Interesting Poems by V Tech Prof

You might have seen the disturbed plays written by the killer at VT.

There was, of course, great comment about how that should have indicated something was wrong.

Now it turns out one of the Professors from VT published poems similar in hate, violence, and crudeness of competence.

Nikki Giovanni, who gave the closing remarks at the convocation last week at VT (that dragged in references to AIDs in Africa and elephant poaching and thirsty Mexican kids, etc.), wrote those poems.

More info is here:
WARNING: Contains numerous racist slurs, hate crimes, and violent acts.
http://www.vdare.com/asp/printPage.a...2_giovanni.htm

CR

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

Now it turns out one of the Professors from VT published poems similar in hate, violence, and crudeness of competence.

Nikki Giovanni, who gave the closing remarks at the convocation last week at VT (that dragged in references to AIDs in Africa and elephant poaching and thirsty Mexican kids, etc.), wrote those poems.

More info is here:
WARNING: Contains numerous racist slurs, hate crimes, and violent acts.
http://www.vdare.com/asp/printPage.a...2_giovanni.htm

CR

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Interesting find, Crazed Rabbit. I suppose if Mrs Giovanni wrote this sort of thing, she must have killed thousands of whites over the years.

Oh right, she didn't. It was poetry.

I guess you put this up to prove something, but you don't know how to put it. It's the same as with your thread about 'Canadian journalist attacked by Muslims'. There is something there, but it doesn't quite register in your left lateral brain lobe, the cortical area where words are formed and stringed together into sentences. What is that particular thought that refuses to put on words and come out of the closet? Is it this: Professor Giovanni was an intellectual accomplice or instigator of Cho's killing spree?

Could Giovanni have been his accomplice or instigator, even though it was Giovanni, of all people, who alerted the English department to Cho's 'troubled behaviour' and asked to have him removed and given professional help? Can we use Cho's excesses to attack this black English professor for her political views? Can we politicise Cho's behaviour and turn it into a ' black thing'. Canw euse this to indict all those pomo literati who have lost touch with Crazed Rabbit's world and end their freedom of expression once and for all? Well, I am just guessing and second-guessing here. And I guess I'm dead wrong, huh? Doesn't mean a thing?

Oh wait, that VDare site you linked to says this:

The Virginia Tech massacre compels inquiring minds to search out the many other instances of immigrants who purposely kill in quantity.
We must call this “Immigrant Mass Murder Syndrome”, to match Daniel Pipes’ term “Sudden Jihad Syndrome” describing the distinct tendency of Muslims in the U.S. to start suddenly offing Americans. In fact, Sudden Jihad Syndrome may just be a special case of Immigrant Mass Murder Syndrome.

I guess I was right after all, wasn't I?

I am not an American, but I understand Giovanni's poems very well. And if websites like VDare are still popular in the U.S. I suppose I would even share some of Giovanni's poetic murder inclinations.

Oh, but those poems date from the sixties. It's your basic sixties Black Pantherite Black Artistique expression of rage, albeit in a small voice and not a huge, booming, highly articulate voice. The articulate version can, for instance, be found in Mr James Baldwin's brilliant books. Mr Baldwin didn't kill whites either, he moved to France to live amid a superior version of the breed. To get away from the VDares, so to speak.

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

There was, of course, great comment about how that should have indicated something was wrong.

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Personally, I'm hoping you're trying to prove here that writing violent poems/plays doesn't mean anything...

Those 'poems' don't make her sound crazy.

It's that damned poetry! What is happening to our children? They read violent poetry!

O tempora, o mores!

Ban the poetry!

So it weren't the video games after all. Rockstar will be glad to hear this...

I think the focus on all this violent, perverted literature causing bad things to happen and being a precursor to people going ape balls is completely off base and barking up the wrong tree. No No No No No No No. The vast, vast majority of mass murderers, or even murderers for that matter, don't make an intensive point to focus their hate/craziness/intentions into literature.

For God's sake, didn't any of you ever have to write stories in grade school and middle school, some of which involved monsters or terrorists or aliens that always managed to kill the school bullies and bad teachers first? I wrote things that would get me expelled today, but golly look at me I grew up to be an almost-decent human.

After watching Romeo and Juliet, I realized that Bill Shakespeare supports teen suicide. Damn you, liberal Elizabethan culture!

