Diadochi

As Alexander the Great lay on his death bed, his generals and close friends gathered around him... soon the inevitable question had to be asked... who would be alexander's successor, to whom his kingdom would be passed? #Alexander responded simply.. To the strongest

The Diadochi (Successors) will be a new mod featuring a host of new units that i am currently creating in 3d.. it will also feature a brand new campmap covering all of alexanders empire as well as perimeter territories..will #feature unique style of game play loosely based on dbm gaming rules (giving battles a more chess like feel). There will be an immense amount of new units including several different types of elephants.. scythe chariots.. immitation legionaires... various forms of pike phalanxes.. etc..
Time period will run from alexander's death until roman expansion.Factions listed at bottom of this post.

in game screenies & models, will continue to update

Campmap
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17648

1.Pantodapoi
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=14872

2.Thracian Mercenaries
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=14873

3.Diadoch (Pk) Phalanx
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=14874

4.Immitation Legionaire
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=14926

5.Cretan Archer
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=15036

6.Machimoi
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17049

7.Galatian Heavy Warband
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17223

8.Generic Archer Type
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17274

9.Generic foot (javelin)
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17276

10.Libyan Style Spearman
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17280

11.Heavy Cavalry Type A
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17282

12.Argyraspid (Silver Shield) Pike
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17331

13.Thracian Auxillary
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17334

14.Galatian Fanatic
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17377

15.Hypaspist
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17412

16.Thracian Noble
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17415

17.Generic Light Cavalry
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17465

18.Hellenic Pike Phalanx
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17472

19.Eastern Archer
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17473

20.Galatian Light Infantry
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17476

21.Euzonoi
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17490

22.Greek Light Cavalry
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17518

23.Hellenic Pike II
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17773
http://www.imagedump.com/index.cgi?p...id=19&warned=y
select view anyway
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=18049(new)
in game screenie

24.Klerouchoi Lt Cavalry
http://www.imagedump.com/index.cgi?p..._id=0&warned=y

25.Generic Foot III
http://www.imagedump.com/index.cgi?pick=get&tp=115512

26.Xystophoroi (new)
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=18088


Major Factions:The Diadochi
1. Cassander-Greece
2. Lysimachos-Thrace
3. Antigonid-Asia Minor
4. Ptolemy-Aegypt
5. Seleucid-Babylon..eastern Satrapies

Minor Factions
6. Bactria
7. Parthia
8. Galatians
9. Epirus (Pyrrhus)
10.Greek States
11.Pergamene

Non playable or possible additions
12.Illyrians
13.Jewish state
14.Pontic
15.India
16.Libya
17.Medianite
18.Armenian
19.Kyrenaican
20.Bosphorus

Sounds Good. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...-2thumbsup.gif

image dump

I send you a email alogic

the game will be roughly based on dbm rules... it will be good to read the following article in order to understand the mechanics of the game, as well as, future posts.

begin reading from troop types down
http://www.richardbodleyscott.btinte...k/beginner.htm

I will now begin giving an overview of the units that will appear ingame... i will update as needed

1.PIKE(Pk)
http://www.dbaol.com/images/faces/1361_face.jpg
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=14874

All successor armies are built around this unit...

Positive:
a. frontally in unbroken terrain they are undefeatable.
b. 6 ranks of support
c. high bonus vs. cavalry
d. large formations (180)

Negative:
a. slow movement and turnspeed (easily outflanked)
b. disadvantaged in rough terrain
c. expensive (high production & supportcost)
d. long production time (except levies)
e. vunerable to missle attack (due to smaller sheild and rear ranks being unarmored leading to general decline in overall armor value).

Unit Divisions
1.Levy
2.Regulars
3.Veterans
4.Agema

Unit Sub divisions

1.Levy
a.Levies
b.Pantodapoi (Antigonid & Seleucid)
c.Machimoi (Ptolemy)
d.Iphiktatean hoplites (Cassander)

2&3.Regulars & Veterans
a.successor style phalanx
b.hellenic style phalanx (Greek,Epirus,Pontus)
c.Bactrian style phalanx

4.Agema
a.Regular
b.Argyraspids (silver shields)
c.Chaeonian guards (pyrrhus)
d.Sinopean Guard (Pontus)

Spear (Sp)
http://www.dbaol.com/images/faces/1344_face.jpg

The spear unit is used by the diadochi to compliment their pike phalanx.. spear armed units have better manueverability and are therefore a wise choice to guard the flanks of your pike units (especially from enemy cavalry).. The Hypaspists are the elite of this class..

