Problems riding down fleeing troops

One of the things that I really enjoy doing is using my cavalry to ride down troops once they are broken.

I have noticed however that sometimes the cavalry does not perform well - i.e. rather that engaging with the troops they are pursuing they ride after them, catch up, then wait for the troops to run off a bit more then catch up to them again etc etc - this results in a very slow rate of kills (usually the fleeing troops run off the map before there is more than one or two kills).

Has anyone else encountered this problem (or knows how to fix it)?

As far as I know, a pursuing unit goes for the weighted middle-point of the unit. Usually some members of the fleeing unit get knocked down but survive. They get up and follow their brethren in a considerable distance. Then it might happen that this middle-point is between the main group and the laggards. Your pursuing unit rushes to this point, has nobody to fight, slows down until the middle-point has moved, rushes to it's new location, stops,.....
This is often the case for stretched out/scattered or almost completely killed units.

I don't think that this can be modded easily, but with some micro-managment you can circumvent the problem. Just move your pursuing unit to a point way in front of the fleeing unit. They will rush to it, passing through the unit and killing some of its members. Once your unit is clear, turn around. Now you have all of them in front of you, with the middle point behind the mass of men. Charge and watch the slaughter.

I like to do it also and have the same problem - especially in siege battles cavalry sometimes even stops pursuing fleeing soldiers (out of its own - sudden influx of mercy??). mostly the problem is becouse when one unit attacks another it aims at its middle so when the fleeing unit is scattered over the cavs get a little confused who to run after. Extreme example is when you have a unit of two fleeing soldiers, far apart one from another, your pursuing cavs will stay in the middle between those two guys running, unable to decide who to kill first. I think it is hardcoded.
A way to go around this is to stop or advance your cavs to another position during their chase and a bit later order them again to pursue routing unit (so they attack from behind\front of the routing unit and get some kills on their way to the middle of the routing unit). At the end of a battle, when I have a lot of routing enemy units i often switch my pursuing cavs between them to get a lot of kills fast.
G

I've found out that putting the chasers in guard mode helps. They are almost trying to run through the enemy.

You can easily wipe out fleeing units with repeating attacks or with more than one cavalry unit. Although I, being a very bad guy, normally do this it results in rediculously high casualty rates. It is true that ancient and medieval armies suffered by far the most when they broke and fled but the near extinction which is usual in RTW and EB is a little exaggerated. Of course, when fighting against AS, the Romans or Sweboz I'm very happy about it.:juggle2:

If those troops that are routing are troops that sallied out from a city, then I think there are real problems in trying to get your guys to follow them. I don't know if this is the only situation like that, but there are some buggy RTW effects in that situation.

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Originally Posted by Teleklos Archelaou

If those troops that are routing are troops that sallied out from a city, then I think there are real problems in trying to get your guys to follow them. I don't know if this is the only situation like that, but there are some buggy RTW effects in that situation.

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i never try to chase down troops which have sallied or i get in range of their towers.... once in RTW, a unit of mine somehow followed an enemy unit back in their city without me knowing and got slaughtered. i wasn't able to do anything b/c the enemy gates closed and i had no siege equipment. too bad that unit had 2 silver chevrons too. ~:pissed:

Sometimes the chasers are walking behind the routers, adapting their speed to theirs, killing just two guys on the whole way to the red line. It normally helps to order them to a point way ahead, then let them charge again, or just switch the chasers to pursue another routing unit.

If a unit of sallied troops rout, let a cavalry unit hunt them. It's only important that there are still a few of the routers alive when going through the gates. Then your cavalry will conquer the gate, the gate will be yours, further routers have to go all the way round the city. Inside the city, you can easily "conquer" the rest of the gates, leaving the enemy no chance. Then just occupy the town center - done. Works with wooden walls only, of course.

too bad the city i was attacking when that unit got trapped was a large stone wall. =(

You think thats hard?

Try it with Chariots :P

I find it very frustrating too. The only answer is to micro manage your cavalry as they pursue the enemy and keep moving them to a point ahead of the enemy. Truly a pain, but lifes not easy. The only other "solution" Ive found so far is to have 400 rested light cavalry doing the chasing.

Usually the thing about following a unit and not fighting them is due to the chasers chasing the 'middle' of the unit, as Kham said. If you ever have lengthy phalanx-on-phalanx battle, you might have noticed that some guys wander backwards a hundred meters or so during the fight. Those guys really cause problems when the unit eventually breaks.

