Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
This man was a subject of controversy here a week ago. He's (and I suppose many of you know it) the only one who had access to photography in the tunnels of 9/11. Now he's living here, because the government is persuing him. But before getting to the real problem here I'll post a cut and paste.
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Originally Posted by From 911Encyclopedia
Kurt Sonnenfeld was the only videographer, who was allowed to film at Ground Zero in New York. He was working for the FEMA. On New Years Eve 2002, he was arrested for having killed his wife. The story didn't make big headlines in the news, but started some speculations and rumours on the internet. On June 14, 2002, prosecutors dismissed first-degree murder charges against Sonnenfeld in the early New Year's morning shooting death of his wife. Nancy Sonnenfeld, 36, died of a gunshot wound in the head after she and her husband had celebrated New Year's Eve together. Kurt Sonnenfeld told police that his wife committed suicide. Prosecutors wouldn't comment on specific reasons for the dismissal, but the defense investigation found a note written by Nancy Sonnenfeld which police had not taken into evidence, said public defender Carrie Thompson. "Our investigators found a letter written in Nancy's own hand consistent with a suicide letter, although it was very cryptic," Thompson said. She said the letter said, "What is more beautiful than love and death?" with the word "love" scratched out. "Kurt, please get help." The letter was found behind a framed photograph of Kurt Sonnenfeld. ...Nancy Sonnenfeld's sister, Amy Leek, said the family knew this was coming but would have no comment on the news. ...Kurt Sonnenfeld was a videographer who documented disaster sites for FEMA, including the Sept 11 attacks in New York. Nancy Sonnenfeld was a manager for BSA Advertising.
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drm...208124,00.html FEMA's Denver-based Region 8 Deputy Public Affairs Officer Jim Chestnutt and Public Affairs Officer Kurt Sonnenfeld used Canon XL1 digital video cameras with Mini DV disks through 16- to 18-hour days, shooting Ground Zero, the Pile (the mass of debris at the center of the disaster) and the arduous rescue and cleanup operations. They carried the cameras through the streets, over the mounds of debris, and underground for three weeks. Photographers Andrea Booher and Michael Rieger shot the still photos using Olympus E20 and Nikon D1X digital cameras. The four cameramen passed the Mini DV disk footage to CNN. tvtechnology.com/features/news/fema-1.shtml On March 13th, 2002, Jim Chestnutts office in North Dakota received $2 Million for an anti-flooding program, officially to construct a new lift station governor.state.nd.us/media/news-releases/2002/03/020313b.html Andrea Boohers and Mike Riegers photos are located at app1.fema.gov/usr/usr_d1391c9.htm
Now here are some links in spanish, because it seems that the ameican press has not treated the actual situation: link.
The thing is that this guy appeared in a TV show here, and as much as I regard those TV shows, as biased sources, there's some material evidence of what I'm goingo to talk about. You see he was a camaramen of the FEMA, one of the few (i presume) that knows where the chemical and nuclear armament of the USA is hidden and storaged. He was charged with the murder of his ex-wife (Nancy), but the justice dropped the charges when he still was on USA (link). Now when he came here all changed, first our justice inprisoned him because the american authorities passed the information that he was a fugitive. Now in the link in spanish it explains basically why the extraditory request of the USA government was not obeyed, it's because the treaties between our countries doesn't allow the worst punishment to crimes when the matter concerns both states. In this case if he returned to USA, death penalty will be his punishment, here he'll receive a better treatment, so the judge didn't find any strong evidence or circumstances that authoriced an extradiction, thus Kurt Sonnenfeld is now a legitime inhabitant here. The real polemic is not only because the sudden re-beggining of the accusations of the commonwhealt vs. Kurt Sonnenfeld, but because of his declarations. In short he said that he was being followed all the time (him and her new wife) by cameramans who take photographies of him doing anything. Now I couldn't find those photographies, but I saw them on the show. At various locations some guys with cameras behind this persons taking photographies. He also sais something wich I don't agree but...he sais that USA is becoming a very facist country (i agree in part with this) and that Argentina is more free than the last (of course for a guy with certain money and education it could be...). At the very last of the interview, he did not want to tell the reasons that he presumed to be the potencial causals of this persecutions for fear to be just killed by the state of USA. Now nothing here is definitive nor conclusive, but for making opinions it's enough.
