martels anvil

another one of my inventions i stumbled upon several months ago that will be super powerful in version 1.2 is the martels anvil or super schiltrom.

i usually pick the papal states and purchase in high age 4 papal guard, 4 italian spear militia, 4 armored seargeants, and 4 seargeant spearmen. i then give them as much armor upgrades as possible to give some protection against missiles.

now that the shield bug is fixed they will be a quite formidable formation for a new player. one not even need camp with it since once you group the formation as i will describe it will move as one and then when you drive into the middle of the enemy line you can camp with it.

all you do is stack all spear units on the same spot and then hit schiltrom. they will all be clustered in a tight rounded phalanx that cannot be flanked and their massive numbers and schiltrom formation will give them plenty of morale.

an all cav army will have absolutely no chance even if it has missiles since they will expend them all without significantly weakening the formation. a balanced army will most likely not beat it either.

its greatest weakness would be if the enemy has naffatun or has muskets or pavise crossbowmen. also a no rules game would leave it vulnerable to artillery fire.

this formation would be invincible in early era and would hold its own fairly well in high era parring you dont come across factions with naffatun or pavise crossbowmen.

in late era i wouldnt use it.

First impressions are that it would be an easy army to beat.
Its vulnerable to missile fire,even with the armour upgrades,Any army without missiles,and without cav to chase away missiles is a sitting duck.Sure opposing archers/x-bows would run out of ammo before destroying your army, but you would be depleted.

It also lacks melee strength versus other better melee infantry units.Notably two-handed units,(which seem to excell in 1.2), or swordsmen.Schiltroms main effectiveness is against cav, not specialised melee inf.

Finally and most importantly,it lacks mobility.What does your army do, if the opposing cav do not attack you? Just sit and wait for hours? Someone has to take the initiative and engage at some point.Are you saying that with this armies composition then that onus is always on the opposition?
If not, then at some point you would have to break schiltrom to engage, in which case it leaves you open to a frontal cav charge, followed up with some nasty melee units.

On paper at least, your army build appears to be one-dimensional.

its a novelty army for beginner players and a rush army will find it difficult to defeat it. even with shock troops because you have to remember the papal guard are hidden in it.

you have a tremendous number of troops with at least light mail that can soak up missile fire from say a 4 unit missile equipped army or up to 8 units of cav missile an javelin army because they do not have as many missiles and their units are smaller.

shield fix with spearmen gives them a step up more than what they had before versus other types of infantry and especially horses.

if you knew a person had martels anvil im sure you could have an army to beat it. but its the knowing thats the problem. most army setups are 8 horse, 8 melee infantry and 4missiles. usually of that only four elite infantry.

all cav army would have no chance period.

high missile armies especially pavise crossbowmen are the worst. longbowmen are good but they run out of ammor quicker.

as i said its a simple no brainer that can beat some armies. it can be modified and added to to give it more combined arms abilities but superimposed schilroms are very tough to beat.

you can also group the entire formation fixed and tell it to advance into the enemy postion and then stop when it is attacked. in effect that is not camping since the other guy is trying to stay out of the way and you have done your part by trying to attack him. and if he refuses and decides to sit back and rain missiles at you that is his choice.

Yes but you have to remember that with the patch people are going to realize that two-handed weapons are more powerful than they used to be. Now that they can fight cavalry, there wont be a dependance on spear units to win the cavalry scrum, and people will be more likely to bring in sword and two-handed especially with AP. If somebody has one of the four nations with naffatun you are wrecked immediately. Expect one naffatun to get 300 kills throwing into a cluster like that. I think your army is too one dimensional, and although you have created a way to defeat cavalry, you are neglecting to expect the alterations people are going to make in their armies with the new patch. Going from a 1.1 mindset, your army will catch some people off guard during the transition from cav to inf heavy armies, but once that transition has been made its not going to work well.

What happens if this is a team game? This setup is too static to assist your ally against a more mobile army.

Naffatun were the first thing that came to my mind when I read your post. The chain route in that battle would be pretty fun to watch though. The first comparison I made to this army was the Spartan Square from RTW that everyone thought was unbeatable, but in reality it was the easiest army on earth to beat.

well the point as i stated before is a novelty strategy for beginners. i would never use the full formation as i have described in a team battle. im just listing some armies beginners or tinkerers might want to play with. only trying to add a few more to the academy.

yes one demensionally it can be beaten if you have the right army but sometimes even an experienced player will not have the assets to defeat it. you have to remember that the papal guard are hidden in the formation and can contribut to wearing down the average four units of elite infantry your opponent has.

any of the armies in the academy can be defeated with the right army combo and tactics. its just a novelty as i said. i have used it successfully before. sometimes add in some cav to take out the opponents missile units before they get beaten by his cav.

its defiinetly tougher to beat than a pike camping strategy. one has to definetly agree on that one.

Keep them coming Mech .... :)

Nafatun general! The general will have most kill! :D

Annie

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Originally Posted by LadyAnn

Nafatun general! The general will have most kill! :D

Annie

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Not guaranteed. :no: :beam:

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Originally Posted by mad cat mech

now that the shield bug is fixed they will be a quite formidable formation for a new player. one not even need camp with it since once you group the formation as i will describe it will move as one and then when you drive into the middle of the enemy line you can camp with it.

all you do is stack all spear units on the same spot and then hit schiltrom. they will all be clustered in a tight rounded phalanx that cannot be flanked and their massive numbers and schiltrom formation will give them plenty of morale.

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Isn't that what I used to do with my 214-104 Selecuiud Army on Warman'sDeathField on RTW:beam: ??