THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
*sarcasm*
"We learned, for example, that in some areas of Poland, children are regularly taken underground into deep mines to gain some respite from the buildup of gases and pollution of all sorts in the air. One can almost imagine their teachers emerging tentatively from the mine, carrying canaries to warn the children when it's no longer safe for them to stay above the ground."
from 'Earth in the Balance'.
I know that it was written in 1992 and at that time there were many myths about certain countries and regions, but this is something I will not forget easily - especially after the guy got the Nobel prize.:wall:
Regards Cegorach
To the mods - if you think the thread is not necessary merge it with something else.
10-16-2007, 10:15
CountArach
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Most of the World is not aware of economic conditions in Poland, and Gore was just spreading the word. I do not believe he was being preachy to the Polish people.
10-16-2007, 11:42
Mikeus Caesar
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
At least he didn't forget Poland.
10-16-2007, 12:56
naut
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Christ you'd think Gore would have floated away by now with the amount of hot air he's packing.
10-16-2007, 13:47
Gregoshi
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by cegorach
"We learned, for example, that in some areas of Poland, children are regularly taken underground into deep mines to gain some respite from the buildup of gases and pollution of all sorts in the air..."
Gore is just concerned about future of miners... :inquisitive:
10-16-2007, 14:25
cegorach
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by CountArach
Most of the World is not aware of economic conditions in Poland, and Gore was just spreading the word. I do not believe he was being preachy to the Polish people.
Sorry, but you have to be ... different to believe that:
" in some areas of Poland, children are regularly taken underground into deep mines to gain some respite from the buildup of gases and pollution of all sorts in the air. "
Again children - taken deep underground - to breathe safer and fresher air.:wall:
10-16-2007, 14:43
Gregoshi
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by cegorach
Again children - taken deep underground - to breathe safer and fresher air.:wall:
Well cegorach, that just shows how bad your air really is. Al himself has a huge ecological footprint (is that the right term?), so he should know. You have to face up to An Inconvenient Truth that Poland is one step away from being like the planet Spaceball. ~;)
10-16-2007, 14:50
Fragony
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
LOL@Poland
10-16-2007, 15:14
cegorach
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregoshi
Well cegorach, that just shows how bad your air really is. Al himself has a huge ecological footprint (is that the right term?), so he should know. You have to face up to An Inconvenient Truth that Poland is one step away from being like the planet Spaceball. ~;)
LOL
But there is some Inconvenient Truth in that indeed - I have been in several of those regions of Poland several times in my life - I guess... I have only weeks/months to live because Al Gore cannot be wrong I am sure !:juggle2:
EDIT - I need to buy a canary...
10-16-2007, 15:22
Gregoshi
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by cegorach
EDIT - I need to buy a canary...
:laugh4: Save some money and buy a dead one because:
1) they are cheaper
2) According to Gore it will die anyway
and last but not least
3) freak out your neighbors when they see the dead canary..."Quick Beata - to the mines!"
10-16-2007, 15:23
Myrddraal
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
1) they are cheaper
2) According to Gore it will die anyway
3) freak out your neighbors when they see the dead canary..."Quick Beata - to the mines!"
:laugh4:
10-16-2007, 16:41
Slyspy
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregoshi
:laugh4: Save some money and buy a dead one because:
1) they are cheaper
2) According to Gore it will die anyway
and last but not least
3) freak out your neighbors when they see the dead canary..."Quick Beata - to the mines!"
Very good!
10-16-2007, 20:35
cegorach
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregoshi
:laugh4: Save some money and buy a dead one because:
1) they are cheaper
2) According to Gore it will die anyway
and last but not least
3) freak out your neighbors when they see the dead canary..."Quick Beata - to the mines!"
It is no use...there are no mines in my city/region - I am doomed, DOOMED I TELL YOU !!
P.S. Do you know any Beata BTW Gregoshi ? It is a nice, female name... say hallo from a fellow countryman. :yes:
10-16-2007, 20:42
master of the puppets
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
what a waste of a nobel prize
10-16-2007, 21:00
Xiahou
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by master of the puppets
what a waste of a nobel prize
Gore- doing a disservice to real scientists everywhere... and winning awards for it. :shrug:
10-16-2007, 23:20
Gregoshi
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by cegorach
P.S. Do you know any Beata BTW Gregoshi ? It is a nice, female name... say hallo from a fellow countryman. :yes:
As a matter of fact I did and I agree that it is a lovely name. Back in the 80's I shared an office with a beautiful young woman named Beata who was born in Poland and whose parents moved to the US when she was young. She was one of the nicest women I've even known. I took great pains to learn from her how to properly pronounce her name - "Beh-ah-tah" as I recall - most of our co-workers just called her "Beta" like the Greek letter. I learned a little about Poland from her, but it has pretty much faded into the mists of my memory. :no: But I still do remember her wonderful smile. :2thumbsup:
10-16-2007, 23:53
Devastatin Dave
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Thank God for Al Gore, he's such an inspiration.... ummm no.:laugh4:
10-17-2007, 19:47
rotorgun
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Has Polka dancing now moved underground as well? You Polish Poles better stop dancing and eating Kielbasa so much, or the North and South Poles are going to melt faster. :beam:
Al Gore! What a :clown: He's so funny! :laugh4: :laugh4:
10-17-2007, 19:59
Viking
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xiahou
Gore- doing a disservice to real scientists everywhere... and winning awards for it. :shrug:
:uhoh:
10-17-2007, 21:27
KrooK
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Gah Cegorach - you are a bit like PIS - you are finding conspiracy everywhere. :daisy:
If you are angry that not everyone see how great is our Country - simply buy mtw2, start playing online and see what is situation there :) - full polish domation. No one who started with Poles won.
Greets
10-17-2007, 21:36
Husar
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Dear Krook, I see you still enjoy your irrational prejudices. Have a nice day and please think about it. :bow:
10-18-2007, 06:41
cegorach
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by KrooK
Gah Cegorach - you are a bit like PIS s
Your luck, you said A BIT, otherwise...:hmg:
10-18-2007, 06:58
AntiochusIII
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by KrooK
Al Gore is typical American and you good know what we are thinking about inteligence of Americans here in Poland
Hey now, that isn't nice.
10-18-2007, 11:52
KrooK
Re: THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
OMG I just told the truth. Sorry but its common point of view. If you want change this point of view - change your education system. Some moths ago I have read that into test about religion (which is quite important into public debates into USA) 30% Americans replied that Sodoma and Gomora are twins. Sorry but who do you think they are?
Cegorach - don't worry:) PIS is not bad.
10-18-2007, 12:33
Louis VI the Fat
Re : THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
And to think people look at me like I'm mad when I insist that Americans are more open and respectful of other cultures...
***
@Cegorach - I don't know if the specifics of Gore's statement are true or not. I also don't think he meant that all Polish children were brought to underground mines all the time to get a chance at a gasp of fresh air occasionaly. In the book, in the relevant chapter, Gore gives a general description of the immensity of the environmental ravages of communism. About which he was right, was he not?
Rather than focus on a single - perhaps indeed a somewhat unfortunate - quote, why not focus on the larger story? Communism nearly wrecked Polands environment. Then, soon after the fall of communism, Poland managed to pull of a 15 year run of major economic growth AND ecological recovery. Something to be proud of, surely?
Quote:
When communism died in Poland, it left a legacy of economic decay and environmental ruin. Today, a half-decade into the transition to market democracy, Poland's economy has the highest growth rate in Europe, and environmental protection is vastly improved.
Between 1990 and 1993, air pollution in Poland fell by 40%.
In 1993, economic growth doubled to 4% and industrial output was up 7%. But air pollution continued to decline by 9%. So recession could not have been the predominant cause of environmental improvements in Poland. Improved environmental policies, strengthened law enforcement and the systemic reforms themselves have played central, if underappreciated, roles.
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Poland's environmental laws are also more stringently enforced today, thanks to a 1991 law that greatly expanded the power and independence of Poland's chief environmental law enforcement agency, the State Environmental Protection Inspectorate. In the 1980s the inspectorate was a small and weak agency. Its 400 poorly-paid, -trained and -equipped inspectors were responsible for investigating and monitoring compliance at some 43,000 polluting enterprises nationwide, but they had no power to actually enforce the laws and penalize violators. Today, under the 1991 law, inspectors can shut down polluters, order installation of pollution-control equipment and impose noncompliance fines. The agency now employs 3,000 environmental inspectors operating out of 50 offices throughout Poland.
The increased power and staffing of the State Environmental Protection Inspectorate has led directly to improved monitoring, compliance and enforcement. The agency has issued thousands of orders to install emissions-control equipment at polluting factories. It has completely shut down seven plants, closed parts of 25 plants and temporarily halted production at 22 others. These enforcement actions have been a major source of pollution reductions. And they have been facilitated by systemic reforms, most notably the institution of the rule of law in Poland.
The law in post-Communist Poland now has real authority, and can no longer be ignored by politicians, administrators and plant managers. This is clear from the fight that took place in 1992 over pollution-control equipment at Warsaw's new Okecie II airport. The airport was planned in the mid-1980s, when the Communists still held power. Even at that time, the law required installation of all environmental-protection equipment specified by environmental inspectors. But Warsaw city officials summarily waived the legal rules, and construction proceeded without any environmental controls. However, by the time the airport was ready to open in 1992, the system had changed. The law was no longer subordinate to politics, and the airport's noncompliance with environmental regulations was headline news all over Poland. The regional environmental-protection inspector from Warsaw threatened to close the airport. And though the main administrative court later ruled that the airport could remain open, it ultimately was forced to retrofit all of the originally required equipment. Simply put, the law was enforced.
Poland is backing up its improved environmental law enforcement programs with increased environmental investments. In 1991, for the first time ever, Poland reached a level of environmental spending commensurate with the OECD countries. This money is being used to fund badly needed public environmental improvements. In 1989, almost half of Poland's cities -- including its two largest, Warsaw and Lodz, with a combined population of 2.5 million -- were without operational sewagetreatment plants. All of their municipal wastes were dumped, completely untreated, into surface waters. Since then, more than 1,200 new sewage-treatment plants have been built all over Poland and hundreds more are currently under construction. In addition, the Polish government has funded several independent and innovative institutions for environmental protection, including the National Fund for Environmental Protection, the Eco-Fund and the Environmental Protection Bank.
While political-economic transformation has brought structural improvements for environmental protection, Poland's ecological problems are far from over. It is still home to some of Europe's most polluted places. Many Polish rivers and lakes are still so polluted that they cannot be used even for industrial purposes -- let alone for drinking water -- and Poland remains among Europe's largest waste generators both in absolute terms and per unit of economic production.
Meanwhile, this environmental degradation continues to take a toll on the Polish economy and the health and well-being of Polish citizens, especially the young. In the heavily polluted region of Upper Silesia, infant mortality in 1993 was twice the Polish national average and five times the average of the OECD countries.
But all this simply confirms what most observers understood quite well in 1989: Cleaning up the environmental mess created during more than 40 years of totalitarian socialism would not be quick, easy or cheap. In 1991, the Ministry of Environmental Protection predicted that complete reversal of Poland's ecological crisis would take 30 years and cost a quarter of a trillion dollars. Poland still has a long road ahead to environmental health and safety. But acknowledging this obvious fact should not blind us to the very real progress that already has been made."
Why waste time being indignified over a single fifteen year old trivial quote? A quote that, I want to stress, is understood by readers of his book as an attack on poor ecological policy, not a stab at Poland.
Lastly, will we see a Polish election thread by your hand? Am looking forward to it.
10-18-2007, 13:56
Husar
Re: Re : THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
And to think people look at me like I'm mad when I insist that Americans are more open and respectful of other cultures...
:inquisitive: Are you...nevermind... ~D
10-18-2007, 17:35
cegorach
Re: Re : THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
KrooK
Quote:
Cegorach - don't worry:) PIS is not bad.
Bad joke... if they win I am becoming a terrorist when they cross the line which they are planning to.
Louis VI the Fat
Ohh Dear God another easy-going/light hearted thread will become a dead serious one ? Come on - read Gregoshi ! That is the SPIRIT !:laugh4:
Quote:
@Cegorach - I don't know if the specifics of Gore's statement are true or not. I also don't think he meant that all Polish children were brought to underground mines all the time to get a chance at a gasp of fresh air occasionaly. In the book, in the relevant chapter, Gore gives a general description of the immensity of the environmental ravages of communism. About which he was right, was he not?
Not a single one was brought underground to breathe fresh air.
Of course the comunism brought incredible demage to our environment and the recovery is even more incredible as the result, but it was never my idea to discuss this issue.
I just though this will be something good to laugh at.:inquisitive:
Quote:
Rather than focus on a single - perhaps indeed a somewhat unfortunate - quote, why not focus on the larger story? Communism nearly wrecked Polands environment. Then, soon after the fall of communism, Poland managed to pull of a 15 year run of major economic growth AND . Something to be proud of, surely?
Of course - I remember the times when the rivers were so polluted... now fish are returning to major rivers and some smaller ones are amazingly clear.
Quote:
Why waste time being indignified over a single fifteen year old trivial quote? A quote that, I want to stress, is understood by readers of his book as an attack on poor ecological policy, not a stab at Poland.
Again it is becoming too serious...
Quote:
Lastly, will we see a Polish election thread by your hand? Am looking forward to it.
I am away and I am not going to discuss it for now - even if I could I wouldn't.
Check your inbox for my answer.
10-18-2007, 18:53
Louis VI the Fat
Re : Re: Re : THank you Al Gore for the lesson about my own country
Quote:
Originally Posted by cegorach
another easy-going/light hearted thread will become a dead serious one ?
My bad then. Sorry.
On the upside, it seems we managed in a single thread to both poke fun at Gore's creative use of 'facts', and celebrate Poland's succesful ecological recovery. :2thumbsup:
We shall leave the coming elections for what they are, and not go into them.
Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Quote:
now fish are returning to major rivers and some smaller ones are amazingly clear.
You..you m-mean those small, incredibly clear fish that glow in the dark and have strange feet? :sweatdrop:
