Can We Stop Being Petulant Children

Can we finally say "starving the beast" is DOA? A 3 word buzz phrase used to pander for votes. I don't understand how people can cut taxes ( I will not use the word revenue, we are all adults here. Toads bump their ass when they jump and the gov't collects taxes. If you can't handle this fact talk to your therapist or become an inconsequential libertarian wearing your Ron Paul'12 t-shirt as you smash together 10 mins of non sequiters on you tube to PROVE that humanity is here to acquire capital and property. ) Still continue to spend at the same rate, and then be perplexed as to why the debt is going up.

I also don't understand how people think cutting Planned Parenthood, the EPA, and school lunches for poor kids will be anything more than a bb pellet in a cows ass.

Granted these things get wrapped into talking points and sound bites that are about as useful as tits on a bull

We are looking at SS and Medicare as what 50%? of the budget Next in line are DoD and the interest on the debt (which, to me, is HILIRAOUS.)

Simpson-Bowels seem to have a pretty middle of the road approach; I would love to see a bit more cuts congruent with an assurance that will we have tax increases. Currently we are getting 60 cents on the dollar and that ain't getting fiber out of cotton.


Just cutting spending won’t work but what I fear is the R’s will get into office, cut inconsequential social programs, declare victory, and we’ll be back in this mess in a few years. The D’s would do the same but it’s not there turn
At some point the world isn’t going to need us like they do now.

But wait! We got involved in two wars, passed MEdicare PArt D, did a bailout preceded by lots of mini-bailouts, then got a new president who was naieve enough to think he could fix it with more bailouts, a joke-of-a-healthcare plan, cap and trade and a third war. And now instead of getting a tax credit for buying a humvee under Bush I get a tax credit for buying a little over-priced gay go-kart because it is "green" but not really

Time to stop blaming Bush, you say? I think not, he is just as culpible as the current administration. But how did the economy look up during Bush even though taxes were cut? I'll give you a hint: wars temporarily stimulate the economy, even moreso when half the soldiers are reservists who open up job vacancies when they get shipped off, thereby lowering the unemployment rate. Even more so when common tasks that should be done by American soldiers are contracted to US companies who overpay their employees and artificially boost the tax base and GDP with money paid by the government that never existed in the first place. Even more so when the wars injure tens of thousands of soldiers who have to return home and be cared for by both government and private healthcare providers. Then, eventually, it comes time to pay.

Trickle down economics works on a local, micro level and that is it. On a macro level it is a joke, and fails to take into consideration what people and companies do with their extra money, like save it or spend it overseas. What really tickles me is that eliminating something like the child-tax credit would be considered a tax increase, while not giving an agency an annual budget increase would be considered a "spending cut" when really neither case is true.

There is no reason for poor people to get more back from the government than they paid in taxes through EIC and child tax credits. There is no reason not to drug test or dig through the trash of people on welfare. There is no reason to give a corporation a decrease in tax liability because their actual profits were less than their projected profits, tax them on their actual and be done with it. There is no reason that a bank, who makes money hand-over-fist off of foreclosures, should get a bailout because of excess foreclosures.

But who am I to judge. I mean look at the tax issues facing all the people in Washington. Look at who leads the country. There is no accountability, there never has been, and there never will be. So much of our market is made up of things that are not real, things that do not exist. This whole thing is one big joke

People are P*****. Politicians are even bigger ones. As a result they will never undertake the hard and politically suicidal task of making true reform. This would include,

Reforming Social Security and Medicare. These programs are a joke they are literally giant steaming pieces of crap.

Fixing the way the DOD operates. The best you can say for the military is that it creates some economic stimulation and serves a valuable purpose not least being a social guinea pig. However, the militaries buying practices and immense levels of red tape at contractor levels is horrendous and obviously needs reform.

Reforming the way the tax system works. Loopholes only exist because the government wrote the law. You cannot bitch and moan about loophole tax evasion when you write the damn laws. Once again more bureaucratic bull

Wefare....... i do not even wan to broach the idiocy that permeates this. No i do not believe everybody is entitled to the handouts. You should not be getting unemployment if your last job was 5 years ago and you were terminated for being a crack whore.

