Hoe to lose a siege...

I'm in the fortunate position of having been quite successful in my crusades. Playing the English, I'm managed two crusades which have taken two significant local cities, allowing me to focus on conquering the incredibly weak and decadent Egyptians to the south and east - no Sala Din there! I have managed to work my down the coast, conquering Acre, Jerusalem! Now Alexandra and Thebes? (not sure) have also fallen into my hands. Following a brief piece of ethnic cleansing, they are well on their way to becoming proper seats of Christendom. The Holy English/Norman Kingdom of Jerusalem is thriving.

I've also focussed on my economy - recognising the history of england is commerce (nation of shopkeepers..) and focussed and clever application of force.

Remembering my experience with the first Medieval, I knew the Mongols would be making their presence felt soon. I built up Antioch to an incredible degree, a huge city, ballista towers, knights, archers, crusader dismounted knights - you name it. I beat off one stack, with huge casualties - and they looked like the might let up. They came back ten turns later - FOUR stacks, 5-8 star generals, but minimal infantry. Two siege towers, one battering ram.

One siege tower destroyed - but I knew the key was the battering ram - despite the 8 units of spearmen, 2 knightly units and my KING - if they got through into the city I'd be cactus. In RTW, the ram would regularly go up in flame quite easily. Not so this asbestos covered baby. I had 3 units of longbowmen, two units of archer militia pinging away at this baby with flaming arrows - and not a lick. :help:

In other sieges as well, the battering ram seems a damned sight more resistant to flaming arrows than previously? Can others share their experiences? Another thread bemoaned the weakness of wall attacks via ladders and towers - but if the mongols get into your city you're pretty much dead - particularly considering the fact I was outnumbered 6 to 1.

Now the great fortress of ACRE is besieged - I think given the curtain walls and inner bailies - they might find this harder to crack. More opportunity for my suicide anti-ram brigades to act as well...:laugh4:

Great game though - am suffering terribly from lack of sleep and the dreaded phenomenon and enemy of marriage:whip: , JOMT.

I have had some great seige battles thus far:

The first was when I was under the misconception this was RTW and went in with a piecemeal force of infantry and cav gainst a moderate city (wood wall)

my ram turned into a bag of poo 100m from the gate - my towers and ladders were expected and the welcoming parties chewed my early spearmen like tobaccy

my gen watched the whole fiasco unfold unable to render any assistance and as the last of his men fled - he waved at their commander who said "thankyou come again"

my 1st question "the seige towers dont fire at will anymore?"

The next seige was Dijon held by me being attacked by a superior Milanese force

I tried to hold at the gate, the wall. They had a tower a ram and a ladder

my first observation was despite my 2 divisions of flaming archers their ram was successfull maybe they were dousing it with water somehow

my second was thier ladder men ran to my walls at full pelt - i held them at the ladder but was losing at the tower - when they stormed the gate they ran up into the gatehouse and took it then attacked the rear of my men losing ao the tower - masterful

I retreated with my gen some mailed cav and what archers I had left to the town centre

they came in piece meal luckily for me or i was finished

here i finally mastered the heavy cav charge - and whilst weakend by arrows my general smashed and ran over each unit that came calling - until by a miracle we had won the day

playing M/M

loving it

my favorite way to kill AI controlled rams is to have a catapult on hand i'm willing to sacrifice.

just wheel it out the gate as soon as you see the ram incoming and have it blast away with non-fiery rocks. just a couple hits and its done for.

i've found that it can be a bad idea to let the crew back into the city, as the AI usually tries to rush the catapult, if they manage to get even a single unit through the gate, it won't close back up.

so as soon as the ram is dead, order the crew to break for the hills. they'll probably all die, but hey... fuck em, thats what they're there for.

after all, dread > chivalry.

Good advice pat, but watch the language please...

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Originally Posted by Yunus Dogus

my 1st question "the seige towers dont fire at will anymore?"

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I have also noticed this. At first I didn't care for it, but now I think It adds a little for challenge to the game. The fire at will on the towers in RTW was pretty devastating; sometimes taking out 3 or 4 guys at a time, if I remember correctly.

I also think it was good that they switched that off... Simply for game balance as the repeating balistas in the bigger towers where just excessive in their effect...

As for getting rid of incoming siege engines it would seem that archers with their flaming arrows are now next to useless (unless you are real lucky, or are defending against the smallest levels siege towers) and you have to depend on your wall defenses for destroying towers and rams...

You are better off leaving your archers on regualr ammunition and fire at will to thin out in the incoming units...

Getting those Balista towers built in your settlements really helps...

Has anyone experimented with including siege weapons of your own in defending your settlements? I was thinks a couple of balistas might halp against any siege towers that actually made it to our walls...

I couldn't destroy any ram, though in a couple of siege battles I used more than 8 units of yeoman, +3 experience, all trying to flame the thing. Now I go for direct attack against the unit that mans the ram and, if not enough, suicidal attacks just before the ram gets to the gate.

And if this fails, retreat to inner defenses and hope for mercy and/or luck :2thumbsup: .

Much more interesting, I'd say, sieges in MTW2. :2thumbsup:

But still no boiling oil....... such a shame

I've only had the ram destroyed by (advanced) city defences. If I have to fall back to an inner keep I'm keen to see any remaining forces slaughtered to a man as routing soliders will run back to your square thereby opening the door for the attackers. I recently saw the AI use the ram on the first door then go back and pick it up and take it to the keep gate as well. Troubling stuff...

Seiges would be great is....they....weren't....so.....damned.......slow.....

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Originally Posted by Bob the Insane

Has anyone experimented with including siege weapons of your own in defending your settlements? I was thinks a couple of balistas might halp against any siege towers that actually made it to our walls...

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The problem is you either need to take you artillery out, or shoot through a breach in the wall...
I'd be too afraid of shooting down my own walls, and troops up there (I've seen AI do that).
Yesterday I had a wonderful siege battle, about 2000 egyptians from a Jihad army besieging my turkish castle: they broke down one wall and threw 75% of their infantry through the breach. 3 units of hashishin were holding roughly 1000 soldiers while my catapult was hurling fireballs in the mass at blank point, great show ! Multiple general / light cav charges finally routed the enemies.
Hashishin are wonderful troops: all of them died, none routed, and a 54 men unit took down 222 enemies (not peasants, more like ghazi infantry !) while being outnumbered 10 to 1.