Koinon Hellenon Campaign Question

I was well into my KH campaign holding the initial 3 settlements (Sparta,Athens,Rhodes) plus Kydonia,Korinth,Chalkis,Demetrias and Thermon (having to attack it after Makedonia took Ambrakia from friendly Epeiros).I was preparing a decent hoplite army to push into the Makedonian homeland (Pella) when all of a sudden at 260 BC Halikarnassos rebelled to me... unfortunately AS immediately sieged the city so i quickly assembled any troops i could save up from protecting my northern borderline +some mercenaries and landed them on Asia Minor.It's now 258 BC i have beaten AS , concluded an uneasy ceasefire with them and took the time to siege and capture Mytilene-Makedonia's Aegean stronghold. Now that i've stabilized my eastern front i'm back to my old plan of expelling Makedonia from all its coastal settlements...

What troubles me is that alot of people on this forum keep mentioning abt random eleutheroi cities turning to KH further on the game. So what should i expect ? Should i prepare some immediate-response troops(and if so where should i station them)? which cities and when exactly will rebel to me ??? thanks alot for any answers :beam:

It does happen a lot... I've seen Pergamon, Pantikapaion, Chersonesos, Syrakousai, and Emporion all rebel to the KH in various campaigns I've played. It could also happen with Massilia, Sinope, Trapezous, Byzantion, and maybe Kallatis and Olbia, but I don't recall seeing these ever rebel.

The fact is that all of those towns are pretty far away, so you might have some trouble getting troops there before they fall to a siege.

When a town that I have no desire to possess rebels to me, I usually use force diplomacy to give it back to its original owner and then force a peace treaty. This makes sense from an RP standpoint. Just pretend that revolutionary powers seized control of the city and petitioned the Koinon for protection. Needless to say, a real world government would only except such an offer if it fit in with their foreign policy. No one now or then would go to war with a major power just because some two-bit town decides to ask for protection.

Yes but you see Greeks Metropoleis always helped and protected their colonies when asked... supposedly it was a mother-daughter relationship... hmmmmmm, do they rebel with some general in at least ??? that way i can recruit some mercenary troops during the first hard years...

I personally would give those cities to another faction who is not currently in that region just to mix things up a little :)

Teucer, don't forget Sinope.

Most Hellenic cities found by Hellene sea farers in the past will rebel to you (if they were taken from the Eleutheroi).

As KH you have barracks around the Mediterranean everywhere!

~Fluvius

Yeah, most of them can recruit levy hoplites when you get them. They're incredibly good for their price, so just recruit a bunch of those and hope you can hold out until you can get more troops there.

can't recall that happening :(

I think Kyrene is also on the list.

In my current game with the KH I sent a diplomat to most of these cities(two that are next to each other get only one for both) I roleplayed them as Ambassador of the Leage. everytime a city is in danger one of my young FMs(or two I need be) who dick around in Athens or Sparta(agoge or Academy) is granted a half or quarter stack and takes the fleet to wherever Hellenes are oppressed by Imperialistic or barbaric Foes or both. concerning preperation I usually have a couple of ships in stationed in the harbors of athens Kreta and Rhodos and one or two in most of my harbors for that matter. this and I tend to keep at least one non levy unit which is not essencial to garrison duty in most of my provinces. depending on the threat, location, state of recruitment, current campaigns, peace treaties, Agoge progress and buget I pick up units along the way, enroll some haploi and psiloi or even purchase some Mercs to get an appropriate army.

this may not be the most efficient , realistic or inteigent way to play with the KH, but it is quite fun and a way around the idea that the KH would probably no be expansionist and thus the game would get very boring if roleplayed correctly^^

@Teucer

Are you sure that Syracuse rebelled to KH? In my campaign it rebelled to Epeiros!

In Real Life™ Syracuse rebelled from Epeiros.

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Originally Posted by Teucer

It does happen a lot... I've seen Pergamon, Pantikapaion, Chersonesos, Syrakousai, and Emporion all rebel to the KH in various campaigns I've played. It could also happen with Massilia, Sinope, Trapezous, Byzantion, and maybe Kallatis and Olbia, but I don't recall seeing these ever rebel.

The fact is that all of those towns are pretty far away, so you might have some trouble getting troops there before they fall to a siege.

