Generals getting stars

Tired of my questions? :no: If not, here is one more.
Sometimes when you win a battle, you get a message that your general received +1 in command rating, but other times the general doesn't get any stars. Why does it happen and what are the conditions under which generals receive stars?

Nope, not tired at all.

Quoting myself from the Caravel mod thread:

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Originally Posted by gollum

Regarding general stars, a balance needs to be stricken from a gameplay perspective, and this mod sticks with that.

The need for balance comes from the fact that General stars give +1valor per 2command stars to all units under their command and that means that every unit gets a +1attack,+1defence,+2morale per valor point.

Essentially most mods charge up the game with more command stars for generals and also from titles. This mod sticks to the vanilla command stars that are more moderate, because past a certain point, if too many high star generals are around morale is downgraded as a gameplay element - armies fight to the last man as a rule. This is not how this mod is meant to play at all.

On the other hand, reducing too much the initial stars of generals does not make much sense either because the generals upgrade command stars as in Shogun TW that is: 1star for 1 victorious battle, 2 stars for 2 vict battles, 3 stars for 4 victorious battles, 4 stars for 8 victorious battles, 5stars for 16 victorious battles, 6 stars for 32 victoroius battles, 7 stars for 64 victorious battles, 8 stars for 128victorious battles and 9 stars for 256 victorious battles. Every loss counts as -1 to the general's record and he has to counteract it with +1 victory and reach the numbers said before for the stars. So for example, a general that has 32 victorious battles and loses 1 battle will lose his 6th star.

However, ShogunTW had 4 turns(seasons) per year while MTW has 1 turn per year (1turn=1year). This means that generals in MTW are around much less time (typically a faction leader will last 25 to 45 turns) in order to accumulate stars with Shoguns system (where a faction leader would live from say 25 to 65 ie 40yearsx4turns per year=160turns! much more time to raise his command stars...). Hence it is necessary to give them some initial stars, especially since hero characters (Jeanne d'Arc, Saladin etc) make appearances as Generals.

If however, too many initial stars are given (or from titles etc) the gameplay becomes warcraft; ie morale practically doesn't impact on the battles, and battles are won by greater numbers and more uber units and upgrades.

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So basically the answer to your question is that some generals with their victory they complete the string of +victories to get one more stars while others still haven't with their current victories.

Its not possible to know in MTW how many more victories your gerneral needs because this information is not given out, unlike in STW that general's victories recirds are given and so the player can choose who to use and how many more battles he needs to upgrade.

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Originally Posted by Gilrandir

Tired of my questions? :no: If not, here is one more.
Sometimes when you win a battle, you get a message that your general received +1 in command rating, but other times the general doesn't get any stars. Why does it happen and what are the conditions under which generals receive stars?

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And sometimes generals get vices/virtues as a result of a battle. This may also result in gaining stars.

And those v&v and titles doesn't count towards that scale.

It's pretty much impossible to test in MTW, but in STW it was also impossible to get above 127 victories. So it's possible that it's only due to the bonus stars that makes it possible to get 9 star generals. I've gotten the message, so it's certainly possible, just possibly not by the blunt way (a 4-star getting 4 more through titles should become a 9 star with 8 victories).

Gollum, the valour gotten from the general stars doesn't give morale bonuses. But the general itself gives bonuses based on the stars though. 1/star in close range and 0.5/star for every unit on the field. afaik they stack.

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Originally Posted by Ironside

Gollum, the valour gotten from the general stars doesn't give morale bonuses. But the general itself gives bonuses based on the stars though. 1/star in close range and 0.5/star for every unit on the field. afaik they stack.

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If that is so, thank you for correcting me Ironside, its good to know :bow:

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Originally Posted by Ironside

but in STW it was also impossible to get above 127 victories

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Yes, i have heard it so too. In STW i have never reached ablove 7 rank/stars that's 64+ vistorious battles record, simply because there isn't time enough for the most part to achieve this. Sasaki Kojiro posted in the Sword Dojo once that its impossible to go above the 127 as you say.

It is also most likely, as you mention, although indeed impossible to test, that the levels above that are entirely due to the stars coming from provincial and office titles bonuses.

I may be wrong, but it seems to me that if a general has one or two "inborn" stars (that is not received for victories, but given to him by the AI at his "birth"), it is qiute easy for him to get some more. But if it is a 5-6 star general (say, a former prince gotten disinherited by his nephew's accession to the throne), he doesn't get stars the way Gollum described. It takes him more than two victories to get two stars. Am I right or is it only a biased suspicion?

If you mean that a general comes with 5 stars, then it will get him another 8 victorious battles to get the 6th star, so no surprises there.

You seem to think that the list goes back to 0 no matter how many stars teh general comes with. But that is not the case; rather the general coming with the stars he has means that he is credited with the battles for those stars - so in the example it means 8 victorious battles for 5 stars. Then to reach the 16 vict. battles for the 6th star, he needs 8 more.

This works like that in STW, as the generals that come with more than 0 stars also come with the victoriuos battles needed for them, but in that game as mentioned you can see the record of every general unlike MTW. I strongly suspect that it is exactly the same in MTW.

I see the point, although it doesn't sound fair to me. If a general is a born commander with 4-5 stars, it seems natural for him to win first two battles and get his next two stars. But the game doesn't leave us any choice in this issue.
The connected question is what "winning a battle" means. Do you have to excell on the battlefield only? What about cases when the enemy withdraws into the fortress without putting up a fight or leaves the province in the same way?
Moreover, I won two battles in the following manner: in one I was the attacker and I managed to outmanoeuver (just look at the consequence of vowels!!) the enemy taking higher positions so finally he left the field without an arrow being shot; in the second I was the defender and the enemy, after having a look at my troops, thought better of it and left the field. Are those star-winning victories?

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Originally Posted by Girlandir

I see the point, although it doesn't sound fair to me. If a general is a born commander with 4-5 stars, it seems natural for him to win first two battles and get his next two stars. But the game doesn't leave us any choice in this issue.

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Well yes, as you say its nothing we can decide :)

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The connected question is what "winning a battle" means. Do you have to excell on the battlefield only? What about cases when the enemy withdraws into the fortress without putting up a fight or leaves the province in the same way?
Moreover, I won two battles in the following manner: in one I was the attacker and I managed to outmanoeuver (just look at the consequence of vowels!!) the enemy taking higher positions so finally he left the field without an arrow being shot; in the second I was the defender and the enemy, after having a look at my troops, thought better of it and left the field. Are those star-winning victories?

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I believe they are - or at least were counted as such in STW (again in MTW you can;t tell as there is no display of battle records for geberals). Basically any encounter that the opponent appears on the field (he doesn't retreat from the province or in the fortifications), and is either routed or killed or made to retreat is a victory - or at least so i think :)