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Using the map editor to create a custom battle map leaves me with some questions:
1. How do I determine startingpoints for each army on the battle-map?
2. How do I create farms? Is there a palette for it?
3. How do I create sea, both on the map and in the background?
4. Beaches, how do I do it?
Thanks in advance
1. Not possible.
2. Use the textures and models-section of the map-editor.
3. Hold left (guess also the other works) "Alt" on the keyboard and click with the left mouse button on a place with a certain height you want to have as the sealevel.
4. With textures. Also the beach should be in the east of the map.
The important thing is to have somewhere in the east a part with sea to get a working beach.
I would link them also with your beach, if your main beach is not in the east.
I personally haven't tried that, but is it possible to make an island map? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...gc-curtain.gif
Regards
EC
EDIT: On 3: Do what Antalis said, he's the map-expert here. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...icons/wink.gif
You can't I'm afraid. With the single exception of Historical Battles and Campaigns, it is done by the game following some rules. I don't remember them very well right now but I'll try:Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
1)When there is riverbattles the attacker always start on the "North" side of the map (or was it the other way round??)
2)Castlebattles; defender starts in what the computer can recognise as a closed ringwall. When there are several ringwalls, the one with the keep/fort enclosed is defined as the main castle.
3) In open battles it depends a bit on the strategymap I think, it can vary.
By combining buildings and tiles. You will find farm-houses and hedges among the buildings, and tiles with different agricultural fields.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
"Fly" under the surface, and you will see that the sea-level is below the landscape. Make a low-point on the map with the same level that you want the sea to have. Then hold Alt and then right-click (I think this was so, but not sure) with the mouse on that point. This will be the new sea-level.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Well, make a slowly sloping downhill and do the above. Then use sandy tiles.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Ok here are some more "secrets" of map-making:
I randomly discovered some of those functions (some with the help of my cat http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif , because she walked over my keyboard, lol) :
To copy a height:
1. Click anywhwere on the map with the right height, then hold "STRG"+"ALT". Than paste it with the left or right (doesn´t matter) Mouse button.
After you have paste some terrain heights, press "Enter" to make them smooth.
2. Raising terrain with different sizes:
Use 1-9 of your keyboard.
1 is the smallest brush, 9 the largest.
3. Set textures very fast:
Go into your textures section of the map-editor:
-Press space: Look at your minimap:
You will get a map-grid with the possiblity to set textures very fast on the minimap.
-Press space again and
you will get an overview of the textures you can use.
----
About islands: I´v tried it 2 times and failed, but maybe the troops had no terrain to deploy.
But I guess it doesn´t working.
HOW TO MAKE MAPIMAGES:
(preview pictures in the custom battle and in the campaign)
First you´ll need a graphic program like "Paint shop pro 8":
You can download a trial version (60 days) at:
Paint Shop Pro 8 trial version
Than you will need also a second graphic-software that can save in the lbm-format.
But be aware: Paint-shop pro (and I think no other software can, except Ultimate paint) cannot save it right in lbm-format, so you will need:
"Ultimate Paint 2.8 or higher (maybe also lower)":
Ultimate paint
Its also a sharware version (so don´t use it too often ).
If it don´t working anymore, use another version of it (or delete your harddisc, lol, or buy it).
Ok, here we go: Make an ingamescreenshot with F2 from your map.
You will find your screens in the TGA folder.
Open this image with Paint Shop Pro and open also a new white image there with the resolutuion: 716x120.
Select the whole new white paper with the selection tool:
Than select a part of your screenshot (the part you will show in the preview), and press copy in the panel above.
Now go back to the white new image and click on it: Now its activated.
Go to "Edit"/Paste/Paste into selection".
Now your mapimage has the right resolution.
Save it as tga-format.
Now open this new tga with Ultimate Paint and go to "save as": Choose "AMIGA IFF (iff, lbm, bbm, ilb, ilbm).
BUT after you have choosen AMIGA IFF you HAVE TO WRITE behind the name of your map: "lbm".
You cannot save it without this
Example what you have to write while saving it: "hillyinland04.lbm"
Also Choose 256 colours
So now your mapimage is finished and ready to get tested.
Your new mapimage goes into the MapImage folder (Battle/Mapimage/Arid, Lush, Temperate and so on": Choose the right clima folder for your map: Arid, Lush, Temperate and so on.
So if you have made your screenshot in a Temperate area and your startpos.txt definitions have only temperate areas (look into it): Then the mapimage goes into your "Temperate" folder.
It must have the exact same name as your map
So if you are very buisy, then make a mapimage for every clima-zone, but that depends how much you don´t like the imagination of a arid-mapimage and you fight on a temperate battlefield ,)
Antalis
btw: Can we make this a sticky, where all mapmaker could write theire tipps and expiriences with mapmaking?
To build a castlemap:
The castle should be near (or in) the middle of the map.
And never use "Don´t snap model to gruid" when you´re building the walls and gates
For towers and keeps it doesn´t matter.
Use ALWAYS the "Snap model to grid centre/edge/corner" (try what from this 3 is best for the currently situation) to get a working castle.
Will walls, which are not closed as a ring will work: No.
Your castle must always be closed:
Never like this: "-----"
So it should look like : "[]"
Explain raising terrain with 1-9 on the keyboard as I was a child Antalis.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
I have made working island maps but Norseman´s persistance that it will fail eventually makes me worried since they are gems to play. I guess extensive game-testing is the only thing to do. What I did was to make a small land-connection in the north and south.
Activate in the mapeditor your heights-raise-section in the panel above:
Press the number 1 on your keyboard to get a very small brush to make hills and so on.
Use 9 on the keyboard and you´ll get the largest brush to make very large hills in no time.
1-9 (numbers on your keyboard) means that with every step from 1-9 the brush to raise a hill or dig a hole is larger.
Use the left mouse button to raise a hill, the right to make it smaller.
How to create a castlemap with a river:
The castle has to be in the south of the map on the other side of the river.
The attacker has the abbility also to DEPLOY on the battlefield, like the defender
He starts like in riverbattles comon, on the other side of the river.
The defender starts in the castle.
So you have both: A riverbattle and a castleattack map in one map.
Thanks Norseman for some tipps in this case.
Here is a screenshot of such a map:
http://max45.250free.com/castle6.jpg
btw: If you have any tipps for battlefieldmapmaking, please post them here.
Awsome castle-map , as usual, Antalis I thought I played every darn castle-map in HTW but I sorley missed this one though - which one is it? One creative point of critisism from me regarding the HTW castle-maps though, is that too many of them looks pretty much like the next. Nomatter how exiting you get playing HTW at some point the player is going to auto-resolve many castle-battles.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Q: When placing bridges on the map do I extend them in lenght, if needed, in the same way as with walls: place, left-click to get a longer one etc or how do I do it?
Q: If I decide to have two bridges on a map will that confuse the battle-engine? Ex: on a rivermap can I have a water-grave?, sorry for the spell, around the castle with yet another bridge?
Thanks for your kind words about that river-castlemap http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/cheers.gif
Well the castles in HTW follow a construction plan with upgrades and so on, so I cannot make them very variable and there should always something like an acropolis and sometimes a city with a wall around.
Since the beta 2.01 I´ve reworked many of the castles and made much better textures for them.
Also: I kicked castlehilly08 and added one new castle-series.
You will not find that river-castle-map in the actual beta: I´ve reworked castlehilly01 for it.
You will find the new river-castle map in the next beta.
To your questions:
1. Placing bridges is quite simple: You need a working river. Thats the important thing: Without that MTW will not know that its a riverbattle.
I always make one part of the river more in the south at the right site, a bit below, and then make the rest of the river. This always works well (look at the minimap in the image).
Then place anywhere at the river your bridge.
The bridge is now short and reaches not the other site, but that doesn´t matter.
Then start a custom battle and you will see that your bridge fits yet to the other river site.
Now MTW knows that you´ve created a rivermap.
Or you build a river without a bridge, start a custom battle and a bridge is automaticaly set on a good place (but you can delete it afterwards).
Go back to the map-editor and now you can set bridges, which will automatically fits to the other river site.
2. No you cannot make a working water ditch, which goes around the whole castle: The engine of MTW is very limited for rivers.
But you can make a water ditch like this:
Your water ditch should not surrounding the whole castle.
To make a working bridge on such a water ditch:
You need a piece of land exactly in front of
the bridge on the other part of the water ditch to get a working bridge there (thats the reason, why the water ditch should not surround the whole castle).
Look at the screenshot: (This castle is not from me, I only solved a problem there and made this working bridge):
http://max45.250free.com/calais.jpg
But you can place up to 3 bridges, but not one in the south and one in the north, like in front of the castle and behind of it in a water grave.
Water is always a problem: A single river is working well, coast should be in the east, lakes should not be to large and also not too long and the river should go from one side of the map to the other, from right to left (or vice versa).
I am going to pin this topic for now.
I will leave it here as long as it takes to post relevant information, once it has been built up to a decent guide it will be moved to the Repository for safekeeping and future refrence, I will prune any posts that are not needed for the topic, and to those who post here please stay on topic and do not repeat information already included.
...LOS
Thank you LOS http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ons/cheers.gif
Thanks LoSQuote:
Originally Posted by [b
If thread is now pinned is there a way to change the header to more accurately reflect the topic of the thread? Or a completely new sticky-thread on the topic could be created? I think a more correct header should be: "Battlemap editing - Q&A´s". What do you think?
How steep does a hill need to be to be unpassable/ greyed out on the minimap. Is there a separate landscape texture for this? What I mean is can any texture be used like woods, grass etc and just by raising the ground enough creates an unpassable cliff? Darn, I hate not being able to express myself fully in English sometimes. It would be better if everyone was speaking Swedish, LoL
Yes, it depends, which textures you´re using:
No matter how steep the mountain is.
If you´re using, as an example, a cliff texture AND you make a height or hole you will get an unpassable area.
Not on flat ground, also if you´re using a cliff textures
So you will need both: The right texture and a height (or hole).
If you´re making a mountain with forrest textures, you will get no unpassable area, no matter how large your mountain is.
If you´re making a hill or mountain without the right texture, then you´re units can walk like flys up the walls of the mountain.
Very strange.
There are three groups of textures, which can be used for unpassable areas.In my picture are the arid version of them, but its always the same texture numbers:
http://max45.250free.com/textures.jpg
Antalis
Although I have always experienced the same as you before, I somehow, just by making a downhill, got an unpassable area on the Carcassonne map currently in my workshop. The texture is the basic one(nr.4?). Methinks this is a bit odd .Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Well, it actually suits the map very well so I won't try to change it, but I thought I should mention it. You can have a look at it when the map is finished if you're interested.
Thanks guys I suspected that it was connected to certain textures. I just had an idea and needed someone to spoil it for me, he he Are we the only ones interested in this topic?
Yahoo... three musketeers rides again http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg.../ht_charge.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/grouphug.gif
How to implementate a custom battlefieldmap into the campaign:
Open your MTW-Maps folder (Battle/Maps): There you will find very different names for maps.
But they have always the same elements in the name:
plains
flat
hilly
mountain
inland
coastal
river
desert
steppes
to
hills
Now open a campaignmap.txt, like "early.txt" (campmap/startpos): There are the landscape definitions:
You will find definitions for terrain, clima, architecture style.
Scroll down a bit in this early.txt and you will find this landscape definitions:
//========================================
//Border Info
//Attributes of borders between provinces
//and the maps available to each border
//========================================
As an example:
SetBorderInfo:: ID_NORTH_UMBRIA ID_MERCIA 7712 6000 0 LUSH AT_WESTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND FLAT NO_RIVER
What is defined here:
If you´re attacking FROM North_Umbria TO Mercia you will get a "FLAT" terrain, with a "LUSH" clima and with "WESTERN_EUROPEAN" architecture style.
Also the battlefieldmap is INLAND (not coastal).