When a town that I have no desire to possess rebels to me, I usually use force diplomacy to give it back to its original owner and then force a peace treaty. This makes sense from an RP standpoint. Just pretend that revolutionary powers seized control of the city and petitioned the Koinon for protection. Needless to say, a real world government would only except such an offer if it fit in with their foreign policy. No one now or then would go to war with a major power just because some two-bit town decides to ask for protection.

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After the Second Punic War the Res Publica Romana did in fact aid every two-bit town turning their way. KH and Ptolomoi against Mac and AS respectively comes to mind. Personally I believe the Romans decided to nip any potential threat in the bud, so they would not have to face another fight for their lives as with Carthage.

You can add Messana to that list BTW. When the carties took it from Rome in my current Sweboz game it rebelled to KH who then took Syracouse and have been besieging Lilabeo without luck a few times (I have no idea how they lost it was 16 vs 4 unit battles).

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In Real Life™ Syracuse rebelled from Epeiros.

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It wasn't really a rebellion. I'm pretty sure Alexandros and Pyrrhos actively supported Hieron II; they were allies (and probably more than just allies, as Pyrrhos' daughter married Hieron II).

I swear I've seen Syrakuse go to KH. I usually play with the RTW engine so I doubt they actually conquered the city.

Hold on... checking the relevant txt files

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hmm... that is odd. The faction creator is listed as thrace (ie Epeiros), so it is odd that it rebelled to KH. Maybe my memory is wrong, or else KH bribed the city.

Then again, I've seen Ankyra rebel to the Aedui before, so my guess is that there is always a small chance that a city will rebel to a different faction with the same culture type as its listed creator. I dunno :dizzy2:

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Originally Posted by Teucer

Then again, I've seen Ankyra rebel to the Aedui before, so my guess is that there is always a small chance that a city will rebel to a different faction with the same culture type as its listed creator. I dunno :dizzy2:

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I believe you mean the Arverni. That is who really deserves Ankyra.

Well, actually, even in RTW.exe soetimes, the AI will try to doing overseas mission. remember how vanilla Brutii and Scipii works?

I had Carthage send a bunch of balaeric light infantry and slingers over to Sardinia on my Rome game on RTW. That's about all I've ever seen though.

Anyways, I think there are two factions that settlements can rebel to. It has to do with upgrading the palace I think. Like Ankyra, by default it would rebel to the Arverni, but if the palace gets upgraded before it rebels, then it would rebel to the Aedui. I read that somewhere before, but I may just be pulling this info out of my butt, so someone correct me if I'm wrong.

i don´t see a problem here sincerly, it´s actually most of the fun of playing kh is sending diplomats to those city´s and wait for them to rebel

an important note is that sending spy´s normally doesn´t work because the ai is actually extremly good at controlling minor rebellions and stuff but with diplomats there (roleplay that they are defending the poor opressed greeks from the nasty and evil barbarians) they tend to rebel at the 1st chance they get

this is actually extremly usefull expecially in the crimean city´s where you get acess to those amazing heavyarchers

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I believe you mean the Arverni. That is who really deserves Ankyra.

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No, I meant Aedui. I've seen it happen, although it may have been after the Arverni had already been wiped out.

I have seen it go to both. It happens.

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Originally Posted by moonburn

i don´t see a problem here sincerly, it´s actually most of the fun of playing kh is sending diplomats to those city´s and wait for them to rebel

an important note is that sending spy´s normally doesn´t work because the ai is actually extremly good at controlling minor rebellions and stuff but with diplomats there (roleplay that they are defending the poor opressed greeks from the nasty and evil barbarians) they tend to rebel at the 1st chance they get

this is actually extremly usefull expecially in the crimean city´s where you get acess to those amazing heavyarchers

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Can you explain what you mean by this? A diplomat can't sit in a Rebel or any city but your own, and just leaving a diplomat near a city won't have any influence over it rebelling whatsoever...

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Originally Posted by moonburn

i don´t see a problem here sincerly, it´s actually most of the fun of playing kh is sending diplomats to those city´s and wait for them to rebel

an important note is that sending spy´s normally doesn´t work because the ai is actually extremly good at controlling minor rebellions and stuff but with diplomats there (roleplay that they are defending the poor opressed greeks from the nasty and evil barbarians) they tend to rebel at the 1st chance they get

this is actually extremly usefull expecially in the crimean city´s where you get acess to those amazing heavyarchers

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How can diplomats make a region rebel?

KH Bribe Syrakousai :2thumbsup: