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It's time for a new primaries thread. Iowa has come and gone. We all thrilled to the rumble in Wyoming. Pick your horse for the granite state, and please badger Don Corleone to vote for your pick. If we have any other New Hampsherinians, I suggest we harass them as well.
-edit-
Darn it, I forgot to make the poll public. Can one of the Backroom mods undo my mistake?
Well, I'm hoping Ron Paul shows up strong. I didn't even know Alan Keyes was running though. My dad did a little campaigning for him in 2000 I think. Tilting at windmills, Keyes is.
Just for kicks, here are some videos of campaigns behaving badly:
Romney supporters taking down McCain signs. I've never been involved in a political campaign, but is this considered fair game? I thought the idea was to put up more of your guy's signs, not to pull down the other guy's. In broad daylight. With cameras rolling. Is stupid, no?
Ron Paul supporters heckling Sean Hannity before last night's debates. Sure, they have every right to be steamed that their guy was excluded from the debates, but I don't think this makes them look good.
Finally, Rudy Giuliani wants you afraid. Very afraid. If this was not posted to YouTube by the Giuliani campaign, I would have bet it was a parody.
Bill Clinton apologizing for the fact that he cannot make Hillary "younger, taller, male." This is a glimpse into the sexual fantasies of Bill that I really didn't need.
Romney
The guy came from a virtually unknown status among Washington insiders a year ago and you would have been hard pressed to find someone who had heard of him even 6 months ago unless they were in Mass or more politically savvy in surrounding states.
Now he is the punching bag because he is viewed as a front-runner. His policies are interesting and unique, his personality is being described as "too good to be true" and people don't like the idea that people can change their mind about an issue ONCE. He is the center right candidate with the least baggage and the best record on all of the issues that he supports.
People are saying that he has been "attacking" the political records of the other candidates. They have responded by attacking him on a personal level. Listen to the disputes and make up your own mind about who is fighting for the issues appropriately
I am totally impressed with this guy and I hope that people start really listening to him answer questions and explain his ideas.
If he loses in NH tomorrow, he will still have more delegates than any Republican candidate.
He came in second in Iowa
He came in first in Wyoming
(first or second) in NH?
He can go all the way with this bid, please give him a chance by listening to him objectively.
Also, I think it's funny that Ron Paul would be elected president of the back room. I love that guy, especially as President of the Backroom.
Over here that wouldn´t just be unfair....it´s damn illegal....Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemur
you guys over there let political campaigners get away with this kind of stuff?
That video is ridiculous. That woman was either crazy or working for another campaign. The cameras were clearly filming her the entire time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin
Who does it damage? Romney.
Who gained from this? Why would an intelligent supporter of Mitt do that right in front of a camera?
Infuriating - first that someone would do that and second - that you would report a youtube video to be cold fact, Lemur.
Numerous possibilities include:
"Did any of you stop to think that maybe these people owned the signs? That they changed their mind after seeing McCain flip-flop on the bush tax cuts -- within a single interview? Or that they finally figured out he was lying about amnesty? Or maybe that they got tired of his playground bully shtick the other day?"
Lets try not to judge this without knowing any facts about it, please.
Here's some polling to chew on. I believe this was conducted entirely in Iowa. Upshot: Iowa loves the Obama man very much. Also, Rudy Giuliani gets his buttocks handed to him at a much higher margin than any of the other Repubs.
Huckabee and McCain, however, do much better. Romney doesn't do a whole lot better than Giuliani, which is interesting. As summarized by NRO:
Obama defeats McCain by 17 points.
Obama defeats Huckabee by 23 points.
Obama defeats Romney by 26 points.
Obama defeats Giuliani by 40 points.
McCain defeats Clinton by 4 points.
Huckabee and Clinton tie.
Clinton defeats Romney by 8 points.
Clinton defeats Giuliani by 16 points.
-edit-
I see Mrs. Clinton has a new primary tactic: Cry.
After the event, Pernold Young told ABC News that she was glad Clinton showed emotion.
"That was real," Pernold Young said.
Another woman in the group, Alison Hamilton of Portsmouth, New Hampshire said she, like most of the people in the room, had been leaning toward voting for Obama before the event.
But after seeing Clinton become emotional, she said she was going to change her vote to Clinton.
"That was the clincher," Hamilton said.
just think of it...if Hilary has a meeting with Ahmadinajacket all she has to do is open the waterworks and all will be solved...
well...this lady could re-write the book on international relations...:laugh4: :wall:
and people are changing their votes TO her over this?...talk about a joke...:inquisitive:
This seems a little premature:
Obama Costs Irish Bookie $75,000
DUBLIN, January 7, 2008 /PRNewswire via COMTEX/ -- Ireland's largest bookmaker, Paddy Power, are today claiming that the Democratic Nomination race is well and truly over and are already paying out on Barack Obama to be the successful Democratic nominee.
The early payout signals a massive EUR50,000 ($75,000) payday to lucky punters who backed Obama over the recent number of weeks at various odds ranging from 4/1 to 4/9.
The unexpected decision by the Irish bookmaking firm comes almost a week after the Iowa primary election and just a day before the New Hampshire primary election where Barack is now the odds on favourite at 1/12 to demolish his Democratic rival Hillary Clinton.
Paddy Power, said: "From a betting point of view we reckon that it's game over for Hillary. With each passing day Obama is looking more like a certainty to get the Democratic vote and as far as we're concerned he's already past the post. So well done to all who backed him, your winnings await!"
Barack Obama has also overtaken Hillary Clinton for the first time in the betting to become the next US President. Paddy Power now make him the odds on favourite at 10/11 to become the first African-American President over Hillary Clinton who has now drifted to an incredible 5/2.
That is excellent news BUT they must have never listened to the soap box of Yogi Berra "It aint ova till it's ova".Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemur
Welcome to USA politics. The general rule is "!^(& policy, I want to know he/she cares about me...." Not sure how it works in Iberia, but here the key to an election is to secure the nincompoop vote.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin
Distaff Clinton cries, Bubba felt their pain, Edwards rails against the machine (for 40% of the jury award), and Obama looks toward the "radiant future."
Thompson puts together 17 minutes of video describing his stance on pretty much every issue and the collective response is a yawn. He should post a 17 minute youtube clip of him !^(&ing the missus instead. THAT would melt servers everywhere and get him a 10% bump.
Churchill claimed that the best argument against democracy was a 5 minute chat with the average voter. We've got it down to a 15 second sound bite.
P.S. Somebody wake Fred before NH please.
I'd say its premature, if I were him I would have waited until after super tuesday before the payout. Clinton looks weak and to be honest I am a little surprised she is dropping so fast given the expirence and money she has.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemur
But if she can hold 2nd place until 02/05 she still has a shot.
I remain the only person on the Kucinich bandwagon!
I think Clinton will just edge out Obama.
I thyought you might be interested in how this is being reported in Australia. Here is an example from what I suppose you would call a Liberal newspaper. Here is what is arguably the most unbiased source in Australia (Public broadcasting). And here is a Conservative Australian Newspaper.
As you can see, everyone has focused on the Democratic Nomination, with only brief mentions of the Republicans. They have all also given good reviews of Obama and not-so-good reviews of Hillary. Actually I read a great one-page story of how good Obama is from the first source yesterday. McCain had maybe an 5 paragraphs.
If Romney is the Season's favorite flip-flopper, then Kucinich must be pancake.Quote:
Originally Posted by CountArach
The man rose to mayoralty using race politics for crying out loud! And he proceeded to prove how much of a massive fail he was by screwing his poor city further. Not that it wasn't already bad, but you know. At least Mitt Romney didn't destroy Massachusetts while he was Guv'ner.
Good riddance I say.
Devil's Advocate time:Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh
The quality of being charming might not necessarily have applications only for election politics, but also for the job of the President in general. Who knows? The no-nonsense all-policy guy might easily prove himself a failure in an office that combines the Head of State with the Great Compromiser, the Diplomat, the Leader, and the CEO of United States, Inc. precisely because he doesn't know how to charm.
I just read a comment on Politico that I liked (of course I would)
"People looking at Iowa hurts Romney? I don't think so,there's entirely different voter base in NH. Mitt cleaned up with the non-evangelical vote in Iowa. Now the media is in a complete state of confusion because their boys, Huck and McCain are going against each other and they don't know who to support to knock Romney off..There's a great irony emerging here.Huck and McCain have been giving each other a tongue bath but they might wind up splitting the anti- Romney vote and hand it to Romney in the process. McCain had the state to himself for over a month and could only eek a 2 point lead over Romney in NH.Romney has been fighting a 3 front war. MCain,Huck and the MSM and he's still near the top. Romney has a firm base of support because he has the intellectual part of the base. Huck's has the emotional and McCain has the old school support. If you put an old man like McCain up against Obama it would be Bob Dole all over again, not to mention the fact Huck or McCain would never raise the money needed to compete against the dem candidate who each have over $100 million."
