Jade Goody, Shilpa Shetty, Jordan and the kidney.

I was going to post this in the News of the Weird but it disgusted me so much I decided it needed a thread of it's own.

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No reality television programme has played for such high stakes: three nervous candidates will be competing in front of a prime-time audience this week for a life-saving kidney operation, as the Big Brother format gives way to The Big Donor Show.

The macabre contest will be broadcast in the Netherlands on Friday. It is produced by Endemol, the maker of Big Brother, which is about to begin an eighth series in Britain. But while the worst that can happen in Big Brother is public humiliation, the Big Donor rivals are battling for their lives.

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http://entertainment.timesonline.co....cle1851853.ece

In Oz, at the moment, this same TV production company hasn't told a contestant of their Big Brother that her dad is dead. He's been buried a week.

Not content with inflicting Jade Goody and all the rest of the morons who go on this tripe, they have decided to go one better.

Call me old fashioned but should a kidney transplant only be considered on medical grounds? By that I mean the doctors should decide whom of the candidates has the best chance from the procedure.

Utterly revolting.

:no:

This is truly sad. How are they going to do dismissals?
"Sorry, but the country wants you to die."

I guess part of the motivation for the show - highlighting the need for organ donors - is noble, but the execution is less than ideal. The concept is quite morbid. The Reality show gets a little too real in this case.

:furious3: :furious3: :furious3:

Just when you think we can go no lower...

Can this really be true? How can they have found a doctor to agree to do the op, it could surely never pass an ethics committee?

Where did they actually find the kidney for this? I can't believe that the Dutch health service would just give them one, if this is what they plan to do with it.

Oh yeah, Endemol who else, if he lived during WW2 he could probably make something out of the selections, I hate his greedy guts. Well BKS, the kidney comes from a terminally ill girl who gets to pick the winner I believe. We aren't exactly happy with John de Mols latest pearl.

See, this is why I don't have TV.

All those producing this [insert word violating forum rules here] should have both kidneys donated.

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Originally Posted by HoreTore

All those producing this [insert word violating forum rules here] should have both kidneys donated.

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That's a tad mean coming from an avowed pacifist. Still, the whole show concept is repulsive, so I will readily forgive you your "slip."



Organ Receipt (legit issues in order of preference IMVHO):

1. Medical need and survival viabilty.

2. Time waiting for donation.


Note1: Private donation to a specific person sidesteps (legitmately) general donation.

Note2: People selling their organs to another -- though not inherently wrong -- is NOT a practice to be encouraged (too many negative indirect consequences for this to be considered good practice)

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Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh

That's a tad mean coming from an avowed pacifist. Still, the whole show concept is repulsive, so I will readily forgive you your "slip."

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I've said I'm a pacifist. I've never stated that I'm nice....:laugh4:

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Originally Posted by HoreTore

All those producing this [insert word violating forum rules here] should have both kidneys donated.

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Disagree, whatever it is that's in their blood, I don't want it.

More gems from De Mol and BNN,

Big brother
Golden Cage (big brother where you have to terrorise other players)
This is how you screw
Shooting and swallowing (teaches you how to use drugs, yes)
Rembrand, a study in realism

ok, last one is a lie.

and they wonder why less and less people are watching tv nowadays :inquisitive:

Are they gonna show the operation? Do London bookies take bets on these shows still?

Up next season: the TV audience can "Pick The Donor", the 'winner' being given a free motorcycle (no helmet) and access to the (rain-slicked) autobahn.

Excellent show! It exposes the hypocricy of our societies. :2thumbsup:

Organ shortage, and limited medical means in general , mean that decisions of life and death like this one are made daily. The one difference is that they are usually hidden from the public eye, and that doctors make the decisions.
Refugees wash on the shores of Europe daily. Some are allowed to stay, some not, for pretty much random reasons, by anonymous civil servants. I want them on television too, with audiences getting to pick one winner from every boat who gets to stay while the others are send back.

Decisions like these are being made, all the time. About real people, in matters of life and death. By relegating them to anonymous commisions, civil servants, doctors we relieve ourselves of our responsability, pretending that these decisions are not being made.

Yeah, it'$ really $omething el$e Louis.

