The 'find the frog a pile of new books' thread

Froggy needs some new fiction, and the poor amphibian has already filled her shelves (and all other handy spaces) with all the definitely good and promising books, and is now left only with a list of titles which could be good … maybe. Has anyone read any of these? If so are they any good? All prices etc are from amazon.uk; my local bookshop is useless.

Housecarl - Laurence J. Brown (Nastily expensive at £12 and hard to get, but sounds good)

Cold Heart, Cruel Hand: A novel of Hereward the Wake - Laurence J Brown. (Sequel to previous book, same issues)

Eagle in the Snow: General Maximus and Rome's Last Stand - Wallace Breem (A very expensive paperback at £7)

Gardens of the Moon (Malazan Book of the Fallen) - Steven Erikson (Supposed to be comparable to the ‘Song of Ice and Fire’ series, and has many rave reviews. Call me sceptical froggy)

The Black Company - Glen Cook (Again supposed to be comparable to the ‘Song of Ice and Fire’ series, and has many rave reviews.)

Children of the Earth - Jean M. Auel (a five book series, supposed to be really good but the individual books are expensive at £6.39)

Gods and legions/The ten thousand/Gods and Legions: A Novel of the Roman Empire/The Last King: Rome's Greatest Enemy - Michael Curtis Ford (sounds good, but the comparisons to awful books like ‘Gates of Fire’ and ‘Spartan’ have me concerned)

Legion - William Altimari (sounds good … maybe, but is short and expensive)



Recommendations would be appreciated too; I mainly prefer historical fiction (medieval or Roman, but I can and will branch out so long as it goes no later than 1600AD) of any type. I can tolerate some kinds of fantasy; those without too much magic, elves, trolls and other Tolkeinesque stuff. Strictly no romance please! I can just about tolerate Phillipa Gregory, and that takes a lot of effort combined with the warm glow which comes from getting her books at half price or less.

Quick rundown of some of authors I have on my fiction shelves in no sort of order: Robin Hobb, George R R Martin, Sharon Penman, Elizabeth Chadwick, Helen Hollick, Terry Pratchett, Brain Wainwright (his ‘Within the Fetterlock’), James Clavell (but only ‘Shogun’; the others have boring sounding settings), Ellis Peters, Simon Scarrow (but I find his first book the best and have not bothered with the latest), Lindsay Davis, Colleen McCullough (her ‘Masters of Rome’ is great, her ‘Song of Troy’ terrible), Eiji Yoshikawa (English translations of ‘Mushashi’ and ‘Taiko’), Phillippa Gregory, John Maddox Roberts.

Have you tried the "Emperor: gates of Rome" by Conn Iggulden?
There is a sequel too : "Emperor: Death of Kings", and there is also supposed to be a third book that is not out yet as far as I know.


I liked them both , they are about Julius Caesar. IMO the best part of it is the Comments at the end of the 1st book, when the author compares his novel with the actual biography of Caesar and you see the "gaps" filled or explained.
They are compared to "Gladiator" (the film), but thats just for selling purposes, doesnt have anything to do with that.

Dunno about the price tho, I bought the first one on a ship (I had a 3 day journey ahead of me and nothing to read), and the sacond one on a Holiday in France... So dont know about its real price...

I have the first two books in that series; I got them both on 'just published' special offers from my local W H Smiths. I want my £18 back, and the hours of my life I wasted. Randal sums it all up perfectly in post 73 here. I can't honestly believe I actually liked the first book when I read it the first time. My re-read soon showed how bad it was, and I had to force my way through the second book.

Side note: I believe the third book may be out now; the other two came out around Christmas and Amazon advertised it at me not long ago.

I should probably have mentioned that I found these books stunk. Also please don't recommend Bernard Cornwall. His original Sharpe books were ok in a popcorn reading kind of way, as was his Arthur trilogy; everything else stinks

I have read "The Black Company" a while ago (the reviews on Amazon and the comparison to GRRM made me try it).
IMO the comparison to "Song of Ice and Fire" is absolutely invalid, the writing style and the type of story differ completely.

