Hoepefully this thread will be useful to some of you, but this depends on the activity of more experienced PMTW gamers.:book:
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Hoepefully this thread will be useful to some of you, but this depends on the activity of more experienced PMTW gamers.:book:
well, i guess ill post first. my favorite tactic is setting an ambush. heres the battle stats:
enemy: smaller army but with heavily armed soldiers mainly pikemen,corselets,ect.
me: larger army but with weak melee troops but with a lot of musketeers,arquebusiers,ect.
so what i do is set up my men on a slope and wait for the enemy to come up. then i unleash a series of volleys just to slightly weaken the enemy. after that i run up the mountain and continue the process. however, my men do need to be extremely accurate cause once they run out of bullets they are dead. so i place my soldiers at point blank range and fire. eventually when the pikemen reach the summit of the hill i send out my melee troops as cannon fodder. after that i continue firing at point blank range until the enemy begins to retreat.
Note: if the enemy has calvary dont try this. also if they have many units of pikemen you might have to move your soldiers around a lot to stop them from engaging you in melee combat.
Totally irrelevent post... didn't realize what forum I was in;)
got v.:furious3: :furious3: with the spainsih because of lots of money so
1 build big fleet
2 fight their fleets 3 tyre .deadringer. as i have put it:yes: :yes: :yes: :beam: :beam: :laugh4: :laugh4:
*Semi-random observations and advice*
I've found that in a singleplayer campaign that I tend to follow a semi-accurate historical trend, that of a move towards favouring lesser armoured infantry with more shot and cavalry. But it does pay to keep some heavily armoured halberdiers or pikemen around as specialist troops, as they're quite useful in siege breaking or bridge battles.
Early in campaigns it works well having a lot of combat troops, supported by shot , as early shot units by themselves generally do not mass enough firepower or numbers to see off a foe. A model for army design in the middle years that I have found to be sucessfull is 2 or 3 shot units per pike unit.
If playing English, try to keep those longbowmen units around in later years, as they start becoming effective again as lightly armoured pike and shot units become prevalent over the older heavier armoured types. They also have worked wonders for me in bridge battles before the awesome mobile field guns come out to play.
In general (and this may seem obvious but a lot of people forget it still), always try and keep a reserve of a unit or two, because when that gap in the enemy lines opens up, you're gonna want to exploit it, and if your whole force is committed at that point you're usually deep in the brown stuff or kicking yourself by not being able to pull of an easier win and having to go for it the hard way.
:beam:
I mainly played as the Poles in this mod (2 campaigns) and since they are a very diverse faction unit-wise some of the tactics lined out above by Spurious also apply to this faction. Poland loses ground in Late because they become technologically backwards but they rule the field in the first two campaigns, especially during Religious Turmoil.
Infantry-heavy armies were only an option to me after the appearance of Muskerterzy and - finally - the pikemen unit, but it is not these that are the Poles' true strength. Instead of relying on cuirassiers (wonderful units) as supporting cavalry, they can field excellent cavalry as the mainstay of an army with winged husaria (who rip everything to shreds except pikemen) as an elite core. A few low-quality infantry units i.e. any of the early Polish infantry are perfectly sufficient to distract the enemy troops and buy some time for the decisive strike. Most enemy cavalry are inferior to the Commonwealth's so use this to your advantage.
A feature of PMTW is that battles are often rather large due to money not being too tight most of the time...for quite a number of factions at least. Consequently good maneuvring skills are required to really exploit the benefits of cavalry, but if handled correctly a Polish army relying on cavalry is difficult to overcome....which is a good thing because the Ottomans deserve an opponent as well suited to their own army as possible. As mentioned above the longbowmen retain their virtues as time goes by, and the same applies to the good ol' ever-annoying horse archer - of which the Porte sports quite a number. Basically they are even stronger than in vanilla MTW because of the lack of archers after 1572. Their killing powers may be lower than those of musketmen, but their range is far superior, as is their speed and maneuvrebility, and against almost unarmoured musketmen they really hurt. Thus, one has to overcome them either by the usage of many of those light cannons or by deploying massed fast cavalry to trap them.
I started playing after 1572 and its much enterainment! Those regimental cannons are much fun- but talking about effectiveness, i wonder if they are worth a place in my armies.
what do you think?
Was that a serious question?:inquisitive: I ALWAYS have AT LEAST 4 regimental cannon groups if I can in any way manage it. They've got a much longer range than any musket and quite enough ammo too. I have found them extremely useful in forcing the AI to abandon a hill or else get punished for it quite severely. Of course, that's just attacking. Defensively, if you can get those boys situated on a nice hill, their nigh upon unstoppable. I have won a defensive battle with absolutely NO casualties, all because my regi's were on a very steep hill, I had 6 of them, and they flat tore the enemy apart. My poor Tufecki's hardly got any action in the battle.:beam: Plus, since they've only got 4 men per group, they can gain valor VERY fast, making them extremely accurate.:yes: In all, USE THEM! I have never, in all my experience playing any mod, had quite as much fun with a unit, and one that's so darn effective as well.
