The European Union

I know there's been a lot of threads about the EU already, but I was just wondering about what my fellow Organs think about the EU as a whole - is the current system working?

Personally, I am for a political union in Europe. I am unsure about the extent of powers this union should have. I think there are problems with the current set up, and I am once again unsure as to whether these can be resolved within the current framework or whether the whole thing needs to be remade. It would probably be simpler if the whole thing was started again.

What do you think?

I also support a political union. I'm wondering how come you haven't got lynched yet in your country for such blasphemous thoughts Marcellus :san_grin:
Unfortunately the current set of institutions does not allow a proper orientation. See how long they fight for small compromises... the unanimity system causes the EU to advance at a crawl.

The EU needs a restart. There's a ton of useless bureaucrats sucking up money while politicians work on re-election instead of the Union. Hey, sounds a lot like democracy in action! :san_angry:

the current eu economy is stronger than the american dollar. that's a good measure of global success even if domestically it may have efficiency problems.

I support the EU. I think so far, as Solypsist pointed out the Euro is worth more than the US Dollar, so they're doing something right. A few minor organizational changes should be noted, but on the beaurocratic level its nowhere near the corruption in say, The Russian Federation.

I support the EU, it makes sense and is a great thing for every European.

There are some changes which need to be done of course, especially makign the people the EU is meant to represent feel more connected with the whole procedure somehow.

Free trade is good- but I take the "economic" option to mean more than just free trade. So, I vote 'no thank you'. But I don't really have a big interest in what they do to themselves. :san_wink:

I only have 1 gripe with the EU..

one unified language please, so when i'm rampaging across the european country admiring the sites, i also get to chat with the local populace!

During my time travelling from munich to venice and back... it was hell. I can see it in peoples eyes, they hate people who talk english ~;p

they have one: it's called English. whether they hate it is irrelevant, they all know it and their economic infrastructure depends on how much of it they know.
i would prefer to chat up the younf italian ladies in their own tongue myself, but whatever works...

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Originally Posted by faisal

I only have 1 gripe with the EU..

one unified language please, so when i'm rampaging across the european country admiring the sites, i also get to chat with the local populace!

During my time travelling from munich to venice and back... it was hell. I can see it in peoples eyes, they hate people who talk english ~;p

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Originally Posted by faisal

I only have 1 gripe with the EU..

one unified language please, so when i'm rampaging across the european country admiring the sites, i also get to chat with the local populace!

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I couldn't agree more and we're working hard on it!

When oh when will those stubborn Germans and English finally give up their petty nationalistic claims and accept French as the natural common tongue of Europe? :san_cry:

We've already got air traffic control sewn up, it's only a matter of time before the rest of you fall into place and start speaking our fair English tongue.

Economic is fine. Political is not, due to some very distinct differences that can tear it apart (French arrogance, mainly. Yes, I know, but that's the main problem I see with it. And I mean arrogance in the foreign relations theater, not in general. The French Foreign Policy seems to be "You cannot intervene in other nations militarily because you are not French, but we, France, can and will!" How Chirac keeps getting re-elected I do not know.)

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Originally Posted by Kaiser of Arabia

How Chirac keeps getting re-elected I do not know.)

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It's because the way the French system works means that they end up with a choice between Chirac and the far right Jean-Marie Le Pen. When given a choice, they 'vote for the crook, not the fascist'.

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Originally Posted by Kaiser of Arabia

(French arrogance, mainly. Yes, I know, but that's the main problem I see with it. And I mean arrogance in the foreign relations theater, not in general. The French Foreign Policy seems to be "You cannot intervene in other nations militarily because you are not French, but we, France, can and will!")

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Very funny coming from someone who lives in the USA, isn't it? We could replace France by USA in each of these sentences.

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How Chirac keeps getting re-elected I do not know.

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As Marcellus explained it, it's mainly because of a poor pool of candidates, who lacks any form of competence but not lust for power and money.
Incidentally, it also comes from French people being stupid and short-sighted.

"I believe that there are some minor problems in the EU, but no major changes are needed."