I actually did not like the book at all and did not continue after reading the first volume. It's hard to describe waht I actually disliked about it - but I could not at all get warm with the "heroes" in this book, nor did the setting seem "realistic" (whatever that means in a fantasy series).
The whole thing radiated some apocalyptic sadness and the fact that I could neither like or hate any of the characters did not help either.

I am sure some people like this style, but it is very different from books by Martin or Hobb.

Based on the reviews I also bought Steven Erikson's book recently, however, I did not get to reading it yet.

You might take a look at Tad Williams' "Memory, Sorrow and Thorn" books

Dragonbone Chair

however, they might be a bit too much fantasy-like for your taste (somewhere between Tokien and GRRM I would say)

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Originally Posted by frogbeastegg

I have the first two books in that series; I got them both on 'just published' special offers from my local W H Smiths. I want my £18 back, and the hours of my life I wasted. Randal sums it all up perfectly in post 73 here. I can't honestly believe I actually liked the first book when I read it the first time. My re-read soon showed how bad it was, and I had to force my way through the second book.

Side note: I believe the third book may be out now; the other two came out around Christmas and Amazon advertised it at me not long ago.

I should probably have mentioned that I found these books stunk. Also please don't recommend Bernard Cornwall. His original Sharpe books were ok in a popcorn reading kind of way, as was his Arthur trilogy; everything else stinks

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Yeah, well, It is the kind of book you read travelling. I read the first one on a ship, and the secon one in a couple of week using public transport. It takes 35 mins from college to home.

How about Pride and Predjudice or Sense and Sensibility?




*ducks flying poisoned hairpin*

Similar to Pratchett in terms of humour - an author by the name of Jasper Fforde.

Pertaining to Rome - the Masters of Rome series by Colleen McCullough (nice and thick - several of them, an inch and a half each - glorious). Also, Ross Leckie has some on the Punic wars.

I'd put in a shameless plug for my father's book here, but that'd contravene my code of attempting to maintain anonymity.

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I should probably have mentioned that I found these books stunk. Also please don't recommend Bernard Cornwall. His original Sharpe books were ok in a popcorn reading kind of way, as was his Arthur trilogy; everything else stinks

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wrong, wrong, wrong. The arthur trilogy wasn't his best - though some seem to think it is - but his Starbuck series - the American civil war books - are GREAT. You may not like the 19th century historical books, but you shouldn't go around saying all his work is crap because these are very, very good. Great descriptions of just what so many people in the period felt like and a great understanding of how the war early on was conducted. I can't recommend them enough.

Ser Clegane, thanks. I might give the first book in the Memory, Sorrow, Thorn series a go sometime. Shame about the Black Company; anything which can compare to aSoIaF is exceptional. I'll see if I can find a library copy or something.

I suppose the Emperor series might read better under public transport conditions, and it does depend on what you really want from a book. I didn't like the way it altered history so much, and the constant push for action scenes felt out of place.

Jane Austen? :sigh: Well, I did manage to enjoy the famous BBC version of Pride and Prejudice, so I suppose I can risk that book. I can enjoy Lizzy and Darcy arguing and then boo at the end when they stop and get married :tongueg:

:adds Jasper Fforde to list of people to investigate: I have Masters of Rome; it's good, dry but so detailed and epic that is more than forgivable. I suspect this series is partly the reason I don't get on with Emperor.

Jag, I found the original Sharpe books (from Rifles to Waterloo) enjoyable in a light reading kind of way. I did not like Sharpe's Devil much. Arthur was ok; I remember not liking the third book much, and I also disliked some of his characters and concepts. His Grail Quest trilogy was awful; I had to force myself to read the final book, and didn't care at all at any point about any of the characters or even what would happen with the plot. That one off book he did (gallows .... thief?) I borrowed a library copy of, and I didn't make it past the first 100 pages. His new Sharpe books have none of the appeal of the originals and after struggling through several of them I gave up. His recent book about king Alfred had me running from the cover blurb.

Since his earlier books were considerably better than his recent ones I might see if my library has any of the Starbucks.

i enjoyed the clan of the cave bear (think it's the children of the earth series) try that one out.

do you ever visit the library frog? or do you have trouble returning the books in a timely fashion like myself?

Get some Terry Pratchett books!

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Originally Posted by frogbeastegg

Froggy needs some new fiction (..)