Sorry for the dumb question:wall: . And thank you for your answer. I just fought one battle with them- they didnt kill that many enemys but they seemed to drop the enemys morale.
I hadnt more fun with any other mod either!
I quickly discovered two things with two of the factions in this mod (which is brilliant btw); don't but all your heirs in one army and you can build huge armies with the Dutch.
I'll divide my tactics into two lists, infantry and cavalry.
My favourite tactic when commanding cavalry is to set feint attacks. The tactic requires stretching a unit of 100 dragoons out as far as it will go (to maximise firepower) and using them as the feint soldiers. I set them to skirmish, and form up my main body of Ironsides ready and waiting. What the tactic comprises is the following:
The Dragoons trot up to the enemy cavalry troops, and begin firing off volleys into them. Usually, enemy cavalry troops which rely on shock rather than sniping are likely to charge. So, the faster Dragoons will be able to get away, and the enemy cavalry will be stretched thin chasing the dragoons. Then I order my Ironsides to charge, and they hit the now unprotected flank of the enemy cavalry.
Sometimes the tactic doesn't work, as the AI of Medieval Total War leaves much to be desired (they don't even advance their armies in lines for christ sake).
For Infantry, I try to outflank my enemy as much as possible. I always position my most powerful and experienced troops on the left and right flanks of my infantry line. When they advance into battle, the two lines will look something like this:
________________________________
________________________________
Hopefully, my flank regiments will repel those of the enemy, then I can turn my flank regiments in on the enemy, so it will now look like this:
_______________________________
|________________________________|
I see one weakness of the cavalry tactic - dragoons in the game (and in the reality) have weaker horses than ordinary cavalry - they are a bit slower and their stamina is much worse. It would be really risky when fighting a faction with really fast cavalry for example the Ottomans especially the Delils whose morale should allow them to charge even if shot by a couple of musketeer units at close range.
It is a very risky tactic, you're right. At one point, enemy ironsides outflanked my dragoons and annihilated them. By the time by Ironsides had caught up to them, they had re-formed. After about twenty minutes of intense combat (combined with the rest of the army), we routed them, killed about 1,000, took around the same number of prisoners.
I try to get a unit of Pikes and a unit of Musketeers to work grouped together. That way pike protects shot which is how it worked.
In the English Civil war the predominant formation was Swedish with Dutch coming from those Officers who had seen service on the continent. It has to be remembered that Pike and shot were formed in the same regiment. In the New Model Army it was 2 musketeers to one Pikemen and this ratio fell more to shot later on. Early in the ECW half a regiment was shot the other pikes especially for the Royalist side.
Unfortunately we cannot get integrated pike and shot but I find grouping a shot and pike unit together works well.
The Dragoons were mounted Infantry then, on inferior horses but Colonel Oakey at the Battle of Naseby lined his Dragoons along the Selby Hedges where they poured shot into the side of the Royalist cavalry as they advance and then toward the end of the battle he mounted his dragoons and succesfully charged the Royalist centre!
I try to use my dragoons behind hedges or at the edge of woodland, maybe securing a village or bridge pulling them back before contact. Dragoons are nuisance value unlike Col. Oakey I never commit them to close combat!
To some degree it will be easier in 2.0 - there will be units of pikemen with musketeers attached to the same formation.Quote:
Originally Posted by William Waller
Which is a mistake - the dragoons in the mod are created to move like a cavalry, but FIGHT as infantry and have all the bonuses any infantry gets, or more don't have any disadvantages (except their horses decreasing stats in woods) any cavalry suffers from when fighting pikemen and the likes.Quote:
The Dragoons were mounted Infantry then, on inferior horses but Colonel Oakey at the Battle of Naseby lined his Dragoons along the Selby Hedges where they poured shot into the side of the Royalist cavalry as they advance and then toward the end of the battle he mounted his dragoons and succesfully charged the Royalist centre!
I try to use my dragoons behind hedges or at the edge of woodland, maybe securing a village or bridge pulling them back before contact. Dragoons are nuisance value unlike Col. Oakey I never commit them to close combat!
Unfortunatelly the re is no other way e.g. giving an ability to dismount DURING a battle.
Think of them as light infantry with horses - they move much faster, have a bit less ammunition, are a bit larger targets and their formation is rather loose, but except of that they are infantrymen.
Of course unlike most other musketeer units they DON'T change mode into minerteams when in a siege - so aren't best for storming a castle - their second mode is ordinary infantry.
This is a story from one of my Medieval Total War campaigns, not Pike and Musket, but the same thing applies. I started off as England in the early period. I had a small army, and no navy, but there was method to my stalling. I built up (using cheats of course!) master armourers, bowyers, swordsmiths, metalsmiths, shipyards and the works. I also built a military academy and huge fortresses and castles across the land. I "bought" Wales and Scotland into my Kingdom. Then, I began my conquest of the land. I invaded Ireland with nearly 2,000 well trained, well armoured and well-led soldiers. We took only 4 losses during the battle to over 200 Irish dead.
