some suggestion to make it a perfect game

Hi all this is my first post.

First of all I want to give many thanks to the creators of this mod, it is really great.

Then I have some suggestions/requests for the next EB release.

1) Please add the loyalty system as seen in BI, it could recreate the situation of civil wars for romans and not only.

2) I think also religions must be added as in BI cause it gives more realism to the game.

3)The possibility to recruit Legions after the Marian reform.

4)Much more natural events.

5)Reintroduce the senatorial office scroll.

Hi and welcome,

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Originally Posted by marseu

1) Please add the loyalty system as seen in BI, it could recreate the situation of civil wars for romans and not only.

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I'm sorry, but in R:TW 1.5 loyalty can be implimented, but does nothing to the game. Civil wars and faction rebellions also cannot be implimented into R:TW 1.5.

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Originally Posted by marseu

I think also religions must be added as in BI cause it gives more realism to the game.

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I am sorry to give you the same answer again, but in R:TW 1.5, unfortunately, religion cannot be added.

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Originally Posted by marseu

3)The possibility to recruit Legions after the Marian reform.

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It is possible already to recuit legions after the Marian reforms. I beleive what you mean is the Marian reform announcement which occurs when the vannila marian reforms would happen. This announcement is a problem that will be fixed in the next version (0.81) according to the EB team.

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Originally Posted by marseu

4)Much more natural events.

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I don't understand what you mean by that. Could you please elaborate, thanks!

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Originally Posted by marseu

5)Reintroduce the senatorial office scroll.

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Sadly this cannot be brought back with out killing three factions - Baktria, the Saba and the Avernii. You need those faction slots either free or used by other Romans to get the senate scroll to work correctly without crashes to the desktop. I hope this helps you and welcome again! Cheers!

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Originally Posted by Omanes Alexandrapolites the Idiot

Hi and welcome,

I'm sorry, but in R:TW 1.5 loyalty can be implimented, but does nothing to the game. Civil wars and faction rebellions also cannot be implimented into R:TW 1.5.

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I respectfully disagree, there are mods that have loyalty implemented in 1.5.
Unfortunately loyalty cannot reach its full potential without using proper rebel factions, something unacceptable in the EB environment.

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I am sorry to give you the same answer again, but in R:TW 1.5, unfortunately, religion cannot be added.

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"Religion" can be added too (up to 3 religions), I've got a religion system working on my 1.5 (just ironing out the traits but the rest seems fine).
XGM5 in fact will feature a government system that uses the religion feature to slow down player expansion and give some more realism on factions.

About Loyalty and religions I have to say that I'm playng EB with BI, but this two elements of gameplay aren't present anyway.

About the possibility to recruit Legions I have read on some other forum of some other mod that is possible to recruit specific historical legions such as the X Legio Augustea, I think that this is done by building some kind of structure that let you train Legions.

About Natural events I was referring to events such as storms and quakes, that happens so rarely in the game.

I hope you understand cause my english is really bad.

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Originally Posted by marseu

About Loyalty and religions I have to say that I'm playng EB with BI, but this two elements of gameplay aren't present anyway.

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They need to be modded in the campaign, otherwise the BI exe gives only slightly better AI on itself.

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About the possibility to recruit Legions I have read on some other forum of some other mod that is possible to recruit specific historical legions such as the X Legio Augustea, I think that this is done by building some kind of structure that let you train Legions.

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You just need to give to an unit the legionary eagle attribute and mod the legion names in the appropriate territories, pretty easily doable.

Numbered First Cohorts will be available in the next full release, not 0.81. We cannot name them without having multiple Legions of the same name, which is historically inaccurate.

Hi again,

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Originally Posted by marseu

About Natural events I was referring to events such as storms and quakes, that happens so rarely in the game.

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Hmm, I don't know much about them. The EB team hasn't commented on them at all - yet.

And I am also sorry to say that have said that they will not implement anything from BI into their mod even if they could. This is due to the fact that these games are paid for and EB is a free modification - not every EB player has BI. According to the EB team it would be a form of theft from the Creative Assembly (the R:TW developers) should they do this. I hope this helps you! Cheers!

Oh and by the way:

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Originally Posted by marseu

I hope you understand cause my english is really bad.

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No need to apologise, I can understand you perfectly :bow:

If it can be implemented using the vanilla executable I don't see any form of thievery as they are effectively tools made available by CA for free.

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Originally Posted by Zarax

If it can be implemented using the vanilla executable I don't see any form of thievery as they are effectively tools made available by CA for free.

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The thievery angle is slightly out of context. When it was made it was understood that we would need to include certain BI-specific graphics files which were certainly not made available by CA for free but only accessible with a copy of BI. This was about a year ago prior to moving to a RTW 1.5 base and using the -mod switch, which is why it might be moot. However, that was only ever a secondary (though showstopping) issue. The primary issue was one of playability - a much smaller amount of RTW players have BI, so making a BI-only EB means much less people will be able to play the game.

We currently have no official plans to make 1.0 BI-specific.

EDIT: Forgot to include the most essential word in that sentence. ~:)

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Originally Posted by blacksnail

We currently have no official plans to make 1.0.

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My tiny brain is *very* confused :dizzy2:

Do you mean that you have no plans to take EB beyond 0.8x or are you just saying that EB has no plans for making a modification for BI?

Well, it doesn't take that much work to replace a few icons especially for a team the size of EB, does it?

Plus as I stated RTW (not BI) 1.5 supports both loyalty (not useful in EB campaign admittely due to the need to have faction slots reserved to rebels) and religion without needing the BI exe as we have them both working publicly or experimentally in XGM.

AFAIK the only features that does not work for certain on vanilla 1.5 exe (what EB is developed for) are swimming and special formations, although they can be implemented in the EDU files without any crash (allowing BI users to take advantage of them while 1.5 will just play as if they are not in the EDU).

To clarify things my posts are not meant to push the EB team in any direction whatsoever but just to list some available options that might have been overlooked due to misunderstanding.

The part referring to "tools released for free" in my previous post was meant to be "for free to RTW1.5 users" so that they had a few extra features at their disposal if they wanted to mod them in.

P.S. Nice title blacksnail!

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Originally Posted by blacksnail

The thievery angle is slightly out of context. When it was made it was understood that we would need to include certain BI-specific graphics files which were certainly not made available by CA for free but only accessible with a copy of BI. This was about a year ago prior to moving to a RTW 1.5 base and using the -mod switch, which is why it might be moot. However, that was only ever a secondary (though showstopping) issue. The primary issue was one of playability - a much smaller amount of RTW players have BI, so making a BI-only EB means much less people will be able to play the game.

We currently have no official plans to make 1.0.

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No 1.0 Just .81? Maybe go to 2.0.:egypt:

Post edited! Please re-read it. Many, many apologies if I gave anybody on the team or off a minor heart attack.

:oops:

Ahh! "Shatterer of Hopes & Dreams".. I finaly get it.

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Originally Posted by Zarax

Well, it doesn't take that much work to replace a few icons especially for a team the size of EB, does it?

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The concern at the time was that it wouldn't have been "a few icons." At the time it was a whole .PAK file worth of BI data. (Go into your RTW\Data\paks directory. I'm talking about one of those huge things.) I think we ran it by CA at the time? I don't remember exactly. But like I said, that was a year ago and that whole argument no longer applies because we're using the -mod switch.

Loyalty and religion working with 1.5 is interesting. We are at the 21 faction limit, so as you say loyalty doesn't appear to be very useful. Beyond that I can't see right now how we'd be able to use Religion in EB, particularly with the limitations you mention. That doesn't mean that it won't be used, just that it doesn't seem to line up with anything in this period of history.

If you can make a good case, I'll look into what it would take to implement.

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To clarify things my posts are not meant to push the EB team in any direction whatsoever but just to list some available options that might have been overlooked due to misunderstanding.

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That's how I read it, so no harm done. I am always interested in finding new ways to make this engine do cool new things, so please share if you have any ideas!

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P.S. Nice title blacksnail!

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For a while I was afraid it would be "The guy who broke EB recruitment," so I decided to pre-empt it. ~:)

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Loyalty and religion working with 1.5 is interesting. We are at the 21 faction limit, so as you say loyalty doesn't appear to be very useful.