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I'm not a fan of fantasy, to put it mildly, but I like historical fiction. If you want to try something different from the English authors you mentioned I can recommend the seven historical novels by Maurice Druon, member of the French Academy, about Philip the Fair and his progeny. I read the series in French, but in English it is called The Accursed Kings after the famous Templar curse on Philip. One of the best characters is the superb bastard Robert of Artois, whom I loved throughout the series. Happy reading!

In keeping with the Roman Era, this series by Steven Saylor may interest you.
http://www.stevensaylor.com/

Yes, clan of the cave bear is one of the children of the earth series.

Ah, my local library, or should that be libraries? There are two in comfortable distance. One is a great cavernous Victorian building, massive and awe inspiring, what you dream a library should be like. The other is smaller, a 70's concrete construct that looks as if it is about to collapse. Between them they house hundreds of thousands of books. For some reason or other about 29% of those books are Harry Potter.

The rule for acquiring books in froggy's pond goes like this:
-The library does not have it, nor have they ever heard of it. They have had a grand total of 2 books I have enquired about in the last ... fourish years. I am not enquiring solely about obscure books; indeed I only ask about the common, popular ones.
-Waterstones have never, ever heard of it. It does not exit. At all. Go away. Now. Your request has crashed our computer.
-Amazon can send it within 24 hours and it's half price too.

This holds true, even for supposedly popular books by supposedly popular authors. If the shops had these books I would be able to stand there and read the first few chapters to see if I liked them or not :sigh: Shame.

BDC, I have all the Discworlds except going postal. Thanks anyway.

AdrianII, I just looked Maurice Druon up and I can get two of his books, both in French. I never advanced beyond GCSE French. Drat! Sounded promising.

Hosakawa Tito, nice link. I am off to browse.

Going Postal is quite good. I got it for Christmas.

Get the new Adrian Mole... ;)

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Originally Posted by frogbeastegg

AdrianII, I just looked Maurice Druon up and I can get two of his books, both in French. I never advanced beyond GCSE French. Drat! Sounded promising.

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I'm sorry to hear that. Since you have already pretty much exhausted 'all that is good and promising' among English authors, allow me to recommend one more French author. Regine Pernoud was a respected medievalist and she has written some fantastic monographs on Abelard and Heloise, Joan of Arc and Alienor of Aquitaine. There must be good English translations of her work. If not, then your Commissar for Translation should be executed forthwith on grounds of counterrevolutionary sloth. Like Druon's, Pernoud's books are not politically correct at all, historically they are about as close to the subject's characters as you can get - in fact they are so well done that in some instances you actually hold your breath between chapters. I'm sure you will love her book on 'Aliénor, by the wrath of God Queen of England...'

I suppose I shall pick up going postal sometime, but the last few adult Discworlds have not felt as good as the previosu ones. It's been a slight downhill since Carpe Jugulum. I do love the children's discworlds books though; they had the old sparkle. I've never read Adrian Mole.

Regine Pernoud, ah yes, Regine Pernoud. After about a month of waiting and praying I managed to get a translation of her 'those terrible middle ages'. It's good, but kind of light. I would love to see her go into more depth. The real tragedy strikes with 'women in the days of cathedrals'. Two months I waited and hoped, two months of emails saying amazon was having a hard time getting it. They couldn't. I hear nothing but great things about that book.

Looking through amazon now I can maybe get a translation of her Joan of Arc. It's a long wait and not guaranteed. The other books are unavailable or second hand at exorberant prices.

The only Eleanor: By the wrath of God, Queen of England is by Alison Weir; I already have that one. Regine's Eleanor book, with an altered title, is sadly unavailable.

I have a trilogy to suggest:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/...379231-1035640 Road to Jerusalem

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/...379231-1035640 The Knight Templar

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/...379231-1035640 The Kingdom at the End of the Road

Im unsure how the English translation is, but the trilogy is among the best books Ive ever read. The author mixes history and fiction in a nice way, and by my view, he details the tactics, warfare, equipment etc. in a good way.

Arn is however displayed as a close-to-flawless hero, and the Scandinavian bishops are described in a bad light. Muslims tend to be described in a good light, and the Saladin you encounter in the book, is one you like.