So, the battlefieldmap that will be used in such a battle will have this name: "flatinland01" (or any number: from 01-...) (don´t know if there is an end: but I doubt so)).
Other example:
SetBorderInfo:: ID_KHAZAR ID_CHERNIGOV 27656 6568 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND FLT2HLL RIVER
Name of the map that would be used: "flattohillsinlandriver01"
You can see that this is a rivermap with a river definition: The "NO_" (NO_RIVER) is deleted and only RIVER is written.
But don´t beliefe that your map has to be really flat and inland like in the first example: If it has this NAME then it will be used, no matter if its in reallity a mountainmap or something else.
-------------------
Look again into your mapsfolder: You will find following names for maps (wihout the castles):
flatinland
flatinlandriver
flattohillsinland (FLT2HLL/HLL2FLT: vice versa)
flattohillsinlandriver
flattomountaininland
hillyinland
hillycoastal
hillyinlandriver
hillytomountaininland (HLL2MNT/MNT2HLL: vice versa)
mountaininland
mountaincoastal
plainsinland
plainsinlandriver
desertflat
deserthilly
desertcoastal
steppesinland
---------------
You can see again: flat, hilly, mountain, inland, coastal, plains, river and so on.
Sometimes there is a "to" in it and "hills".
So all you have to do is to name your custom map with such a name that fits to your landscape (but you must not, the name is the important thing): If you have made a mountainmap without a coast then name it: "mountaininland01" (02, 03, 04, 05 ...) (never forget the zero).
If your mountainmap has a coastal-character, then: "mountaincoastal01".
But MTW is very flexible: You could also define new names:
like: "mountaininlandriver":
SetBorderInfo:: ID_BURGUNDY ID_MILAN 11600 12968 0 ARID AT_SOUTHERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN RIVER
Then simply put the custom map into your Maps folder (Battle/Maps) and if you have replaced all maps with your maps you will always get them in the campaign.
If you have only replaced a few or only one then not very often, randomly.
So evertime you´re attacking a province from a province with the attack-definition (from province1->province2) (look above) for the battlefieldmap "mountaininland" you could get your map to play.
If you don´t want to replace a map and only want to add one, then give it a number fitting to the existing maps: So if you have a flatmap and MTW has 24 flatmaps in the Maps-folder, then give your map the name "flatinland25" and you will not replacing any map of MTW and have added one.
Antalis
Excellent work Antalis:: http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...-2thumbsup.gif
Antalis, you´re a fountain of knowledge. I´m stunned and amazed. This is exactly the kind of inormation I need. Thanks a mill http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...gc-stunned.gif
Ok a bit more http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...ns/biggrin.gif :
This I have written in the NTW forum about creating a new maps folder (without the need of replacing the maps in the MTW folder):
"Do you plan to replace all MTW maps?
Thats a huge work, but its worthing.
If you don´t want to replace all maps in the maps folder, you could create a new maps folder:
It must have the name, which you have defined in the startpos.txt:
You have written in 2.09 beta there: SetMapTexturesSubdir:: "nap".
This nap-folder has to be in the Maps folder.
So: "Battle/Maps/nap.
Put in this new folder the NTW landscapes.
For every definition in the startpos.txt (like hilly, FLT2HLL, MOUNTAINS ...) put some landscape-maps in it.
But you need also a nap-textures folder in Battle/MapImage.
So Battle/MapImage/nap .
There you have to put every mapimage you need for your new maps and put them in the right folders.
You must create there:
If you have lush and temperate definitions, you need a lush and temperate folder there and so on.
Only problem is that if you´ll release a new beta/version the maps will be doubled in the mapslist in custom-battles and map-editor list (problem is that MTW allows only 1000 maps there).
So if someone has two campaignmap.txts of two different NTW versions installed: For example v2.00 and v 2.09, then that happens.
But that is no problem, if you have lesser then 1000 maps what I know.
So you could tell the people than to delete the old campaign.txt(s), or you could replace the old campain.txt(s) with exact the same name of the new campaign.txt.
