The "EB shieldwall", the AI, and you

I recently quite by accident realized what the "can form shieldwall" description given to a few EB units means in practice (namely, the alternate formation behind the "loose formation" button is simply denser instead of looser). There really should be an explanation about it somewhere, maybe in the relevant units' UI texts or something. :sweatdrop:

Anyway, once the human player realizes this neat detail he or she can naturally employ it to his heart's content. What I'm curious about, however, is if the tactical AI is smart enough to recognize it and use it, and without being specifically told to by the formation_ai.txt or something similar.

What are peoples' experiences ?

I've never seen the AI use it.

EDIT: I haven't tried this yet though, I should probably give it a try.

I don't think I've seen the AI use it, but what EB units have this?
I don't believe I've ever used it, I only use loose formations for skirmishers, archers and horse archers.

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Originally Posted by Redmeth

I don't think I've seen the AI use it, but what EB units have this?
I don't believe I've ever used it, I only use loose formations for skirmishers, archers and horse archers.

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Quite some germanic units can do this. Frameharjoz, Wodanawulfoz, Haruskoz-Swaiut and Sahsnotoz just to name a few. Don't know much about units from other factions, though.

Can't remember ever seeing the AI use it. It may be because usually when a battle of mine involves units that I know can do this, they are fighting on my side, but when they have been the enemy they've always been in a loose formation.

Judging by the description the Belgae Milnaht should, but their formation values kinda don't reflect it... The Arverni Arjos have it, anyway. The Baktrioi Agema and Hypaspistai look like they might be meant to have it, or alternatively use the normal tight/loose scheme - but their formation values are weird enough I suspect some of them have changed places. Ditto for Massiloi Hoplitai. Other types of hoplitai lack it, anyway.

Casse Rycalawre had this ability in the 0.7 build, not sure if they still have it. I have never seen the A.I. use it, though. I am using Thorlof's latest formations, without the rest of his battle pack.

It's a function of the unit-specific "formation" line in the EDU, not the separate battle formation files.

0.81a Rycalawre don't have it, incidentally. Instead, with the exception of the Arjos, all the units sharing that model have a pretty tight base formation and a rather looser secondary one.

I'm starting to get a feeling this stuff is a bit WIP...

wait.... ur telling me when units get closer together instead of far appart when pressing the "Spread Out" button is not a bug?????? :dizzy2:

Depends on the unit but, yes, could well be a feature instead.

It is a feature, although it hasn't been completely implemented.

It is a feature but some units, notably Hoplites, have it the other way around.

..........................................i guess i just learned something new...

OK now.... should I have them in "Guard Mode" too, like hoplites????

does this decreased unit spacing actually protect against ranged weapons like a shield wall is supposed to? Or are they still working on that?

The BI shield wall formation gives a bonus vs. the front I think, but the spacing and bonus are both hard-coded afaik. This would be really neat to do since the vanilla shield wall causes the unit to expand and the soldiers to dance. It also screws with unit speeds since they use the advance animation when in vanilla shield wall formation which is faster for spearmen than it is for swordsmen for reasons passing understanding.

If it actually helps vs. ranged attacks, we could replace CA's shield wall with one that works properly.