Though it's a little stronger than that. I believe that although the EU is functioning well enough right now, quite a bit needs to be changed and improved to ensure future efficiency and to reflect the expanded nature of the EU compared to when the current various rules were put in place; if not, the EU expansion and outdated guidelines will cause too many conflicts between member nations in the future and may cripple the EU as a political and/or economical power. I disagree with the statement that the EU should start afresh, but the current guidelines do need to be reviewed, altered to fit the current situation, and enforced in a stronger fashion than at present. There needs to be more political ambition within the EU, and more willingness to see beyond national gains; only then can the EU become what its founders envisioned.

If you guys form one political entity you might actually rival us (probably in baking but Im leaving the options open) besides you guys together would just make it so harder for the USA to move you like pawns to further our intrests. Oh well we still have the balkans:san_rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Marcellus

It's because the way the French system works means that they end up with a choice between Chirac and the far right Jean-Marie Le Pen. When given a choice, they 'vote for the crook, not the fascist'.

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That sound exactly like how Paul Martin keeps getting elected as our PM (he's the crook). :san_laugh:

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Originally Posted by Marcellus

It's because the way the French system works means that they end up with a choice between Chirac and the far right Jean-Marie Le Pen. When given a choice, they 'vote for the crook, not the fascist'.

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That's not a problem of the system, but a problem of apathy among the leftist minded people of France. If they had voted in a significant amount in the first round it would have been easily enough to push Jospin into the second round, making it a choice between Chirac and Jospin. Their system isn't flawed, what's flawed is the political culture and voter apathy.

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Originally Posted by Germaanse Strijder

That's not a problem of the system, but a problem of apathy among the leftist minded people of France. If they had voted in a significant amount in the first round it would have been easily enough to push Jospin into the second round, making it a choice between Chirac and Jospin. Their system isn't flawed, what's flawed is the political culture and voter apathy.

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I thought that one of the problems was that so many left wing candidates stood that the left-wing vote was split, meaning that only the right wing candidates, with a more concentrated voter base, got through to the final round.

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I only support an economic union in Europe

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You took the words right out of my mouth :)

Gah!

I voted 'I only support an economic union in Europe '

I dont believe that a full union can ever work. Economically it makes sence, but only on flat playing field where all is equal.

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Originally Posted by ShadesWolf

I dont believe that a full union can ever work. Economically it makes sence, but only on flat playing field where all is equal.

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But to keep the playing field equal, isn't a political union necessary? Such equality would have to be artificial. Or do you mean on the basis that everyone does what they can within their means, no advantages such as subsidies or rebates?

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Originally Posted by Viking

Gah!

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The EU should stop this bickering and unite against a common foe. I say we go after Norways oilfields. :san_wink:

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Originally Posted by Ldvs

Very funny coming from someone who lives in the USA, isn't it? We could replace France by USA in each of these sentences.

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Touche. However, what I can say is, we didn't lose to the Ivory Coast.

I am a strong supporter of EU. In the poll I have to go for the 3rd alternative though, since I would like to start from scratch and set up a strong federation instead of todays rather loose compromise..... ~;)

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Originally Posted by Geoffrey S

Or do you mean on the basis that everyone does what they can within their means, no advantages such as subsidies or rebates?

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Correct.

I simply dont believe that a political union can work. Every country would need such a massive overall, that the cost would be unacceptable

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Originally Posted by Kaiser of Arabia

Touche. However, what I can say is, we didn't lose to the Ivory Coast.

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No but you lost Vietnam :san_lipsrsealed: wooo *bitchslap*

Ok, lets get back to topic.

I wish the EU rolls over and dies painfully, then we can do it all over again and not screw things up this time. Fat chance of that ever happening.

I think the economical Union is good for the EU nations but,that is as far i would like the European Integration to go. In the area size of the Europe we just dont have the same intrests in all politics. If we need to have federal unions those should be covering smaller areas like here in North we could have a Scandinavian Union,which would be part of the European economical union.

I support a political left wing Union of Europe, nothing else. And yes, it must be rebuilt from scratch.