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PLEASE please dont make units untrainable once you get past a certain year. In RTW and MTW it was really annoying. In RTW by the time you get marius reforms you arleady have 2-3 armys on the move, and all of them experianced, it stops your conquest for some years and complicates everything (once you conquer a city your depleted forces, even though they have 3 gold chevrons, you have to disband them).
And it makes no practical sense whatsoever.
Then there would almost be no point to new units as you'd just keep using the same armies of old.
not if the new units are (a little bit) better. compare it to CMAA and FMAA. At the same valour, CMAA are a bit better than FMAA. But if the FMAA have 1 valour, they are better, so it might be usefull to keep them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wonderland
Maybe just re-train then, and no training.
Would be fun if u could convert an FMAA to a CMAA by the time you get technology for CMAA. I seldom get more than a few bronze chevrons for my troops in the campaigns as it is now (because I tech up quickly with many unit replacements and finish the campaign before the highest-tech units have time to reach a high xp level)...
Yes that's a good idea, it would encourage you to go for experience rather than brute numbers - which in my opinion is a good thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by LegioXXXUlpiaVictrix
:balloon2:
I'd love to see something converting experienced basic units into more elite units; not a on a large scale of course, some limitations must apply, but things like regular pikemen in RTW being converted to silver shields if you want them to and they've got enough experience. Or regular legionaries becoming praetorians. Obviously some limits should apply, but it would create an emphasis on having personal favourite units that you take care of throughout the campaign game, as would have happened historically.
A bit like royal knights in the original mtw, where u could retrain them to upgrade them to the next era. If they expanded it for all units that would be awesome.
Indeed upgrading existing older units to the newer ones would be the ideal scenario. It seems like there shouldn't be any problems with it, I wonder why it isn't the case.
Agreed. :2thumbsup: It was less essential in RTW where often the unit line up did not change much over time. But in M2TW, basically the same units - knights, men-at-arms, whatever - will get dramatically better kit over time. It's just painful to have to disband your old veterans.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wonderland
in MTW you could updat your royal knights. the old royal knights could be retrained and so they became the royal knights with a new weaponry. when you can updateyour old troops with new weaponry, it also means that you wont be able to train the old troops anymore.
I've always wondered why they dont have this already.It wouldn't be too hard to do I'd think because they already had it with the royal knights. I think that CA just thought that weaon and armour upgrades were already enough and essentially thats what upgrading weapon and armour already is.
I think you overlook that there will be a new recruitment system. Recruitment time won't be a constraint for building armies only the availability of certain resources (like men). So if you have highly developed cities/castles, you should be able to get an army instantly.
I thought something like what you guys are talking about. I also like to get the highest tech units possible, and resigning 9 chevron hastati to garrison duty seems like a huge waste.
Mind you, I think veteran units should deteriote over time anyhow, if they are not getting regular combat that is. Not so they ever go back to being completely green recruits, but they should lose a few "stripes" to reflect old soldiers retiring and newer ones joining the ranks, and the consequence loss of experience.
I think the same as you guys. They should be able to be re-trained as a different unit retaining some of the experience they had. They could make it take a number of years so you don't just all of sudden upgrade all your armies in one turn.
Yeah, when a unit gets superceded, it makes sense that you should be able to pay in order to upgrade it with new equipment. I see no problem with that. You pay the same amount as for a new unit of that type, minus the manpower, and you get to keep the experience of that particular unit.
Mind you, if you do this, you could end up with a lot of highly experienced uber-units. So I guess it could end up unbalancing the game. So it would have to be implemented carefully to make sure it didn't unbalance things and make it too easy for you.
Well, what you can do is have a large cost to upgrade.
240 Feudal Man-at-Arms
240 x 10 gold each = 2400 gold
-1 experiance chevron
240 Chivalric Man-at-Arms
Now you make a choice - pay more (somewhat) and lose 1 experiance to get CMAA or get green CMAA at a reduced rate.
It doesn't make sense to upgrade your FMAA experiance 1 or 2, but if you have an experiance 5 unit, then it would be a good deal.
That would be useful and not too much micromanagement.
@ Holybandit although a minor annoyance IMO, I would be fine if that did'nt change but would be e-candy if there was a way to make obsolete units not so obsolete. The trick is to make it balanced.
Hastati < cohorts
3 chevron hastati > cohorts ----- even though the base stats are better of cohorts
3 chevron hastati converted into 3 chevron cohorts = complete murder and pwnage.
The reforms did'nt occur in the snap of the finger and implementing should'nt be so either. For me when the reforms occur, cohorts get the meatgrinder treatment while the old pros sit back and watch the action, with an occasional step into the action.
Upgrading if implemented or implemented in a future title should be costly either in time constraints or money, preferbly time as in all series money eventually never comes into the equation.
There are no years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Krauser
...only passing flickers of sensation...Quote:
Originally Posted by A.Saturnus
I would like to see upgrades for units hastat-legionarries
There is something that I would like to suggest.
The soldiers be "retrained" as another unit.
They lose some experiance (new weapons) but not all of it.
I really enjoy watching a unit progress, knowing in a battle
"This one unit has served me faithfully, I can put him in my battle line, right in the center, able to bear the brunt of the battle"
It would also seperate the "men-from-boys", that you have a solid reserve of men, not as able to crack as the green units.
Also, since they would be experianced, they will typically bear the brunt of combat. As super army would probably only appear in late game, as your well on your way to ultimate victory.
I say let all units get upgraded for a sum of money!
Well if you go by Alexander the Pretty Good's system it might work. Each upgrade costing money and experience.
For example, hastati in RTW,
We could get a green Hastati but after a few battles the unit has two chevrons.
Then a player could upgrade the unit if he wished to princeps and this would cost x amount of gold and 1 experience and now the player has a princeps with 1 chevron.
Or the player could upgrade straight to a triarii for x money and two experience to get a green triarii unit.
This means that a regular legionary cohort would require at least three chevrons to upgrade from a hastati and it would be only green.
Of course a whole structure would have to be made up of what and how exactly you can upgrade but you get the picture.
This could potentially stop all the uber-elite unit building by forcing the player to start from the more regular units and upgrade them as he/she goes along.
Quote:
Originally Posted by holybandit
Agreed.
Suddenly untrainable units is nonsense. Besides the obvious problem of having to train furiously, the player should have the option of retaining as many old units as wanted.
As long as the AI can adjust to changing technologies. If the AI from MTW only trained FMAA when it had CMAA available then that's bad. It should be up to the player to keep training old units but make sure the AI doesn't misuse this feature.