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Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat

Excellent show! It exposes the hypocricy of our societies. :2thumbsup:

Organ shortage, and limited medical means in general , mean that decisions of life and death like this one are made daily. The one difference is that they are usually hidden from the public eye, and that doctors make the decisions.
Refugees wash on the shores of Europe daily. Some are allowed to stay, some not, for pretty much random reasons, by anonymous civil servants. I want them on television too, with audiences getting to pick one winner from every boat who gets to stay while the others are send back.

Decisions like these are being made, all the time. About real people, in matters of life and death. By relegating them to anonymous commisions, civil servants, doctors we relieve ourselves of our responsability, pretending that these decisions are not being made.

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This is exactly the stated reason why the channel produced this show. They used to have a director who suffered from a congenital disease and at some point needed a kidney transplant. Since no donor (or kidney) could be found, he died. The makers of the program pretend they want to confront the general public with the stark choices often involved in these issues.

I agree that the show is a bad idea.

But for good order it should be stated that on this show, as in every such case, the (live) donor decides to whom she will cede a kidney (the public can only try to influence her decision by sms-ing her during the program).

Only if a declared donor dies without stating a preference, a medical team from the national donor transplant system makes the decision.

Speaking of tasteless, Fragony is right that they produce even worse programs. 'This is how we screw' (yes, you read that right) is so vulgar it makes me roar with laughter. The instalment I watched was presented by a woman so tacky I wouldn't want her anywhere near my dingerling.

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Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat

I want them on television too, with audiences getting to pick one winner from every boat who gets to stay while the others are send back.

Decisions like these are being made, all the time. About real people, in matters of life and death. By relegating them to anonymous commisions, civil servants, doctors we relieve ourselves of our responsability, pretending that these decisions are not being made.

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Recalls something about "immigrant Survivor: This time it's for real!" comments in the thread about that wall between US and Mexico (or then it was another thread). The survivors winners get citizenship.

There's good ways and baaad ways to illuminate a problem, because can you at any point really determine if they vote on who will stay alive or who will die?
And as allowing one to live you've just condemned 2 others to die, you will quickly build up walls protecting you from the cruel reality and the closr reality are to you, the higher the walls... So it the end you'll be able to see this kind of show without caring and without caring what are you voting for and for what reason?

Edit:

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Originally Posted by Adrian II

But for good order it should be stated that on this show, as in every such case, the (live) donor decides to whom she will cede a kidney (the public can only try to influence her decision by sms-ing her during the program).

Only if a declared donor dies without stating a preference, a medical team from the national donor transplant system makes the decision.

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Not as bad as first expected, but the program is still despicable. And unlike a documetary it still contains the moment of who deserves to live and who doesn't, in it. I would not be wanting to be the donor in any case. It will either cause me great sorrow or cost me a part of my humanity.

Well even if the show has good intentions, which I doubt, the people watching it are emotion-vultures, it makes me sick. Sobsob, ok what else is on, ahhh gilmore girls. And sms-messages to 'select' who gets to live, since when do emotions count instead of medical science? This is all so wrong on so many levels. As for the guy Adrian refered to, it's all in his name after all, the guys making this program could have given him one of their kidneys if they really cared.

I'm actually siding with Louis here. From what i've heard about the Dutch organ donation system people need a wake up call so they can go sign the consent forms.

This might seem low, but I don't think it really is. There's a shortage of kidneys, even if they wanted to they couldn't help all the people participating out. This isn't some reality show for terminally ill people who can't afford treatment and the winner get it for free (expect that soon in the US though, possibly by Endemol too).
This sheds light on a real problem.

Of course, if it was just some documentary about some people waiting for a kidney and only one survives in the end, people would probably call it socially responsible, touching, deeply human, and whatnot. This is the same principle, only the format has changed.

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Originally Posted by Louis

Decisions like these are being made, all the time. About real people, in matters of life and death. By relegating them to anonymous commisions, civil servants, doctors we relieve ourselves of our responsability, pretending that these decisions are not being made.