1.Greek Hoplites
2.Hypaspists
3.Rule Infantry Spears (jewish)
4.Greek Mercenaries

Positive
1.good manueverabilty
2.relatively cheap to produce (compared to pikes)
3.cheaper support cost
4.bonus vs cavalry
5.3 rows of support
6.Large shield gives better protection from missles

Negative
1.cannot face a full strength pike phalanx head on
2.penalty vs warbands
3.unable to fight effectively in rough terrain

Warbands (WB)

Galatian Warband (reference)
http://www.dbaol.com/images/faces/1543_face.jpg
Galatian Warband (model)
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=17223

Warbands generated by both the galatians and illyrians.. the diadochi can often employ them as mercenaries. Warbands are good overall units that have some special bonuses attatched.while they cannot stand up to a full strength blade or pike unit in good terrain.. they are more than a match for these same units in the rough.. they are also very useful for ambushes.. can also help open up enemy flanks by driving off spear armed units.. just watch out for enemy cavalry

1.Galatian Warband (heavy)
2.Galatian Warband (light)
3.Galatian Mercenaries
4.Illyrian Warband

Positive
1.bonus vs spear units
2.fight well in rough terrain
3.strike fear in many units
4.good overall manueverability
5.special concealment bonus
6.very cheap to produce and support
7.lg shield offers good protection from missles

Negative
1.heavy and medium cavalry are a major threat
2.cannot stand up to blades in good going
3.cannot stand up to frontal pike in good going
4.may charge without orders
5.hard to keep under control

Blades (Bd)
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=14901
http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=2&x=14926

Blades represent the Diadochi attempt to emulate the fierce roman legions that they encountered in the later ages.. they are therefore labeled as immitation legions.. They are excellent all around troops combining the best attributes of the other foot troops: they can skirmish with heavy javelins, they have good manueverability, large shields, good armor, can fight well in both good and bad terrain (though they do suffer a small penalty in the latter), they also get a small bonus vs cavalry, they are the only unit that can stand up to a frontal full strength pike charge (though they are not guaranteed to win, they do stand a chance).. overall they are the most versatile and sought after units in the game..

1.immitation legionaire (Ptolemy,Seleucid,Galatian,Pontus)
2.Jewish Rule Infantry (Blade);no skirmishing ability

Positive:
1.very versatile
2.able to skirmish
3.good manueverability
4.good armor protection and lg shield
5.2 rows of support
6.small bonus vs cavalry
7.good in all terrains

Negative
1.very expensive
2.take several turns to produce
3.lots of building requirements necessary to produce
4.small rough terrain penalty
5.need to use caution when facing elephants or scythe chariots

Auxillaries (Ax)

1.Euzonoi (all Diadochi & Hellenic Factions)
2.Thracians (Lysimachus & Thrace)
3.Thracian Mercenaries (all Diadochi & Hellenic Factions)
4.Mountain Indian Spearmen (Bactria & India)
5.(more to come)

These guys are great for holding rough terrain, driving off pesky skirmishers, and running down heavy infantry that are fleeing the field. Most also have the ability to skirmish as well, typically with javelins. The Thracians are the best of this category.

Positive
a.high mobility (can match speed of Psiloi)
b.typically carry large shield (missle protection)
c.bonus when fighting in rough terrain
d.bonus when fighting psiloi
e.very inexpensive to produce and support

Negative
a. very vunerable if caught in open, flat terrain
b. very light armor protection
c. have to watch out for warbands
d. need to attack flank or rear to be effective (melee)

Psiloi (Ps)

Slingers, archers, and javelinmen make up this category. These guys are all capable of ranged attacks, but need to keep away from close combat.