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

Personally, I'm hoping you're trying to prove here that writing violent poems/plays doesn't mean anything...

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That's probably the only point someone can get from this in relation to VT shootings.

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I guess I was right after all, wasn't I?

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'Vdare' or whatever looks like a stupid site, especially with that moronic 'symptom' they dreamed up.

The most interesting point one might get about this is how a person who wrote those poems could get such a high ranking university job. I can only suppose certain expressions of violence are more politically correct than others.

Crazed Rabbit

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

I can only suppose certain expressions of violence are more politically correct than others.

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Those that don't result in people getting killed do tend to be more accepted. An interesting relevation this is...

If you can show me one guy who wrote white supremacist poems and holds a high ranking university position...

CR

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

If you can show me one guy who wrote white supremacist poems and holds a high ranking university position...

CR

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Those types usually end up in the US Senate.

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Originally Posted by Vladimir

Those types usually end up in the US Senate.

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:laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:


EDIT: Now it's about racism all of a sudden CR ?

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EDIT: Now it's about racism all of a sudden CR ?

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All of a sudden? Hardly, considering I pointed out how these were racist poems in my first post.

CR

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

All of a sudden? Hardly, considering I pointed out how these were racist poems in my first post.

CR

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[QUOTE-CR]
Now it turns out one of the Professors from VT published poems similar in hate, violence, and crudeness of competence.[/QUOTE]

Only in the warning. Besides, you started the thread commenting on the similarities to the plays of the killer, he didn't write anything racist (okay, he didn't care for the white kids/christians very much, but did he call anyone a crakcer or wrote a play about killing the white man ?).

So why are you brining up racism all of a sudden ?

Let me ask a clear question: Do you or don't you oppose this professor, for whatever reason ?
If so, then you can clarify the reason, if not, then why the attacks ?

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

The most interesting point one might get about this is how a person who wrote those poems could get such a high ranking university job. I can only suppose certain expressions of violence are more politically correct than others.

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Well, I suppose that Nikki Giovanni's 30 books, celebrated courses and speeches and 22 honorary degrees have something to do with her tenure at V Tech.

Wanna bet? :mellow:

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Well, I suppose that Nikki Giovanni's 30 books, celebrated courses and speeches and 22 honorary degrees have something to do with her tenure at V Tech.

Wanna bet?

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What's interesting is she got her first honorary degree not to long after publishing these poems.

If her remarks at the convocation are any guide, it makes one wonder if she was given so many honors for her talent or for the basic theme she included.

Would a KKK poet asking if people had killed (insert various racist slurs here) in poems get so many degrees?

In short, then, what has she done to merit all these honors? They all seem to accumulate from her initial poems. They have become a repeating cycle of award for all her past awards.

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Let me ask a clear question: Do you or don't you oppose this professor, for whatever reason ?

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I first heard of her when she read her remarks at the VT convocation. Then I opposed her remarks, which I thought tacky. Now, I she has written these poems and tattooed 'Thug Life' on her arm. And so I oppose her for one simple reason; I oppose all racists.

CR

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

I first heard of her when she read her remarks at the VT convocation. Then I opposed her remarks, which I thought tacky. Now, I she has written these poems and tattooed 'Thug Life' on her arm. And so I oppose her for one simple reason; I oppose all racists.

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Thanks for the pointer, I read the address and I think it's great.

I don't know what trip you are on, Crazed Rabbit, but I'm getting bad vibes when I read your VDare website. Reclaiming America for the white man, painting immigrants as murderers. Yeghh.

A 60s era expression of frustration with the system at that time isn't QUITE like the mediocre, homicidal rantings of Cho Seung Hui.

There are differences you know. And I strongly suspect that YOU are the racist Crazed Rabbit.

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

I first heard of her when she read her remarks at the VT convocation. Then I opposed her remarks, which I thought tacky. Now, I she has written these poems and tattooed 'Thug Life' on her arm. And so I oppose her for one simple reason; I oppose all racists.

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Considering those poems apparently date back to the sixties I think it's unfair to judge those by today's standards. I doubt she would have gotten all that recognition if she actually was a racist. She probably wouldn't have been picked to give the closing speech if she was a controversial figure either.

I think you're judging a book by it's cover, a very old and probably outdated cover at that.

