Scotland would have had strongest currency in Europe

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Papers reveal oil fears over SNP


A secret Whitehall dossier written 30 years ago has revealed that Labour ministers were concerned about the case for Scottish independence.
The information was kept confidential at the time to keep Nationalism at bay.

The paper was obtained by the Scottish National Party under freedom of information legislation.

Written by a leading government economist in 1974, it sets out how oil would have given Scotland one of the strongest currencies in Europe.

The report by Professor Gavin McCrone also stated that Scotland would have had "embarrassingly" large tax surpluses.

'Industrial desert'

But Dr McCrone's projections for independence were kept secret because of Labour's fears about a surge in SNP popularity.

The report shows officials advising ministers about how to take "the wind out of the SNP sails".

"This is a fundamental lie that the people of Scotland have been spun for 30 years" -Kenny MacAskill, SNP

Kenny MacAskill, of the Scottish National Party, said the report was proof of 30 years of official lies, cover-ups and betrayal.

He added that it showed how much Scotland would have benefited from independence and oil.

He said that in the 30 years since the report, Scotland had suffered low economic growth and manufacturing decline while at the same time oil wealth had "transformed" Canadian provinces and Arabian shiekdoms.

"Some have chosen when they've discovered oil to make the desert bloom and the tragedy was that in 30 years in some areas of Scotland, the UK Government has created an industrial desert," he said.

Service cuts

Mr MacAskill insisted that, with prices rising rapidly, oil was now "on the agenda" and he claimed an independent Scotland "would never be richer".

He added: "I would first of all like to have an apology from the UK Government for lying to us.

"We're not talking about something that's negligible.

"This is a fundamental lie that the people of Scotland have been spun for 30 years - that we were too wee, we couldn't do it, that the oil was going to run out - when they knew for 30 years that Scotland was sitting on a bountiful presence that would have transformed our economy for the better."

However Scottish Secretary Alistair Darling dismissed the document.

He said: "This is typical of the Nationalists, looking back to the past. This document is 30 years old.

"The fact is that all recent figures show an independent Scotland would have a fiscal deficit even if oil revenues are taken into account. That would mean cuts in public services."

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Arrrgh. I friggin' knew it.

You should break of from GB if they are only taking advantage of you.Then you guys can join in a nordic union with the scandinavian Countries. ~;)

It's fun to see that the SNP were right all along.
However, I'm sure the revenues are now such that the argument would not work.

At this point, I'd give them the benefit of the doubt and tell them to have a try. It's a good time to get in the oil market, what with the prices being so high.

That will never happen, realistically. "Shaken" is an extreme understatement.

It will happen when I become Prim Minister...
If Gordon Brown becomes Prime Minister, then the union would seem less biased to foreigners, since the Head Honcho would be 100% Scottish, unlike Blair, who was born in Edinburgh, raised in England, and completed his education in Edinburgh again, then left to England again. Governance only seems biased because the foreign representatives of the country are English, or at least have English accents...

Financially, it seems that that nice Alex Salmond was right all along about money being kept in the South-East, when it was Scotland's oil money.

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Originally Posted by King Malcolm

It will happen when I become Prim Minister...

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as the man said, it will never happen

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

From an American perspective, the UK is an extremely bias union. Something should be shaken up so that all of the member "states" are treated equally.

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Er, our whole country is substantially less than the size of some of your states. We don't need a federal system, we aren't large enough to warrant it.

The entirety of the UK is subsidised by the South and London, anyway. Seems a bit unfair to complain about an 'unfair union' on that basis.

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Originally Posted by King Malcolm

Governance only seems biased because the foreign representatives of the country are English, or at least have English accents...

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So why didn't Scotland get any of that oil, again?

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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube

From an American perspective, the UK is an extremely bias union. Something should be shaken up so that all of the member "states" are treated equally.

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Rank Name Population (2001 census)
1 England 49,138,831
2 Scotland 5,062,011
3 Wales 2,903,085
4 Northern Ireland 1,685,267
United Kingdom 58,789,194

England forms 5/6th of the population of the UK, and most of its economic wealth. It's really not that surprising that politics in the UK seem 'biased' towards England. Actually, in some ways it's biased against England: we have no national assembly.