1.Irregulars
2.Persian Archers
3.Egyptian Archers
4.Macedonian Archers
5.Rhodian Slingers
6.Syrian Slingers
7.Cilician Javelinmen
8.Jewish Guerilla Skirmishers

Positive
1.good mobility, can outrun most infantry types
2.various forms of ranged attacks
3.typically very cheap to produce and maintain

Negative
1.poor hand to hand combat skills
2.little, if any, armor protection
3.typically, don't carry shields
4.must avoid cavalry and auxillary
5.typically low moral

Bowmen (Bw)

The label here is quite misleading as most archers are covered under Psiloi... For the purpose of this mod this category will be reserved for only bow armed units with special abilities that separate them from being classed as mere psiloi... typically this means they are able to fight in hand to hand combat or have an exceptional ranged attack At this moment there are only 2 units fitting this title

Cretan Archers: carry small sheild and sword, can melee with attack factors ranging around that of a moderate level auxillary, very good ranged attack, some defense from missles do to shield.

Indian Archers: carry longbow and two handed sword, exceptional range achieved with their bows (best in game), have vicious attack combat factor but no armor whatsoever.

Hordes (Hd)

These are units not really suited for real combat, but are better served for holding down conquered provinces while your main army marches off elseware... This is a means of cutting cost as Diadoch armies are very expensive to maintain.. Keeping a large army in a conquered province just to maintain loyalty and prevent an uprising can be very expensive.. especially if you need that army elseware.

1.Border Guards
2.Civilian Militias
3.Babylonian levies
4.General Levies

Positive:
1.Dirt cheap to produce and maintain
2.When used in mass can keep a province loyalty high

Negative:
1.Very poor combat effectiveness
2.Very poor morale
3.Not useful in provinces that are adjacent to the enemy.

Heavy Cavalry (HC):

The glory boys of the Diadoch arsenal.. Heavy cavalry form the primary shock force of the mounted core. With the exception of pikes, spears, and elephants.. they have little to fear on the battlefield. They are almost unstopable if they are able to turn the enemies' flank.. No successor army is complete without them.

They will basically come in three types
1.Regulars
2.Companion styled (lightened slightly for better speed)
3.Cataphracts (armored... barding)

examples:
1. Mounted Agema
2. Xystophoroi
3. Companions
4. Lancers
5. Klerouchoi
6. Rule Cavalry
7. Greek Bodyguards
8. Bosphoran Nobles
9. Various Cataphracts
10.Pergamene Lancers
11.Iranian Lancers

Positive:
1.Very well armed and armored
2.Heavy attack and charge ratings
3.Very good morale
4.Cataphracts have excellent protection from missles
5.Can crush most troop types

Negative:
1.Cannot stand up to Spear(Sp) or Pike(Pk) frontally
2.Small penalty when facing Blades(Bd)
3.Slower than other cavalry types
4.Extremely expensive to equip and maintain
5.Penalty when fighting in rough or difficult terrain

Cavalry (Cv):
With better speed and less cost than Heavy Cavalry (HC) and more punch than Light Horses (LH) these guys create a happy median between the other two classes.

ex:
1.Satrapal Heavy Cavalry
2.Thracian Nobles
3.Greek Mercenary Cavalry
4.Galatian Cavalry
5.Saka Nobles
6.Pontic Heavy Cavalry
7.Epirote Cavalry

Positive:
1.Cheaper than Heavy Cavalry
2.Faster than most Heavy Cav
3.Good Attack and Defense modifiers
4.Decent morale

Negative:
1.Cannot catch Light Horse (LH)
2.Cannot stand up to Heavy Cavalry(HC)
3.Penalty vs Pikes(Pk), Spears(Sp), and Blades(Bd)

Light Horse (LH)

Covers a wide variety of Light Cavalry mostly consisting of ranged (archers & javelinmen) units with little or no close combat value.. one trait that all Light Horse will share is speed... fastest units in the game.

ex.
1.Median Lonchophoroi
2.Satrapal Light Cavalry
3.Bactrian Horse archers
4.Parthian Horse archers
5.Tarantines
6.Thracian Light Horse
7.Ambrakiots
8.Arachosians
9.Scythians

