Swords and spears

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10-30-2003, 20:44
CBR

I have made 5 100 battle tests so far. All on flat terrain with both spears and swords charging each other and swords in wedge. The few battles where a general died quick and made a unit run was not considered(just ran more battles)

CMAA v Order foot
Win/lose: 90/10
Average kills/losses: 67/26

CMAA v Chivalric Sgts
Win/lose: 100/0
Average kills/losses: 60/15

FMAA v Order Foot
Win/lose: 29/71
Average kills/losses: 58/40

FMAA v Chivalric Sgts
Win/lose: 79/21
Average kills/losses: 64/29

FMAA v Armoured Spearmen
Win/lose: 99/1
Average kills/losses 61/17

I will do some more tests later

CBR
10-30-2003, 23:46
Kraxis

So swords will defeat spears that are about 40-45% more expensive in general.

Maybe one should campare to the swords in Close.
10-31-2003, 05:55
MizuKokami

well that sucks http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/angry.gif
10-31-2003, 14:34
Pitt_Slayer

well when i played stw spear were good and in real war they were shit hot BUT when i started playing mp(mtw) i learnt not us spear unless it was for stop cav flanking stuff cos they got beat bad BUT on lower florins ie 5k they started to become good.
i wont use them unless its 5k simple as that.
10-31-2003, 16:00
t1master

how bout the sap cbr? we know those guys are tuff
10-31-2003, 16:31
CBR

I do plan to test out SAP too. But it does take time to do these tests heh

CBR
10-31-2003, 19:07
Nigel

Just to make things more complicated.

What valor level are you testing at ?
10-31-2003, 19:25
Louis de la Ferte Ste Colombe

Slightly OT

Louis,
10-31-2003, 19:54
Rob The Bastard

Huh? what?... I'm awake

"Foraging For Fungi in the Forest..."

Slightly off topic?

http://www.wise.net.nz/users/robm/flyingpig.gif
10-31-2003, 20:49
t1master

that pig oddly enough, looks like uglyham after he's foraged some of his majic truffles, or at least after he's served them up... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif

and i'll be happy to help ya test out the sap cbr.
10-31-2003, 22:59
Kraxis

I think SP are significantly more important that SAP when it comes to this. SAP is 3 times more expensive than CMAA while SP is 2 times. If CMAA can defeat SP, then something is very wrong. We all know CMAA won't defeat SAP at equal Valour.
10-31-2003, 23:04
Louis de la Ferte Ste Colombe

Quote:

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Kraxis @ Oct. 31 2003,16:59)]We all know CMAA won't defeat SAP at equal Valour.

Well, we don't all know. For me, it was not that obvious, or maybe I forgot, or something... I though CMAA had a chance. But I got a reminder yesterday, thanks... *ouch*

It hurts.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

Louis,
10-31-2003, 23:05
Louis de la Ferte Ste Colombe

Quote:

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Rob The Bastard @ Oct. 31 2003,13:54)]Huh? what?... I'm awake

"Foraging For Fungi in the Forest..."

Slightly off topic?

http://www.wise.net.nz/users/robm/flyingpig.gif

Welcome to the Jousting Fields, Rob

*throw mushroom*

*hide in wood*

Louis,
10-31-2003, 23:28
Kraxis

Quote:

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Louis de la Ferte Ste Colombe @ Oct. 31 2003,16:04)]Well, we don't all know. For me, it was not that obvious, or maybe I forgot, or something... I though CMAA had a chance. But I got a reminder yesterday, thanks... *ouch*

It hurts.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

Louis,

Hehe...

Damn, now my special move has been busted. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif Now I can't suck you into such a fight again, I had hoped you had forgotten what CBR did.
11-01-2003, 00:25
t1master

Quote:

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Kraxis @ Oct. 31 2003,16:28)]

Quote:

Originally Posted by [b

Quote[/b] (Louis de la Ferte Ste Colombe @ Oct. 31 2003,16:04)]Well, we don't all know. For me, it was not that obvious, or maybe I forgot, or something... I though CMAA had a chance. But I got a reminder yesterday, thanks... *ouch*

It hurts.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...cons/joker.gif

Louis,

Hehe...

Damn, now my special move has been busted. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif Now I can't suck you into such a fight again, I had hoped you had forgotten what CBR did.

i found that out yesterday whilst chewing on the end of cbr's pikes, but it was one of the best games i'd had in a while
11-01-2003, 00:55
Kraxis

Oh, so that was you... I thought the name reminded me of somebody. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif
11-01-2003, 01:09
t1master

yep the same... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif
11-01-2003, 01:51
Kraxis

I have done a few preliminary tests of SP and SAP vs CMAA.

In a third of the battles the SP lost, but not without making the CMAA pay. Losses ranged from half to double of the CMAA. The charge had no effect whatsoever (:eek:), in fact the CMAA killed about 3-4 in every charge while the SP killed 0 and only initially did the SP have the advantage. When the CMAA passed about 40 men left, the tide turned in almost all battles and they bit back (reason was the SP lost cohesion).
This was not what I had hoped for. Apparently the swords also get the +1 attack against pikes.
I proves it can pay to fight SP with CMAA at times, and even in equal fights as it is long and drawn out.

The SAP on the other hand kicked the CMAA all over the place. Got losses from as low as 5 to 21 compared to abnout 35-40 CMAA losses in general. Again the charge had no effect (even in Engange), despite it is of no less than 12 (chargebonus 4 + rankbonus 4 + melee 2 + rankbonus 2).
The reason the SAP didn't suffer was because it managed to continue its forward advance, something the SP didn't manage.