Here's also a link of the case in english: http://feeds.bignewsnetwork.com/redi...ed072d737073b4
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
:rifle:
The sooner the better.
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by PanzerJager
:rifle:
The sooner the better.
I was hoping you to say something like that, or shut up Soul, you always post some antiamerican thing... ~D
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
There does seem to be a hell of a lot of conflicting evidence in this case .
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
Oh yes there's and the guy is very afraid. Now he has the protection of our state, but as the government of USA helped the nazi hunters to violate our sovereingty, I think that they can and will do it again and again, while it's in their best interests.
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
What I cannot understand is why the prosecution (if they thought they could eventually make a case) didn't ask for a postponmnet or deferral instead of just dropping the charges .
Is there any medical record of her alledged earlier suicide attempt , ormis it just him saying it happened and her sister saying it didn't ?
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Tribesman
What I cannot understand is why the prosecution (if they thought they could eventually make a case) didn't ask for a postponmnet or deferral instead of just dropping the charges .
Is there any medical record of her alledged earlier suicide attempt , ormis it just him saying it happened and her sister saying it didn't ?
No well, the finger prints of Nancy were on the weapon, the man has no motive, a suicide note was founded...I think that constitutes reasonable doubt. The only think that I know from the other side is words...In any case the mistery here, is what is making the state persuing him again now? And follow him with cameramans? ~:confused:
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
How long after his first wife died did he marry his new one?
Did he know her before?
What does it matter if he was a FEMA worker?
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Papewaio
How long after his first wife died did he marry his new one?
I really don't know but not that much, at least for marring. I hope you're not making assumptions over this one.
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Did he know her before?
No that I know. For what I remember he came here because of a friend and then he knew her.
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What does it matter if he was a FEMA worker?
Because he pointed many times that he knew all the locations of nuclear and chemical weapons in USA. Also he was the cameraman, perhaps the gringo government doesn't want him to go around with some evidence...he did not want to tell the reason, but it's important, maybe if you put it in context...
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
"Polemic" in English is "controversy".
Other than that I'm pretty confused.
DA
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Del Arroyo
"Polemic" in English is "controversy".
Other than that I'm pretty confused.
DA
Thanks. And you're confused because... ~:confused:
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
the finger prints of Nancy were on the weapon,
And the residue from the gunshot was on her hands not his , she was not shot on the back of the head according to the coroner , but she was according to the police .
Conflicting evidence ....
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
Now I want to know what this is all about... I understand the guy is certainly not being happy here. But why is he a hunted man? What has he supposedly done?
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Soulforged
Because he pointed many times that he knew all the locations of nuclear and chemical weapons in USA. Also he was the cameraman, perhaps the gringo government doesn't want him to go around with some evidence...he did not want to tell the reason, but it's important, maybe if you put it in context...
Its not that secure of a state secret. You can find out where they are stored by looking at the Defense Department Websites. You just have to know what to look for. Care to guess how many locations I know of from first hand experience - plus the ones that are easily found?
The guy is selling you a story in your country to convince you that the United States is after him for reasons beyond the already stated. A civilians photographer would not be allowed into many of the sightes because of security and the law that states no photographes to be taken - its the same sign on all areas that are suppose to be secured - to include arms rooms in military Units. (There was even a sign like that on my Company Arms Room.)
Being a photographer for FEMA is not the same as being a photographer for the Defense Department.
Since your country often is prone to believing negative press about the United States - its his best opition to stir up emotional appeal for his situation.
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube
~:handball: Gee, take all the excitement out of the scenario, why dont'cha?
All I can tell is that he makes a claim of it based upon being a photographer with FEMA. The circumstances of his claim just does not match with what I know from experience.
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Redleg
Its not that secure of a state secret. You can find out where they are stored by looking at the Defense Department Websites. You just have to know what to look for. Care to guess how many locations I know of from first hand experience - plus the ones that are easily found?