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Is it possible to make the rebels the counter faction for every other or specific factions that had to face large rebellions like Ptolemaioi or Arche Seleukia? For exmaple that if one of genrals is not loyal enough would start a revolt (similar to medieval:tw).

That is definitely worth checking out.

I was just wondering if the faction unloyal generals go to can be changed.

Like for instance a seleucid general who rebels at (or near) the start goes to the ptomlies as they are your current biggest threat, but later on rebeling generals go to the romans for instance or whoever the most powerful faction your at war with happens to be?

I dont know if its historically accurate but it sounds good to me :/

Nah, I don't think that is possible. They have to go to one set faction. It can't vary.

Personally, if possible, I'd rather see every general who rebels go to the Eleutheroi faction.

Some time ago I opened a thread about loyalty in the Ludus Magna at Zarax's request. Sadly, it never generated any discussion, but it does contain a summary of what was known about loyalty. Amongst other things: setting the eleutheroi as counterfaction causes a CTD when the shadowed faction is destroyed.

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Originally Posted by Ludens

Some time ago I opened a thread about loyalty in the Ludus Magna at Zarax's request. Sadly, it never generated any discussion, but it does contain a summary of what was known about loyalty. Amongst other things: setting the eleutheroi as counterfaction causes a CTD when the shadowed faction is destroyed.

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that means if Eleutheroi are the shadow faction for Arche seleukia, the game CTD's if Arche seleukia is destroyed?

Would marking all factions as re-emergent prevent the CTD? Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Bonny

that means if Eleutheroi are the shadow faction for Arche seleukia, the game CTD's if Arche seleukia is destroyed?

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Yes.

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Originally Posted by Omanes Alexandrapolites the Idiot

Would marking all factions as re-emergent prevent the CTD? Thanks.

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I guess not, but I haven't done any research on it myself.

Having generals rebelling to the slave faction would be possible for EB as you have some unreachable Eleutheroi territories IIRC but that might have some limitations as well (could be max 2 factions with loyalty, lusted at TWC would be the best person to ask to), while I'm using religion to represent the 3 main government "systems" (oligarchy, monarchy and tribalism) so that they could be used to represent the government structure (a bit like EB system just more generic) and eventual consequences in changing/conquering a different one.

If religion could be used to represent another concept in EB, I think that that would be fabulous, but what would you do with it?

One possibility that I think could be very exciting is to use 'religion' to represent ethnic demographics. That is, you could have 'religions' of Hellene, Roman, Carthaginian, Celtic, Persian, etc. Each city would have a starting breakdown of ethnicities that could be subsequently affected by the buildings built by the controlling faction. When a city is conquered by a faction, if its ethnic composition is hostile to the conqueror then there would be more unrest, more revolts, lower income etc. It could also have an impact on the troops available to be trained.

This would make the building of colonies and the settlement of veterans in conquered territories a major component in strategy, which I don't think that it is now. That is, not only could you get a 5% public order bonus from building a colony, you also get an 'conversion' bonus that would eventually change the demographic makeup of the city, making a larger garrison less necessary.

This idea is not intended to replace the current 'ethnicities' that are part of the traits system, but to complement and extend it to have more impact on game play.

I think that something along these lines could have a mjor impact in the later stages of a game, when the first surge of conquest turns into consolidation and integration of a large empire. I find this (in RTW) dull, tedious and not terribly difficult. Having to deal with a multi-ethnic heterogenous population could be a whole new and exciing challenge.

Needless to say it would be a hell of a lot of work for the EB team. I wish I knew how to work on it myself.:wall:

As it is right now, both capital distance and squalor are already gamebreaking as soon as you try to make an empire. No point adding another factor, loyalty. Since this one is partially already represented by the two previous factors.

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Originally Posted by oudysseos

If religion could be used to represent another concept in EB, I think that that would be fabulous, but what would you do with it?

One possibility that I think could be very exciting is to use 'religion' to represent ethnic demographics. That is, you could have 'religions' of Hellene, Roman, Carthaginian, Celtic, Persian, etc.

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Well, religion works properly with maximum 3 different beliefs, you can go up to 10 but 7 of them won't cause unrest and other factors might be messed up...