Do politicans do any of this on either side of the party line? Nope, they bitch and moan about the dire straits america is in but they just sit their with their thumbs up their butts wondering why things aren't doing super. And then when they decid to be "proactive" they add a trillion or so dollars to the debt in "stimulus"

Hey here's a thought america. Just because it appears everyone decided Keynesian economics were the be all end all it does not mean it really is. And at least if your gonna prescribe to that line of economic reasoning at least do it right. I swear to god nothing is more disgusting then seeing the way politicians scrabble around with taxpayers hard earned cash to get their ********** districts some of the cash so that they can go back and say "I did this for you" now relect me so i can screw over all of your future children.

America had real growth in the 19th Century as it expanded. It then got a massive boost in WW1 by trading with Europe and competition all but destroyed. WW2 was then another wonderful external boost where industry had the European market again and took vast amounts of European money.

Then... things started to change. Foreign competition coupled with increasing social security spending at home. Real growth tailed off, and so was replaced by fake growth as by this point Americans were used to a perpetual increased in standards of living. Property bubbles, dotcom bubbles - anything that makes money out of nothing for a time.

~:smoking:

Whatever happened to the good ole days where we razed a country and then rebuilt it with someone elses money, like the international community or said countries resources itself?

Now we pay for everything. Everything, everything, everything. Here ya go Haiti. Here ya go Mexico. Here ya go Pakistan. Here ya go country that hates us.

That is half the narrative.

You also destabilise Mexico due to the insane "war on drugs" and loose gun policies - creating both the reason and the means for slaughter.
Pakistan you help support a Military dictatorship with a democratic façade whilst destabilising it at the same time with illegal drone attacks and extra-judicial assassinations.
Afghanistan is again supporting a puppet dictator who fixes elections and tries to embezzle as much money as he can before the clock runs out.
Haiti? Well, that was pocket change in the greater scheme of things.
Billions to Egypt under the old regime.
Saying Israel hate America is probably a bit strong, but they sure don't let anything get in the way of their objectives, and that is more billions flowing out.

And technically most of the time you're spending China's money as they are bankrolling the Dollar at the moment.

~:smoking:

Tax rises are an interesting conundrum, yes you need to raise taxes, but which ones?

Raising income tax just upsets people, and while it is a reliable source of revenue it depresses growth because you are taking someone's money before they spend it (this is why revenue goes up when upper-rate taxes fall), loath as we are to admit it the rich pay for the rest of us. At the top end the very rich are taxed huge amounts on their earnings that they might otherwise spend on cars, boats, maids.... actually economic activity that provides jobs for others who also pay tax.

At the same time, low interest rates and taxes on stock and savings encorage people to spend on credit rather than saving or investing.

Then you have a stupidly expensive heathcare system. Here's a tip America, if your taxes are paying for that doctor you shouldn't have to pay again for his services - he isn't worth that much. Then add in pet military projects, foriegn wars, special interest groups and the polarisation of American politics and the problems are fairly obvious.

Unfortunately, the fixes aren't.

I think the Simpson-Bowles presented a good framework, including deep spending cuts and some tax increases. But the GOP will not entertain tax increases, and Obama is trying to take only the tax increases from Simpson-Bowles (a generalization, but you get the point).

CR

Oh look, someone who wants to cut spending and raise taxes (and by raise taxes I mean cut deductions and loopholes, which really sin't raising taxes per se, but thats what opponents will call it.)

http://www.newsok.com/sen.-tom-cobur...ad_story_title

For example, other than the fact that its convenient to Americans, theres really no reason to be able to deuct mortgage interest from taxable income. He wants to eliminate that. The argument that this deduction stimulates home purchases and encourages home ownership is outright unproven and false, and I think recent events will show us that perhaps the government whould not be in the business of encouraging home ownership through massive entitlements and deductions because, well, then we get a housing bubble yay.