I know that. That's because all people call it "open hypocresy"
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The guy is selling you a story in your country to convince you that the United States is after him for reasons beyond the already stated. A civilians photographer would not be allowed into many of the sightes because of security and the law that states no photographes to be taken - its the same sign on all areas that are suppose to be secured - to include arms rooms in military Units. (There was even a sign like that on my Company Arms Room.)
He never stated what was the problem really.I clearly said that this was not conclusive. On the other hand my assumption is that maybe he took a photography of something that he shouldn't. Also this is the word of your state against the words of this man, and how would you explain the photographers stalking him?
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Being a photographer for FEMA is not the same as being a photographer for the Defense Department.
Well here you got me, because I know nothing about your defense system.
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Since your country often is prone to believing negative press about the United States - its his best opition to stir up emotional appeal for his situation.
Well this maybe true...But again he was being stalked...Try not to look at it only from your point of view. Like I said all that comes from the press is potencially biased, but it could be biased both ways.
In any case, wheter I'm right or you, there's still a problem. If the state will surpase again sovereingty to persue a "criminal" to the end of the world...and talking about this I said that the charges were dropped, and recently retaken. There's a lot of things to consider biased media, don't you think?
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Soulforged
I know that. That's because all people call it "open hypocresy"
That is a different concept then what you initially wrote.
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He never stated what was the problem really.I clearly said that this was not conclusive. On the other hand my assumption is that maybe he took a photography of something that he shouldn't. Also this is the word of your state against the words of this man, and how would you explain the photographers stalking him?
Lets see could it be because he fled the United States to beat a murder charge? It really could be that simple.
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Well here you got me, because I know nothing about your defense system.
Well this maybe true...But again he was being stalked...Try not to look at it only from your point of view. Like I said all that comes from the press is potencially biased, but it could be biased both ways.
Or you could be jumping to conclusions based upon negative attitudes toward the United States. Again people who flee one nation to escape a murder charge and then proclaim themselves into the public spotlight - are normally viewed by the press in many ways. Who really knows - however I doubt very seriousily any allegation about knowing where all the chemical and nuclear weapons is, is one of the reason. Its most likely because he is a murder suspect who fled the states and has gained a little media attention because of it.
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In any case, wheter I'm right or you, there's still a problem. If the state will surpase again sovereingty to persue a "criminal" to the end of the world...and talking about this I said that the charges were dropped, and recently retaken. There's a lot of things to consider biased media, don't you think?
Maybe with the first charge the state did not have enough evidence to pursue the criminal case, and instead of proceeding with a case they could not win at the time - they dropped the charges so that if other evidence came forward they could go back and review the death and the circumstances to see if new charges were warranted - verus proceeding when they were not sure they had the complete picture of what happened.
Maybe new evidence has come forward that warrants the state to question him as the prime suspect on the death of his wife. Lots of things to look into.
So you believe it is okay for a suspect to flee the country to escape prosecution for his acts. Does not bode well for the discussion if you believe this.
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Redleg
That is a different concept then what you initially wrote.
Maybe because I didn't believe it was soooooo open.
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Lets see could it be because he fled the United States to beat a murder charge? It really could be that simple.
I don't think so, that's just your opinion. In any case that will show fachism, power of the state for the sake of power alone.
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Or you could be jumping to conclusions based upon negative attitudes toward the United States. Again people who flee one nation to escape a murder charge and then proclaim themselves into the public spotlight - are normally viewed by the press in many ways. Who really knows - however I doubt very seriousily any allegation about knowing where all the chemical and nuclear weapons is, is one of the reason. Its most likely because he is a murder suspect who fled the states and has gained a little media attention because of it.
He was no murder suspect when he left the USA. He was when he arrived here however, that at least tells me something.
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Maybe with the first charge the state did not have enough evidence to pursue the criminal case, and instead of proceeding with a case they could not win at the time - they dropped the charges so that if other evidence came forward they could go back and review the death and the circumstances to see if new charges were warranted - verus proceeding when they were not sure they had the complete picture of what happened.
Not maybe, not, I'm sure they didn't have enough evidence. But do they've it now?
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Maybe new evidence has come forward that warrants the state to question him as the prime suspect on the death of his wife. Lots of things to look into.
And again I never said it was conclusive.