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I think this is why people find it so revolting. It's all great when 'wise men' make the choices, but when they're confronted with their own responsibility (and in a free democracy, you are *ALWAYS* responsible for what is done by authoristies), when they're asked to choose, this is revolting. And then they wonder why politicians sometimes seem to make such 'weird' choices as limititing the budget for healthcare, enforce immigration laws and other things.

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Originally Posted by Adrian II

Speaking of tasteless, Fragony is right that they produce even worse programs. 'This is how we screw' (yes, you read that right) is so vulgar it makes me roar with laughter. The instalment I watched was presented by a woman so tacky I wouldn't want her anywhere near my dingerling.

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I've never seen it, we do have shows with a similar premise here though (which I tend to avoid). I've seen the drug show a couple of times, that was pretty funny, though perhaps not the most responsible program.

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

This might seem low, but I don't think it really is. There's a shortage of kidneys, even if they wanted to they couldn't help all the people participating out. This isn't some reality show for terminally ill people who can't afford treatment and the winner get it for free (expect that soon in the US though, possibly by Endemol too).
This sheds light on a real problem.

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After seeing the rest of the lineup this company has come up with, I'm surprised anyone's buying this. Perhaps you could say the show might have an incidental result of awareness being raised on the issue, but you can't possibly believe these guys are sincere in their concern.

I agree much more with Ironside that it's very possible people will give less of a damn about this issue as a result. For the few moments I've been near a tv when Big Brother has been on, I'm usually wondering how long the entire cast, production team and fan base could go without two kidneys.

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Originally Posted by doc_bean

I'm actually siding with Louis here. From what i've heard about the Dutch organ donation system people need a wake up call so they can go sign the consent forms.

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People need a wake up call. My solution is simple, aren't you a donor? No organs for you then have a nice death au revoir.

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Organ shortage, and limited medical means in general , mean that decisions of life and death like this one are made daily. The one difference is that they are usually hidden from the public eye, and that doctors make the decisions.

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I can see where you're coming from, but they're normally made on the basis of objective criteria relating to medical need. As opposed to which prospective recipient is the cutest, or which one has the saddest story.

Doctors train for years to make decisions like this without letting emotion come into the equation. It's why we pay them well.

As an aside-my thoughts on organ donation.

-Opt out, rather than opt in system.
-Relatives do not have the ability to veto organ harvesting.
-If you opt out for whatever reason, you become ineligible as a candidate for recieving organs.
-If you choose to opt back in, you have to wait two years before you are eligible to recieve an organ. This would stop people opting back in as soon as they discover that their liver is failing, for example.

I think this would be a much fairer system.

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Originally Posted by Proletariat

After seeing the rest of the lineup this company has come up with, I'm surprised anyone's buying this. Perhaps you could say the show might have an incidental result of awareness being raised on the issue, but you can't possibly believe these guys are sincere in their concern.

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I'm not saying they're good samaritans, but their motives are largely irrelevant, it's the result that matters.

Ahhh...the good old 'ends justifying the means arguement'.:shame:

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...
This is how you screw
...

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Just to confirm for the benefit of Louis and our other friends on the continent, Endemol have yet to transfer this one to England, although I heard they have an exciting new show on reality tea-drinking coming our way instead.

:clown:

(This joke was brought to you in substitution for one on "shooting and swallowing" which would have certainly got me banned)

This is is disgusting.

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Originally Posted by Fragony

People need a wake up call. My solution is simple, aren't you a donor? No organs for you then have a nice death au revoir.

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Yes.

How disgusting.

"Oh my God he lost!" - American Idol, some wannabe got dropped

Whatever.

"Oh my God he lost!" - Big Donor, a dying man got dropped

Barbaric.

It's for sale for, as Fragony wonderfully termed, emotion-vultures. It's Real It's People Dying It's Ratings Galore Yadda Yadda.

I don't buy the awareness crap.

Ah, I just see this from a very post-modern point of view. This show is a brilliant, bitter societal critique disguised as revolting reality television claiming to be a clever societal critique pretending to be sensationalist, exploitative television.

It's brilliance all over. :2thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by Proletariat

Perhaps you could say the show might have an incidental result of awareness being raised on the issue, but you can't possibly believe these guys are sincere in their concern.

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But that's what so great about it. This distinction has becomed blurred, nay, is rendered obsolete by it.