And about romance! Its in there, but it doesnt overshadow the story. Its in the background!

The synopsis from amazon.co.uk:

The hero of this phenomenally successful historical trilogy is Arn Magnusson, born in 1150 to an aristocratic Swedish family.
THE ROAD TO JERUSALEM covers his childhood and education at the Cistercian monastry of Varnhem. There he is taught the best of spiritual and worldly learning, as well as being trained to become a master archer and swordsman by the giant Brother Guilbert, a former knight. At seventeen, equipped to become a monk or a warrior, Arn returns home, a young man and yet an innocent in the ways of the world. Two sisters cross his path: one seduces him, while with the other, Cecilia, he falls deeply in love. In loving two sisters he has committed a crime punishable by both civil and clerical authorities, and he is sentenced to serve 20 years as a Knight Templar in the Holy Land.
THE KNIGHT TEMPLAR recounts Arn's experiences as an occupation officer in Palestine. Born in 1150 to an aristocratic Swedish family, handsome Arn Magnusson is educated at a Cistercian monastery. As well as training to be a monk, he is to be a warrior, and becomes a master archer and swordsman under the tutelage of the giant Brother Guilbert, a former knight. But Arn is innocent in the ways of the world, and when two beautiful sisters cross his path, despite falling desperately in love with one of them, Cecilia, he is seduced by the other. Such a crime is punishable by both civil and clerical authorities, and, while Cecilia is banished to spend twenty years as a nun, Arn is sentenced to serve the same period as a Knight Templar in the Holy Land. As an occupation officer in Palestine, he discovers that the infidel Saracens don't appear to be brutish and uncivilised as they are portrayed in Christian propaganda. On the contrary, in love and war he learns from the example of his noble adversary Saladin that there's another side to the teachings of the Cistercians...

KINGDOM AT THE END OF THE ROAD
Arn leaves Jerusalem a changed man. He returns to a Sweden torn apart by feudal infighting in which his family is deeply embroiled; and to Cecilia, the love of his youth, who was banished to a nunnery for the period he was in the Holy Land.

Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrel - i can't remember who by; set at the time of the Napoleonic Wars, two feuding wizards - it's rip-roaring stuff, also the size of two house bricks, so you'll be entertained for some time...

also, may I reiterate the reccomendation of Jasper Fforde? excellent stuff...

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Originally Posted by frogbeastegg

Regine's Eleanor book, with an altered title, is sadly unavailable.

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I'm sorry, I'm of no use at all. I have only one safe bet left, though you may have read it already. It is Batavia's Graveyard (2002) by Mike Dash. The book is about the historical ship-wreck of a Dutch East India vessel on one of the Abrolhos islands near the coast of Australia, and the subsequent mutiny by its apothecary, a raving lunatic named Jeronimus Corneliszoon, who turned the small colony of survivors into hell on earth. It's a brilliant book, done in English but based on excellent research and well-written. Dash has done a previous, equally good book on the Dutch seventeenth century financial investment rage of Tulipomania. Aye mylady, stark madness lies but barely hidden beneath a Dutchman's burgher veneer... ~:eek: ~;)

Here's another link for your perusal. The Camulod series by Jack Whyte. An alternate tale of the King Arthur legend, set in the time of the last Roman settlers in Britain. I like how these characters are developed with out the sappy, goody-two-shoes persona of the classical tale. http://www.camulod.com/

Part two of this thread:"Find the Frog a pile of money for these new books" ~:cheers:

I got some money for Christmas and my birthday is fast approaching, so as long as I don't get expensive books I should be able to get a nice big stack. Happy froggy :gring:

Krusader, those sound good enough to risk. I have ordered the only second hand copy of the first book, since no new copies are available.

Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrel .... is edging its way onto my list of potentials. I shall see if I can find an extract first. It sounds odd, but probably in a good way.

Any particular recommendations for Jasper Fforde? Which is the best book to start with?

Batavia's Graveyard is actually available! ~:eek: I shall look into it, thanks. But first, I had another idea of where to look for Regine Pernaud: abebooks. A network of small bookshops selling through an intermediary.