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Originally Posted by Adrian II

Thanks for the pointer, I read the address and I think it's great.

I don't know what trip you are on, Crazed Rabbit, but I'm getting bad vibes when I read your VDare website. Reclaiming America for the white man, painting immigrants as murderers. Yeghh.

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Gah - I've never seen that site before (nor do I intend to visit it again). I did not search around before posting the link. If what you say is true, they're just as despicable.

Don't call it 'my' website, please.

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A 60s era expression of frustration with the system at that time

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Acts of violence against individual people of different race or religion is an odd way of expressing dissatisfaction with the system.

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I doubt she would have gotten all that recognition if she actually was a racist. She probably wouldn't have been picked to give the closing speech if she was a controversial figure either.

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Let me draw a parallel - have you heard of Al Sharpton, labeled a civil rights leader, and if so, what is your opinion on him and what he does? You'll notice there's not that much mainstream controversy surrounding him.

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And I strongly suspect that YOU are the racist Crazed Rabbit.

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Ah, the ole racism accusation. I'm saddened, but not surprised. You are, of course, completely wrong.

CR

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Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit

Acts of violence against individual people of different race or religion is an odd way of expressing dissatisfaction with the system.

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I'm sorry, I thought she just wrote stuff...

You can see the difference between real and something fictional right ? :inquisitive:

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Let me draw a parallel - have you heard of Al Sharpton, labeled a civil rights leader, and if so, what is your opinion on him and what he does? You'll notice there's not that much mainstream controversy surrounding him.

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I've only heard of him, don't know much about him. Is being controversial a crime these days ?

intermission
please focus on the arguments instead of making personal attacks - calling other patrons "racist" is not appreciated.

Thanks

Ser Clegane

Her poems have violent content, but they are not violent in intent. I read most of them as comments on that attitude (as much black poetry is). And her poems are not exactly being criticized by an unbiased source or one that is educated in poetic criticism. Cho's work was delirious, incoherent, and dangerous. Giovanni's are, while not my style, are solid poems. Someone else will see more beauty in them than I do but I understand it is there. If you were to ban violent poems would you ban the works of Russell Edson and Allen Ginsberg?

What about Gwendolyn Brooks' poem "We Real Cool"? It glorifies something bad but she doesn't agree with it, she just represents it.

We real cool. We
Left school. We

Lurk late. We
Strike straight. We

Sing sin. We
Thin gin. We

Jazz June. We
Die soon.

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Gah - I've never seen that site before (nor do I intend to visit it again).

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Whats wrong with the website , why wouldn't you visit it again ?
Personally I think it is quite important when forming views on things to visit the most extreme sources on both sides of the coin and get all the middle ground stuff as well .
Besides which some of those extremist websites are just so hilarious (though of course they are trying to be serious)

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You'll notice there's not that much mainstream controversy surrounding him.

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I beg to differ , there is lots of mainstream contoversy about Sharpton .

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Originally Posted by JimBob

What about Gwendolyn Brooks' poem "We Real Cool"? It glorifies something bad but she doesn't agree with it, she just represents it.

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I actually love that poem. It's refreshing and contemporary...or perhaps it's just because the whole thing is short, to the point, yet carry a lyrical quality in it: just like a poem should be. Unlike the bloodily annoying, incomprehensible archaic poetry of long dead Englishmen everyone seems to love.

In any case, I'm curious of this thread's intention. Are you implying that Cho's action is motivated by institutionalized racism against whites, Crazed Rabbit?

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Originally Posted by AntiochusIII

I actually love that poem. It's refreshing and contemporary...or perhaps it's just because the whole thing is short, to the point, yet carry a lyrical quality in it: just like a poem should be. Unlike the bloodily annoying, incomprehensible archaic poetry of long dead Englishmen everyone seems to love.

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I like it also, but I also admire all the 'archaic' writers such as Alexander Pope, Wordsworth, and of course Shakespeare. But that poetry in the link has to be the most god-awful rubbish I've ever read.

Yeah, so anti-white racism is more acceptable than any other kind of racism. Has it ever been different? By which I mean to say-- Your point is?

Certainly reverse racism and academic decadence are issues to be tackled in today's society, but attempting to exploit this particular mass murder-- which, in the view of any reasonable person, had very distinct causes-- is just tacky, and unlikely to inspire any action on the matter.