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So you believe it is okay for a suspect to flee the country to escape prosecution for his acts. Does not bode well for the discussion if you believe this.
Yes. To me it's ok for any person to do what they want to avoid punishment. I cannot judge them. And what does not bode well? I'm always against the state, I think that the very text of Thomas Paine sais it clearly it's society vs. the state, if not then there's some Marx ot Bakunin perhaps...Also he flees here because here he doesn't receives primitive penalties of death, perhaps is for that. Now will you say that he's doing wrong, that every person should accept like a little puppet any punishment and be ashamed of their acts? (Well in any case this is for another thread)
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Soulforged
Maybe because I didn't believe it was soooooo open.
Its not open for everyone to just walk into - most of the sites are closed sites - ie you can not get into without clearance.
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I don't think so, that's just your opinion. In any case that will show fachism, power of the state for the sake of power alone.
Extradiction is not facism
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He was no murder suspect when he left the USA. He was when he arrived here however, that at least tells me something.
He was one before he left the states - charges dropped - charges seem to be under review again. Tells you absolutely nothing unless your looking for a conspricary theory.
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Not maybe, not, I'm sure they didn't have enough evidence. But do they've it now?
Well its obvious they have something or they would not want him to return for questioning and trail now would they?
Lets see what multiple sites have to say
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Prosecutors refiled the case because of new evidence, including incriminating statements Mr. Sonnenfeld made to cellmates.
http://quickstart.clari.net/voa/art/...ADAED792C.html
http://denver.rockymountainnews.com/sonnenfeld/
Or it could be just revenge by the State of Colorado and the City of Denver for his filing suit for wrongful arrest to the tune of 20 million dollars.
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And again I never said it was conclusive.
Lets see we are calling a nation Facist for wanting to extradite someone back for trail for a murder charge, making up allegation of conspiracy because he worked for FEMA and knows secerts. But nothing was conclusive - but it did not keep you from making certain statements and jumping to conclusions on the issue now did it?
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Yes. To me it's ok for any person to do what they want to avoid punishment. I cannot judge them. And what does not bode well?
Flight indiciates something besides innocence. Yep and the discussion does not bode well given your next statements.
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I'm always against the state, I think that the very text of Thomas Paine sais it clearly it's society vs. the state, if not then there's some Marx ot Bakunin perhaps.
Being against the state is fine when the state is doing something wrong - however running from the state to aviod prosecution for an action you did - is not the same thing.
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..Also he flees here because here he doesn't receives primitive penalties of death, perhaps is for that.
I would respect that postion if that is what was stated - however other things have been stated to cloud the issue by not only him but you.
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Now will you say that he's doing wrong, that every person should accept like a little puppet any punishment and be ashamed of their acts? (Well in any case this is for another thread)
You have very little understanding of how I think.
If he is innocent why not come back and answer the state's questions? Why not tell the truth even while in another country verus making up stories? So yes he is doing something wrong because he is definetly hiding the truth and attempting to cloud the issue with the statements that you claim he is saying? Personal responsiblity for your actions seems to be a concept that you refuse to understand anytime the state becomes involved in the accountablity process.
If you care to make it personal - keep up with the idealogue comments - and you just might get the same treatment in return.
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Redleg
Its not open for everyone to just walk into - most of the sites are closed sites - ie you can not get into without clearance.
It's enough with "manifest destiny", at least to me, you're entitled to your opinion, let's see how things develop in the future.
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Extradiction is not facism.
No when it's an important matter, though following one criminal around the world just to punish him is power of the state for the sake of power. Another thing, I never said extradiction, that's formal, I said take him out by force, things that the USA has done already.
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He was one before he left the states - charges dropped - charges seem to be under review again. Tells you absolutely nothing unless your looking for a conspricary theory.
That's my point, it may seem delirious but call me a wacko if you want. For now I'll reserve my opinion respect of the statements of Mr. Sonnenfeld.
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Well its obvious they have something or they would not want him to return for questioning and trail now would they?
Yes it's obvious.
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Lets see we are calling a nation Facist for wanting to extradite someone back for trail for a murder charge, making up allegation of conspiracy because he worked for FEMA and knows secerts. But nothing was conclusive - but it did not keep you from making certain statements and jumping to conclusions on the issue now did it?
Yes it didn't kept me. So? All we can make here are assumptions, nothing more. But again it will not be extradiction because the judge here denied it. You might want to know that fachism has to do a lot with nationalism, breaking treaties and surpasing soveriengty for the sake of imposing the power of one state above the other is certainly a fachist practice, for what i know of fachism.
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Being against the state is fine when the state is doing something wrong - however running from the state to aviod prosecution for an action you did - is not the same thing.
Oh but it's. You asked me if I thought it was right, and to me the individual has the right to do anything in his possibilities (without damaging others rights) to avoid punishment.
I
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would respect that postion if that is what was stated - however other things have been stated to cloud the issue by not only him but you.
What I've stated to cloud the issue?
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You have very little understanding of how I think.
Yes. I'm not omniscient, and if that word doesn't exist in english "allknowing".
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If he is innocent why not come back and answer the state's questions?
Because he did it one time, and because the new beggining might have frighten him.
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Why not tell the truth even while in another country verus making up stories?
You say that he's making up stories, I disagree, you cannot proove it, I cannot proove it.
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So yes he is doing something wrong because he is definetly hiding the truth and attempting to cloud the issue with the statements that you claim he is saying?
No, he said that in fact, I don't claim anything personal here, except my views of your country. And who sais clouding the truth? It appears that you're willing to accept conspiracies from individuals against the state, but not the other way around.
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Personal responsiblity for your actions seems to be a concept that you refuse to understand anytime the state becomes involved in the accountablity process.
Again. If I were Sonnenfeld I'll do exactly the same, i try always to put myself in the other's shoes to see how it will feel, when you ask me that kind of questions. And I understand responsability, but the question was a personal one, and I'll do everything to avoid punishment, so I cannot say: "How bad is Mr. Sonnenfeld, he must have stayed." If you're questioning it from a technical point of view, then yes he's responsable and ideally he should support the punishment, but that has nothing to do with your question. Or it does?
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If you care to make it personal - keep up with the idealogue comments - and you just might get the same treatment in return.
Personal? Look amigo, I'm talking about your state, not you or the people of USA, if you've a problem then tell me maybe we can solve it, because this last days you've been stating in the same direction towards me, when my intention never was to say anything towards you (the only thing I can remember was the question about how you see capital punishment).
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Soulforged
It's enough with "manifest destiny", at least to me, you're entitled to your opinion, let's see how things develop in the future.
We are talking a specific case here are we not - you made broad sweeping comments as it relates to this individual. What is going on with Kurt Sonnenfeld has nothing to do with WMD, nuclear weapons - nor maifest destiny.
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No when it's an important matter, though following one criminal around the world just to punish him is power of the state for the sake of power.
The evidence in the media does not suppor this claim. Its the State of Colorado asking for the return of a citizen you fled the country for trail.
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Another thing, I never said extradiction, that's formal, I said take him out by force, things that the USA has done already.
Not this time - it seems its being done the correct and formal way so far. Again jumping to conclusions based upon past actions but not present circumstances.
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That's my point, it may seem delirious but call me a wacko if you want. For now I'll reserve my opinion respect of the statements of Mr. Sonnenfeld.
Wacko would not be the term I would used - mis-informed and highly baised would be the call.
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.
Yes it didn't kept me. So? All we can make here are assumptions, nothing more. But again it will not be extradiction because the judge here denied it. You might want to know that fachism has to do a lot with nationalism, breaking treaties and surpasing soveriengty for the sake of imposing the power of one state above the other is certainly a fachist practice, for what i know of fachism.
So your assuming that the United States will come and take him by force - well we all know what assume really means now don't we.
Extradiction for criminal matters does not fall into the catergory of facism.
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Oh but it's. You asked me if I thought it was right, and to me the individual has the right to do anything in his possibilities (without damaging others rights) to avoid punishment.
So the individual is never to be accountable for thier actions.
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I What I've stated to cloud the issue?
Read your first post - your allegade comments about chemical and nuclear weapons.
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Because he did it one time, and because the new beggining might have frighten him. You say that he's making up stories, I disagree, you cannot proove it, I cannot proove it.
If he stated anything other then he did not want to go back and that he did not kill his wife - he is making up stories. especially if the claim of the United States wants him because of chemical and nucelar weapon location knowledge as you stated here.
[quote = soul]You see he was a camaramen of the FEMA, one of the few (i presume) that knows where the chemical and nuclear armament of the USA is hidden and storaged. He was charged with the murder of his ex-wife (Nancy), but the justice dropped the charges when he still was on USA (link). Now when he came here all changed, first our justice inprisoned him because the american authorities passed the information that he was a fugitive.[/quote]
So was this made up by Kurt Sonnenfeld or by yourself?
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No, he said that in fact, I don't claim anything personal here, except my views of your country. And who sais clouding the truth? It appears that you're willing to accept conspiracies from individuals against the state, but not the other way around.
If the individual had a leg to stand on - I would give it consideration. However in this case the individual in question has no grounds for such a claim, other then his own word. The State seems to have more evidence and testimony to warrant re-opening the case to insure justice is done.
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Again. If I were Sonnenfeld I'll do exactly the same, i try always to put myself in the other's shoes to see how it will feel, when you ask me that kind of questions.
That is emotional appeal - not logic.
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And I understand responsability, but the question was a personal one, and I'll do everything to avoid punishment, so I cannot say: "How bad is Mr. Sonnenfeld, he must have stayed." If you're questioning it from a technical point of view, then yes he's responsable and ideally he should support the punishment, but that has nothing to do with your question. Or it does?
you might want to look into it.
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Personal? Look amigo, I'm talking about your state, not you or the people of USA, if you've a problem then tell me maybe we can solve it, because this last days you've been stating in the same direction towards me, when my intention never was to say anything towards you (the only thing I can remember was the question about how you see capital punishment).
Comments like puppet are idealogue - if you want to make it an idealogue conversation then we don't want to discuss any issue - idealogue based discussion are by their nature nothing but emotional appeal and personal attacks - they have a tendency to get very personal very quickly hence the statement made by myself. Futhermore I tend to get very reactionary to idealogue statements because I find them insulting and not a real attempt at discussion.
Again show me using just this case how Facism is growing in the United States because of the desire to extradict an alledged suspect in a murder case in accordance with International Law and the accepted process between nations.
Show me where there is a conspricary to wrongfully convict this individual for a crime he did not commit.
Show me where the conspricary is based upon his knowledge of possible secert locations of chemical and nuclear weapons. Especially given that no evidence exists that he would have taken photo's of such sights or even visited them. His professional resume does not indict any such knowledge.
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Redleg
We are talking a specific case here are we not - you made broad sweeping comments as it relates to this individual. What is going on with Kurt Sonnenfeld has nothing to do with WMD, nuclear weapons - nor maifest destiny.
How do you know it? How do you know that this is not related even to nuclear weapons?
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The evidence in the media does not suppor this claim. Its the State of Colorado asking for the return of a citizen you fled the country for trail.
I fled? Not sure if I understood this last statement.
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Not this time - it seems its being done the correct and formal way so far. Again jumping to conclusions based upon past actions but not present circumstances.
Are you sure? Here the justice is very clear: "no hay lugar para la extradición" there's no place for extradition, i must add that it's only because the capital punishment is enough to found that assumption.
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Wacko would not be the term I would used - mis-informed and highly baised would be the call.
Then, it's Ok. I'm not offended, however again I say to you, let's see how future events develop.
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So your assuming that the United States will come and take him by force - well we all know what assume really means now don't we.
Yes.
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Extradiction for criminal matters does not fall into the catergory of facism.
Is not for criminal matters simply. I'm talking here on doing anything to take him out and punish him. The idea of national unity and of eternal duty of the individual with the state, is a fachist idea. The situation will be clearified if there were a conspiracy against him.
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So the individual is never to be accountable for thier actions.
What does this has to do with your question? You asked me if it seemed right to me, and I answered yes.
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Read your first post - your allegade comments about chemical and nuclear weapons.
Yes allegade comments about what he stated, and the show too...jesus...not mine.