Then we began our move south. Our long term friend and close ally, the Holy Roman Empire was embattled in a war with France. Knowing that the French would eventually defeat the HRE with superior numbers, they would become a major continental enemy. We assisted our German allies, and came very close to annihilating the French as a faction. Luckily for them, they had established colonies near Ukraine after a Crusade, and so the French still thrived. Following the conquest of France, I began to build up huge armies and naval fleets. Soon, England became the most powerful nation in Europe, with the largest and most advanced army. Following a destructive war, the Spanish had conquered the Almohad Dynasty. Hungry for more land, I built up a large invasion force. At this time, in the mid 12th century, the English army in total numbered over 40,000 men. Nearly 5,000 of them were stationed in garrisons, while around 14,000 were trained up, specifically for the invasion of Spain. Around 20,000 remained on alert around the empire.
The invasion was swift and decisive. Within years we had taken control of the entire Iberian peninsular, and all of Spain's continental possessions in North Africa. The Pope called for crusades, but my nation was so powerful and strong that nobody dared to do so. We went on and destroyed the Crown of Aragon. During both campaigns, we lost no more than 900 men. Then, we began our move against the Holy Roman Empire. They were building forces back up, and we were receiving an influx of assassins and spies. We invaded with an overwhelming number of soldiers, the army was some 20,000 strong. The Germans retreated from almost every battle, until they were defeated in head-on clashes. There, my army suffered heavy casualties storming a fortress; over 1,400 dead were taken by my troops destroying the remnants of the Germans. We began to build fleets of more advanced Cogs; ships bristling with guns. Eventually, the troops stationed in the British Isles alone numbered over 11,000, while the fleet surrounding it was nearly 120 ships.
The moral of this story is; never go to war unless you have properly trained troops, or an advantage in numbers.
I downloaded the mod and it is great but i noticed the starting faction leaders in all the campaigns don't have accurate names which is kind of annoying.
oh well, the monarch names ain't so bad, but sometimes the spelling is! (eny instead of any for example)... and Augustiin (Dutch faction leader) should be Augustijn or Augusteyn... no, actually it should be Willem, Maurits or Frederik-Hendrik ;)
Concerning tactics I followed through on a little tactic I tried in M:TW VI, the massed infantry charge, including the missile units. The ultimate test was a battle of about 500 (medieval) french against double their number of English, I charged with urban militia, spears and archers at their UM and Spears and they broke almost instantly, while my king crashed into 3 units of English Hobilars supported by just one French Spear unit. The hobilars panicked when their footmen ran and 75% of the battle was just a chase!
I implemented this into pike and musket. take care that all your foot is on "engage at will" for this. Especially pikemen perform much better on this stance, against cavalry too. my pikes were usually "losing/losing slightly" when on "hold formation", when I switched them to "engage at will" (first just to try, now it's their standard stance) they quickly gained the advantage.
A combined charge of pike AND shot after a volley or two at the enemy pike is a battle-winner. In addition I use the shot as flankers if possible/necessary. In essence, it's the swedish infantry tactic used in the 17th/18th century (volley at 50 yards, volley at 20 yards, CHARGE!!!). even with a 2:1 shot/pike ratio, this tactic works a charm, I've advanced south steadily and reduced the King of France to a single nameless province and suspect the king of Spain to be having nightmares about the fiendish Dutch ;) Cavalry is used against enemy cavalry or to lure away a few companies of pike to weaken the enemy line. If all enemy pike is engaged with my own foot, the cavalry charges the flanks and rear.
In fact, it's quite easy to mess up the enemy's line on normal difficulty. send some cavalry in close (but not too close) and the pike leave their position to chase after them for a few score yards, isolating themselves. I could try to perfect this exploit by keeping my foot closer to the horse in the advance.
the last battle before a break was a huge 2100 Dutch vs. 3500 French, and I won it handsomely. The French threw at me every unit of pike, shot and horse they got and were decimated. I left a whopping 17 companies in reserve who did not see action that day. There were some hairy moments though, and their abundance of pike made it hard on my (mostly mercenary) Cavalry. This big one was more of an offensive-defense battle. The 1st "brigade" of defending French I shattered with a speedy advance, then came about 3-4 waves of reinforcements which I received on pike and shot formations.
that's another thing, income... I've never been so rich in vanilla MTW! and I don't have to do anything for it. I can bribe and hire mercenaries and still end the turn knowing I'll make a profit. Maybe it could have been a bit harder money-wise as I don't get the impression it's a struggle to keep a standing army... and it used to be like that! especially the Dutch were not keen on big armies... but who can blame Augustijn II when he kicks so much @$$? :smash:
OK, cool!^_^ I just wanted to make sure I didn't do anything wrong :]Quote:
Originally Posted by cegorach
OK, so I was taking some time out from Ancient, and thought 'Persia looks interesting'..... Don't open the spoiler if you haven't played this faction yet!!!
Spoiler Alert, click show to read: