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Hi all, since switching over to a more rout centric strategy in battle I now usually focus on trying to kill the enemy general. But, since they are notorious tough guys I have trouble always doing it in a timely manner to truly effect the battle. So... I wanted to know what you all think is the best general killing unit for any given faction and why and if you want some tactics on how to best get that general pushing up the roses.
Well, I'd go with any javelin armed cavalry. Disable skirmish and fire-at-will mode. Flank the enemy army and order your missile cavalry to toss their javelins in the backs of the enemy general. Just make sure they dont get involved in melee, especially if they have some javelins left.
If you dont have any javelin cavalry you could try ballistas, serpentines, crossbowmen or gunners. When you use any of these you got only limited time before the armies engage in melee... If you use missile cavalry you can pepper the advancing enemy army when your army is waiting in the other corner of the map.
Camel gunners, crossbow or javelin armed cavalry would be the best choice for the job since they are all armour piercing. It's good to attack from behind because the shield doesnt offer any protection there.
- Guru
Mounted X Bows (poland has strezlcky). If I can get them they always have a place in my army. But the overall HA theory is applied just whittle them down from multiple angles and allow thier infantry to chase you around and tire.
You ought to cut his ranks by 50% in a lot of cases, more if you become more adept at HA usage, then just send in the infantry.
I use a relatively simple strat.
Let him charge the battle line, usually on the edge of the line, and then nail him on the general's side with a cav charge. Insta-gib.
Maybe I'm just lucky that the general usually rides over to (my) right side of the battleline hence hanging himself out on the end and exposed.
Course, failing that, you can always simply dedicate 2-3 cav units, preferably at least mailed knights, to squash him.
I go for up close and personal, rather than missilecav. My experiance with jav-cav or xbow-cav is that even when you are nailing the general's unit from a flank or rear, most of his bodyguards usually die long before he does. Whether this is a function of simply the fact that he may have 10 times the hitpoints with good traits/ancillaries, or some sort of "safety" feature that spreads missile damage to the entire unit rather than directly to him I couldn't say, but melee/charge seems to be MUCH more expediant at actually whacking the genreal when you can pull it off. Especially the charging. Have 3-4 lances driving through his chest has never failed me. Melee can take a while, although it still seems quicker than missiles.
It's like the charge takes all the hp's of damage inflicted in a charge to the front of normal units, and focuses that entire damage on the general.
My best general-killers are naffatun, but that's faction-limited. Second-best is catapults set to flaming projectiles. I think it's because flame damage bypasses armor stats?
Well, in melee you'll lose men. Sometimes quite a many men. If you throw javelins at the enemy who doesnt react only the enemy will lose men. In my games I've never found charging the enemy cavalry with my own to be very effective. But that's just my own opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by DesertEagle
From what I've experienced the general survives in melee very long too. 1 Turkish general took half of my feudal knight unit down single handedly, alone. I bet those poor knights were getting pretty scared! With the bodyguards being such beasts I deem it far safer to fight them from a distance. A woman's stratagem; throwing things at them. ~DQuote:
Originally Posted by DesertEagle
In melee the boduguards defence is very high. They have good armour, high defence skill and a shield. In melee all of these factors apply. When engaging with missiles from the rear shield and defence skill are ignored. If the missiles are armour piercing only half of the armour is counted. This leaves the deadly warmachines, to say, pretty naked.
Of course you might run into trouble if the enemy have horse archers or other light cavalry to hunt down your missile cavalry. I think I'll try out your strategy next time I play M2TW. See if I can get it working. :applause:
Cheers, Guru :bow:
I think using four or five Sipahis is enough for killing generals. I tend to take them behind the enemy line while sending some other troops to the flanks and the vanguard ( not for attacking just to make sure the enemy does not chage the direction of their line). And then I order the sipahi to attack the general with missiles. Most of the time you will kill the general. then since you have some cavalry behind the enemy line after the general is dead it is another advantage. The enbemy may try to charge you though if they have plenty of cavalry so be careful.
I just amke sure that I have more Generals bodyguard than him, they come back free so where's the loss? :)
I don't dispute a single word of this, but he asked for the quickest way, not the safest ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Guru
In my experiance, IF you can pull off a formed charge as follows (forgive my craptacular artwork) -
c = horseman
g = general
Code:cccc
ccccccccc cccc
ccccccccc cccc
cccccccccg <--- cccc
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- the general is going to die very quickly. As I said, maybe I'm just lucky to have the AI playing against me have some inexplicable fondness of hanging his general either behind the battle line, or chasing flankers where I'm able to actually pull off a formed charge in this way. I must confess that I do play on m/m so that may have something to do with the ai measuring and handing me the rope as well.
Also, as a side note, god help the enemy if you can pull off a three sided charge like this (back and both sides). The general will rout faster than you can say "Hoosier Daddy?" and will rout through your cav leading to a quick capture, if he didn't perish in the sidecharge..
But yes, to clarify my original post - it seems to be my experiance that a general will fall faster in melee than to missilefire, however, missile cav will take far fewer losses in the process, in most cases.
Easy. Routing French peasants.
Have your unit of French Peasants wander up to the general, and then turn and run away screaming.
The general will of course chase them down, and the moment he makes contact he will die.
I have to confess that I have not actually tried this approach myself, but I have had the AI use it very successfully against me. Poor King Rufus - The ignominy of it!
:oops:
Really great suggestions all. I will definitely try them out. They certainly beat my current method of swamping him with spears.:balloon2:
Balistas, a single hit, and the generals a goner.
Two groups of mounted Crossbowmen. One sits in front, one sits behind, no matter where the general turns, his back is to someone, maybe both, and it's not that hard to use light cavalry or the Crossbowmen themselves to lure him away from the "real" battle so that the Crossbowmen never have to worry about skirmishing others. General gets destroyed by the crossfire, you lose no one.
Edit: Not to mention the fact that luring him away from the front lines diminishes the morale boost he's giving to his men, anyways. This would help your "rout centric" battle style.