Positive:
1.Cheapest cavalry to produce and maintain
2.Fastest unit on the battlefield
3.Often can be used to draw enemy out of formation

Negative:
1.Little to no armor
2.Poor melee rating

Scythe Chariots (ScH):

Nothing instills fear on the battlefield more than these guys.. sure to make your enemies wet their pants..er..uhm..I mean..skirts... at first sight of them.
Seriously though the chariot by this time was really outdated and only used by a few of the factions (Seleucids, Pontics, Galatians).. However they did sometimes prove useful as I will relate to you in the following story.

The Roman army, when facing Mithridates' Pontic army, broke into laughter and mock applause at the sight of the Pontic Scythe chariots.. However, at the battle of Ennium their laughter was silenced by Pharnaces (Mithridates' son). When the battle began, Pharnaces sent out a huge contingent of skirmishers to screen his actual intent (ala Napoleon Bonaparte). As the Pontic forces unleashed their missles into the roman ranks.. the romans followed their text book procedure and drew up into 'testudo' formations. The romans, unable to see the scythe chariots lining up behind the dense clouds of skirmishers, had inadvertantly opened up gaps in their lines... gaps large enough to drive a uh..idunno..a..SCYTHE CHARIOT through.. Ibet you can guess what happened next... needless to say that the romans suffered one of their most humiliating defeats..38,000 dead 8,000 taken prisoner compared to Pontic losses of around 8000 total.

In game the Scythe Chariot will be a frightening machine.. literally as all units will have a fear penalty when facing them.. They will be built to cause as much mayhem as possible in as short a time as possible.. what I mean by this is that they will have extraordinary Charge and Attack modifiers, but an abysmal defensive rating.. So use them wisely.........

Elephants (EL)

Do you like Elephants?... well then.. your gonna love Diadochi.. this particular time period featured some of the largest elephant battles in history... this is also the time when the romans were first introduced to the "Lucanian Oxen" as they refered to Pyrrhus' elephants.

Elephants come in 3 main divisions
1.Regulars
2.Towered
3.Cataphracts (Armored)

1.Great for use against Cavalry, Warbands, Auxillary, and Blades
2.Regulars need to watch out for psiloi and bowmen
3.All need to stay away from Pikes and to a lesser degree Spears

Camels (Cm)

Campaign Map:

i have begun working on a campmap for this mod.. it is still very much in its infancy and will probably undergo many changes... but just for the moment.. here it is

http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=15070

this is just a very small piece of the map.. it extends all the way to india.. covers all areas belonging to factions listed in first post..

i would like to get some feedback.. i seem to be getting lots of views but no replies.. also not many people seem to be viewing my screen shots.. this seems kinda weird since these represent brand new unit graphics... at any rate i will continue to develope the mod even if i'm the only one who cares...

Looking Good :D

This is looking very good, I'm sure as more people find out about this mod and see your results, you will get a lot more feed back. Keep up the excellent work http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/bigthumb.gif

Looks good. I always wondered when someone would make a mod based on the successors http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cg...s/bigthumb.gif

heres a new look at my campmap... again this is still in its infancy... this is just to give an idea of the extent of the regions involved...

http://www.image-dump.com/view.php?m=1&x=15188

Hello Alogic ,
Great period , your mod will most definately be on my playlist .
You mention ... dbm style and chess like gameplay .
Do you mean battles will be a stop start affair ? FRAGMENTED or can they be fought without the need to pause ?
cheers
Dimitrios...

Alogic,
Brilliant mod-idea, def on my playlist in the future. I actually though the HTW crew would pick up this one after HTW instead of going back in time. I wish you the best of luck. BTW, with RTW released in september are you planning on using the Medieval- or Rome-platform?

In response to:
You mention .......dbm style and chess like gameplay. Do you mean battles will be a stop start affair? or can they be fought without the need to pause ?

Not at all.. the game will play the same as you are used to... what i mean by chesslike and dbm is that more thought will be required in game; both stategically and tactically... here are 3 examples of what i mean:..