I only recently finished a historical version king Arthur, the trilogy by Helen Hollick (the kingmaking, pendragon's banner, shadow of the king. Would recommend; not the best books ever but a nice, new take on things) so I'm not entirely keen to do another quite so soon. I shall put this on my list for future reference. Thanks.

Jasper Fforde - start with The Eyre Affair, then Lost in a Good Book if you like the first one. The thrid is The Well of Lost Plots and the fourth is Something Rotten. I think there's a website run by the author somewhere, but I can't remember/be bothered to find the address.

here's some links:
www.jonathanstrange.com
http://www.jasperfforde.com/

including extracts from the books and all kinds of goodies...

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Children of the Earth - Jean M. Auel (a five book series, supposed to be really good but the individual books are expensive at £6.39)

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Read em, Loved em, Highly Reccomend them.

But they are huge, and will take you a massive amount of time to read.

I have a series of books by Pauline Gedge (Lords of the Two Lands). The first one is "The Hippopotamus Marsh". It's historical fiction set in Ancient Egypt, Middle Kingdom timeframe. It deals with the dealings of the now subject royal family (living as local nobles in Waset (Thebes)) during the reign of the Hyksos and the BLOODY civil war it took to regain their kingdom. I have to warn you three things about these books:

1) Long periods of inter-scene boredom (marches, intrigue that leads nowhere, training of armies that gets too much detail)

2) They are very, very bloody. Ms. Gedge describes events in graphic detail.

3) If you're of Semitic descent, you may be a bit offended with the way the Hyksos are portrayed. The books are very pro-Egyptian.

Other than that, they are really, really good. Very engrossing and offer insight into every day details you might not think of. If you're interested, PM me your snail mail address and I'll send you the first one (slow mail, if you don't mind, very cheap). If you like, I'll be your library for the other two.

Book 1 of the Swedish Crusade Trilogy arrived this morning. The translation is great and I'm racing through it. I've now placed my final order for my other books. Based on recommendations here and on another forum, and plenty of except reading I went for:

-The rest of the Swedish Crusade Trilogy
-The Eagle in the Snow
-The Clan of the Cavebear
-The Pillars of the Earth
-The Egyptian
-The Eyre Affair

All other books have been added to a document I keep hanging about on my hard drive with the snappy name 'Books that sounded good at some point in time and merit further investigation some day'.

Don Corleone, that is a very kind offer, thanks. For some reason the name of the first book rings a bell; I may have read it several years ago. I'll investigate and see what I turn up, then get back to you by PM.

It should be added that there is a independent sequel to the Crusader triology, I'm not sure if it's out translated but if it is it should be called "Arn's Heritage" or something like that. It's not as good as the third one (IMO the best) but it's a nice end to the story.

"Children of the Earth" series by Jean M Auel is good. Be forwarned that Auel does heavy research so at times you may have to wade through twenty pages on knapping flint or skinning hides. She does have a tendancy to go off on tangents.

Jean and Micheal O'Neal-Gear have an excellent and extended series of books about pre-historical America. They start with the migration across the Berring land bridge and go from there. Both Authurs, husband and wife, are actual archealogist.

As far as fantasy the "Lord of the Isles" Series by David Drake is excellent. Drake based the magic and such in this on the beliefs of ancient Sumaria. He is a Vietnam vet and Military historian with heavy emphasis on the roman empire. As a matter of fact he lifts alot of his plots from historical happenings in the empire.

While not in what you listed as what specifically interest you I highly recomend the "Hammer's Slammers" series by Drake and the Draka series by him and SM Sterling. The first is a future sci-fi band of mercenaries and some of the stories are retold events he witnessed in 'Nam. The Draka series is an alternate timeline where the English win the Revolution and the Confederates all migrate to South Africa. Both have some of the best combat stories I have read.

urgg you make it hard for me,
but i do suggest: "Nostramo" and "The Heart Of Darkness" both by Joseph Conrad
"Crime and Punishment" By Dostoyevsky is beutifully written
i can't remember any others right now, since im reading "Beyond Good and Evil" by Niectze and "The Discourses" by Niccolo Machivelli
and the biggest problem with your selection of genres is that before the printing press there was very little fiction, and to be honest to write about something you need to draw your ideas from somewhere to be any good and that is from your own life and own experiences.

thanks,
dessa