And BKS is right, London and the South East basically pays for all the rest of the UK (I seem to remember hearing that if the square mile [the very centre of London; the business area] were a separate country, then it would be the 14th richest on its own. In comparison the entirity of the UK is the fourth richest country in the world.)

The point is that SNP have been saying that because of the oil money, Scotland would have been able to be an independent country quite comfortably, but there has always been doubt over this. This document released shows that the SNP were right, but the money has been mostly used in the South-East instead of Scotland as the SNP would have used it after getting Scotland independence. If this information was released 30 years ago, then we might have had devolution in 1979, and maybe even independence.

Right. What does that have to do with foreign representatives?

IF you ask me, there should be three COMPLETELY SEPERATE Countries (Ie. Britian should not control any part of Ireland). It should be a confederacy...

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Originally Posted by NeonGod

So why didn't Scotland get any of that oil, again?

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The oil revenue went to the UK. Scotland is a prt of the UK.

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Originally Posted by NeonGod

Right. What does that have to do with foreign representatives?

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I was just saying why our government appears to be very biased to foreigners, even though a great many senior ministers are Scottish.

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Originally Posted by ghost908

IF you ask me, there should be three COMPLETELY SEPERATE Countries (Ie. Britian should not control any part of Ireland). It should be a confederacy...

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Too conservative. Unite Wales, Scotland, and divide England between them, and rename the new nation Romano-Britain, then give Ulster back to Ireland, and rename it Eire.

The Celts shall rise again! :charge:

All the oil would be gone now, and Scotland would have reverted back to being a poor haggis, whiskey and kilt exporting nation, only famous for Loch Ness.

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Originally Posted by BDC

All the oil would be gone now, and Scotland would have reverted back to being a poor haggis, whiskey and kilt exporting nation, only famous for Loch Ness.

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And fightin' can't forget that.

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Originally Posted by meatwad

Too conservative. Unite Wales, Scotland, and divide England between them, and rename the new nation Romano-Britain, then give Ulster back to Ireland, and rename it Eire.

The Celts shall rise again! :charge:

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Too liberal. My idea :smash: yours.

:charge:

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Originally Posted by ghost908

IF you ask me, there should be three COMPLETELY SEPERATE Countries (Ie. Britian should not control any part of Ireland). It should be a confederacy...

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Maybe just maybe the people of Northern Ireland want to be part of the UK...

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Originally Posted by ShadesPanther

Maybe just maybe the people of Northern Ireland want to be part of the UK...

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LIAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~;)

Scottland would be invaded by somebody if it would have.

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Originally Posted by ghost908

Too liberal. My idea :smash: yours.

:charge:

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Okay... I thought you were a celt... but apparently you are a TRAITOR!!! :furious3:

~D

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Originally Posted by Zalmoxis

Scottland would be invaded by somebody if it would have.

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Come on- you know that modern-day arms are no match for claymores! At least, not according to Mel Gibson. Give it time- Braveheart 2 will be made:

"You can saturation-bomb my cities, but you can never..." you get the point.

I wonder if their currency would have been called kilts...

Ha ha!
I wander what the bloody BNP think about the SNP.

i am sorry - in the face of increased cultural relativism- the direction that i see the Europe moving in in the modern age is more integration, not secession into petty nation-states.

if that actually accurred you would hear of little towns wanting to seceed because they believe that they are being taken advantage of by other towns and this trend would continue downward to every individual man (who believed that he could gain more from a smaller union)

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Originally Posted by Big King Sanctaphrax

Er, our whole country is substantially less than the size of some of your states. We don't need a federal system, we aren't large enough to warrant it.

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UK has a population 3 times that of Australia... at just over 20 million people,

But we can manage a Federal System... so I think that is a bogus answer that the UK is to small.

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Originally Posted by meatwad

Too conservative. Unite Wales, Scotland, and divide England between them, and rename the new nation Romano-Britain, then give Ulster back to Ireland, and rename it Eire.

The Celts shall rise again! :charge:

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You missed Wales. In any case, I'd prefer a pan-Celtic nation or union of nations. It would solve the issue of Northern Ireland, unless they'd all rather pretend to be Englishmen on religious grounds.

Brittany, Cornwall and Man can come too. Galatia still likes to think it's a Celtic nation, but I don't really know about that...