1. There will be a slightly exaggerated set of combat modifiers giving all units certain strong advantages and disadvantages when facing other units.. this already exist in the original game, I'm just going to adjust it a bit... this will create a sort of chesslike atmosphere as you will be looking for good matchups when facing an enemy army..

example: The most powerful unit in the game is the pike phalanx(Pk), one of the weakest units in the game are the psiloi(Ps)... however, if you match them up the psiloi is somewhat of an advantage.. though he is incapable of melee combat with the pike, in turn the pike will be unable to catch up to him to engage in melee.. meantime the psiloi will be picking away at the mighty phalanx as it lumbers along the battlefield (pikes are very
susceptable to missle attack and since a typical pike unit is extremely expensive this type of attack will be unacceptable) therefore you might opt to send in some auxillaries(Ax) to drive off the psiloi (auxillaries get a bonus when attacking psiloi they also are quick enough to run them down) the enemy might then counter you by sending in the cavalry(Cv) which can overrun the auxillaries and chase them off the field, then you might a spear(Sp) unit to stave off their cav, they counter with a mercenary warband(Wb) to punch through your spears you then send in the heavy cavalry(Hv) to crush them, and they respond by throwing some elephants(El) your way, in which case you will need to bring up the pike phalanx(Pk) that you started with in the first place.. this of course is an oversimplified example but it shows the overall gameplay that i'm trying to achieve.

2. The Diadoch armies will be very expensive to produce and support so you will have to think carefully on how and where to use them effectively. Battles now can become very costly, a victory could even become a defeat in the end... here's an example.. let's say you have chosen the Seleucids as your faction.. just to the northeast of you lies the Parthian empire whose armies are made up almost entirely of cavalry.. you look over
your pike and spear heavy army and think their horses don't stand a chance.. and so you invade.. as the battle commences you feel confident as their cavalry is completely unable to meet your forces head on.. however, you also discover you can't catch up to them to engage them anyway.. then their horse archers pepper you with wave after wave of missles.. after a long grueling march you finally are able to corner there forces which sends them into flight... battle won?.. your casuelties are certainly going to be high. most of their army has escaped.. the territory you now have captured has little in the way of resources to offer you the troops you have lost were very expensive and will take quite a while to replace.. meanwhile the parthian
army you have just defeated has escaped into their northern province joining up with the army in that region.. they will certainly return on the next turn just to repeat the process over again... and the next turn, and the next, until they have depleted your forces enough for their heavy cavalry to finally come in and finish you off.. https://forums.totalwar.org/forum/no...s/ceasarno.gif [b]

3.In the beginning of the game all factions will start off green.. what i mean is that the armies they produce will be of low morale and will have both low attack and armor values.. this means you will need to spend more time molding your armies into the fighting machine you want..by building shrines, blacksmiths, armorers, etc.. you eventually have a professional army to call upon.. i noticed in several of the mods that i've played that armies seemed ready made, that is they already were very powerful forces that seemed to fight to the death.. i saw very little reason to build anything to increase their say morale as they already seemed to be absolutely fearless, instead i simply concentrated on increasing my wealth (building farms, trade centers, etc.) In my mod you will need to spend more time considering your strategic options in order to produce both a quality army and a wealthy empire.

My god https://forums.totalwar.org/forum/no...ticons/eek.gif https://forums.totalwar.org/forum/no...ticons/eek.gif

I had no idea that there was a mod like this in development.
I disregarded many threads(including this one)and now im going back and seeing what i was missing

I loved Hellenic total war, but dreamed of a mod wich was bigger in scale, or based on alexander. I can'rt beleive it was already in progress. Thank you, thank you

Im so happy

https://forums.totalwar.org/forum/no...ns/biggrin.gif


Btw, when can we expect a BETA version?

Hi alogic your mod seems to be GREAT After roman era this is my preferred historical period.

I think that it will be a great mod , Good Luck





https://forums.totalwar.org/forum/no...s/bigthumb.gif

Excellent idea for a mod period. Yet it's so obvious it makes you wonder why it hasn't already been done. Great idea.

Any idea when we can expect to see a beta or even just a campmap to get us salivating?