces, I stop to consolidate and rebuild. Develop the cities, build roads, etc. ...when I am ready, I look for a new block of provinces to attack, and, repeat the whole process.

In real life it is often easier to win the war than to win the peace. In EB, winning peace is al but impossible. So I settle for the second best option: a good choke point where I can win many battles and rack up a lot of chevrons - Archers with gold chevrons are great. :2thumbsup:

I usually conquers an area suited to my needs and demands. Then i wage war with my neighbours but not conquering their settlements. fun fun

For me, it's a combination of natural borders (picked this one), at the point where borders/realm looks good (tends to coincide with the previous point) and where the victory conditions tell me to.

wherever nature favors me, provided I achieved the VC's

I like to create buffer states around me, so I can actually concentrate on one front. Also I like to keep the balance between AI factions, like giving them a large sum of money (not by console) and make alliance with them.

I favour natural borders, but if pushed by agressive neighbours I will expand to prevent them irratating me with repetitive invasions.

I guess I also favour political borders, i dont tend to start wars, i focus my forces on those who attack me.

I do play as the hai though, so if i fought all my neighbours simultaneosly it could be a bit frustrating. My main focus intially was the seleukids, who are now limited to their far eastern provinces + 1 well defended city in asia minor.

iritatingly ptolmeioi declared war on me soon after I entered the levant, ihave now reduced them to one city in Ethiopia.

Next Carthage decided to march across the desert to attack me at kyrene, so i have had to start taking some of their cities- which strategically are of no interest to me.

The point is I have ignored the sarmations, sabaens parthians and pontus for as long as possible.

pontus have actually just declared war on me, which is ok as they would have been my next logical target, unfortunately I was in the process of sending several stacks over to Carthage, so they have caught me off guard.

...Stop expanding...? Does not compute... I must encompass the whole world as fast as humanly possible. Well that's what I do when I'm Rome, where I take the whole Mediterranean and go north into central Europe and even toward the Caspian, but I might think of doing a more realistic empire in my next game. It's also easier to manage if you have less extensive provinces. Everyone starts revolting if you're too big, and it's easier to defend if you're smaller and have natural borders. But usually the sea is a good barrier for me. Other than that, just to wherever the victory conditions say to.

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I like to create buffer states around me, so I can actually concentrate on one front. Also I like to keep the balance between AI factions, like giving them a large sum of money (not by console) and make alliance with them.

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Ditto. I find it's a helluva lot easier to crush one enemy at a time in a blitz with a dozen armies, rather than doleing out one or two armies per enemy. I use Force Diplomacy mod to help out, since RTW diplomacy consists of: "I next to you? I KILL YOU!!!"

Natural frontiers like seas and mountains.
Once I have Greece secured (i.e. I kick the KH and Epirotes in), I expand North to the Getic border, West into the Western Balkans until the Roman border, East into Byzantium and Pergamon.

From there, a blitz North against the Getai, a blitz West and into the Italian peninsula, a blitz East until I hit the big mountain regions in the southeast and east of Asia Minor.

After that, anything goes.

I dislike using the sea as a transport method.
I used to conquer Italy from Greece by sending troops on boats, but I don't do that anymore.
Reinforcing them is a nightmare if I lose.

When I reach danube, adriatics, caucasicus, sahara.
Later I like sacking campaigns for fun, mainly Italy, Saba, Getai and Carthage.
But my best campaign is second Persian invasion of Greece, mostly I roleplay history repeats itself then get back to Asia Minor after I consolidate my power in Balkans mainly making Getai my vassal.
Horse archers beats getai, getai beats maks, maks beats horse archers. so rock scissors, paper ...
but before last phase I stop my camapigns when I reached persian gates, then euphrates, then Bosphorus, then sahara,
so not a total crazy blitzkrieg.

I like rivers, mountains and seas as borders. I only build forts at choke points when I don't plan to invade the other side. When there's still a war in the process with the possibilty of territorial gain I think it's better not to bother with defense logistics and instead fight the enemy in the open whenever it's possible.

Currently my empire has three "limites", a Thraikian Limes (I really don't want eastern europe, but Carrodunum might be convenient to swallow, we'll see), a Kimmerian Limes (no I don't want the steppe, not at all), and a Kaukasian Limes (same reason).

I don't follow the province boundaries always, instead I defend at choke points such as fords and passes, and in the Kaukasus area, a great part of my defence line is in Sarmatian or Eleutheroi territory, whereas little parts of my lands are only guarded by watchtowers.

The fort-garrisons consist of six units each, which are as follows:

Thraikian Limes:
1x Illyrioi Hippeis
2x Keltohellenikoi
1x Autokratorikoi Hoplitai Panoploi (I invented them, look like H. Indohellenikoi), plan to replace with Triballoi
2x Iaosatae

Kimmerian and Kaukasian Limes:
2x Skuda Baxy (sorry, the rider variant)
2x A. Hoplitai Panoploi
2x Skythian Archers

For when there is a war going on, and I face frequent invasions, I prefer a kind of "adaptive hinterland defense". My empire is divided into themai, military districts, that have a force of regionals in their capital (1x cavalry, 4x infantry, 2x missile). At unruly borders, these force is augmented to 2x cavaly, 4x infantry, 8x A. Hoplitai Panoploi, 4x missile and is often lead by a strategos.