Inventions the ancients left out! (post ideas here)

ok im going to start this thread for anyone who has come up, or can think of an invention or idea that would have benefited any nation or kingdom within 300 B.C. to 100 A.D. . You have to use only the technology and resources available at the time so any crazy notions such as a machine gun or atom bomb will lead to your expulsion :furious3: (Of course the resources were there, just not the tech to aquire them.. dont be a smarta$# :P). The goal is to be as original as possible and the invention or idea is not restricted to just warfare. It can be benefitial to politics, civics, science, etc.. Also it can be a series of new inventions tieing to one purpose, or something as simple as a new type of soldier equipped with weapons already available or even just a new formation.

I'll go first as an example (you'll have to excuse my laziness as there will be no upload of pics)

I was sitting on the can the other day and came up with an idea for a multi purpose shield (believed to be original).

year is 97 A.D.

shield would be similar in design to a Scutum (roman shield) being able to enjoy the full benefits of its success, but with a new enhancement. The shield would be covered with 9-12, 3-4 inch iron spikes.

the shield would have 3 primary uses:

1. Offensively: Against light, unshielded, or unaware heavy troops, one thrust with the shield would have the potential to cripple or even be fatal to the enemy.

2. Defensively: The shape of the spikes would somewhat resemble that of a pine tree, (or christmas tree) with a small gap between the face of the shield and the base of the spike with the intended purpose of snagging enemy blades and possible disarming them;

/\ <-- Iron spike
/_\
[] <-- "Trunk" of the spike to catch enemy blades
====================== <--- Horizontal Shield (laying flat on ground)

the length of the "trunk" would be about the same as that of the average thickness, flatwise of swords of its time.

3. Emergencies: in the event that an army equipped with such shields had to retreat, they could rely on the fact that any pursuers would be slowed or possibly even halted when the shields are dropped face up en masse. Of course new formations would have to be adopted to prevent friendly casualties from these shields. Then again, maybe they intentionally wont be trained in such formations as to deter them from wanting to retreat for fear of stepping on the spikes:laugh4:

i like the idea but i see a small problem with your 3rd use, such a sheald would be rather expencive pice of equipment nad to just throw that away would probly not be a wize or favord move by the govern ment, or the soldier if they were requierd to provide there own equipment which was often the case.

what i think would be usefull would be a sheald with a strong magonet in it, that way when an iron or steel whepon stikes it the wepon becomes stuck to the sheald, it wuld also make it harder to luse gear, armor and the like beacouse you could just stick it to your sheald and then it is all in one place.

If the magnets were powerful enough it would enforce a tight formation. Although if you fight a foe with armour, their bodies would weigh down your army.

Read somewhere about an unused (probably) Roman invention where a shield has two spikes on the bottom that you plant into the ground. When a foe pushes against the shield its in the ground so they can't move it. Then once he's tired himself out you can push back.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnificant me

i like the idea but i see a small problem with your 3rd use, such a sheald would be rather expencive pice of equipment nad to just throw that away would probly not be a wize or favord move by the govern ment, or the soldier if they were requierd to provide there own equipment which was often the case.

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You have to realize though that armies that fled tend to drop anything they can anyways to pick up speed, so the case where these "spiked shields" are being dropped is no exception. Obviously the cost of the new shield would be somewhat more expensive due to the spikes being made of iron, but you have to look at the situation in retrospect;

1. If you are a nation such as carthage, who has to depend heavily on auxiliaries and mercenaries, you might implement this idea if its successful in use with its own citizen armies as to attempt to preserve its own cities manpower.

2. If you are a nation that provides funding for its own professional forces then the idea could be largely successful if you weigh the options of the cost and time it takes to raise and train an army vs. the cost and manufacture time it takes to replace such shields. Certainly at which point anyone would realize that the shield is more expendable than the man, and expecially if it prevents the capture or death of any units that are veteranized..

another drawback that could possibly develope is that of the mentality of soldiers to perhaps too willing to drop the shields to run, if the idea is that successful.

as a note on the spike-shield

problems:
-the soldier standing behind you pushes your forward into battle..don't wanna get a spiek driven up my but by a fellow-soldier! or get just plain impaled when cavalry charges in our backs.
-when you impale an enemy with that shield you kill him, sure, very nice..now try to pry of a 80kg body that's tuck on your shield!

I strongly doubt it would be practical. Shields are heavy enough as it is without adding iron spikes to them, and they did already make quite effective weapons when bashed into someone's face, especially if they had a metal boss. Then there's the "friendly fire" issue Jerby noted...

it would cost loads to produce. it would take ages to produce. it would be heavy and unpractical. the offensive use of it would not work the way you describe it. it's easier to swing a blade, and more efficient.
and having routing troops drop them wouldn't stop the pursuers. it's not difficult to step over a thing like that, especially if you're running....

anyway, i'd fight naked with nothing but a sword and shield.
a bit of paint perhaps.

Given the choice i would definately rather have a regular large imperial Roman shield with the metal boss in the middle... Even if wearing a helmet or armour getting hit hard with the boss would certainly injure or wind you... Possibly knock you out even.

A small channel to test Shipmodels in (in German it's "Strömungskanal", how is it called in English :help: ), they could have built a primitive one and may have benefitted from it in trade and military matters.

1) Grow lemons.

2) Stick strips of copper and zinc in them.

3) Connect the strip of copper to a cheap metal implement via a copper wire.

4) Connect the strip of zinc to a piece of a precious metal via a copper wire.

5) Put the cheap metal and the precious metal together in salt water.

6) Allow to sit for a few days.

7) Sell resulting precious-metal-plated cheap metal instrument as made of solid precious metal.

8) Keep moving so you don't get caught.

Edit: I may have gotten which piece to hook up to which wrong, though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnificant me

what i think would be usefull would be a sheald with a strong magonet in it, that way when an iron or steel whepon stikes it the wepon becomes stuck to the sheald, it wuld also make it harder to luse gear, armor and the like beacouse you could just stick it to your sheald and then it is all in one place.

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Magnets of that strength didn't exist in ancient times. The strongest magnet available was naturally-occurring magnetite and other iron alloys. Heck, magnets of that strength are very rare today, used only for specialized industrial applications.

That's actually a bloody good idea Sim... If i'd lived back in the Roman days and discovered that i would make myself a small fortune... You would have to move quickly though because if someone found out they wouldn't think twice about ending your life, since they would get away with it if they told the judge the reason...

Mind you they still do this... Go on holiday to Spain and you will see men in the streets selling 'gold' necklaces and 'gold' watches for phenominally low prices... Wear them for a day and then take them off, you'll discover your wrist or neck has probably turned green.

As far as the magnetized shield goes, id be afraid of getting myself or equipment stuck to the damn thing.. wouldnt be a pretty sight missing a swing at an off guard samnite only to have my gladius stuck to my shield, and him turning toward me, chuckling and then promptly cutting my head off "Yee ahhh!"