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If he stated anything other then he did not want to go back and that he did not kill his wife - he is making up stories. especially if the claim of the United States wants him because of chemical and nucelar weapon location knowledge as you stated here.
He never stated that last. I never said it, it was only MY assumption, he only said that he'll not tell anything of his theories because he was afraid.
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So was this made up by Kurt Sonnenfeld or by yourself?
Are you assuming that I created something here? Again all that posted in my first post are facts, not personal creations.
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If the individual had a leg to stand on - I would give it consideration. However in this case the individual in question has no grounds for such a claim, other then his own word. The State seems to have more evidence and testimony to warrant re-opening the case to insure justice is done.
First I don't see the better evidence here. The material evidence is still on his side, that was recogniced by the justice here too. Also was recognced that his guarantees were violated. Even if all of this were true, it will not be just for a man, when he can receive an atenuated punishment, to be taken by the state and executed. Or will it?
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That is emotional appeal - not logic.
Yes the kind of question that you asked me was emotional too. But if you want logic responsable= punishable=ok punish him -> but not ok to punish him with higher standards= no extradiction= he stays american "justice" cannot put a single foot here (well at least formally)
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Comments like puppet are idealogue - if you want to make it an idealogue conversation then we don't want to discuss any issue - idealogue based discussion are by their nature nothing but emotional appeal and personal attacks - they have a tendency to get very personal very quickly hence the statement made by myself. Futhermore I tend to get very reactionary to idealogue statements because I find them insulting and not a real attempt at discussion.
Sorry? Insulting? The comment was not against you. With that question you asked, it appeared that you wanted to say that the individual should support any evil for the sake of society, so I call it puppet. "Come on Pluto daddy is going to hit you with an sitck", that's all that I meant.
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Again show me using just this case how Facism is growing in the United States because of the desire to extradict an alledged suspect in a murder case in accordance with International Law and the accepted process between nations.
What? I didn't know that making opinions, personal opinions, had to be so foundamented. If I've so many evidence I'll rather write a book than post it here, don't you think? In any case I already said that, if you wait and see what is the fate of Mr. Sonnenfeld all will become clear. Maybe you'll shut me up or maybe it's the other way.
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Show me where there is a conspricary to wrongfully convict this individual for a crime he did not commit.
I never said it was for the crime...the conspiracy is presumed in other things, his past maybe. The crime might or might not be.
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Show me where the conspricary is based upon his knowledge of possible secert locations of chemical and nuclear weapons. Especially given that no evidence exists that he would have taken photo's of such sights or even visited them. His professional resume does not indict any such knowledge.
Well he has all the records here. When the justice here took him, inmediatly the state of USA asked that all his possesion were seized and delivered to them, including the camera of course. Now what would they want that?
Re: Kurt Sonnenfeld and the USA
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Originally Posted by Soulforged
How do you know it? How do you know that this is not related even to nuclear weapons?
Well all one has to do is look at his resume and where he worked in his career. You made a leap that was not there because it is what you wanted to believe. Nothing indicits that such is the issue.
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I fled? Not sure if I understood this last statement.
Take out you and insert he. Or it could be he left the United States after the dismissal to just leave the area where his wife had been killed, and someone offered him a photographer job in your country. However what has been shown in the media is more toward he left as soon as the dismissal was granted.
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Yes the kind of question that you asked me was emotional too. But if you want logic responsable= punishable=ok punish him -> but not ok to punish him with higher standards= no extradiction= he stays american "justice" cannot put a single foot here (well at least formally)
The only part of what is the issue of Kurt that is based upon the actual facts.
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Well he has all the records here. When the justice here took him, inmediatly the state of USA asked that all his possesion were seized and delivered to them, including the camera of course. Now what would they want that?
Nothing you presented until now indicats such a thing was done. I would assume that was part of the warrant for extradiction to see if any evidence of his murder charge was still present in his processions. Instead of some conspricary theory assumption based upon not logic but emotional appeal.
I wonder if the Argentia Media is reporting his law suit against the City of Denver as well. It seem that if one wants to believe in conspricary theories, the one of The City of Denver re-installing the charges based upon his law suit is more vaible then the one you have fallen for.