I believe the thing with chasing units who are retreating into a town is a pathfinding problem with the walls of the city.

Anyone tried to chase down units in M2TW? :wall:

In the early rounds of the inevitable blitzing ( when playing with poor factions ) it is essential that the sallying troops NEVER return inside to prolong the siege to even six whole turns .

I usually curse at just about everything in the history of mankind when for the 1000th time my horsies stop the minute they touch a routing unit . This has only happened when the enemy sallies . I do not consider the rest actual problems , because it doesn't bother me much when the capture of a city isn't at stake ..... Stupid horses .... Grrgrgrrrhrlhrhrlhrhlrhhrlhrlhrlhrlhrlgrrghlgrhlgrhrhrhhrhrrrrrr.

I also have on many occasions experienced a non victory with a captured central square even after the counter reaches 0:00 . If there are routers outside the ( captured ) gates , the battle doesn't end .

Today I experienced something brand new .

Usually , while trying to kill as many routers as possible so as to achieve an "army routs " result - if I cannot kill every sallying soldier - and capture the city , I always " continue battle " and wait for them to regroup , come outside again , kill 2-3 with the horses ( all ranged weapons long gone , much needed to achieve routing in the first place ) until the time passes . ( I play with time limit on , because the AI is stupid and sometimes attacks and just sits there with a billion troops against my few hardy men and actually expects me to attack it .)

Anyway today at the phase of rout-go-in-come-out-rout etc , the timer reached 0 minutes ...

.....and started counting negative minutes .

How's that for a ballbreaker ?

I know you might accuse me of abusing stuff etc but the game is too hard for me , and I keep my slingers to a maximum of 4 units ( in a full stack ) , but usually 2-3 . Another question that pops to mind is : how deep in debt do you plunge when playing ... say .. the Aedui ? Pontos ?

About the wandering phalangitai , I've noticed that ( when this happens in your army )if the moment you notice it just select it and hit backspace , the unit will try to regain formation . Didn't work every time for me though , which leaves me in the not so happy position to curse at everything in the history of mankind .

Satyros

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Originally Posted by Satyros

About the wandering phalangitai , I've noticed that ( when this happens in your army )if the moment you notice it just select it and hit backspace , the unit will try to regain formation.

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The wandering phalangitai are caused when your phalanx attacks the enemy instead of defending against it. If you hit backspace, it'll stop attacking, hence why.

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Originally Posted by Satyros

Another question that pops to mind is : how deep in debt do you plunge when playing ... say .. the Aedui ? Pontos ?

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For Aedui, a good -10k at most. But then, I steamroll through the whole of Gaul, first the independents, then the Arverni. I limit myself to two half stacks, at most, though.

I take it that no solution to crapy horse behaviour against sallying troops exists ?

Does this happen to everyone ?

Satyros

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Originally Posted by MarcusAureliusAntoninus

Usually the thing about following a unit and not fighting them is due to the chasers chasing the 'middle' of the unit, as Kham said. If you ever have lengthy phalanx-on-phalanx battle, you might have noticed that some guys wander backwards a hundred meters or so during the fight. Those guys really cause problems when the unit eventually breaks.

I believe the thing with chasing units who are retreating into a town is a pathfinding problem with the walls of the city.

Anyone tried to chase down units in M2TW? :wall:

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GOD!!!I HATE WHEN THAT HAPPENS!!!!! i made a video/slideshow about when that happened- it looked kinda funny
http://s199.photobucket.com/albums/a...t=03ac4dd9.flv

I found that increasing game speed to max really solves the problem. Cavalry then swarm round routers like pirahanas leaving few if any survivors, quite scary to watch!

However, only do this when you have the enemy in complete retreat, either all units routing or leaving the battle.

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Originally Posted by hooahguy14

GOD!!!I HATE WHEN THAT HAPPENS!!!!! i made a video/slideshow about when that happened- it looked kinda funny
http://s199.photobucket.com/albums/a...t=03ac4dd9.flv

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LOL - great title too

Hehe. Love the '5 minutes later' bit too. :beam:

I have question about the end of a fight (the moment when a army is fleeing) why is it possible for the human player to have a option to quit or continue to kill the enemy and not for the ai (you have to decide that for the ai of course) it looks unfair to me

because your casulties could (should) be higher

:shrug:
Ask CA.

it's hardcoded i guess :no: too bad