Put the castles in the normal Maps folder (you must replace every castlemap there.
It depends on the definitions you have made in the startpos-txt-file (in the castlepart there) which castleseries you need to replace. If you don´t have plains-castle definitions you don´t need to replace the castleplains, what I know).
For hilly thats 5 series to replace."
Antalis
...moore, mooore, moooore... my preciousssss http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg.../gc-greedy.gif
Ok more, but not from me:
This thread is thought as collection of knowledge about maps, the map-editor, landscapes, castles and definitions:
Everyone can post in here to share his knowledge about creating maps and everything surrounding it.
So here is something "Norseman" has posted in a thread in the topic "Castles and maps" (started by ShadesWolf) and should also be posted here I think:
Thanks Norseman for those very good informations: You helped me very much with that, when I read it some months ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Antalis
Yeah, Norse showed me that one and some other stuff a while back but it´s good that it gets posted here... real good info. How fortunate I am to have two mentors in mapmaking. Maybee I´ll play the lottery this weekend... if my luck doesn´t run out until then.
How to make new ground textures:
Here the basics about making new ground textures: I never used new one in my maps, because I thought the one in MTW are ok.
But here the knowledge about making them:
Open your Textures/Ground-folder:
There you will find all used MTW ground textures seperated from each other in different clima-folders .
Choose one clima, where you want to add a new texture:
As an example "Arid": Open the Arid folder and you will find 181 textures there.
If you want to add a new texture to arid, open one of the textures there or make a absolutly new one with your graphic editing software.
I use Paint-Shop pro 8.
It must have the resolution: 256x256 with 16 million colors and it must have the tga-format.
Ok, make your new texture and save it in tga format outside of MTW with a new number (as example "182").
Then open your texture again with IRFAN VIEW and save it again as tga-format and put it into your Arid folder (Textures/Ground/Arid).
If you use your tga of Paint shop pro 8 it will crash when you´re loading your map or map-editor.
I don´t know if another graphic software can save it as tga and it works except Irfan View (try it).
Now you can choose and use a new texture in the map-editor.
You can also change the existing textures if you want.
Is it possible to make a new unpassable area: No.
It seems that it depends on the number of the texture and every new texture will only be a normal texture.
And never forget that if you will add a new texture to a clima folder also the other folders in the Ground folder need it in it (changed if you want to lush style and so on) if you want to play your map also in other clima zones.
btw: You can also change the water texture: Its texture nr.: "000".
http://max45.250free.com/new.jpg
Antalis
The castledefinitions:
Open your campmap/startpos folder: Open as example your "Viking.txt" and search the castledefinitions:
//========================================
//Castle Map Groups
//specifies the number of castle map groups
//available to this start pos.
//This is needed for determining which
//castle maps are to be used for each region
//in siege battles.
//========================================
example:
SetAttributes:: ID_LANDREG_27 "Middel Seaxe" 0 CATHOLIC_CULTURE LUSH AT_DARK_AGE_EUROPEAN -1 120 "Bilmiga" INLAND FLAT NO_RIVER TRUE
Maybe you have asked yourshelf sometimes, why there are also definitions for landscapes:
Well in this definitions for the castles is defined what landscape-type will be used, if in this province where the castle stands, is a rebellion, or if troops trying to break a siege.
In this example from above a flatinlandmap will be be used if there is a rebellion.
Also a castleflat-map will be used too, if there is a castle assault.
You cannot find all landscape types there:
Only:
flat
plains
mountain
hilly.
Look into your Maps folder (Battle/Maps): You will find three different castlenames there:
castleflat
castleplains
castlehilly
Which castlemap will be used depends on the castledefinitions: If plains is defined , then a castleplainsmap will be used and so on.
If mountain is defined the castlehillymap will be used what I know, also if hilly is defined.
Also: What landscape-type is written, if you click on a province, depends what you have defined in the castledefinitions.
Antalis
He he, Antalis my friend. Either you´ve been waiting for this thread to start for a veeery looong time, or you are on a serious educational tour? Keep´em coming... you´ve got one serious fan atleast.