Ummm Hi, got a question (and suggestion, I guess)

Had medieval for years before ever even thinking to check for mods, so I'm new to all of this. Downloaded a couple mods to play with, then edited them because the balance wasn't quite right for my tastes.

Anyways, has anyone ever considered making actual General units?
I mean, you have your regular armies, yeah, but set them all to discouraged, since I don't think you can actually prevent them entirely from becoming generals. Then create a new unit, that's 1 man only, to be the general. (Or add a few men to be his aides/whatever.) Make him expensive/slow to train, as that kind of knowledge doesn't happen overnight, and maybe make his upkeep relatively high to reflect his importance. Set his combat abilities somewhat below standard, but find some way to make it so he gives healthy bonuses to morale and discipline by his presence, as well as lowering the natural morale/discipline of all the regular grunts.
A general who picks up a sword is no longer a general, just a common soldier. And charging into battle in front of your men, while inspiring, is a bad idea as if anything happens to the general, the common grunts won't know what to do and wont be able to coordinate as effectively. The common grunt (of the time) has only a limited grasp of tactics beyond burn, fight, kill, and is likely to make mistakes against a well trained/experienced general.

So, anyone have any suggestions on how to make this work? Or to make the idea better? If you point me in the right direction, I don't mind doing the grunt work digging through the files to prevent anyone else from becoming generals/adding generals to the various factions.
If anyone has brought this up before, I apologize for the noob I am, but I really don't have the time to read the entire forum.

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Originally Posted by Nekokaburi

If anyone has brought this up before, I apologize for the noob I am, but I really don't have the time to read the entire forum.

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don't worry about it. nobody reads the entire forum!

Ya I'd never actually thought of making an exclusively general unit. Ususally Royal Knights or something is what your thinking, but for simply generals that is actually a decent idea. I experimented with making new systems of buildings and units by just playing with gnome editor and bif files, and you can make some sort of military enhancer unit like... specifically discipline building commander, or morale building holy warior... That actually becomes fun and adds more variety to the game. If you want the unit to always be a general, just make it encouraged and make the rest either discouraged or normal. since the unit is so small i wouldn't sugest a high upkeep. If you make it too dramatic it will become the whole point of the game... raising morale or discipline by 1 or 2 is usually quite effective. Since it is so small 2 would probably be worth it. And instead of making them invincible, just make make them dispensable. Death of a general is sometimes the only way to win against a huge apponent, and invincible units are really annoying. Since units like to have their "flanks protected" its usually cool to have the general somewhere near them rather than in rtw when you can leave them behind sometimes. So give him a bunch of armor if you want. Ya give it a try if you want.

I considered once making a rebel dragon unit made of one or 2 dragons that were super powerful, but its important not to manipulate the strategy too much. With a spruced up unit its difficult to tell whether it will either take a long time to kill or whether no soldier in the other army will actually have the ability to kill it. (only like 6 can fight at a time if he can take on 6 oponents easily he could kill a whole unit.) I've played battles where the general knight killed 100 of my spearmen before he finally went down, and i thought he was going to win. so keep it within bounds of existing units.

Actually part of the point was for them not to be invincible. Give them average at best abilities in combat, and a unit size of no more than 10 (5 or less, I think). You CAN take them into combat, but you'd want to be very careful. The main point really is to add a new depth to the combat. No more having your general personally lead the charge/flanking maneuver. The only time a general should enter combat is when the shit hits the fan.
More or less it adds a new danger, as well as a new tactical opportunity. Rather than go through the meat grinder routine, butchering the enemy troops, flanking them and grinding them to dog food, you distract the main forces while you send a small force to cut off the serpent's head, as it were.

I realize there are some flaws in the idea, namely that it would become a bit more tedious, having an extra thing to build, but it's worth checking out, I think.

By the way, any idea of how to make a unit that boosts morale/discipline of other units by its presence on a battlefield? I know that some vices/virtues can have that effect, but I have no idea how to make a unit spawn with those vices/virtues, let alone replicate the effects.

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Originally Posted by Nekokaburi

By the way, any idea of how to make a unit that boosts morale/discipline of other units by its presence on a battlefield? I know that some vices/virtues can have that effect, but I have no idea how to make a unit spawn with those vices/virtues, let alone replicate the effects.

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Yes of course. Download Gnome Editor. !Basically, anyone that wants to make new units or change existing ones should do that, (or unless you have hedgemod) still gnome editor is handy cause i think it covers it more thouroughly for changing existing things. *Open up the crusaders_unit_prod.txt (if your doing the main camp) see all those numbers and scripting codes. All those have something to do with the units stats, size, shape, fighting, building, everything. Gnome editor sorts those all out by columns. and tells you what each collumn does. Just change the numbers (or add numbers) in the collumns provided in gnome editor and the stats chang in the game. VERY SIMPLE. which is ... ya. a few of those collumns has to do with basically the raw. MORALE, DISCIPLINE, VALOR, and of course just having a standing unit will increase morale if you raise their own discipline. And scepcially if you have a bunch of units that are eliete and "dont route unless general is routing" that thing you know... I believe the valor, morale, general thing effects the battle. and increases the entire battle sequence not just the unit... thats right its called "morale bonus..." so it effects everybody. it worked for me. Ya and once you know how to do that, you can make small units that are basically stat boosters, and that is just as effective as having an extra unit in the battle so...

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Originally Posted by Nekokaburi

I realize there are some flaws in the idea, namely that it would become a bit more tedious, having an extra thing to build, but it's worth checking out, I think.

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"Don't worry bout a thing, don't worry." -shedaisy:) :coffeenews:

The Napoleonic mod for MTW/VI has a General's unit with 5 men.
Our Samurai Warlords mod has a Hatamoto (Daimyo's bodyguard) unit with 11 men.
Both are frequently used in online games, too.

R'as