I believe that Romney, Huckabee and Giuliani are the only ones who have a shot at drumming up enough support to win this election. Huckabee would do it because people would fear that the U.S. is slipping back to a "simpler" time. Take that how you will.
McCain as 2008's Bod Dole is a real concern for me. Then throw in his absolutely mixed record and, you know how it goes.
Who knew? Hillary is really channeling the spirit of ... Margaret Thatcher?
"Guess who stepped to the plate in 1990. Margaret Thatcher," she said of Thatcher's early leadership on the issue, adding that the Iron Lady "happens to be a woman."
"We had one leader — I don't know how likable she was — we had one leader who made it a priority and got the job done," she said of Thatcher.
So if Obama is the new Kennedy, and Clinton is the new Thatcher, and every Republican except Ron Paul is the new Reagan, what does that make Edwards?
Are people voting based on principles of the candidates, or marketability to the other party in the real elections...?
Could you please define "mixed" for me, in your context of the word?Quote:
Originally Posted by TuffStuffMcGruff
:cry: I never got harassed when the Iowa caucus was coming around...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemur
-"McCain voted against President Bush's tax cuts in 2001 and 2003, though he voted to extend the tax breaks in 2005"
-One of only two Republicans to twice vote against the permanent repeal of the Estate Tax
-McCain Feingold (although it seems to have been fought in 2007 and the major problems were overcome)
-Went from being a supporter of anti-gun bills to being a lead sponsor
-John McCain's immigration policies have earned him a D grade from Americans for Better Immigration
But in reality - I don't mind McCain - I didn't mind Dole either. I think many of his policies are good. I think that he is an interesting man with a courageous history.
I believe that there is a better choice
I cannot, in any remote form of good health, vote for Romney.
If he gets the presidency, do you realize what will have happened the past two years?
- The Patriots go 16-0 and most likely will take the Super Bowl.
- The Red Sox win their second World Series and stand a good chance at getting Johann Santana.
- The Celtics get Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen, go on pace to break the NBA record for wins, and might win the NBA Finals for a record-setting 17th time.
- Romney, former governor of Massachusetts, takes the White House.
Make it stop already! :dizzy2:
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneralHankerchief
Hahahaha
That is the best argument I've heard so far. I'm a New Yorker, too.
Bah - he's from Michigan anyway. So am I.
Maybe Johnny's just "changed his mind", perhaps? :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by TuffStuffMcGruff
Hmm, frankly, I'm not familiar with this "Americans for Better Immigration" organization, perhaps some info or a link?
As for my opposition to Mitt: I believe his foreign policy is a disaster waiting to happen, and also, yes, he makes my skin crawl. :scared:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NumbersUSA -Quote:
Originally Posted by kamikhaan
as an aside
I think Mitt shows an excellent understanding of foreign policy. Just because he refuses to opportunistically condemn the Bush Administration doesn't mean he is going to follow in it's footsteps. He has outlined a NEW policy, but not one that repudiates his predecessor.
I was watching the Fox GOP New Hampshire debate and I think you all should too.
I thought Romney did extremely well in it. In fact - compare him to the other candidates. The only one who came close was Giuliani. Thompson came off well enough. Paul said some crazy stuff, but then tempered it with some great stuff (ie his clash with Thompson)
here is the link
I have to say, apart from Romney and Huckabee they're quite....old, some of them sound a bit like they wouldn't even make it to the end of a possible second term. :sweatdrop:
watch the health care aspects episodes 5 and 6 - I think that if Romney hasn't converted you yet on at least that idea - he will tonight.
Man are you a Romney fanatic, or what? :beam:
I am. I can't vote in the primaries in my state because I am not a Republican, so I'm consigned to try and sway people here.
Watching debate after debate - reading political argument after argument; If I can do anything to get Romney into the nomination - I will try to do it.
I really believe that the other candidates are afraid of Romney. They are afraid, because if he means what he says and he is the person he seems to be - then he is a force to be reckoned with. He has years on his side (60 of them), he has exceptionally run companies in the private sector behind him, He is a gifted orator with a firm foundation in modern thought - one who looks 20 years younger than he is. He is also considered a genius by those around him and those who have met him in the past, something that I haven't heard of the other candidates so far.
His policies are right
His personal energy is right.
He is a Washington outsider.
His ideas are unique and his own (which is a rarity in presidential primaries)
I hope he gets a chance to go head to head with Obama or Clinton. If he does this I have the confidence that he will win. I don't have that confidence regarding the other candidates - I wish I did. This is the clincher in a very tough race and I think everyone on the G.O.P. side realizes this.